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My W9 Build

Posted By: MattW

My W9 Build - 10/25/14 01:45 AM

Some people were asking for some info.

436ci 4.04×4.25
Block: Mopar R3
Compression Ratio: 11.43:1
Crankshaft: BPE
Connecting Rods: Scat 6.2-inch I-beam
Pistons and Rings: Total Seal .043/.043/3mm rings
Camshaft: Comp 250/252 degrees at .050, .735/.685 lift, 108 degrees LSA
Cylinder Heads: Brett Miller small CNC Mopar W9 363cfm max intake flow, 255cfm exhaust flow.
Intake Manifold: Mopar 420
Matt
Posted By: rt66jim

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 01:51 AM

I'm sure it will run well Matt. What size valves are in your heads? Jim
Posted By: tubtar

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 02:00 AM

That should really make some steam.
It might like a little more duration , but I guess that depends on your end use too.
Mine is a 405 ( 4.125 X 3.79 ) with a little more compression and a different cam....268 @ .050 and .680 ish lift on a 104 center and in at 102.
The heads flow less.......348 @ .700 and I think 248 on the exhaust.
I ran out of time and money so it never went on the pump , but it has more than fair street manners and really pulls once it hooks.
It ran hotter than I expected ( over 210 on hot days. ) , but I just went with the HHR fan / shroud and that fixed that issue.
Cold starting with E-85 takes a while , but if the air is over 65 or so it isn't a problem.
My plans for hitting a test day before the season was over got waylaid by a couple family weddings , but I can't wait for next spring to bury the speculation regarding what it will do.

Me thinks you're gonna really enjoy that one.
Posted By: J_BODY

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 02:09 AM

timing chain (do you have a cover?)? or weber belt drive?

keeping the stock front end?

got a header builder handy?

2 speed trans? ....or torqueflight torture (I chose the latter so far...)

running a 4500 carb? or sticking with a 4150? My 598 intake and spacer for 4500 sits to high....going to have the intake modded to a 4500 flange eventually.
Posted By: Hot 340

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 02:13 AM

Quote:

Some people were asking for some info.

436ci 4.04×4.25
Block: Mopar R3
Compression Ratio: 11.43:1
Crankshaft: BPE
Connecting Rods: Scat 6.2-inch I-beam
Pistons and Rings: Total Seal .043/.043/3mm rings
Camshaft: Comp 250/252 degrees at .050, .735/.685 lift, 108 degrees LSA
Cylinder Heads: Brett Miller small CNC Mopar W9 363cfm max intake flow, 255cfm exhaust flow.
Intake Manifold: Mopar 420
Matt

Do you think you'll overpower that rod with this combo?


That crank has a 2.00 rod journal right? Didnt know scat made a 6.200 I beam with a 2.00 big end.
Posted By: tubtar

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 04:06 AM

Quote:

timing chain (do you have a cover?)? or weber belt drive?

keeping the stock front end?

got a header builder handy?

2 speed trans? ....or torqueflight torture (I chose the latter so far...)

running a 4500 carb? or sticking with a 4150? My 598 intake and spacer for 4500 sits to high....going to have the intake modded to a 4500 flange eventually.



All pertinent questions.
Weber belt and front drive distributor here....mostly for show and tell.
And an AlterKtion or I'd never even try making headers for it.
I went under sized with the carb.........a QuickFuel 850 done for E-85.
One of a couple compromises I made to keep some manners.
I made my own headers....1 7/8" X 35 " primaries into a 3 1/2" collector.
I bought a set of Flowmaster 4 into 2 into 1 - 3" collectors , added tubes for the evac and had them coated only to decide that enhancing low end torque was not going to be a priority.

And a low 1st gear 904 with a 3.91 rear cog that feels O.K. , but it runs out of first in a big hurry.
3200 rpm @ 55 mph .......not horrible , but I don't see any long trips in my future.
Posted By: J_BODY

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 05:11 AM

I removed my 1050 and spacer and installed the "supposed" 930 cfm BG 4150 carb we ran on the 360. figured it will be a good carb for the learning curve. It's funny..... racing/working on the Mirada for 26 years I never had the "joy" of working around steering linkage and torsion bars. As sad as it sounds that was a huge factor in me having a tube K put together with coil overs and a steering rack for the Duster. Made life ALOT easier.
Posted By: fishy340

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 06:01 AM

Should make a True 750,but I think the carb will need to be bigger by alot.
sb Mopars imo love carburation atleast all mine have.
Posted By: Ian

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 09:44 AM

a very nice combo,should be a reliable and run hard
Posted By: 1967dartgt

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 01:48 PM

What block are you using? Why such a small bore?
Posted By: B3422W5

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 02:26 PM

Seems like a waste to run such a tiny cam and bore on a motor/ heads with a lot of potential.
Posted By: RAMM

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 02:59 PM

Quote:

Seems like a waste to run such a tiny cam and bore on a motor/ heads with a lot of potential.



The cam is not the limiting factor. I agree about the bore but the R3 we used was sonic checked and 4.070" is all there is fo0r future overb0ores. J.Rob
Posted By: MattW

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 03:16 PM

Quote:

timing chain (do you have a cover?)? or weber belt drive?

keeping the stock front end?

got a header builder handy?

2 speed trans? ....or torqueflight torture (I chose the latter so far...)

running a 4500 carb? or sticking with a 4150? My 598 intake and spacer for 4500 sits to high....going to have the intake modded to a 4500 flange eventually.




Stock

Yes

No

727.

My carb will be 1025 race demon.
Posted By: MattW

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 03:21 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Some people were asking for some info.

436ci 4.04×4.25
Block: Mopar R3
Compression Ratio: 11.43:1
Crankshaft: BPE
Connecting Rods: Scat 6.2-inch I-beam
Pistons and Rings: Total Seal .043/.043/3mm rings
Camshaft: Comp 250/252 degrees at .050, .735/.685 lift, 108 degrees LSA
Cylinder Heads: Brett Miller small CNC Mopar W9 363cfm max intake flow, 255cfm exhaust flow.
Intake Manifold: Mopar 420
Matt

Do you think you'll overpower that rod with this combo?


That crank has a 2.00 rod journal right? Didnt know scat made a 6.200 I beam with a 2.00 big end.



Don't know about the rods but everything I've read is stroke and speed. This thing is all done at 6500 rpm.

They do unless I was given wrong info. Matt
Posted By: B3422W5

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 03:32 PM

The little enginemaster's 318 I bought has a 6.200 Scat I beam Chevy rod in it.
Posted By: MattW

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 04:11 PM

Trying to figure out how to transfer pictures from my galaxy s4 to this post.
Before it when to engine masters it was dynoed at 665 hp and 630 tq.
Matt
Posted By: 340B5

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 05:06 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Some people were asking for some info.

436ci 4.04×4.25
Block: Mopar R3
Compression Ratio: 11.43:1
Crankshaft: BPE
Connecting Rods: Scat 6.2-inch I-beam
Pistons and Rings: Total Seal .043/.043/3mm rings
Camshaft: Comp 250/252 degrees at .050, .735/.685 lift, 108 degrees LSA
Cylinder Heads: Brett Miller small CNC Mopar W9 363cfm max intake flow, 255cfm exhaust flow.
Intake Manifold: Mopar 420
Matt

Do you think you'll overpower that rod with this combo?


That crank has a 2.00 rod journal right? Didnt know scat made a 6.200 I beam with a 2.00 big end.



Don't know about the rods but everything I've read is stroke and speed. This thing is all done at 6500 rpm.

They do unless I was given wrong info. Matt



NICE combination! Whats the bobweight? I would think you'd be fine w/ those rods if the bobwt isn't way up there. I put 6.250 rods in mine and really like the characteristics of the engine.
Posted By: J_BODY

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 05:45 PM

Quote:

Seems like a waste to run such a tiny cam and bore on a motor/ heads with a lot of potential.



sometimes "potential" is pretty hard on stuff....
Posted By: Thumperdart

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 05:56 PM

Quote:

Seems like a waste to run such a tiny cam and bore on a motor/ heads with a lot of potential.



My first thaught.............hugh lift but baby duration........
Posted By: MattW

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 06:30 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Seems like a waste to run such a tiny cam and bore on a motor/ heads with a lot of potential.



My first thaught.............hugh lift but baby duration........



Keep in mind that this venture was a last minute deal so to speak.
The stuff that's in this engine is stuff that was already purchased.
I was not built specifically for engine masters.
It was more of let's see what all this can do.
I had a couple of limiting factors one being a hydraulic roller and compression.
I want to be able to drive this thing around town if I ever get my junk together.
Matt
Posted By: TRENDZ

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 06:39 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Seems like a waste to run such a tiny cam and bore on a motor/ heads with a lot of potential.



sometimes "potential" is pretty hard on stuff....



Would be a sweet cam for a turbo motor
Posted By: Thumperdart

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 06:48 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Seems like a waste to run such a tiny cam and bore on a motor/ heads with a lot of potential.



My first thaught.............hugh lift but baby duration........



Keep in mind that this venture was a last minute deal so to speak.
The stuff that's in this engine is stuff that was already purchased.
I was not built specifically for engine masters.
It was more of let's see what all this can do.
I had a couple of limiting factors one being a hydraulic roller and compression.
I want to be able to drive this thing around town if I ever get my junk together.
Matt



Not baggin and using what you`ve got it is what it is..............
Posted By: MattW

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 06:52 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Seems like a waste to run such a tiny cam and bore on a motor/ heads with a lot of potential.



sometimes "potential" is pretty hard on stuff....



Would be a sweet cam for a turbo motor



Now there's an idea!

Matt
Posted By: MattW

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 07:02 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Seems like a waste to run such a tiny cam and bore on a motor/ heads with a lot of potential.



My first thaught.............hugh lift but baby duration........



Keep in mind that this venture was a last minute deal so to speak.
The stuff that's in this engine is stuff that was already purchased.
I was not built specifically for engine masters.
It was more of let's see what all this can do.
I had a couple of limiting factors one being a hydraulic roller and compression.
I want to be able to drive this thing around town if I ever get my junk together.
Matt



Not baggin and using what you`ve got it is what it is..............



All good
Not a keyboard whiner. Truth is it will probably sit for awhile before anything happens.
R3 is good but not worth my time for high compression big mechanical with the sloppy 59 degree lifter angle.
I would love to have a 48 degree siamese block.
But I've moving towards the new G3. Matt
Posted By: Hot 340

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 08:13 PM

Quote:

The little enginemaster's 318 I bought has a 6.200 Scat I beam Chevy rod in it.

With a 2.0 journal?
Posted By: B3422W5

Re: My W9 Build - 10/25/14 09:05 PM

Quote:

Quote:

The little enginemaster's 318 I bought has a 6.200 Scat I beam Chevy rod in it.

With a 2.0 journal? [/quote

Said in the enginemaster's article he just widened the throws to accept the Chevy rods. Haven't had the shortblock apart
Posted By: BPE

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 12:36 AM

I'm pretty sure scat doesn't make a small journal I beam SBC rod in 6.200" length. But, I have been wrong before.

Rod
Posted By: MattW

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 12:47 AM

Quote:

I'm pretty sure scat doesn't make a small journal I beam SBC rod in 6.200" length. But, I have been wrong before.

Rod



I've seen them but can't find tthem . lol
It's an I beam and it's 6.20 and your crank is 2.00 rod sooooo
Posted By: BPE

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 12:59 AM

I'm not saying they aren't out there, I'm just saying I've never seen them. When you know for sure, let me know. Also, do you have a part number for the T and D rockers for the 59 degree W9 heads?

Rod
Posted By: MattW

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 01:14 AM

Not thinking that at all.
I believe the part # is Sca2 ICR6200-7/16A
As for the rockers I believe I have the raise port version because they have the most offset. 8097.
Matt
Posted By: SpareParts

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 01:17 AM

Yeah that's the most offset. .750 offset IIRC
Posted By: RAMM

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 01:34 AM

The offset is .770" and it needs every bit of it. Scat DOES offer the rod in a 2.00" journal, its right on their site in the Chevy section. J.Rob
Posted By: Hot 340

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 01:39 AM

Quote:

The offset is .770" and it needs every bit of it. Scat DOES offer the rod in a 2.00" journal, its right on their site in the Chevy section. J.Rob

Not 6.200 long.
T&D makes a .775 for the rp head. Its what I'd use on a 59.
Posted By: BPE

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 01:56 AM

There is nothing listed on Scat's website for an I beam in 6.200" with a small journal. You might be thinking an H beam (that's listed). Thanks for the info on the T and D part number.

Rod
Posted By: Ian

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 02:19 PM

how much power is he leaving on the table running a small bore combo
Posted By: RAMM

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 02:56 PM

Quote:

There is nothing listed on Scat's website for an I beam in 6.200" with a small journal. You might be thinking an H beam (that's listed). Thanks for the info on the T and D part number.

Rod



I will supply the part # on Monday along with a phone number and contact name @ Scat Enterprises. J.Rob
Posted By: RAMM

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 03:05 PM

Quote:

how much power is he leaving on the table running a small bore combo



We will never know. J.Rob
Posted By: Ian

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 03:11 PM

Quote:

Quote:

how much power is he leaving on the table running a small bore combo



We will never know. J.Rob


what would be your minimal bore size for the w9/8 head would you run thanks
Posted By: RAMM

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 03:17 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

how much power is he leaving on the table running a small bore combo



We will never know. J.Rob


what would be your minimal bore size for the w9/8 head would you run thanks



I would let Brett Miller answer that if he sees this. I can say that a larger bore fixture on the flow bench didn't unlock much more in terms of flow rate though. J.Rob
Posted By: BPE

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 03:35 PM

Quote:

Quote:

There is nothing listed on Scat's website for an I beam in 6.200" with a small journal. You might be thinking an H beam (that's listed). Thanks for the info on the T and D part number.

Rod



I will supply the part # on Monday along with a phone number and contact name @ Scat
Enterprises. J.Rob



Thanks,
I contacted them a while back checking on them and they said they didn't make them. Hopefully they are now available. A part number would be great.

Rod
Posted By: tubtar

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 03:45 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Seems like a waste to run such a tiny cam and bore on a motor/ heads with a lot of potential.



sometimes "potential" is pretty hard on stuff....



Would be a sweet cam for a turbo motor



Now there's an idea!

Matt



Make that " an excellent idea " .
It will solve much of your header issue.
With a stock front end , building a set of under chassis headers would be a real challenge.
Posted By: WHITEDART

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 05:24 PM

for me 4.125 would the min . the first cut on my block was 4.185. keep in mind r blocks dont wear like a stock block they are much harder.
Posted By: MattW

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 05:50 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Seems like a waste to run such a tiny cam and bore on a motor/ heads with a lot of potential.



sometimes "potential" is pretty hard on stuff....



Would be a sweet cam for a turbo motor



Now there's an idea!

Matt



Make that " an excellent idea " .
It will solve much of your header issue.
With a stock front end , building a set of under chassis headers would be a real challenge.



Well I think your right. Building headers for this will not be fun.
My dyno headers won't even be close. Lol
I'm going to try the John Doe approach. He use to post here and had a valiant with a 505 small block in it. He made his own headers that he could remove in under 30 minutes.
Wish he still posted here.
Matt
Posted By: jg309

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 06:26 PM

got a short deck cover & gkts. if interested call,jg309 @618-946-2640, it's new,$120+freight,got lots of s/b parts if u need any
Posted By: jg309

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 06:32 PM

my r3_w9 headed engin makes 728 to the ground with a willy's 4150 750 holly, bore is 4.185 stoke 3.335,6.125 rod
Posted By: MattW

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 07:06 PM

1

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Posted By: MattW

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 07:14 PM

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Posted By: MattW

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 07:23 PM

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Posted By: MattW

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 07:24 PM

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Posted By: MattW

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 07:25 PM

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Posted By: MattW

Re: My W9 Build - 10/26/14 07:26 PM

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Posted By: RAMM

Re: My W9 Build - 10/28/14 07:29 PM

Quote:

I'm pretty sure scat doesn't make a small journal I beam SBC rod in 6.200" length. But, I have been wrong before.

Rod



Scat part # 2-350-6200-2000
6.200"
2.000" journal

J.Rob
Posted By: MattW

Re: My W9 Build - 10/28/14 07:54 PM

7

Attached picture 8314405-20140919_103412.jpeg
Posted By: onig

Re: My W9 Build - 10/28/14 08:38 PM

Quote:

4


Hey Matt.
Those pistons look like they have gold color to them. What is that, or is that just incorrect coloring of the pic by the camera.
Posted By: RAMM

Re: My W9 Build - 10/28/14 08:53 PM

The pistons have Diamond's ceramic, thermal coating and are gold in colour. J.Rob
Posted By: onig

Re: My W9 Build - 10/28/14 10:35 PM

Thanks, will this coating stay on, or will it wear away like the piston skirt coatings?
Posted By: Hot 340

Re: My W9 Build - 10/28/14 10:57 PM

Quote:

Quote:

I'm pretty sure scat doesn't make a small journal I beam SBC rod in 6.200" length. But, I have been wrong before.

Rod



Scat part # 2-350-6200-2000
6.200"
2.000" journal

J.Rob

.... but that's an H beam.
Posted By: WHITEDART

Re: My W9 Build - 10/29/14 04:21 AM

awesome build should be a fun ride good luck
Posted By: Stroker Scamp

Re: My W9 Build - 10/29/14 05:24 AM

Quote:

6


you guys make this or buy?
Posted By: RAMM

Re: My W9 Build - 10/29/14 01:16 PM

Quote:

Thanks, will this coating stay on, or will it wear away like the piston skirt coatings?



Coating should last indefinately. J.Rob
Posted By: RAMM

Re: My W9 Build - 10/29/14 01:20 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

I'm pretty sure scat doesn't make a small journal I beam SBC rod in 6.200" length. But, I have been wrong before.

Rod



Scat part # 2-350-6200-2000
6.200"
2.000" journal

J.Rob

.... but that's an H beam.



Just checked my notes and you are correct. I used a 2-ICR6200-7/16" for a 2.100" pin with Lunati/King CR867HP--nice bearings and inexpensive too. I thought for sure I had a listing for a 6.200 I -beam for a 2.00" pin. Calling Scat today J.Rob
Posted By: RAMM

Re: My W9 Build - 10/29/14 01:22 PM

Quote:

Quote:

6


you guys make this or buy?



Valley plate was custom as was the thermostat housing/water manifold. There is a lot of custom work when using and R3 and W9's. J.Rob
Posted By: Blucuda413

Re: My W9 Build - 10/29/14 04:04 PM

MattW, how did you run your water lines, six holes and only 4 at your water manifold?? Nice package!!!
Posted By: MattW

Re: My W9 Build - 10/30/14 01:48 PM

Quote:

MattW, how did you run your water lines, six holes and only 4 at your water manifold?? Nice package!!!



I believe two of he lines mate with another two, then into the housing.
RRAM would know more.
I haven't seen this engine since before then Dyno.

Matt
Posted By: J_BODY

Re: My W9 Build - 10/30/14 04:02 PM

personally..... I think if you go aftermarket K and rid of the torsion bars and open up the undercarriage a bit it will make like alot more enjoyable working headers into the equation.
Posted By: tubtar

Re: My W9 Build - 10/30/14 05:17 PM

Quote:

personally..... I think if you go aftermarket K and rid of the torsion bars and open up the undercarriage a bit it will make like alot more enjoyable working headers into the equation.



Quoted for truth !
Whether you make them or have them done , this will save many hours.
Posted By: Darryls-Demon

Re: My W9 Build - 11/01/14 09:35 PM

Quote:

Trying to figure out how to transfer pictures from my galaxy s4 to this post.
Before it when to engine masters it was dynoed at 665 hp and 630 tq.
Matt



At what RPM did the motor make 665HP and 630tq?
Posted By: MattW

Re: My W9 Build - 11/01/14 10:51 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Trying to figure out how to transfer pictures from my galaxy s4 to this post.
Before it when to engine masters it was dynoed at 665 hp and 630 tq.
Matt



At what RPM did the motor make 665HP and 630tq?



IIRC 6400 hp and 4800 for the tq
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