Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time....

Posted by: DaveRS23

Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/08/18 08:56 PM

We should be reviewing this here, too.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-42997518
Posted by: Supercuda

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/08/18 09:00 PM

Why?
Posted by: 3hundred

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/08/18 09:04 PM

Why not split the difference and then leave the clocks alone?
Posted by: JonC

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/08/18 09:06 PM

I'm all for DST all year.
Posted by: markz528

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/08/18 09:14 PM

Poland is also switching.
Posted by: Morty426

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/08/18 10:11 PM

Originally Posted By Θάνατος
Why?


Because it's stupid and a waste of money

Arizona doesn't have it
Posted by: hooziewhatsit

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/08/18 10:13 PM

Originally Posted By JonC
I'm all for DST all year.


I'd probably be ok with that. More light in the evening after work would be great.

Why? Heart attacks and car crashes both go up right after we lose an hour in the spring. Not a huge amount, but enough to be seen in the statistics.
Posted by: John Brown

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/08/18 10:39 PM

Indiana used to have one time all year around... and it was fine, but then the governor had this really bright idea. When I lived in Arizona we had one time all year around. Had no problem with it at all. Moved back to Indiana and clock changes twice a year all over again. If you want more light so you can play golf (ugg) start work earlier and close earlier. No reason to have government tell you when to get up and when to go to bed, or how to wipe either.
Posted by: Supercuda

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/08/18 10:47 PM

Originally Posted By Morty426
Originally Posted By Θάνατος
Why?


Because it's stupid and a waste of money

Arizona doesn't have it


stupid is subjective.

How does it waste money?

Arizona has McCain, next.
Posted by: Not_A_Duster

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/08/18 11:13 PM

Originally Posted By JonC
I'm all for DST all year.


That’s what we do here.
Posted by: SomeCarGuy

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/08/18 11:48 PM

Originally Posted By Morty426
Originally Posted By Θάνατος
Why?


Because it's stupid and a waste of money

Arizona doesn't have it



DST saves energy. That’s why you do it. No idea why a place that is dead set against burning fuels is wanting to burn more.
Posted by: Grizzly

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/09/18 01:07 AM

Originally Posted By JonC
I'm all for DST all year.


No.

This is so hard for people to understand:

I would rather NOT have the house blazing hot and the sun still shining at 11pm.............so I can get to sleep!

I prefer where the time is now and keep it there. You want more daylight? Get up at 4am and have at it.

Rant off.
Posted by: it's Bob

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/09/18 01:08 AM

It has been surmised that if Cali, Texas, and Florida were to say "F'it we're staying on one time all year long" the whole DST/ST scheme would just fall apart. With just those 3 states, CA, TX, FL you could/would have over a 1/4 of the country's population and a large chunk of corporation HQs out of sync with the rest of the nation.
Posted by: JonC

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/09/18 02:18 AM

Originally Posted By Grizzly
Originally Posted By JonC
I'm all for DST all year.


No.

This is so hard for people to understand:

I would rather NOT have the house blazing hot and the sun still shining at 11pm.............so I can get to sleep!

I prefer where the time is now and keep it there. You want more daylight? Get up at 4am and have at it.

Rant off.


Or you could get up at 5 AM and go to bed at 12 PM
Posted by: 340Cuda

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/09/18 09:23 AM

Originally Posted By JonC
I'm all for DST all year.


Works for me...
Posted by: 340Cuda

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/09/18 09:27 AM

Originally Posted By Morty426

Arizona doesn't have it

Quite a while ago I had a job interview in Arizona.

I mentioned that they did not observe Daylight Savings Time.

The guy looked at me and said, "Believe me the last thing you want in Arizona in the summertime is one more hour of daylight".

Bill
Posted by: wingman

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/09/18 10:38 AM

I don't have strong feelings either way about DST.

But I will comment on the common phrase "Europe is doing XYZ, so we should too." I hear it all the time on various topics.

I have spent some time in Europe. And I will say that you will not convince me anything is a good idea by telling me that "Europe is doing it." If anything, it makes me think we should do the opposite...
Posted by: Grizzly

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/09/18 10:49 AM

Originally Posted By 340Cuda
Originally Posted By Morty426

Arizona doesn't have it

Quite a while ago I had a job interview in Arizona.

I mentioned that they did not observe Daylight Savings Time.

The guy looked at me and said, "Believe me the last think you want in Arizona in the summertime is one more hour of daylight".

Bill


Thank-you! up

"Because of Arizona's hot climate, DST is largely considered unnecessary. The argument against extending the daylight hours into the evening is that people prefer to do their activities in the cooler evening temperatures."
Posted by: Not_A_Duster

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/09/18 11:06 AM

Originally Posted By wingman
I don't have strong feelings either way about DST.

But I will comment on the common phrase "Europe is doing XYZ, so we should too." I hear it all the time on various topics.

I have spent some time in Europe. And I will say that you will not convince me anything is a good idea by telling me that "Europe is doing it." If anything, it makes me think we should do the opposite...


AGREE!!! thumbs
Posted by: sabbfan

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/09/18 11:25 AM

The only thing I hate about the time change is having small kids at home it really messes up bedtime and when they wake up. No extra hour of sleep here!
Posted by: Spaceman Spiff

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/09/18 11:38 AM

Originally Posted By Grizzly
Originally Posted By JonC
I'm all for DST all year.


No.

This is so hard for people to understand:

I would rather NOT have the house blazing hot and the sun still shining at 11pm.............so I can get to sleep!

I prefer where the time is now and keep it there. You want more daylight? Get up at 4am and have at it.

Rant off.


We have DST, it’s NEVER been light out at 11pm.....
They also make the things called shades to cover your windows, keeps the sun out...
Posted by: Grizzly

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/09/18 12:39 PM

Originally Posted By Spaceman Spiff


We have DST, it’s NEVER been light out at 11pm.....


Oh well, take a bow there, Mr. Speshul. tonguue

That ain't the case here.
Posted by: Morty426

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/09/18 12:48 PM

Originally Posted By Θάνατος
Originally Posted By Morty426
Originally Posted By Θάνατος
Why?


Because it's stupid and a waste of money

Arizona doesn't have it


stupid is subjective.

How does it waste money?

Arizona has McCain, next.


Complete waste of time. Tons of man hours wasted on resetting clocks.

An example of the waste is International travel. Because not every country observes it and some countries observe it yet change at a different time than we do it creates a situation where all the travel schedules need to get revamped. Complete waste of money.

As for McCain, happy to say he is closer to you than he is to me. grin
Posted by: hooziewhatsit

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/09/18 01:01 PM

It's not just the time spent manually changing clocks too. There are tons of embedded computer systems that need extra checks added so they can adjust their internal and external clocks, and then congress goes and changes the date the time change happens, making them all wrong again.

Some of them can be updated, but a lot can't, and that's a lot of time that could be better spent elsewhere.

Also, there's a certain amount of hubris to assume that since we made a decision, we have to continue that decision even if we have better information now.
Posted by: DAYCLONA

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/09/18 04:12 PM

Originally Posted By SomeCarGuy



DST saves energy. That’s why you do it. No idea why a place that is dead set against burning fuels is wanting to burn more.



So they once thought... http://time.com/4549397/daylight-saving-time-history-politics/
Posted by: Powerflow

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/09/18 07:07 PM

The worst part of winter for me is that it gets dark early. The later the sunset, the better. I'd be in favor of year-round DST.

Several months ago, Massachusetts was thinking about changing to the Atlantic time zone so it would get darker later in the winter. It gets dark earlier in the eastern part of a time zone. The theory is that people are leaving the Boston area because it gets dark too early in the winter.
Posted by: Spaceman Spiff

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/09/18 07:35 PM

Originally Posted By Powerflow
The worst part of winter for me is that it gets dark early. The later the sunset, the better. I'd be in favor of year-round DST.

Several months ago, Massachusetts was thinking about changing to the Atlantic time zone so it would get darker later in the winter. It gets dark earlier in the eastern part of a time zone. The theory is that people are leaving the Boston area because it gets dark too early in the winter.


Nothing like leaving work in the dark. at 4pm.
Posted by: SomeCarGuy

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/09/18 07:56 PM

Originally Posted By DAYCLONA
Originally Posted By SomeCarGuy



DST saves energy. That’s why you do it. No idea why a place that is dead set against burning fuels is wanting to burn more.



So they once thought... http://time.com/4549397/daylight-saving-time-history-politics/



Interesting. So in aggregate we do save, some local areas don’t. Used to be 1% was the number given, a half is still a ton for the whole country.
Posted by: HotRodDave

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/09/18 09:32 PM

Originally Posted By Grizzly
Originally Posted By JonC
I'm all for DST all year.


No.

This is so hard for people to understand:

I would rather NOT have the house blazing hot and the sun still shining at 11pm.............so I can get to sleep!

I prefer where the time is now and keep it there. You want more daylight? Get up at 4am and have at it.

Rant off.


I would rather not have the sun come up any earlier than it has to blazing in the window waking me up way too early.

I prefer daylight savings all year long, if you want to go to bed when its dark dont get up at 4am and stay up a little later.

Some (most actually are working for the man) don't have a choice when we get off, 8am to 5pm for most, can't just tell the boss I am gonna start leaving an hour earlier from now on. Also I hear otherwise but I have way better luck fishing in the afternoon than the butt crack of dawn.
Posted by: RSNOMO

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/09/18 09:48 PM

As Harry Callahan once said, "You meet a better class of people in the dark"...


Get rid of the BSDST, and leave dusk to dawn as nature intended...


Mankind has done just fine without it...
Posted by: Yellow Fever

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/09/18 10:42 PM

fan
Posted by: 360view

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/10/18 06:21 AM

The Austrailian experiment during their hosting of a past Olympics is the best one I have read the results of. DST was found to waste energy and kill/harm people in traffic and industrial accidents.

The USA should “replicate” this experiment by having some states not go to DST besides other states that continue to switch to DST.

In a similar way the USA should run an experiment on
Federal Minimum Wage Laws
to determine if they harm poorer people and slow economic growth.
Posted by: 65pacecar

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/10/18 08:24 AM

Make it easy, just stay on DST all year. The extra hour of light after work is great.
Posted by: moparx

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/10/18 08:40 AM

just stay on XYZ time all year. i'm retired, so i can care less. and my wife would quit crabbing about changing all the clocks in the house. biggrin
beer
Posted by: Frankenduster

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/10/18 01:07 PM

I find it really sad to learn that something as simple as a ONE HOUR switch can affect people this much. IT really shines a light on how fast they would die off in an apocolyptic event.
Posted by: 300rag

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/10/18 01:48 PM

DST in the frozen wasteland winters up here would suck big time. Natural light is a motivator to the body. It's bad enough now with daylight not showing up until 9 in the depths of winter, but DST would make it 10. I vote standard time year round here.
Posted by: cudaman1969

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/10/18 02:21 PM

Keep it the standard time, I like getting that extra hour of sleep in the morning. I'm thinking the main reason the switch back in the winter is the school kids don't stand in the dark at the bus stops. Here it's would be 8:30 or later for sunup.
Posted by: 5thAve

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/11/18 08:23 PM

Originally Posted By Spaceman Spiff
Originally Posted By Grizzly
Originally Posted By JonC
I'm all for DST all year.


No.

This is so hard for people to understand:

I would rather NOT have the house blazing hot and the sun still shining at 11pm.............so I can get to sleep!

I prefer where the time is now and keep it there. You want more daylight? Get up at 4am and have at it.

Rant off.


We have DST, it’s NEVER been light out at 11pm.....
They also make the things called shades to cover your windows, keeps the sun out...


Same here. I hate when the clocks roll back for the winter. It's dark by the time you get home from work so an evening of doing anything outside is lost. Who cares how light it is in the morning when you can't do anything with it.
Posted by: fourgearsavoy

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/11/18 08:41 PM

Personally I HATE DST because it throws off my sleep schedule.I am borderline OCD and when things don't go to according to my superior plans I can't sleep at night.
I would be first in line if we ever got to vote that stupid DST out twocents

Gus beer
Posted by: John Brown

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/11/18 09:48 PM

Originally Posted By fourgearsavoy
Personally I HATE DST because it throws off my sleep schedule.I am borderline OCD and when things don't go to according to my superior plans I can't sleep at night.
I would be first in line if we ever got to vote that stupid DST out twocents

Gus beer



Yeah, right behind me. stirthepot
Posted by: Spaceman Spiff

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/12/18 06:15 AM

Originally Posted By Frankenduster
I find it really sad to learn that something as simple as a ONE HOUR switch can affect people this much. IT really shines a light on how fast they would die off in an apocolyptic event.


When it gets dark at 4pm... kinda hard to do much outside....
Posted by: Superfreak

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/12/18 10:32 AM

That's what lights are for.
Posted by: A12

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/12/18 10:39 AM

Originally Posted By Θάνατος
Originally Posted By Morty426
Originally Posted By Θάνατος
Why?


Because it's stupid and a waste of money

Arizona doesn't have it


stupid is subjective.

How does it waste money?

Arizona has McCain, next.


Well the farmers in the mid-West are complaining the extra hour of daylight is burning up their crops........................ wink
Posted by: HoosierTA

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/12/18 10:49 AM

Originally Posted By John Brown
Indiana used to have one time all year around... and it was fine, but then the governor had this really bright idea. When I lived in Arizona we had one time all year around. Had no problem with it at all. Moved back to Indiana and clock changes twice a year all over again. If you want more light so you can play golf (ugg) start work earlier and close earlier. No reason to have government tell you when to get up and when to go to bed, or how to wipe either.


On top of that, they decided to let some areas be on central time, and one area with a huge naval facility which overlaps two counties- guess what? One switched and the other didn't- probably thought it would cause cows to dance with chickens.

Folks who commuted from a DST county had be be up at 4AM to be at work on time.

My other farm/recreation home is on central time. Been a couple times I had an event I wanted to do and my alarm went off at the time it began. Gets aggravating.

My biggest worry was that it would kill drive in movie places- waiting until 10PM for two a double feature to begin? our local one seems to be doing great though. So much that there is no way I am going to get there early for a spot and wait 2.5 hours.
Posted by: John Brown

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/12/18 01:22 PM

Not only does Indiana go to DST for 9 or 10 months, but Indiana was moved into the Eastern Time Zone when it clearly belongs in the Central Time Zone. Same deal with Michigan. The break off line for the time zone goes through Cleveland Ohio (or nearly so). None of Indiana or Michigan are East of Cleveland on my map.

CENTRAL ZONE MAP

Red lines : The geographic limits of Central Zone
Blue line: The center of Central Zone



That's why the argument by the Drive-in Theatres Owners Association was that putting Indiana on DST was actually "Double Daylight".
Posted by: A12

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/12/18 03:07 PM

Originally Posted By John Brown
Not only does Indiana go to DST for 9 or 10 months, but Indiana was moved into the Eastern Time Zone when it clearly belongs in the Central Time Zone. Same deal with Michigan. The break off line for the time zone goes through Cleveland Ohio (or nearly so). None of Indiana or Michigan are East of Cleveland on my map.

CENTRAL ZONE MAP

Red lines : The geographic limits of Central Zone
Blue line: The center of Central Zone



That's why the argument by the Drive-in Theatres Owners Association was that putting Indiana on DST was actually "Double Daylight".


My son would gain an hour going to work and lose it coming home from work if the above geographic limits of time zones were in place..............would that mean he could leave an hour later for work and get home an hour sooner laugh2 (JK)
Posted by: 300rag

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/12/18 03:18 PM

Originally Posted By John Brown
Not only does Indiana go to DST for 9 or 10 months, but Indiana was moved into the Eastern Time Zone when it clearly belongs in the Central Time Zone. Same deal with Michigan. The break off line for the time zone goes through Cleveland Ohio (or nearly so). None of Indiana or Michigan are East of Cleveland on my map.

CENTRAL ZONE MAP

Red lines : The geographic limits of Central Zone
Blue line: The center of Central Zone



That's why the argument by the Drive-in Theatres Owners Association was that putting Indiana on DST was actually "Double Daylight".


I believe your boundaries are a little off. Your center line is actually close to the western edge of eastern time zone
Posted by: A12

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/12/18 03:46 PM

Quote:
I believe your boundaries are a little off. Your center line is actually close to the western edge of eastern time zone


Your map is showing the actual "current" time zones and the other map is the "geographical" location of the sun or earth's revolution position in regards to time for the day and time point in the year. (I think???) I think also with GPS and satellite positioning that geographical (time) zones are more accurate now then when they were first created......just a guess?
Posted by: John Brown

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/12/18 08:51 PM

Originally Posted By A12
Quote:
I believe your boundaries are a little off. Your center line is actually close to the western edge of eastern time zone


Your map is showing the actual "current" time zones and the other map is the "geographical" location of the sun or earth's revolution position in regards to time for the day and time point in the year. (I think???) I think also with GPS and satellite positioning that geographical (time) zones are more accurate now then when they were first created......just a guess?


The map with the red and blue lines is a map that shows where the natural time zones would be if man in his infinite wisdom hadn't F'd with em. Imagine if you would that the sun isn't overhead until an hour and 45 minutes after the clock shows noon. That's how it is in Michigan and Indiana.
Posted by: amxautox

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/12/18 09:01 PM

Not enough times zones. The current zones are too wide. work
Posted by: Supercuda

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/13/18 09:34 AM

There are no such things as "natural time zones". Time zones are a construct of man not nature. Nature gives a rats ass what time it is only man does and apparently some care enough to really wind them panties up.

Let us take this "natural time zone" idea to it's end conclusion. Everyone, every where, has their own timezone because it is never noon everywhere at the same time. So then we get back to why the current time zones were created, so that there was consistency in time in a reasonable geographic area, something nature cares nothing about. It does not matter where the cut lines end up, someone won't be happy, get a tissue.

Don't like DST, fine tell your boss you aren't changing your clock and that you will be there at your "normal" time.

You'll soon not have to worry about driving to work in the dark or whatever is winding them panties up.
Posted by: wingman

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/13/18 09:44 AM

Let's just put everyone on GMT (Zulu) time. That will really mess with everyone's mind...
Posted by: 65pacecar

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/13/18 09:46 AM

Originally Posted By Θάνατος
Everyone, every where, has their own timezone because it is never noon everywhere at the same time.



https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=X_7wdpGvTms


Posted by: moparx

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/14/18 09:08 AM

Originally Posted By 65pacecar
Originally Posted By Θάνατος
Everyone, every where, has their own timezone because it is never noon everywhere at the same time.



https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=X_7wdpGvTms




that's the exact song i thought of........ [ "i'm gone !" ]
beer
Posted by: ChryCoGuy

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 02/14/18 01:06 PM

Originally Posted By Powerflow
The worst part of winter for me is that it gets dark early. The later the sunset, the better. I'd be in favor of year-round DST.


iagree

Getting dark at 4:30 to 5:00 pm sucks no matter how you slice it. I don't care if it's dark when I get up in the morning, but it would be nice to have some daylight when there's at least a chance to enjoy it (though usually it's dark when I get up and dark when I go home in the winter...).
Posted by: John Brown

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 03/07/18 01:44 PM

LINK -> 10 ways DST is bad for you
Posted by: fourgearsavoy

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 03/07/18 07:55 PM

Originally Posted By John Brown


iagree All valid points and most of them boil down to sleep deprivation which is bad for everyone.
They forgot more automobile accidents from driving in the transition period when morons don't know how to turn their lights on rant

Gus beer
Posted by: roadrunninMark

Re: Europe might remove Daylight Saving Time.... - 03/07/18 09:41 PM

If Europe is going to do it, we need to do the opposite!