Posted By: 1967dartgt
Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/02/14 10:07 PM
Getting ready to put mine in.
Anti roll bars who has them?
Posted By: Quicktree
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/02/14 10:08 PM
everyone should have them 
Posted By: DJVCuda
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/02/14 10:23 PM
Who's is that?
Looks good
Looks good
Posted By: 1967dartgt
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/02/14 10:39 PM
Well it's a s&w bar with a custom rear tube and extensions. They sent some mounts with it and thought this was a better way to mount it in my car.
Posted By: pittsburghracer
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/02/14 10:41 PM
Quote:
everyone should have them
WHY????
Posted By: Quicktree
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/02/14 10:45 PM
Quote:why do you think?Quote:
everyone should have them
WHY????
Posted By: pittsburghracer
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/02/14 11:00 PM
Quote:Quote:why do you think?Quote:
everyone should have them
WHY????
Why do you think we need them?
Posted By: pittsburghracer
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/02/14 11:01 PM
I've never had one on a car yet.
Posted By: Wv68charger
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/02/14 11:03 PM
Talked to John Holt about this while he's been doing our 4 link and he doesn't think there absolutely necessary. Depends on the setup .
Posted By: MR_P_BODY
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/02/14 11:14 PM
Quote:
Talked to John Holt about this while he's been doing our 4 link and he doesn't think there absolutely necessary. Depends on the setup .
I wont build a 4-link car without the anti roll bar
but in my opinion a ladder bar doesnt need them unless
its a wimpy one and its flexing
Posted By: Ohio Joe
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/03/14 12:43 AM
Went from a 1.43 60' to 1.37, sold me! That 1.43 was at Norwalk and the 1.37 at Tri-State 2 weeks later. The Go-Pro camera really convinced us that it was needed. It's a 4 link with double adj Afco's
Posted By: fishy340
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/03/14 01:14 AM
I have one but it only has one bar that mounts inner frame to frame...i believe mine is from A.R.T
Posted By: Leon441
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/03/14 02:01 AM
I raced without one on an in board 4-link for years. The reason I mention in board is the space between brackets was narrow for the tire width I had. The wider the bracket centers the more stable the car should be.
My car did picture perfect wheel stands and could maintain center of track for a full 1/8 mile wheel stand. So do you need one. HECK NO.
Now do I have one now. Yes. I was at Rockingham running KOS. The track was horrible. I was running Tony Marculwics(surely misspelled sorry Tony) for a two out of three. It was the last round and we were tied. I got on the pedal late in the run and the car picked the left front up pretty high and did not bring it down until the laundry was out. The amount of preload in the fourlink was perfect for launches. But, could not handle the rocking action of a late hit with a lot of nitrous.
I installed an ART with the bearings and all. Ran it for years. Last year was under the car and realized the link to the housing had broken off. It had been broken long enough to have rusted pretty bad and had witness marks where it had been striking the rear end housing. I had not even noticed it. After welding it back. Resetting preload and putting the anti roll to neutral I saw no difference in 60 ft.
4-link cars at our level can do without. I know several comp cars that have held records in recent years that also do not have them. I run it for down track safety in case I start writing checks I can't cash on the track.
Leon
My car did picture perfect wheel stands and could maintain center of track for a full 1/8 mile wheel stand. So do you need one. HECK NO.
Now do I have one now. Yes. I was at Rockingham running KOS. The track was horrible. I was running Tony Marculwics(surely misspelled sorry Tony) for a two out of three. It was the last round and we were tied. I got on the pedal late in the run and the car picked the left front up pretty high and did not bring it down until the laundry was out. The amount of preload in the fourlink was perfect for launches. But, could not handle the rocking action of a late hit with a lot of nitrous.
I installed an ART with the bearings and all. Ran it for years. Last year was under the car and realized the link to the housing had broken off. It had been broken long enough to have rusted pretty bad and had witness marks where it had been striking the rear end housing. I had not even noticed it. After welding it back. Resetting preload and putting the anti roll to neutral I saw no difference in 60 ft.
4-link cars at our level can do without. I know several comp cars that have held records in recent years that also do not have them. I run it for down track safety in case I start writing checks I can't cash on the track.
Leon
Posted By: pittsburghracer
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/03/14 02:16 AM
I won't go as far as to say they are not needed in some cases BUT they are a real help to those that either lack suspension experience or are afraid to make the changes to track tune their cars. Four links scare a lot of racers.
Posted By: MR_P_BODY
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/03/14 02:22 AM
Quote:
I won't go as far as to say they are not needed in some cases BUT they are a real help to those that either lack suspension experience or are afraid to make the changes to track tune their cars. Four links scare a lot of racers.
I ran my 4-link for about 1/2 a season... then put it
on... my car did pick up in the 60' but ran level
either way... I know when I broke my small anti roll
I thought the car was gonna roll over... it was BAD
Posted By: Quicktree
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/03/14 02:40 AM
Quote:I set mine up neutral, really has nothing to do with setting a 4 link. just another aid to keep both tires planted.I am going to put a set on my leaf spring car. no reason not to have them.
I won't go as far as to say they are not needed in some cases BUT they are a real help to those that either lack suspension experience or are afraid to make the changes to track tune their cars. Four links scare a lot of racers.
Posted By: gregsdart
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/03/14 05:12 AM
Quote:
everyone should have them
I agree! Anti roll systems reduce the amount of preload, if any, by a huge amount and force the energy (for the most part) equally to both tires. That has to be a good thing
Posted By: pittsburghracer
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/03/14 05:24 AM
No anti-roll bar ladderbar set-up
Posted By: pittsburghracer
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/03/14 05:26 AM
No anti-roll bar four link set-up.
Posted By: 1967dartgt
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/03/14 05:53 AM
Quote:
No anti-roll bar four link set-up.
Generally speaking ladder bars don't need them, but four links like them. I wonder how much or any the car would pick up with one?
Posted By: Eric
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/03/14 06:02 AM
Wafflebatter and I put one in the Arrow last winter. With the car being so narrow it really helped.
Posted By: 1967dartgt
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/03/14 06:06 AM
Quote:
Wafflebatter and I put one in the Arrow last winter. With the car being so narrow it really helped.
Ladder car or four link?
Posted By: rowin4
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/03/14 06:29 AM
I might put one on the 70 but the 67 launches straight enough. 
Posted By: gregsdart
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/03/14 06:40 AM
Quote:Quote:
No anti-roll bar four link set-up.
Generally speaking ladder bars don't need them, but four links like them. I wonder how much or any the car would pick up with one?
no anti roll in this picture
anti roll in the avatar pic
ladderbars. I figure I gained .02 in the 60 ft.
Posted By: TRENDZ
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/03/14 02:04 PM
My input here is this... I've watched enough crashes to see that alot of cars would benefit from anti roll bars. It seems the first thing guys do when setting up thier cars is remove the front sway bar. This is probably the worst thing you could do to a car that is traveling at the speeds we see. The problem gets compounded when you throw a ladder bar into the mix. A car with a ladder bar and no front bar usually will hit the wall. Stiffening the back without doing the same to the front may be fine when the car is in a straight line, but it can and does turn into meyhem when the car gets loose at speed. My advice is if you are adding a rear sway device, do the same to the front. This applies to "stock" front suspensions, not low/ strut cars.
As far as what rear bars do for launch, I added one after a few years of going without on a 4 link. It calmed the car down on the launch to a much more manageable line down the track, although my best 60 ft was without the bar (1.28 vs 1.29 with) The car drove down the track like a caddilac. I wouldn't build a stockish door car without one
As far as what rear bars do for launch, I added one after a few years of going without on a 4 link. It calmed the car down on the launch to a much more manageable line down the track, although my best 60 ft was without the bar (1.28 vs 1.29 with) The car drove down the track like a caddilac. I wouldn't build a stockish door car without one
Posted By: Dragula
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/03/14 04:45 PM
I will never run a four link again without one. Our car can be a real handful without it, and with it, just night and day difference.
We had some trouble setting up the four link. We finally got that set-up better, but still had some pretty good roll to the passenger side. It would roll to the passenger side on launch and then the other way on decel to the point your correcting with the steering wheel.
When we put the S&W bar on it, we rescaled the car, set the coil overs level, and adjusted the preload on the sway bar...Car leaves level, and goes thru the traps level. For me, its about safety. We had some aborted runs when the track was marginal, and since doing this, it seems like the car is easier to drive and handle.
I see even the dragsters steer to the right on the launch and have to correct all the way down the track...Do I have to have it to get down the track, No, but I will not do another without it.
We had some trouble setting up the four link. We finally got that set-up better, but still had some pretty good roll to the passenger side. It would roll to the passenger side on launch and then the other way on decel to the point your correcting with the steering wheel.
When we put the S&W bar on it, we rescaled the car, set the coil overs level, and adjusted the preload on the sway bar...Car leaves level, and goes thru the traps level. For me, its about safety. We had some aborted runs when the track was marginal, and since doing this, it seems like the car is easier to drive and handle.
I see even the dragsters steer to the right on the launch and have to correct all the way down the track...Do I have to have it to get down the track, No, but I will not do another without it.
Posted By: Eric
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/03/14 04:47 PM
Quote:Quote:
Wafflebatter and I put one in the Arrow last winter. With the car being so narrow it really helped.
Ladder car or four link?
4 link..
Posted By: Crizila
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/03/14 08:59 PM
I think a lot depends on the type of car you are running and the speeds / ET's you are running at. Short WB, low 10 / 9 second car or faster would benefit. On the other hand, Long WB, 10 second car, leaf spring suspension, might not need them. My car came factory equipped with BIG bars front and rear. For a land yacht, handled great - stayed nice and flat around turns. Removed the front bar first ( running high 11's ) and noticed no handling maladies at the track. Removed the rear bar and went to Cal-Trac springs and traction bars ( running mid 10's and upper 120's ). No change in handling. Probably dropped an easy 60 lbs by removing both bars. Never had the car get way out of shape, even in a big cross wind - probably due to a 117" WB and 3600 lbs.? Low 10's and 130's might a different story if I ever get there without breaking stuff.
if I ever get there without breaking stuff.
Posted By: dvw
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/04/14 04:15 AM
I don't use a ARB. It leaves dead level. The car handles well at speed. Stock rear frame rails with ladder bar. 1.32-1.34 60 ft. Best of 9.25@147 on 10.5's@3340.
Doug
Doug
Posted By: Quicktree
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/04/14 10:58 AM
I think some of you are missing the point. you can adjust the car to leave straight and level. the anti-roll allows you to use less adjustment thus maybe gaining a little in 60'
Posted By: gregsdart
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/04/14 03:54 PM
With my car it seemed to be the length of the ladderbar, combined with where the front mount was on the neutral line. When in the bottom hole, the ladderbar straddled the neutral line and the body roll was severe. If I moved it up away from the neutral line it calmed down.
A short instant center that straddles the neutral line must allow the left side to rise above it and gain leverage upward due to torque roll from the motor which then forces the right side down below the neutral line, and the forces feed on each other to cause severe body roll. That seems to me why some have very little need, (high torque, two speed, long instant center above the neutral line) while others don't.
I am betting that the gains seen would be related to preload needed without the anti roll, and how much of the available traction a car needs. I can see where a smallblock car with a glide and big tires would not see anything at all in a lot of cases. A nose heavy, bigblock three speed car on the other hand may gain a lot.
A short instant center that straddles the neutral line must allow the left side to rise above it and gain leverage upward due to torque roll from the motor which then forces the right side down below the neutral line, and the forces feed on each other to cause severe body roll. That seems to me why some have very little need, (high torque, two speed, long instant center above the neutral line) while others don't.
I am betting that the gains seen would be related to preload needed without the anti roll, and how much of the available traction a car needs. I can see where a smallblock car with a glide and big tires would not see anything at all in a lot of cases. A nose heavy, bigblock three speed car on the other hand may gain a lot.
Posted By: 1967dartgt
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/04/14 03:59 PM
Quote:
I don't use a ARB. It leaves dead level. The car handles well at speed. Stock rear frame rails with ladder bar. 1.32-1.34 60 ft. Best of [Email]9.25@147[/Email] on 10.5's@3340.
Doug
Now I go 5 mph less on motor then you and sixty foot the same. Do you think you are leaving et on the table? Does your class allow them?
Posted By: G_bob
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/05/14 04:52 AM
I don't have one, but plan on finally putting one in now that we have a track to run at again. Four-link car weighing in at 3550 all-in. Best of a 9.92 @ 135.
Have so much trouble hooking up on marginal track (Irwindale) with radial slicks I don't even bother going there any more.
LOT'S of body roll, but the car drives straight and true when it hooks.
Have so much trouble hooking up on marginal track (Irwindale) with radial slicks I don't even bother going there any more.
LOT'S of body roll, but the car drives straight and true when it hooks.
Posted By: 6PKRTSE
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/05/14 07:43 PM
Quote:
Getting ready to put mine in.
It is better to have one fully welded on a big h.p. rather that this style with the aluminum splined arms the splines will strip out. I have seen it happen. We fully welded mine all out of c.m. steel.
Posted By: 6PKRTSE
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/05/14 07:44 PM
Another shot of the whole assembly.
Posted By: Guitar Jones
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/05/14 09:17 PM
Quote:
I don't have one, but plan on finally putting one in now that we have a track to run at again. Four-link car weighing in at 3550 all-in. Best of a 9.92 @ 135.
Have so much trouble hooking up on marginal track (Irwindale) with radial slicks I don't even bother going there any more.
LOT'S of body roll, but the car drives straight and true when it hooks.
My car leaves like that too, and I have a bunch of preload in the upper right bar. Goes straight down the track though. I'm going to put one on mine too.
Suggestions for whose bar is better are welcome.
Posted By: MR_P_BODY
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/05/14 09:25 PM
I use the S&W one
Posted By: gregsdart
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/05/14 09:28 PM
Quote:
I don't have one, but plan on finally putting one in now that we have a track to run at again. Four-link car weighing in at 3550 all-in. Best of a 9.92 @ 135.
Have so much trouble hooking up on marginal track (Irwindale) with radial slicks I don't even bother going there any more.
LOT'S of body roll, but the car drives straight and true when it hooks.
You should see some gains on your car with an anti roll, especially with radial slicks that are being over powered as it is. I had to go to less air to get some hook, and lost the 60 foot after about 25 passes. It went away by .06 to .07 almost instantly. I suspect I should have tried switching the tires side to side, but switched to a bias for safety reasons.
Posted By: Sammy
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/05/14 09:44 PM
Will a anti roll bar help with a cross wind?
Posted By: 6PKRTSE
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/05/14 09:52 PM
Note on mine we used oil lite bronze for bushings & drilled tapped for a grease zerk fittings to keep it lubed. It will bind with time if not lubed. This saves from having to take it all back apart to do so each time.
Posted By: Quicktree
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/05/14 11:36 PM
Quote:ART makes a good one only get the heavy duty ones, the aluminum ones will cause you trouble.Quote:
I don't have one, but plan on finally putting one in now that we have a track to run at again. Four-link car weighing in at 3550 all-in. Best of a 9.92 @ 135.
Have so much trouble hooking up on marginal track (Irwindale) with radial slicks I don't even bother going there any more.
LOT'S of body roll, but the car drives straight and true when it hooks.
My car leaves like that too, and I have a bunch of preload in the upper right bar. Goes straight down the track though. I'm going to put one on mine too.
Suggestions for whose bar is better are welcome.
Posted By: Quicktree
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/05/14 11:41 PM
Quote:anything that helps stabilize the car should help
Will a anti roll bar help with a cross wind?
Posted By: dvw
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/06/14 12:12 AM
Quote:Quote:
I don't use a ARB. It leaves dead level. The car handles well at speed. Stock rear frame rails with ladder bar. 1.32-1.34 60 ft. Best of [Email]9.25@147[/Email] on 10.5's@3340.
Doug
Now I go 5 mph less on motor then you and sixty foot the same. Do you think you are leaving et on the table? Does your class allow them?
You bet I'm leaving some on the table. But I don't think it's suspension. The car dead hooks. It would hook in a mud puddle. I have the entire suspension very tight, front and rear. Lack of low end power for what ever reason. In order, 4.10, converter to tight, huge plenum, box stock Eddy carbs. Car was brand new last year. Spent plenty of time dialing it for index and being consistent. Now I'll be on to the next step. It should go mid to high 1.20, 5.70? in the 1/8, 9.0? Maybe not either but I'll defiantly be chasing it.
Doug
Posted By: Ohio Joe
Re: Anti roll bars who has them? - 03/06/14 03:43 AM
Q S Components was where we bought ours, very happy with it. All CM steel.