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another space saver spare tire question

Posted By: TinCuda

another space saver spare tire question - 10/26/11 05:14 AM

I am trying to figure out if my 1971 'Cuda had a space saver tire setup as originally installed.

According to Jim Schild's Challenger and Barracuda Collector's Originality Guide it did.

On page 86, it reads, When the 426 Hemi engine, R32 dual rear seat speakers, H31 rear window defogger, or any 15-inch wheels were ordered, a collapsible space saver spare (W34, part number 2944395) was required.

My car has the rear window defogger. 

This makes me think the space saver spare came with my car.

Can anyone confirm this information?
Posted By: 6bblgt

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 10/26/11 05:55 AM

I believe it was required with:

convertible (BH27, BP27, BS27)
or
426 Hemi engine (E74) F60-15 tires were included w/E74
or
R32 dual rear seat speakers & H31 rear window defogger (both must be optioned)
or
U82 E60-15 tires w/15" wheels

The mounting stud is a different length & mounted in a different spot - space saver VS. full size spare.
Posted By: Mastershake340

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 10/26/11 06:25 AM

Any idea of the correct length for a '71 E body hardtop with space saver mounting stud?
Or if the hook was to get wedged under the tire, or on the stud between the wheel and wingnut?
Posted By: TinCuda

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 10/26/11 06:36 AM

N41 N42 P31 R11 26 EN2
L34 M21 M25 M31 M88
G36 H31 H51 J25 J45 J54
FC7 U A04 A21 B51 G15
FC7 H4XW 000 709 16152

I really wish that I had the build sheet.
I show H31 for rear window defogger.
I also show A04. don't know if I had the dual rear speakers.
It does have the original package tray with two speaker grill cutouts.

Anyone have a picture of a truck floor set up for the space saver tire?


.,
Posted By: 6bblgt

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 10/26/11 07:08 AM

I fly in the morning to go see my car. I can add some details later.

single rear speaker with AM radio (R11) dual was with AM/FM stereo (R35)
Posted By: Morty426

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 10/26/11 04:21 PM

Quote:

I fly in the morning to go see my car. I can add some details later.

single rear speaker with AM radio (R11) dual was with AM/FM stereo (R35)



Or dual could be with AM with a cassette player.

Tin - chances are that your car is only a space saver car if it has 15x7 wheels
Posted By: TinCuda

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 10/26/11 05:21 PM

This is a picture that I took of the spare tire tie bolt. Forgive the way the overall trunk looks. I am in the process of fixing that.

I figure a picture is worth a thousand words...

So, what do I have?


.,

Attached picture 6889396-TrunkTieBolt.jpg
Posted By: 1970mopar

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 10/28/11 03:28 AM

Standard Spare tire , NOT A SPACESAVER
Posted By: Mastershake340

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 10/28/11 05:02 AM

Quote:

Standard Spare tire , NOT A SPACESAVER


Pete, how can you tell? Is the stud supposed to be in the more forward position for a spacesaver car? Or length of stud?
My '71 had a bare trunk when I bought it and am trying to detail it correctly.
Tincuda your trunk looks GK6? Your tag says FC7, so the stud could have been changed or moved when the car was repainted maybe?
Posted By: lahatte

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 10/28/11 05:31 AM

How could you have a rear defog AND 2 rear speakers? The defog intake is in one of the speaker openings, right?

In your picture, it seems, judging by the wear marks from the spare tire, that it aligns nicely with the rod in the position shown. To my knowledge, the space saver would be on the other position (to give you more trunk space).
Posted By: 1_WILD_RT

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 10/28/11 06:29 AM

Quote:

How could you have a rear defog AND 2 rear speakers? The defog intake is in one of the speaker openings, right?

In your picture, it seems, judging by the wear marks from the spare tire, that it aligns nicely with the rod in the position shown. To my knowledge, the space saver would be on the other position (to give you more trunk space).



Apparently you've never seen the adapter that allows the blower & speaker both to use one opening..

Even available as a reproduction .....

http://www.herbsparts.com/proddetail.asp?prod=248
Posted By: Mastershake340

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 10/28/11 07:11 AM


Not sure if I'm missing anything here with my blower/speaker setup. I haven't got to studying this detail much yet.

Attached picture 6891965-10-28-11.jpg
Posted By: TinCuda

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 10/28/11 09:25 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Standard Spare tire , NOT A SPACESAVER


Pete, how can you tell? Is the stud supposed to be in the more forward position for a spacesaver car? Or length of stud?
My '71 had a bare trunk when I bought it and am trying to detail it correctly.
Tincuda your trunk looks GK6? Your tag says FC7, so the stud could have been changed or moved when the car was repainted maybe?



Yeah, I am trying to peice it all together. My car was painted FC7 purple from the factory and I can tell you that it was because there is still purple under the inside door panels, bottom of package shelf metal panel, etc. The car was painted blue when I bought the car and a lot of things had been changed for racing. Once I started cleaning up the trunk, under the brownish goldish rustish paint, I found purple underneath. I guess the last owner hated purple. Why he/she painted it that color in the trunk is anyones guess. I can also tell you that the car also had rear window defogger because of the rear window package tray upper bezel and dash board switch for it are present. That with the fender tag call out. My car had the defogger.

The problem with the spare tire that I have is that the spare that I got with the car was a full size spare and the rim was date coded 1978. Also the jack, jack base, and bumper hook where all black. To the best of my knowlege, it should be light gray. I wouldn't think it too much of a stretch that the last owner went to the trouble of removing the spare tire and jack to lighten the car for racing, then at some point latter on, use the car for a regular daily driver, to replce the hold down bolt with a standard one in order to use a more practical full size spare. The hold down is attached with one bolt. And the standard hold downs by definition, would have been more common to find.

Of course, it might have just come with a full size spare. This is why we do research. It's also why I call it my obsession. lol


This a picture of a restored trunk, rear defogger setup. It is not mine but it might make a good reference.


.,

Attached picture 6891987-Cudatrunk003.jpg
Posted By: 1970mopar

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 10/28/11 05:52 PM

Quote:

Pete, how can you tell? Is the stud supposed to be in the more forward position for a spacesaver car? Or length of stud?




Both..
Stud is different legnth for space Sacer vs. the non space saver and location changes to the forward hole with space saver vs. rearward hole for standard spare.

FYI: A photo description of the is layed out on the factory spare tire trunk decal as well as the factory engineering drawing.
Posted By: Mastershake340

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 10/28/11 06:09 PM

Ken- I bought a '71 Challenger V code about a year ago and have been learning about '71's ever since as my purchase had a lot of missing or incorrect details. What I've found is it seems there were changes going on throughout the year, and therefore certain things are hard to nail down.
An early build e body is not going to be the same as one built in May or June.
I still haven't figured out jack component detailing 100%. I'm pretty sure later cars the base and head were semi gloss black. Earlier cars, I'm not so sure. On '70's these components were dove gray. Perhaps there was a transition period, like early '71's were still gray, maybe at some point the heads were semi gloss black but the base was still dove gray? My car has a late October 70 SBD. I started out painting these items gray, but later decided they should be semi gloss black. I'm not at all certain at some point I won't be painting one or both items back to dove gray?
Jack hooks were dove gray, except a friend of mine with a late (June) build Challenger has a green (sort of a forest green) jack hook! He's owned the car since '73 and says that is what was in the car when he bought it. We spotted another late build '71 Challenger at a show last year that also had a green hook. He said that was the first time since hes had his car he has seen another green hook.
Cudas used a different jack hook, I don't know if any late cudas ever had a green one.
"Floyd" here on the board has been a great resource of info to me since I got my '71, he has an early build '71 Challenger and a '71 cuda with a spring if I recall, SBD.
And if I can help you out any way with your researching of your cuda, let me know, I'd be happy to compare notes with you!
Posted By: Mastershake340

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 10/28/11 06:15 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Pete, how can you tell? Is the stud supposed to be in the more forward position for a spacesaver car? Or length of stud?




Both..
Stud is different legnth for space Sacer vs. the non space saver and location changes to the forward hole with space saver vs. rearward hole for standard spare.

FYI: A photo description of the is layed out on the factory spare tire trunk decal as well as the factory engineering drawing.


Interesting. Do you happen to know the correct length for a space savers stud?
The diagram seemed to show the hook mounting on the stud between the cannister clamp and wing nut. It wouldn't fit on mine, but there was no stud in my trunk when I got the car, so maybe I bought the wrong length stud.
Thanks!
Posted By: shakerjoe

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 10/28/11 07:12 PM

my 05/26/71 built cuda tire rod - I was informed was a non space saver - Joe

Attached picture 6892533-joetirerod2.jpg
Posted By: TinCuda

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 10/28/11 07:34 PM

Quote:

Ken- I bought a '71 Challenger V code about a year ago and have been learning about '71's ever since as my purchase had a lot of missing or incorrect details. What I've found is it seems there were changes going on throughout the year, and therefore certain things are hard to nail down.
An early build e body is not going to be the same as one built in May or June.
I still haven't figured out jack component detailing 100%. I'm pretty sure later cars the base and head were semi gloss black. Earlier cars, I'm not so sure. On '70's these components were dove gray. Perhaps there was a transition period, like early '71's were still gray, maybe at some point the heads were semi gloss black but the base was still dove gray? My car has a late October 70 SBD. I started out painting these items gray, but later decided they should be semi gloss black. I'm not at all certain at some point I won't be painting one or both items back to dove gray?
Jack hooks were dove gray, except a friend of mine with a late (June) build Challenger has a green (sort of a forest green) jack hook! He's owned the car since '73 and says that is what was in the car when he bought it. We spotted another late build '71 Challenger at a show last year that also had a green hook. He said that was the first time since hes had his car he has seen another green hook.
Cudas used a different jack hook, I don't know if any late cudas ever had a green one.
"Floyd" here on the board has been a great resource of info to me since I got my '71, he has an early build '71 Challenger and a '71 cuda with a spring if I recall, SBD.
And if I can help you out any way with your researching of your cuda, let me know, I'd be happy to compare notes with you!



Thanks for the info and the offer for help. An expert with an eye for the details is always useful. I am sure that there will be many more questions as this project goes on.

I have to say that this all has been fun. I have learned alot already.


.,
Posted By: 1970mopar

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 10/28/11 07:53 PM

I believe off the topof my head the rod for a space saver is about 7" long.
Posted By: Snoopy

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 10/29/11 03:00 AM

P/N's

Attached picture 6893216-SpareTireAnchorStuds.jpg
Posted By: Snoopy

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 10/29/11 03:03 AM

Maybe someone can help determine which one you need.

Attached picture 6893220-SpaceSaverSpareStudsAll.jpg
Posted By: lahatte

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 10/29/11 05:19 AM

Quote:


Apparently you've never seen the adapter that allows the blower & speaker both to use one opening..




You're right. I haven't. I've only seen the ones mounted to the speaker opening. Thanks for the info.
Posted By: TinCuda

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 10/31/11 09:34 PM

Can someone verify that the space saver spare hold down stud is the 6 inch one. I guess that it is measured from the top of the stud to the center of the attach hole?


.,

Attached picture 6896833-!B1L2EMwBmk~$(KGrHqF,!hcEw5B(QMqWBMdbKb8pFg~~_12.jpg
Posted By: Mastershake340

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 11/01/11 09:29 PM

I just returned from the Challenger lair out back of my house, where I removed the stud in the '71 and re-installed it in the forward hole in the bracket on my trunk floor. When I bought this car last year, my trunk was nekid except for a cheap repro trunk mat, and I bought a spare tire stud from YO based on info a friend with a '71 Challenger vert he's owned since the early '70's gave me. IIRC YO had 3 sizes and the one they had that was approximately 8" OAL was the one closest to what was on his car.
At any rate, I reinstalled the stud in the forward location, put my space saver, base, and cannister bracket back in, and lo and behold, I find the hook now can be installed on the stud.
I have an incorrect base and still don't know if the base should be black or dove gray for a 10/70 SBD car, so the quest continues.
But in the meantime, my tire is now properly located and I know a little more that I didn't know before. Thanks Earl and Pete once again for sharing your knowledge!

Attached picture 6898615-Sparesetup002.jpg
Posted By: RP's R/T's

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 12/28/11 06:38 PM

Who has the repro air cannister?
I bought one from Ken Chettleburgh, and was happy with it, in the past but can't seem to get in touch with him.
Does anyone know if he is still doing them? Or someone else?
Posted By: TinCuda

Re: another space saver spare tire question - 12/30/11 10:45 AM

Dante's sells the canister and clamp. He is listed on the front page as a site sponsor.


.,


Quote:

Who has the repro air cannister?
I bought one from Ken Chettleburgh, and was happy with it, in the past but can't seem to get in touch with him.
Does anyone know if he is still doing them? Or someone else?

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