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Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear

Posted By: GTX MATT

Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/18/14 10:13 PM

Does this look funny to you? This is just a heavy duty Milodon pinned shaft running with a solid flat tappet cam.

Attached picture 8244450-IMG_1326.jpg
Posted By: GTX MATT

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/18/14 10:14 PM

Another

Attached picture 8244452-IMG_1329.jpg
Posted By: JohnRR

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/18/14 10:18 PM

are there raised burrs on the edge of those teeth , it appears like there is , if there is that is NOT good . The teeth are too soft if that is the case , why did you choose a Milodon shaft ??
Posted By: GTX MATT

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/18/14 10:53 PM

Hmmm, I'm not certain I'll have to pull it back out and double check. I want to say no because I thought I'd notice that, but I was paying more attention to how the teeth themselves had worn on the inside.

I chose Milodon because Mancini had Mopar and Milodon, and by default I figured Milodon would be the better choice. I'm running an HV pump so I wanted a pinned driveshaft.

The cam doesn't look like the driveshaft does.
Posted By: Bad340fish

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/19/14 12:11 AM

Running to much oil pressure puts lots of extra load on that gear.
Posted By: JohnRR

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/19/14 09:04 PM

Quote:

Running to much oil pressure puts lots of extra load on that gear.




I put a Mopar HD drive in my latest build but chose to run a std. volume pump that I ported , pressure is not too high so I think I'm ok ??? Haven't looked at the gear yet , but I will when I swap out the distributor .

Posted By: GTX MATT

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/19/14 09:07 PM

I haven't gotten the DS out yet, oil pressure is 25 hot idle, 65 hot cruise, and 70 PSI at high RPMs, so nothing crazy.

If those edges aren't raised does the wear look normal/ok otherwise? I've never seen one look quite like that but I'm used to original used stock drives.
Posted By: JohnRR

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/19/14 09:09 PM

Quote:

I haven't gotten the DS out yet, oil pressure is 25 hot idle, 65 hot cruise, and 70 PSI at high RPMs, so nothing crazy.

If those edges aren't raised does the wear look normal/ok otherwise? I've never seen one look quite like that but I'm used to original used stock drives.




I don't know if it's wera without seeing it , and what it looked like new. if the teeth were black when new then it's obvious that the coating will wear off with use. If no burrs then it should be fine ?
Posted By: GTX MATT

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/19/14 09:12 PM

Yeah I supposed whats throwing me for a loop is that they were black, and I don't remember the stock shafts wearing/changing colors.
Posted By: Bigcube

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/19/14 11:49 PM

Do you run some sort of clamp collar to stop it from bouncing? I had a bronze drive gear show marks like that but not after I put the collar on the shaft and replaced the gear.
Posted By: VernMotor

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/20/14 12:11 AM

Quote:

Do you run some sort of clamp collar to stop it from bouncing? I had a bronze drive gear show marks like that but not after I put the collar on the shaft and replaced the gear.




This is what I was thinking
Posted By: GTX MATT

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/20/14 06:03 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Do you run some sort of clamp collar to stop it from bouncing? I had a bronze drive gear show marks like that but not after I put the collar on the shaft and replaced the gear.




This is what I was thinking




I'm not sure I follow, but no nothing outside of the stock setup. Should I be?
Posted By: ZIPPY

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/20/14 06:16 PM

Quote:

Do you run some sort of clamp collar to stop it from bouncing? I had a bronze drive gear show marks like that but not after I put the collar on the shaft and replaced the gear.





Thanks for the reminder (I needed to install one 10 years ago... forgot)
Posted By: GTX MATT

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/20/14 07:17 PM

This is the shaft in question, by the way: http://chucker54.stores.yahoo.net/stoilpudras1.html

What is this collar everyone is talking about? I've never heard of this.
Posted By: Mopar Guy

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/20/14 08:36 PM

My gues would be that something dosent line up corekly ! Remember that the oil presiure is not indication of what the load is in the gear but is your oilpump a hv ? almost al i read on oil presiure seams to end up whit speculations but i will never put a hv pump in a bb ever again whit half grove main bearings ! I run a 500+ stroker on a rb block and use a stv mellings pump on 10W40 mineral oil and presiure is never under 35psi at idel and it regulates on about 1300rpm on a REALY hot day at about 55psi ! Its not the presiure that protect the bearings and im of the belefe that whit a hv pump you will harm the internal parts even more before you see any change in presiure and why use up hp to pull a to large pump when you dont need one !? Pleas i dont whant to argue this and im no experts but this works fine on my engine and it shore saves the bronze gear i have to use whit the roller cam i have in the engine
Posted By: JohnRR

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/20/14 09:26 PM

Quote:

This is the shaft in question, by the way: http://chucker54.stores.yahoo.net/stoilpudras1.html

What is this collar everyone is talking about? I've never heard of this.




Do a search , the collar goes on the distributor shaft itself to keep the drive from walking up and down as you go on and off the throttle .
Posted By: Mopar Guy

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/20/14 09:49 PM

I shorely doubt that thas wear pattern on the gear have to do whit it moveing up and down but the collar is used for keeping the gear in place to avoid ignition walks so that will be steady at al rpmīs ! I would ask a guy that works on rear ends what that would cause this pattern. Some thing must be cut wrong or out of line !!! Is there any wear in the bushing hole that is in the block ? Many just drive that bushing in the block and forget to see to that there is the corekt zice for the shaft and if its to tight it will wear hard on the shaft.
Could the camshaft for some resone be to far in to the block ? Just a gues but mabe a good one for that kind of pattern `!?
Posted By: Bigcube

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/20/14 11:16 PM

If the slot is too deep in the drive gear there is nothing to stop it from floating up and down. Not only will your timing bounce around it will cause unusual wear to the gear. Here's a few pic to show how much it will move.

Gear seated...


With the distributor seated I pushed up on the hex where it engages in the oil pump with the pump off.

Here's a pic of the clamp collar.


I have a pic of the wear on my gear when it was bouncing but it's so out of focus you can't tell from the pic.

Hope that helps.
Posted By: GTX MATT

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/20/14 11:21 PM

Gotcha! I will be buying one now. Who sells them?

Any chance this is common with the MSD Pro Billets?
Posted By: Bigcube

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/20/14 11:35 PM

It's not the distributor, it's the depth of the slot in the pump drive. Same issue with my NRC offset distributor.
Posted By: Bigcube

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/20/14 11:40 PM

Quote:

Gotcha! I will be buying one now. Who sells them?

Any chance this is common with the MSD Pro Billets?



As far as who sells them, I got it when I worked at a fastener distirbutor but you should se able to find them at Granger or Fastenall or any hardware store. I believe it's 1/2" shaft diameter, measure yours to be sure, it was many years ago when I did this.
Posted By: GTX MATT

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/20/14 11:45 PM

Gotcha, what will they call it at the hardware store?
Posted By: Bigcube

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/20/14 11:49 PM

I always just called them a "Clamp Collar"
Posted By: CHAPPER

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/21/14 12:41 AM

Quote:

I always just called them a "Clamp Collar" [/quote

Shaft collar
Posted By: cudadon

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/21/14 04:49 PM

Big Cube very good pics of that issue!
I will check that.
Although my gear engagement is in the middle like a ring & pinion.
Thanks,
Don

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Posted By: TrWaters

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/22/14 02:42 AM

I actually sell them with the correct size I.D. The distributor shafts are not 1/2". Sure, a standard 1/2" collar will tighten down, but....
Posted By: Clanton

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/22/14 12:46 PM

Wow that gear needs replaced.The dist length in the gear I had someone tig the tip to lengthen it and I ground it to fit .010.
Posted By: VernMotor

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/22/14 04:54 PM

Is the bushing in the block good ?
Posted By: Mopar Guy

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/22/14 08:55 PM

Darn i feal like the wise guy pointing at the moone and everybody is looking at my pointing finger.... The gear cut is not lineing up either in the cam or the drive pin gear ! The wear pattern tells the tale and the more you thing about it the more shore you will be
Posted By: scatpacktom

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/22/14 09:31 PM

That is what they do when the bushing in the block is bad. Is there excessive clearance between the shaft and the bushing?
Posted By: Mopar Guy

Re: Oil Pump Driveshaft Wear - 08/22/14 10:09 PM

Quote:

That is what they do when the bushing in the block is bad. Is there excessive clearance between the shaft and the bushing?




I have also askt about that in this subjekt if you reed my posts like a qestion if the bushing or shaft have mutch wear ! But then it must be pretty mutch to get that pattern as the shaft then will be forceīd out of center It could be ofcorse !
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