EV resale values are falling..........fast

'The adoption of electric vehicles in the United States has hit a pothole.

While the overall percentage of EVs on the road continues to climb — sales reached a record of 7.6% of the U.S. vehicle market in 2023 — resale values are going in the opposite direction.

“Prices for used EVs have been falling in recent months, especially compared to what we saw just a year or so ago when not only were used EV prices high, but some vehicles were also selling for close to new prices or even more,” says KTLA 5 technology reporter Rich DeMuro.

In 2023, prices for the top 10 best-selling battery cars in the U.S. fell an average of 28%, according to data from CarGurus compiled by HSBC.

On the surface, this might seem like good news for those waiting for the right moment to purchase their first electric vehicle. Unfortunately, this sharp decline in resale value points to several problems inherent to EVs that can’t be overcome in the short term.'

https://ktla.com/news/california/why-are-used-ev-prices-cratering-right-now-its-complicated

I must disagree. It's NOT complicated. They are too expensive, too complicated, too limited in range, have too few charging options, have no tolerance for cold weather, have too many unknowns as to longevity, and are just plain not ready for prime time for most of us.

Well written Dave, couldn't agree more!

Prices for used EVs have been falling in recent months, especially compared to what we saw just a year or so ago when not only were used EV prices high, but some vehicles were also selling for close to new prices or even more,” says KTLA 5 technology reporter Rich DeMuro.

In 2023, prices for the top 10 best-selling battery cars in the U.S. fell an average of 28%, according to data from CarGurus compiled by HSBC.


Isn't the above following the resale values of gas cars for the last 50yrs?
Drops 30% once you drive it off the lot?
Now EVs are doing the same, and not holding value?

Twenty five percent or more for initial depreciation is all too typical for many automobiles. What the article does not specify is whether their depreciation numbers are only for initial depreciation or do they include continued depreciation.

One thing that has been constant though, is that about 25% of EV buyers return to petrol powered vehicles for their next vehicle. And that is for the 'initial adopters' who tend to be the most ardent supporters.

Tesla Cybertruck owners have complained that their electric pickup truck broke down after going through a car wash. After driving the $80,000 (Rs 66 lakh approximately) Cybertruck for just two months, and with less than 3,400 miles (5,500 km) on the clock, an owner claimed the truck broke down after washing off some sand after going to the beach, as per a report in the Independent.

The user @captain.ad on TikTok posted a video of his malfunctioning Cybertruck and explained that he tried to reset it but was unable to get it to function. The vehicle was called a "tin can," a "lemon," and a "paperweight" by internet users, who also made fun of the fact that although it seems bulletproof, it is not waterproof.

Two buttons on the steering wheel caused a five-hour computer reset, which eventually got the broken-down Cybertruck operating again. The user said, "What (Tesla) said was, 'It is a known issue in the Cybertruck that when you do a screen reset, instead of resetting in the standard two minutes, it takes five hours'."

Notably, the electric car manufacturer lists several warnings and risks involved with washing the vehicle in the owner's manual of the Cybertruck. It includes a warning not to wash it in direct sunlight and tips on how to avoid damaging it while having your car washed. As per the outlet, the manual states, "Failure to put Cybertruck in Car Wash Mode may result in damage (for example, to the charge port or windshield wipers). Damage caused by car washes is not covered by the warranty."

www.ndtv.com/world-news/tesla-cyber...hicle-not-working-after-car-wash-5505843

The masses were never wanting an EV. The government mandated it and incentivized their production, the politicians, paid youtubers and media from local to Nationwide hyped it and the MFGRS were only too happy to rush design/manufacture them. Fanboys of all ages bragged them up and even argue intensely the superiority of Battery over ICE. Yet ironically- just like the politicians- fanboys do not own or utilize an EV themselves.

Hertz dumping a bunch of EV's on the used car market didn't help.

Look up Fisker Auto. They dropped their prices on cars that are sitting on lots BIG TIME to try and raise enough cash to pay loan interest in the short term. Their stock traded yesterday at ......ready for this......$0.055 per share. That's right. 5.5 CENTS per share. They have cars sitting on lots and nobody wants them. On the plus side, they are also currently being investigated for faulty door locks that will not let you OUT of the car. What's not to like, right?

His second phony pump and dump "car company" to go bankrupt

all i can say is : BOOOFARGIN"HOOOO FOR YOU !
there are only limited applications where electric vehicles can work for the public, and if the stupid among us think electric vehicles are the "cure", then they deserve all the bad experiences they endure.

Ford losing a zillion dollars on them doesn't help, either.

https://edition.cnn.com/2024/04/24/business/ford-earnings-ev-losses/index.html

" Ford’s electric vehicle unit reported that losses soared in the first quarter to $1.3 billion, or $132,000 for each of the 10,000 vehicles it sold in the first three months of the year, helping to drag down earnings for the company overall.

Ford, like most automakers, has announced plans to shift from traditional gas-powered vehicles to EVs in coming years. But it is the only traditional automaker to break out results of its retail EV sales. And the results it reported Wednesday show another sign of the profit pressures on the EV business at Ford and other automakers.

The EV unit, which Ford calls Model e, sold 10,000 vehicles in the quarter, down 20% from the number it sold a year earlier. And its revenue plunged 84% to about $100 million, which Ford attributed mostly to price cuts for EVs across the industry. That resulted in the $1.3 billion loss before interest and taxes (EBIT), and the massive per-vehicle loss in the Model e unit."

Let's not forget some states wanting to invent road taxes for them. An eventuality for everything but right out of the gate puts a damper on it.

if the E trucks can't handle a car wash, how will it work out in places where it has to sit outside in the rain? Many thunderstorms have more wind driven water then any car wash could ever dream of.

I have no sympathy for someone who bought an EV and then has regrets. Saving the planet from evil fossil fuel powered combustion engines takes sacrifice. If one bought into the lies and hype and ignored the facts then too bad. Deal with the nonexistent infrastructure, slow charging, unreliability and high expense of the farce EV.

There's a Tesla that's been parked FOR SALE in front of a produce store near me - probably the store owners' car - been there for a month now. Let's see - a used Tesla. Wanna buy it? Does it have any problems? Owner says "it runs great - no problems!" Do you believe him? Hmm, let's pop the hood & take a look - let's hear the engine. Oh wait - it's an EV. Let's look at the battery - can't see it - it's underneath the floor pan of the car. Does the battery look OK?

So, you take a flyer & buy it for what - $25-grand?. A week later, the car won't move - it just bricked-up. WTH? Needs to go in for repairs. Will your local repair shop look at it? Nope. Gotta go to a Tesla dealer. Where the heck IS a Tesla dealer near me? 25 miles away - OK. Call a flatbed & it gets towed in. Two days later, dealer calls - no warranty on the car - bought it used. Cost to repair $25,000.

Yep - let's go EV.

it wouldn't be quite so bad if if the EV crowd would acknowledge what it REALLY takes to manufacture, then run, those type[s] of vehicles.
of course that won't happen any time soon [if ever]..............
we all know battery replacement [and disposal] ain't like changing the D-cells in your flashlight, and a home charge station that works properly to charge the battery and not destroy it or shorten it's life span dramatically, ain't done by plugging in a dollar store extension cord into any old 110v receptacle that's close to the vehicle.

Anybody who buys a Tesla should have psych eval because something is not right. UGLY bubble top 4 door
It will be interesting when these things get to be around 15 years old and the battery need to be replaced. See how well they sell then.

i may wager the battery needs replaced way before 15 years, due to bad charging practices.

The biggest barrier for me is real-world battery replacement life.

My daily driver is a Subaru with a shade under 300,000 miles, my son's daily driver is a 2000 model-year. So obviously I like to run my vehicles a long time. Doing my part to keep my carbon footprint low.

I know what happens to the Lithium Ion batteries in personal electronics after the charging cycles start to add up. The capacity gets lower and lower until they are virtually unusable. I'm waiting to see how long/how many miles the car batteries really last before they need to be replaced. On some models the cost of battery replacement could be much more than the car is worth--and won't be a DIY job... Buying a new electric car every 8 years because its battery is worn out is not my idea of sustainability

It's a niche market. And a very small one.
Americans love their freedom to fill the gas tank and roll anywhere they want.
It's not going away.

Dig up a /6 powered "something" and screw em on this glorified golf cart BS

speaking of the "leaning tower of power", has anyone done [or know of one done] a maximum gas mileage engine build of one, and if so, what vehicle was it installed in and what were the results ?

There used to be a guy on the Slant board who did that with a 69 Dart. He built an economy motor, had a 5 speed adapted in, and did a bunch of experiments with aero on it. He drove a ton of miles evety day for work. Seems lkke he got close to 30mpg with it.

My brother has had an electric car for 8 years and he's been happy with it. Free charging. Parks it on the street at his place, commutes once a month about 300 miles roundtrip. Otherwise just drives around town doing dad things. Resale is bad but he just keeps driving it as the car is still nice and drives well.

I was thinking of getting one myself as I am getting about 14mpg in my car and even though I just drive around town mostly with gas nearing $7/gal (thanks, California 🤬) the fuel bill is really adding up. I don't like the idea of a fully electric car yet and may never but am thinking about a plug-in hybrid. I can put a solar setup with a battery on my garage (no permit needed), charge up the car overnight, and pretty much only need to buy gas if I am going on a longer trip. Almost all my driving now is taking the kids here, taking them there, going to lunch, going to Target, going to the grocery store, meeting up with friends, etc. All of this is putt putting around our little fake island where the max roundtrip anywhere is 15 miles.

I am looking at a 2023 or 2024 Mitsubishi Highlander SUV which can go 38 miles electric-only after which the gas engine kicks in. I don't drive 38 miles in a day and this would work out perfectly for me. When I need a gas engine, it's there waiting. For my regular driving, though, it's all electric powered through a solar setup. I am just waiting for the 2023s to hit the rental-car-resale market in a few months (which will depress prices for that SUV across the board, like what is happening with Tesla 3s right now).

I might regret it but I bet I don't.

Years ago I was driving a 64 300 around as my DD. Some clowns asked me why I didn't sell it and get something that got better mileage. Told them I wouldn't save enough on gas mileage to even break even on a car payment, much less the increased insurance.

The abyss stared back at me.

Yes, it was in California too.

I currently drive a 51 Plymouth around as my DD. Full coverage is $500 a year. I get about 17 mpg around town, which is where I pretty much all I drive it exclusively.

No hybrid/EV is going to save me any money,

Back in 1978, General Motors came out with a diesel engine. The very troublesome, 5.7 diesel engine. Within 10 years, it was nearly impossible to find a buyer for a diesel powered car!! At this point, it looks like the EV market will likely turn out in a similar manner. It might take a little longer this time though.

Sometimes the proponents of new technology fail to make a practical application of their ideas. In my opinion, these EV's are a great example of this situation. There are MANY issues with these vehicles that need to be worked out before they can be used as practical transportation for most people. (As most of us on this web board recognize!)

A similar situation exists with fuel economy standards. To meet high fuel economy standards, auto makers have made cars smaller. The height and waistline of the average American has been growing larger in recent decades. Building smaller cars for larger people means fewer people will fit into the cars. Those who do not fit in the tiny cars will buy larger SUV's and pick-up trucks, which use more fuel. So the quest for reduce fuel consumption backfires and actually increases fuel consumption. Common sense seems to be lacking in such decisions!

Electric vehicles can be a good choice for a FEW people. I read a story about a guy who bought a well used Prius with a weak battery for not much more than the price of a junk car. His goal was to have a beater car to drive to work. He installed some gulf cart batteries in it (This reduced his driving range, but that did not matter since he lived close to his job.). He installed a charging system using solar panels for power. He worked at night, so the car could charge all day long. He reported that he could easily drive to work and do a few errands on his way home with the Prius. His fuel cost was essentially zero. His total investment in the car was quite low. And the most important benefit: he did not worry about anyone vandalizing or stealing the ugly old Prius while he worked. The car worked out very well for him, in his situation. Obviously, most people have a very different lifestyle, so the needs of most folks will be different than his needs.

That just goes to prove the old adage: 'There's a butt for every seat'.

Life is too short (my feelings) to drive a beater around all the time. We have one time around here - drive what you want if you can afford it. I like my 2017 Hemi Ram, my 2016 300, & my 2016 SPS Challenger. And my AAR & '72 Cuda 340.

my buddy just leased a 24 caddy liriq- 62k msrp, dealer demo with 1000miles on the odometer - 24mos lease , 380 a month with 3k down - smokin deal if u can live with a 300mile range, and the slow charge with a 110V charger...

Good deal but 300 miles under ideal conditions and all the bells and whistles in a caddy turned off.

What is one to do if they want to go somewhere over 150 miles from home, rent a different car for the trip? Ain't happening to this guy.

Looks like you live in the northeast. Get back to us this winter and let us know how his $62,000 Cadillac fairs.

www.consumerreports.org/cars/hybrid...-affect-an-evs-driving-range-a5751769461

SUPER deals right now on the Fisker products. Assuming you can figure out how to fix them yourself once the company goes bankrupt. Currently trading on the NYSE at $0.052/share. Jump on now while you can.

LOL....break a door hinge, they total the car. This sure seems 'efficient' to me

https://carbuzz.com/fisker-ocean-totaled-over-broken-hinge/

I just saw an article today that the Lyriq is one of the few EVs that are seeing increased sales. You can get must faster chargers than a 110v version.

I just checked and our local dealer has thirteen in stock which is almost unheard of here in oil country.

Contrary to popular belief EVs are still selling just not at the rate they were at one time. In my opinion they can make sense for some folks but they are for sure not for everyone.

haha... it has 500hp, and he wanted to see how quick it was, hit the gas and it pinned him, and he watched the miles remaining go down.... and yep in the winter it def goes down- as to getting a quicker charger, that works if u r going ev for this and your next vehicle - he says the 110V charge gives u 2 to 2 1/2 miles per hr of charging - after 10hrs he had and add. 22miles... but if u only stay local and need a new vehicle , 385 a month is dirt cheap...

Any of you mathamajicians that think an EV is 'cheap' has to realize that once the government gets everyone in one, then they have full control. How do you envision they are going to collect road tax that currently NOBODY driving an EV is paying????? Think this thru folks.

GPS tracking. Michigan is exploring the idea and Utah and Oregon are doing it.

I’ve been saying that for many years. GPS will be linked to registration, and eventually include mileage tax, road tolling, and even speeding tickets. And of course knowing where US citizens are and we’re they are going. Control, all about control.

Nope. No extra fees are collected on EVs to go towards roads. Nothing at all.

https://money.com/states-ev-fees-200-dollars/

Or for a deeper dive: https://www.atlasevhub.com/data_story/ev-drivers-in-36-states-pay-a-surplus-of-fees-each-year/

I read through the second link there Hoozie, and the entire study is highly questionable because of this premise:



The author is making assumptions based on future protentional customers, whom many of which are currently priced out of the market for BEV.

Off-peak to peak rates around here are about 13c/kwh to 24c/kwh. Common Electrify America rates are 48c/kwh. Double the peak heavy usage rate of in-home and the study used the most expensive charging option, then justified it using a potential future customer base that isn't representative of the current owners.

This isn't anywhere near accurate enough to be used to discuss current costs vs ICE.

Toss in the thousands of dollars worth of tax incentives the government gives and this entire line of reasoning goes right out the window.

True. The statement I was responding to was about the road taxes that "NOBODY driving an EV is paying". That statement is patently false. One could argue that the current amount is too low, too high, or not fair because it's a flat rate, but it can't be argued that it just doesn't exist.

Overall cost of ownership is an entirely different question, and also entirely muddy and dependent on individual circumstances.

Wait. You are applying logic. Logic has NO place with the EV folks. Its all butterflies and daisies.

A similar class vehicle to a Model 3 like an Equinox will pay about $250 in fuel tax for 10k traveled in Michigan. 10k is about average for most drivers. The additional registration fee per your first linked article lists Michigan as $140. It needs to be increased significantly, but yes, you're correct. In terms of road tax EVs do in fact pay into it in many states, but it's way under taxed and in 27 other states, they collect NO road tax from EVs. So, like most things, it depends.... lol

15,000 miles a year is typically considered 'average'. And that figure is used for vehicle evaluations, too. More than that gets a deduction in value, less gets an addition. Again that's typically, because there are always exceptions.

www.kbb.com/car-advice/average-miles-driven-per-year

Another meaningful statistic in this is that the 'average' age of cars on the road today is in excess of 12 years. And growing. It is also estimated that 23% of those cars are at least 20 years old. Has anyone seen any evidence that EVs can be economically kept on the road for that length of time? I haven't. The most common estimated life expectancy of today's EV batteries is between 8 and 12 years depending on a number of factors. The most optimistic estimates put life spans at 10+ years. But they are all only estimates. I would be very interested in some research into the real world life expectancy of today's EVs given the cost of their batteries and the labor to replace them. That is, IF the bateries are even available by the time the vehicle needs the first one replaced, let alone the second.

www.dynamicmanufacturinginc.com/unv...ar-batteries-how-long-do-they-truly-last

https://cars.usnews.com/cars-trucks/advice/how-long-do-ev-batteries-last

Replacing an ev battery is a hard thing to pin down. You could easily live with a [censored] battery if you drive ten miles a day to work. If you drive 50 it could get bothersome to have to make sure you get out and hook it up or have to worry about the range crapping out on the way back home. So you’ll definitely get ev evangelists telling you they “haven’t replaced the battery after 15 years” when that’s not a relevant take.

I expect to be able to leave on a moments notice for an unexpected 500 miles trip. You simply cannot make a trip like that in a ev without prior planning and/or an extended stay along the way. When my gas powered vehicles are taken from me forcibly, I will no longer be able to move about freely.

The total movement to EV vehicles has hit the wall..
The government subsidies are running out and the real costs are now surfacing..
Tesla has announced major layoffs, Rivian equity value has decreased 90%. Ford reported a $1.2 billion loss due to EV vehicles and they lost $120K on each EV vehicle sold.
There is no argument that we need to clean the air and emissions, but to force this on a depressed national economy in a short time cycle is simply bad judgement...

Just my $0.02...