For those who keep asking...

This new Predator deal has just been one hurdle after another. I am not going to list all of them but needless to say I think we must be cursed with the block from hell. It has fought from the get go but the end is in sight. But just for couple of the more recent issues here ya go..

This is one maybe we should have caught before now, but needless to say it is not something we even thought to check honestly. I mean have to massage things a bit is one thing but this is something entirely different. This is a picture of the oil inlet on the block. The black sharpie line is where the gasket would go. Can you see the issue?


This better illustrates the issue. You can see the witness mark where the hole SHOULD be in the block.


This is a stock gasket laid in place, obviously we have a problem Houston..


This was when we first noticed said issue, with the inlet fitting laid in place to check fitment initially. The pointer is highliting the gap that


So away we go modifying a nice new part from AndyF productions..BTW that black sharpie line on the block is a spot we had to mill off to even get the plate to fit previously





And viola problem fixed.

T next issue was something we were aware of when the B1 from the Cuda was last freshened. We were experiencing some issues with Thrust washer wear on the cam gear of the Jesel belt drive. Called Jesel to discuss the issue and they have a solution. It is a new cam gear with a different thrust set up that is supposed to eliminate the issue. Not sure if it works yet as the Cuda engine just got the new stuff on freshen up but they say it will. Anyway the new cam gear is a different design and sticks out further than the previous gear did. I meant to discuss this with ATI when I got the balancer but it slipped my mind. Anyway here is what you get with the new upper cam gear from Jesel and an ATI balancer.


A "slight" interference to say the least I do not have the after pics here but we basically chuck it up and trim the balancer a bit and the upper gear and it is all well now. But just another example of the kinds of things we have been dealing with.

The latest hurdle has been with the Peterson Spline drive front. Seems someone was not listening when I ordered these parts and they do not want to play well with what I have. Will be on the phone tomorrow with them trying to get it figured out. I expect this will go just as difficult as everything else have.

These are just two of the myriad of issues I have had with this thing. Lots and lots of little stuff for sure. Thankfully I have a very patient and meticulous guy making sure it all goes well. Have no doubt it will make decent power but man what a road it has been. Still a ways to go.


guess this is the price I pay for trying to do this stuff right the first time. It has been a long long road to this point. Now the facility we used to dyno stuff is also closing the end of the month so we will be on hold yet again until we find a place we can do some work on the dyno. That may not be til March now as I will be headed back to DC here very soon. Oh well will hopefully have the top together tomorrow and at least it will look like an engine.

I feel your pain....and creative corrective actions....but that block would scare the hell out of me. CNC features that are mislocated generally have additional baggage.

The simple fix for the balancer fix is a spacer (washer) that ATI offers, seen this many times with milodon and jesel set ups.

Good luck.....and forget the dyno - tune that monster on the pavement

That's crazy. Why is it the end users to figure out manufacture's Mistakes! Well it looks like your towards the end. Good luck. I just had some issue's with a new pair of heads that I ordered. I feel the pain too.

It is hard to believe that machining could be THAT far off.
It is bad enough stuff like this eats up the calendar. A guy without your equipment would really be up a crick, and it would probably be out of pocket to boot.
I had a serious cam thrust issue on my 528, wound up force feeding oil directly to the thrust surface on the Milodon gear drive by running an oil line to the gear cover. That gear drive also needed the spacer to clear the damper.
Is that an Indy block?

And it sucks that you have to pay good $$ for things and they don't work like they are supposed to. I know, that's racing, but that is also a cop out for this industry.

I feel ur pain. I got a new block from Indy 5 months ago, the top four head bolt holes on both sides weren't there....

FWIW the block is fixed. Just took a bit of work for sure. The oil hole no one can explain for sure. We had to machine that pad to accept the plate and never really paid attention to the oil hole, but then who would. Was not a huge issue to address but def should not be there. We are beginning to think it was a "blem" block to begin with. Not happy about it but it is fixed now after a lot of extra time money and work.

As for no dyno, out of the question. We will wait until we have found a place to take it. Have another SB that will be ready in March and will likely do both in one trip since it looks like it will now be a raodtrip deal.

Oh don't get me started on Indy. Have some parts here that have more issues that you can shake a stick at. Although the normal guy putting together a motor in his garage likely would not even catch them. BTW on my block a Mildon pump would bolt on, cover up that hole and likely be ran with not so good results that way.

too bad you don't live closer.


Joe

You probably still have an issue....unless they manually over-ridden the program with an angle change....it would be impossible for this feed passage to intersect with the distribution channel at the proper point....food for thought.

Your ball, your game, your court....but I personally wouldn't spend a dime on dynoing a bracket motor.....confidence and competency are the only tools required. FWIW/IMO....

Wow, drilling the oil hole in the wrong location is a very big mistake to make on a block. The average guy would've just bolted a Milodon pump on there and gone down the track with a huge restriction in the oiling system. The bottom end probably would've lasted to half track before it let go.

Jerry no worries we have addressed all the issues trust me. People way smarter than me who did the work. Just showing the end result is all. It was not a simple grind and do operation trust me.

Andy kinda my point. We put a Milodon pump on it just to see if it would cover the hole completely and it did. SO if I guy put the gasket on the pump and slid it home like he would have had an issue later.

AS for the dyno stuff. I NEVER not dyno a serious piece. On my little stuff sure no reason to spend the extra money. For something like this we will be running in TS track time is very limited and want to maximize what we can. Not like we have any T&T days out here. We have race days that's it. So need to be ready to go when we get the chance

Hey Al, if it's not too far along, machine an oring groove around the feed out hole on your pump where you extended it, and ditch the gasket. Then you can crank that pump down as tight as you like, and forget it.

I've had to make a spacer ring for dampers before as well. Usually cut them off a factory snout, and hone them out a bit so they slip on.

If you're running roller cam bearings, and having trouble keeping the thrust washer alive try this. Pull the front bearing out and with a triangle file, file a groove from the cam bore oil hole out to the front. So when the bearing goes back in there is now an oil feed to the thrust. then take the thrust washers and and file a slot crossing center on the front and rear thrust washers. Mine all look new since doing this. Makes the thrust a pressure fed bearing.

We did machine a slot for oil from the front cam bearing to feed oil to the thrust. Did it with the B1 when we first found the problem. Jesel suggested the new cam gear so we did it to the B1 and the Predator. The damper is not a big deal really. Just something I wished I had remembered when I ordered it. We just machined a tad off it, it really looks worse in the pic than it is. As for the oring Guess more pictures would have helped. Appreciate the suggestions!!

Al
My deal has not had any of the problem you have run into, thank god!
Anyway did you end up running offset lifters?
I was checking pushrods clearances and I'm going to have to do a bit of clearanceing to make sure nothing touches.
Did you go over 1.000" lift?

My lifters are all left hand offset Jesel keyways. Pushrods are pretty much dead perfect. Required a lot of clearancing for the double taper 9/16" pushrods we are using. Not just on the block and head also a small notch in the bushing and lifter at the very top. On the base circle it is just REALLY close with out it. If we had gone one bigger to a 70MM cam core it would not have been an issue.

As for the cam specs I will list all that stuff later whenever we get it to the dyno and have some numbers on the combo. Lets just say we are expecting a good number.

Thanks
I'll keep working on my deal and keep you posted
What RPM are you looking to run?

Whatever it takes

Hot Rodding at its best. I am glad you have the talent and tools to deal with the issues.

Good Luck!
Bill

Al, I heard there is a Dyno in Idaho falls that can do a hemi...Fastlane did not have the stuff...Tim

Is that 11,800 or 12,500 RPM

Welcome to engine building, we always spent a lot of time making aftermarket parts fit correctly, just seems thats the way it is. 70MM cam in a production syle block would be impossible, maybe with a clam-shell style. On your way to DC drop it off we can Dyno it with you if you would like.

QMP or Eric Jones should be able to Dyno those for you.





Ray

Pete appreciate the offer. We have a SB that will be going together here soon to and at this point may wait to do both of them at once. It should be ready in March. But it is a brand X deal Yeah on the cam Bullet said the same thing, but if it were able to be a bigger core would be a non issue.

QMP is used by a lot of guys in SoCal and the region for sure. Did not realize Eric had a dyno, thought he was using QMP as well?? The dyno thing will get hashed out for sure. We have asuperflow here in Vegas too that we may be able to get access too.

Not really trying to bash anyone here. Just pointing out some of the issues we have had. There have been many along the way. But living in two places makes getting anything done a hassle, especially with a limited amount of time to work on stuff. To be honest the biggest hurdle has been pushrod clearancing, that has taken more time than any one thing, but again there have been many. Really were hoping to get it done and ready this trip but not gonna happen. As couple more little issues to address as well as getting the correct parts for the front drive. Oh well maybe when I come back in February it will be ready to go hopefully. Well after the racing obligations hopefully there will be some time.

Unless that hole is at a right angle to the milled surface, milling material off will move the hole. I've never played with that block but I did measure an OE block and the hole is at about a 10-degree angle. Using that angle, milling off a 1/4" will move the hole about .044" in the direction that caused your problem. Milling off 1/2" will move the hole about 0.088".

Only other thing I will say about this block is it came from a VERY well known Mopar engine builder. Not associated with the one who posted on here BTW.

im quite sure if you called indy they would apologize profusely and do whatever it would take to make you happy.we all know their customer service is perfection and ranks right up there with the best in the business.they would consult their signed copy of the third reich customer service manual and fix all the problems quickly and efficiently......

You are a very patient man Al.

QMP..... home of the only running iron Ritter block that I know of!

Voted "Best Customer Service" in their industry!

al, I think the world block is your best choice next to a billet block. As you know talking to tom, my new KB has a ton of issues,getting a new block out of them, or a refund is totally out of the question "financially they can't do it"

For those who are not aware this is a World block. It is the fourth one I have had and the first with issues. Like I said before I think it was a blem from the factory and likely not supposed to be sold. I have had GM blocks as well that had major issues and were not to be sold. In fact the one in the Pink car is one of those with issues as well. Been there since 2000 with zero issues after we fixed it.

BTW and FWIW here is a sneak peak of PART of the car Still a lot to do and a long way to go here too. But getting closer and time is running out.

Next upgrade is 9/16 studs and 1/2 cross bolts to stop the cap walk or should I say reduce the cap walk.
World is a poor choice IMO

IMO World is a FAR superior choice to the other readily available block out there. Been there done that..

What features are different between world, indy, kb? I never had any of them, Just wondering the differences.

Are the World aluminum blocks still available?

Hmmm..... Did you buy me a Sedona Orange street glide for Christmas?

I've had two world blocks (one iron, one aluminum) that also came from a "very well known" mopar engine builder that had several issues. Enough of them to where we were pretty sure they were "blems".

Several on here have posted about blemed World blocks.

What were the blems?

I have a World block torn down and noticed paper thin webbing above #2,#3 and #4 mains. Its between the top of mains and bottom of cylinders on drivers side only. All 3 areas have broke thru...that's how thin they are.

I have contacted World but haven't heard back.

The only comparable READILY available block is indy.
They have issues but are a more ridged block.
No way that world is FAR superior

[/quote]
The only comparable READILY available block is indy.
They have issues but are a more ridged block.
No way that world is FAR superior [/quote]

Ditto....I have had both.

Sure makes me feel better as I paid 2700 for a used 4.350 bore Mega block only needing a quick hone. Lots of money for a used one but at least its been track tested.

Well I have an Indy(2 od f them)and this World block. IMO I will use what I have once we fixed the issues. I have seen up close and personal what is in an Indy block(as in between the liners)and how they hold up over time and think we made the correct decision. I also have a pair of Megablocks here too. We used what we feel is the best option for what we were after and had. I need to order another KB block but did not want to wait at this point probably should have and likely will here soon after I sell some of what's here.

I tore my self up whether I should buy that block from Bob but ultimately decided to wait for a new one. Don't know if I made the right decision or not. Hopefully they will actually ship soon.......

I think you did good.

Al: Chech the parts section. There is a new KB block for sale. No waiting needed.

Two problems for me. One solid block and two standard cam location.

Al, what does Jesel charge for the new cam gear and thrust setup?

John I would have to look but pretty sure it was around $600. We found the issue on the B1 when it was freshened up and changed it and this motor to the new set up. Also grooved the cam bearing to supply oil there. The oil may have done the trick alone but did both anyway. The issue will be the balancer fitment. I forgot to ask the question when I bought the new ATI balancer for the Predator so we just cut it and the upper pulley a tad.