Moparts

what temp thermostat

Posted By: sixpackgut

what temp thermostat - 02/03/12 05:58 PM

i need to put a thermostat in the cuda.

what are your opinions on what temp would be best?
running pump gas

Posted By: 70blackfish

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/03/12 06:02 PM

I run a 160f and my car runs 170-180f

Posted By: dragram440

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/03/12 06:43 PM

I also run a 160 and car usually runs 160. If all your cooling parts are sized properly it should run the temp of the thermostat.

Posted By: sixpackgut

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/03/12 07:09 PM

it runs about 160. my problem is it takes a 25 mile beating to get it to that point.

i was interested to hear if someone thinks 160 is to cold. only reason i'm asking is because the auto parts stores says a 195 stat is stock and i thought that was kindof high

i didnt have these problems when the engine was in the challenger. i guess no fenderwells and the dual pass rad make a big difference

Posted By: therocks

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/03/12 07:40 PM

We run 180s in all the old stuff.Thy all run at just about that temp.My 440 is super radical and OE rad.Still runs 180 all day.Rocky

Posted By: Cab_Burge

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/03/12 07:58 PM

I run a 160 with three 1/8 inch holes drilled through the outer lip to allow air out when filling the cooling system

Posted By: dragram440

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/03/12 09:21 PM

Quote:

I run a 160 with three 1/8 inch holes drilled through the outer lip to allow air out when filling the cooling system

Thats a good idea. Does it seem to change the running temp at all?

Posted By: sixpackgut

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/03/12 09:59 PM

i choose a 180 high flow over the 160. we'll see how it goes and i drill holes when i run a stat

Posted By: dragram440

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/03/12 10:08 PM

I have tried the high flow ones and the standard ones and never saw any difference.

Posted By: rickraw

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/03/12 11:07 PM

alot depends on ur cooling system,(rad size). i run a 180. no over heating issues. a 160 doesn't keep the water in the rad long enough to cool. that's what tech said at becool.

seeya.

Posted By: 70Cuda383

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/03/12 11:35 PM

I think for Max power, 160. For optimum engine wear, 195. Best balance for spirited street driving, 180

I had a high flow expensive performance stat, it never would warm up--I think the water pump would push it open too early.

Went to a cheap $6 stant, and it ran at 180. But my E fan was 190 on, 175 off, so I went to a 160 stat do the fan would actuall cycle on and off. It never went over 190 in town, and would hold 160 on the freeway

Posted By: 440dart

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/04/12 02:25 AM

Quote:

alot depends on ur cooling system,(rad size). i run a 180. no over heating issues. a 160 doesn't keep the water in the rad long enough to cool. that's what tech said at becool. seeya.

WOW! this rumor rears its ugly head again

Posted By: StealthWedge67

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/04/12 02:33 AM

Quote:

alot depends on ur cooling system,(rad size). i run a 180. no over heating issues. a 160 doesn't keep the water in the rad long enough to cool. that's what tech said at becool. seeya.

With all due respect to BeCool, this "tech" should go back to flipping burgers. He clearly doesn't understand how a thermostat works.

Posted By: rickraw

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/04/12 02:42 AM

why would u say that???

Posted By: rustbuckett68

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/04/12 04:44 AM

In the late 70's, I was running a '69 Fargo with a 383 built to RR specs with a 'Street Hemi' cam, intake, 780, headers, etc, and even after having the rad re-cored, it ran hot with a 160 Tstat. An older mechanic told me to run a 190 so the fluid would stay in the rad longer. After that, it ran at about 180-190, no matter what I did to it. Seemed to make sense.

Posted By: challengermike

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/04/12 05:15 AM

if your cooling system is up to par it should run close to what the t stat degree is. Also shouldnt matter what degree stat you have your car will get to temp the same amount of time. the stat will just open at the temp to send the water threw the rad to start the cooling process.If you watch a temp gauge you will see the temp drop when it first opens,after that it will stay open and its the rad and fans job to keep it the temp around when the t stat opened. If its hanging open it will take longer or never heat up if the cooling system is doing its job properly.

Posted By: ahy

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/04/12 06:15 AM

Cooler temps help power slightly - 160F is best. Hotter temps reduce bore wear, 195 is best. For street or mixed street/strip, 180F may be the best compromise. That's what I run.

Posted By: cheapstreetdustr

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/04/12 05:13 PM

Quote:

Quote:

alot depends on ur cooling system,(rad size). i run a 180. no over heating issues. a 160 doesn't keep the water in the rad long enough to cool. that's what tech said at becool. seeya.

WOW! this rumor rears its ugly head again

so chemistry and physics is bogus?

Posted By: rickraw

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/04/12 05:57 PM

what do u mean??

Posted By: 440dart

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/05/12 07:25 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

alot depends on ur cooling system,(rad size). i run a 180. no over heating issues. a 160 doesn't keep the water in the rad long enough to cool. that's what tech said at becool. seeya.

WOW! this rumor rears its ugly head again

so chemistry and physics is bogus?

This right from Griffins web site

One thing to be careful of though, when designing your system and using a thermostat, is to ensure your water pump has an internal bypass circuit (refer back to #6 in the flow diagrams above). Most do, but some aftermarket high-flow racing pumps do not. For these pumps, a special thermostat with a bypass hole is used, or the user drills their own bypass holes in the thermostat (typically one to three 3/16" holes) so that the system can flow when the thermostat is closed.

If you choose to run without a thermostat, do not use a restrictor. The restrictor will do nothing for you except reduce coolant flow which ultimately reduces cooling.

Years ago restrictors were popular for two reasons that do not hold true today. First, as we have discussed, older radiator designs (large cross-sectional area copper tubes) were poor at promoting the necessary coolant turbulence in the radiator, so a restrictor was used to cause the coolant to begin tumbling as it exited the engine and entered the radiator. Secondly, with engines that had the thermostat located in the outlet of the engine combined with down-flow radiators that had a fairly low pressure radiator cap on the high pressure inlet side, if the thermostat was removed the increased pressure seen by the cap from the water pump could cause the cap's rating to be exceeded and the valve to open and purge coolant. Since this opening of the rad cap is what regulates system pressure, it meant that the overall system pressure would now be lower - the cap would open sooner than if the thermostat were in place holding backpressure in the cylinder head. Since system pressure was now lower, coolant vapour point was lower, and therefore the coolant's ability to effectively carry-off heat from the engine at higher temps reduced. This in turn would result in eventual overheating. Many folks erroneously assumed that the overheating was due to the coolant flowing through the radiator too quickly with the thermostat removed, that it didn't have time to cool in the rad. As a result, restrictors were used to "slow the flow of the coolant" and the car stopped overheating. Unfortunately, these folks didn't understand the real cause and effect of the overheating that they experienced after removing the thermostat, and this led to two enduring myths that persist today.

What was really happening was that the removal of the thermostat didn't cause the coolant to flow too fast to cool (we know this is an impossibility), but rather caused a condition where either system pressure (and therefore coolant vapour point) was lowered or where the rad purged coolant which caused the car to overheat. The end result was the same - the car overheated - but the cause and effect were confused and so the myths that a) removing a thermostat can cause a car to overheat and b) coolant can be pumped too fast through a radiator to cool properly began. Neither of these are true.

Of course, today's cross-flow radiators that locate the rad cap on the low-pressure side, do not subject the rad cap to the maximum pressure created by the water pump and so are not susceptible to the pump forcing coolant past the rad cap. We also know now that all systems benefit from maximum flow - never from reducing flow.

Ultimately, reducers reduce the flow of coolant which actually hurts system cooling efficiency, not improves it.

Posted By: 70Cuda383

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/05/12 02:56 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

alot depends on ur cooling system,(rad size). i run a 180. no over heating issues. a 160 doesn't keep the water in the rad long enough to cool. that's what tech said at becool. seeya.

WOW! this rumor rears its ugly head again

so chemistry and physics is bogus?

No. Chemistry and Physics are NOT bogus.

But, if the water passes through the radiator "too fast to cool off" then I guess it's also passing through the engine "too fast to heat up," right?

the longer it sits in the engine, the hotter it gets, the longer it sits in the radiator, the colder it gets. pass the water through the engine faster, it won't get as hot, but then also won't carry as much heat (per gallon) into the radiator to cool down. however, you're still transferring the same joules of heat per minute into the water, and transferring the same joules of heat per minute into the radiator/ambient air. the only difference is how many gallons of water are flowing through your engine as you do it.

Posted By: The Shocker

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/06/12 01:02 AM

I run a 180 in my Dart and it always runs its best ET when i leave the line at 190.I will turn the fan off sometimes in the water box to make it heat up to 190 if its not much of a line in the staging lanes.Time slips dont lie .Back to back runs it will pick up .04-.05 in the 1/8 at 190 over 180 (as i have tested it many times).On a street car i run a 160 ...

Posted By: Paul_Fancsali

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/06/12 04:42 AM

195 other then dead of summer then 180

Posted By: cheapstreetdustr

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/06/12 05:11 AM

if your running a car new than 92 ish it might have an aluminum radiator. however like the cuda in the picture it would be pertinant to ask if its an copper radiator or a newer aluminum style radiator. as your explaination from griffin would be related to a modern aluminum...
also some engines are reverse flow to heads first then to block to radiator.
next would be to assume the radiator in the vehicle is of appropriate size and or the fan is efficient.
if the cooling hardware being employed is not sufficient than you will get heat soak if your not running a t-stat
lots of cars have old copper radiators that fit the chassis from the factory .then they for example put a big block in a car that has a small block sized radiator.
or over bore cyl walls that factors in..or raise compression..
not to exclude running alcohol as fuel that is a factor as it runs cooler

the griffin example as i read it refers to their radiators...which are more modern aluminum and most often oversized..
so all things being equal i would still stand on my conviction...
heat soak can be a factor with out a t-stat or even with a t-stat if the system isnt sized properly or efficient for the application

not knowing these things and making an judgement would be an assumption

and at this point we are still ignoring the whole premise to his question..which is what is a good,adequate or best temp to maintain for his application..the only way to maintain a constant temp is with a t-stat..
i might say..if its an iron head iron block
id go 175-180 depending on carb or carbs.
if its a high compression or supercharged i might say 160 or if your at high elevation ..
if its aluminum headed i might say go with 185 or 195 ..
ditto if its an alcohol fuel.

Posted By: TomZ

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/06/12 06:20 AM

I was just wondering the same thing. The 1971 Chrysler service manual says the thermostat should be 185 degrees. But Napa, AutoZone and O'Reilly's only carry 160, 180, and 195. They all claim 195 is OEM temp., but not according to my manual. For a nearly stock 318 motor, think its better to run 180 because that's closest to 185, or run 195 because a little hotter is better than colder?

Posted By: Cab_Burge

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/06/12 07:22 PM

Quote:

I was just wondering the same thing. The 1971 Chrysler service manual says the thermostat should be 185 degrees. But Napa, AutoZone and O'Reilly's only carry 160, 180, and 195. They all claim 195 is OEM temp., but not according to my manual. For a nearly stock 318 motor, think its better to run 180 because that's closest to 185, or run 195 because a little hotter is better than colder?

Cold motors wear, ot motors don't

Thats what I ahve been told by many engineers and old time mechanics

Posted By: StealthWedge67

Re: what temp thermostat - 02/06/12 07:47 PM

If we're talking about at what point a motor would start to allow blow-by past the rings, and just basically be "worn out", Is it safe to assume that the difference we're looking at is the 180* motor goes 130k - 150k miles, while the 160* motor maybe showing the same wear by 100k. (???)

Most posters in this forum are asking about hobby type motors that are in weekend cars, and would take 50 years to see 100k mi. I doubt the wear issue is a factor in these discussions.

I run a 160 stat in my car because I've seen evidence at the strip that tells me it makes more power there than it does at 180. Also, with a 160 stat, if I get stuck in traffic (or idling through the staging lanes) on a hot day and my temp climbs, It takes a while to get to 200. If I start at 180 and get stuck in the same traffic, It's a much shorter window I have before its at 200.