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Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this...

Posted By: mopartony

Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/13/13 08:27 PM

Ok here is issue.

I have not tried to start my Duster in close to 18 months. It cranks with no issue and no "funny noises".

The issue happens when I put power to it to start. It cranks maybe 3/4 a turn the seems like it is about to start, it then stops dead. Like it is locked. Let off the start button and try again, same thing happens.

The timing is on as it ran when I parked it unless it jumped a tooth or something but don't think that happened. I pulled one valve cover and everything seems to be in order.

I did not see anything in the valley, still need to pull the other side but do not expect to see anything. As it cranks until it seems it is about to start.

The starter is tight, I have not checked the convertor bolts or the flex plate bolts yet but they should be tight as they are lock tighted in. I will check them tonight when I get home.

I'm stumped on this.
Posted By: Challenger 1

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/13/13 08:31 PM

Pull all the plugs and crank it over and see if it is better.
Posted By: Guitar Jones

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/13/13 08:32 PM

The battery is weak.
Posted By: rowin4

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/13/13 08:36 PM

If your battery is charged up, I'd pull the plus and see what runs out.
Posted By: Cab_Burge

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/13/13 08:36 PM

Pull all eight spark plugs, if you haven't yet, and try that If it cranks good, really fast, look under the hood to see if any liquids squirted out or not Another thing to check is the battery voltage before and during cranking
Posted By: mopartony

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/13/13 08:39 PM

It cranks freely. When I turn the MSD on is when this issue happens.

It is a 16V system, it cranks. The battery is fully charged, been on float charge in controled environment so should not be an issue there.

I will pull all plugs and see what comes out.

Thanks and keep them coming.
Posted By: Leon441

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/13/13 09:20 PM

Weak battery.

With no charger or anything check the voltage. It should read at least 16.5 volts if fully charged. Then just turn the MSD on and check the voltage again. It should still read at least 16 volts.

If it flunks these test either your charger or battery is dead.

Leon
Posted By: mopartony

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/13/13 09:44 PM

Will do Leon, thanks.

I will be home in a couple hours and check right away...

I will report as soon as I know.
Posted By: SomeCarGuy

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/13/13 10:47 PM

Weak starter? Might have corroded while sitting?
Posted By: mopartony

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/13/13 10:50 PM

Another thing I will check. thanks,
Posted By: Al_Alguire

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/13/13 11:33 PM

Sounds like a battery issue...FWIW I just killed my third 16 volt battery this weekend. I believe due to the charger not going into "float" mode as all show signs of overcharging. 16 Volt batteries wont work well at much under 16 volts..
Posted By: mopartony

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/14/13 03:20 PM

Thanks, Al.

Well when I got home lastnight I pulled the charger off the battery. The charger was off so it was in float mode, so no worries there on going to float mode.

I waited an hour to check the battery. It was at 17+ volts. So that was good. I then pulled the other valve cover to check the rockers and to see if there was any broken parts laying in the valley. Nothing out of place.

Next was to pull the plugs and see what I see. I pulled the plugs and they were wet. really wet, like shaking them out and liquid came out of them. It was fuel, no water. I found this funny as when I tried to start it the other day, I only pumped the gas 2 times. What I usually do to start the car. Now this is a freshly built carb so nothing was leaking out or anything.

I rolled the motor with plugs out and got sprayed for my effort. All fuel. So rolled it for a few seconds and left it alone for an hour to try.

The only thing I can think of is when I tried to start it in November the old carb just dumped fuel into the motor. I did not think it was possible for fuel to sit and not evaporate in 3 months with no carb and only a towel over the opening.

I put the plugs in, rolled it until I got oil pressure and hit the MSD. 2 pumps of the gas and she lit up right away. I was very happy.

Thanks, for the help. It was an easy fix thankfully.
Posted By: sixpackgut

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/14/13 03:57 PM

fuel hydrolocked motor, that sounds expensive
Posted By: BBR

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/14/13 03:58 PM

Change your oil!!!! It's probably all gassed up!
Posted By: Challenger 1

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/14/13 04:00 PM

I wouldn't call it fixed, you need to find out why it happened.
Posted By: mopartony

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/14/13 04:37 PM

The why is easy, the old carb was dumping fuel. E-85 is rough on parts. The new carb does not leak as I was trying start it and I let it sit with the fuel pump running for a few minutes. So the new carb is doing it's job and not leaking.

I will be changing the oil over the weekend. No worries there....
Posted By: Challenger 1

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/14/13 04:47 PM

Be aware that E 85 attracts water and will cause rust in the cylinders.
Posted By: 68valiant68

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/14/13 05:11 PM

Better keep an ear on it!!! Did the same thing to much fuel while installing new fuel pump, when it hydroed it cracked the crank and hurt a few rod bearings
Posted By: Sammy

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/14/13 06:13 PM

Do9ne it a few times also.check your fuel regulator before you put new plugs in and change the oil.don't. Want it to happen again
Posted By: MRMOPAR622

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/14/13 06:18 PM

Quote:

Sounds like a battery issue...FWIW I just killed my third 16 volt battery this weekend. I believe due to the charger not going into "float" mode as all show signs of overcharging. 16 Volt batteries wont work well at much under 16 volts..




Well my 2nd 16 volt battery also died this weekend also. I use a Turbo-Start charger(now have a Rock 16 volt battery),it charges and when finished I take it off charge,was think maybe I needed a charger that would go into float mode that I could leaved hook up all the time,but I see that's not the answer either.

Anyone have any helpful input on charging or the up-keep of these 16 volt batteries?That is the only problem with the 16 volt batteries. The only useful info. I really have is the Rock 16 volt seems to be the strongest.
Posted By: 74yellowduster

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/14/13 06:36 PM

another thing... i think you should only have about 6.5 to 7 psi of fuel pressure for carbs. any more and it likes to force gas past the float valves and cause all kinds of leaking and other nasty problems. you might want to check that out. the little fuel pressure gauges only cost about 10 bucks.
Posted By: Sammy

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/14/13 07:41 PM

Quote:

another thing... i think you should only have about 6.5 to 7 psi of fuel pressure for carbs. any more and it likes to force gas past the float valves and cause all kinds of leaking and other nasty problems. you might want to check that out. the little fuel pressure gauges only cost about 10 bucks.




After your battery is fully charged by the turbo start charger after your battery is fully charged buy the turbo start maintainer
Posted By: mopartony

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/14/13 09:26 PM

I have the full XS power set up. Charger, alt and Battery. MY XS charger has had no issues and goes to float with no issues. I know someone else who has the same set up and has had no issues with the charger, the batteries on the other had there was but the latest set he has works fine the last 2 years. I'm happy with my choice.

My fuel pressure is 6.5 at idle or at WOT.

I will be putting new plugs in the motor when I change the oil this weekend.

Yes the E-85 does attract water but not like alchol does. There did not seem to be any water in the fuel I got out of the cylinders. But that was only looking.
Posted By: Cab_Burge

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/15/13 12:05 AM

If I was you I would pull the heads off of the motor and check the deck hieghts on all 8 cylinders, trying to comp[ress liquids can bend the dog snout out of metal The first motor I saw get hydraulic was a new 1962 Pontiac Grand Prix that the son of the gas station I worked in squirted some water down the carb. while the owner was trying to start it after we steamed clean it, it bent a rod and lock that motor up tight, while spinning over Good luck, I hope it isn't hurt BTW, I'm glad you didn't have a fire while spinning it over, I forgot to tell you to disable the ignition while cranking it over with the plugs out
Posted By: mopartony

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/15/13 12:58 AM

The electrical is all on spearate switches. I can roll the motor from inside the car or the bump in the engine compartment. The MSD is on it's own switch so it was off while cranking no issues there.

I do not think anything is bent. thankfully. It started, got some heat and reved fine. Just need to tune the new carb.
Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/15/13 01:28 AM

I dont think you bent anything Tony... it was spinning
before you flipped the ignition on(I think your battery
was low or maybe even bad) but either way it was turning
over... if it would have stopped on the first revolution
then I would look at it..... JMO
Posted By: mopartony

Re: Engine crank issue...I'm scratching my head on this... - 02/15/13 05:58 PM

It rolled easily without the MSD on and really nicely with no plugs....

I also don't think anything is bent. The only issue/concern I had when it was running was the #2 cyl header tube was a little cold. like it is not firing all the time. I will change the plug to another hole and see if that changes things. Should eliminate if it is plug or wire.

Going to change the oil do a little clean up and look over on it tomorrow and just enjoy working on the car again...

May have to introduce the area too...
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