Moparts
1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, SO
Posted By: JimDiesel
1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/19/10 04:45 AM
Hello all,
It's my first post - I'm allowed to screw it up.
New member here, I have been reading these boards for a couple months now, and I have to say it is a great source of information.
This car has been in my family since 1993-ish. It has recently passed to me so I have been researching more on the car. I was surpised to find that it is a paint code 999. When we bought the car it was missing the orginal drive train and was painted orange with some green and black mismatched interior. We paid around 2k and the VIN checked out as a RR so we didn't think too much about it. It was repainted silver and a crate HEMI was installed.
My main questions are:
Does the number double stamped on the rad support look right?
Where do I look in the trunk for the other VON number?
What would be the best spot to try to find the original paint color?
Thanks all in advance.
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confused *DELETED* - 03/19/10 04:46 AM
Post deleted by JimDiesel
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confused - 03/19/10 04:54 AM
the car as purchased early 1990s
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confused - 03/19/10 04:56 AM
upper radiator support.
I sanded the paint off since there was a thick coat of black paint that made it hard to see. The orange left over in numbers makes em easy to read.
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confused - 03/19/10 04:58 AM
Fender Tag - hopefully
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confused - 03/19/10 04:59 AM
VIN
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confused - 03/19/10 05:02 AM
How the car sits now.
Not too happy with teh wheel choice.
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confused - 03/19/10 05:06 AM
This is how I think the Fender Tag breaks down. It did have the fender turn signals but was missing the vinyl top.
CAR: Plymouth RoadRunner 2 Door Hardtop
ENGINE: 383cid 4-bbl HP V8
TRANSMISSION: 3-Speed Automatic
TIRES: F70x14 Red Side Wall, Steel Belted
BUILD DATE: June 24.
AXLE: 3.23 Rear Axle Ratio
INTERIOR: High Trim Grade, Vinyl Split Bench Seats. Black Interior.
PAINT: Special Order Paint.
OTHER: Black Upper Door Frame Color. Black Horizontal Accent Stripe.
MOLDINGS:
19: Wide Sill Mouldings
25: Drip Rail Mouldings
ABC OPTIONS:
R1: AM Radio
X2: Tinted Windshield Only
Y6: Black Vinyl Top
Z8: Performance Hood Treatment (Roadrunner/GTX)
abc OPTIONS:
h7: Fender or Hood Mounted Turn Signal Indicators
m6: Driver's Outside Remote Operated Mirror
y9: Special Order
Posted By: ScottSmith_Harms
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confused - 03/19/10 05:07 AM
Actually a fairly rare car. The original color looks to have been "Ohmaha Orange" a very similar color to what was later called "Go Mango" or "Vitamin C Orange" (EK2) first introduced in 1970. There were a number of cars ordered by one Northern California Chrysler group all in that color. The color was actually an International Harvester color. Yours was probably one of those cars due to your location.
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confused - 03/19/10 05:15 AM
THis is what I am coming up with for the VIN decode
RM 23 H8 E167XXX
Body Type: R = Road Runner
Price Class: M = Medium
Body Type: 23 = 2 Door Hardtop
Engine: H = 383 330HP OR 335HP 1-4BBL 8 CYL
Year: 8 = 1968
Sequence Number: 167XXX
The car is pretty far from stock, but I am amazed what some people on the site are able to do. Actually My dad bought this car in the San Diego area, so although I live in Norcal now, not sure about how it came to be in Socal. We were not able to locate the build sheets or anything else when the car was painted silver. Pretty sure the interior was cobbled together, looks to have a blue lower dash pad, and it had green seats, steering wheel, and A-piller covers. It did had the trunk decor piece, although it is gone now.
Thanks for the info on Omaha Orange - I read through those posts. Very interesting...
I found some numbers in the trunk, but they do not seem right. Are there numbers on both the drivers side and the passenger side? I think I am looking in the wrong place.
Drivers side - 2841301
Passengers side - 2841300
Posted By: ScottSmith_Harms
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confused - 03/19/10 05:21 AM
Hard to say where it was sold but a pretty fair number of Ohmaha Orange cars were sold to a dealer in Ukiah, and other Western dealers. I lived in Santa Rosa much of my life, I owned a 68 340 Barracuda back then in the same color. Your car was built at the Los Angeles plant, it's pretty common for LA cars to be missing the broadcast sheets but that's ok, your fender tag gives up most of the info on it, don't lose it! Next time the car needs a re-paint you might consider going back to orange
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confused - 03/19/10 05:26 AM
Nice, another Sonoma Co person.
I have only lived here since 1997.
I love it.
Don't think I will ever move again if I can help it.
Posted By: ademon
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confused - 03/19/10 05:26 AM
My main questions are:
Does the number double stamped on the rad support look right?
Where do I look in the trunk for the other VON number?
What would be the best spot to try to find the original paint color?
*My support is not stamped like that.
*under the weather strip driver side around 5 to 6" to the rear of where the trunk lite plunger switch would be
*package tray, rear wheel wells,under dash
Looks nice, i like the rims
.jpg "5874475-68RR3834-speed(31).jpg")
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confused - 03/19/10 05:29 AM
Look up under the dash for original overspray of the original color. Also behind the front kick panels. These area seldom get repainted unless the car has been stripped/dipped.
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confused - 03/19/10 05:50 AM
Although I think it looks great on A12 cars, I will be honest and say that orange would not be my first choice, although silver wouldn't be either.
The car needs some work, so I am at a point where I need to deceid to stay stock on continue with the modifications. I was all set to just keep modifying it until I found the special order paint code...
Issue #1 is that the pass valve cover hits the fender - think that can be sovled by goign back to stock type valve covers.
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confused - 03/19/10 05:57 AM
Well, the nice thing about having a 999 paint code is that you can paint it ANY color that was avalable to the entire auto industry in 1968 and no one can say it is wrong.
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confused - 03/19/10 06:05 AM
Posted By: ademon
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confused - 03/19/10 06:07 AM
i'm not crazy about Ohmaha Orange also i think the orange looks better on 70 and later cars. what color is your interior?
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confused - 03/19/10 06:19 AM
Interior is black.
aftermarket seats, gauges, steering wheel.
Wish it was more original.
![Attached picture 5874517-RR_008[2].jpg](https://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/upload2/5874517-RR_008[2].jpg "5874517-RR_008[2].jpg")
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confused - 03/19/10 06:23 AM
Look under the rear package tray
you might find some original paint.
The top brace behind the rear seat may have the PPG number of the paint used.
The double stamped core support looks like an appropriate "mistake", I know of a Duster that is stamped 6 times.
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confused - 03/19/10 06:39 AM
I will check more tomorrow when I can see more.
behind kick panels - doesn't seem to really be painted.
Fender wheels - undercoated
Under package tray- looks like light gray or so with orange overspray.
There is a lot of orange everywhere. I am thinking that was the color, although the hood and roof most likely were repainted since the vinyl top and stripes were missing.
Was there a standard color primer?
Posted By: A12
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confused - 03/19/10 07:00 AM
Quote:
Drivers side - 2841301
Passengers side - 2841300
Those numbers may be part numbers for the drip rail or panels. The number you're looking for it the same number(s) that is double stamped on the radiator support and matches the number on the lower (bottom) right on the fender tag. It should be on the top of the drip rail on the driver's side middle to rear on the drip rail and under the weather strip, see photo. You may have found the number with the arrow near it?
Posted By: coffeeman383
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confused - 03/19/10 12:04 PM
Is a VON the same as S.O. Number? And was it only used up to and including 1968?
PS I like the silver and the wheels!
Posted By: 69_SIX_PACK
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confused - 03/19/10 04:25 PM
Omaha Orange is a cool colour
Is that the actual car in the first pic before it was repainted silver?
Dave
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confused - 03/19/10 05:38 PM
Quote:
Is a VON the same as S.O. Number? And was it only used up to and including 1968?
PS I like the silver and the wheels!
Basically the same thing. an SO number is the sales order number that was pre-printed on the dealers sales order forms and used as a portion/combination in different places such as the IBM, B/S, FT, and as the hidden numbers on the cars up until the 1969 year. In 1969 they changed this to a VON or vehicle order number which was still used in the various places mentioned above EXCEPT not for the hidden numnbers on the car bodies.
Posted By: Diego (not Ted)
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/19/10 06:33 PM
Quote:
I disagree.
The code may specify a non-production color, but who's to say it's correct with *any* color?
I'd hate to have an owner with one of these regional CA cars paint it some other color and claim it's correct. In the end, the pedigree is lost unless a build sheet exists.
The fact that the current owner has found some orange on this car is pretty cool, though.
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/19/10 07:21 PM
Quote:
Quote:
I disagree.
The code may specify a non-production color, but who's to say it's correct with *any* color?
I'd hate to have an owner with one of these regional CA cars paint it some other color and claim it's correct. In the end, the pedigree is lost unless a build sheet exists.
The fact that the current owner has found some orange on this car is pretty cool, though.
If it had a broadcast sheet it too would only show a 999 color code so it proves nothing regarding what the car was actually painted.
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/19/10 07:41 PM
yes, the picture shows the condition of the car around the time we bought it. I know there are more pictures some where. I will have to look for them.
I will take some more pics this weekend of the interior and trunk.
As far as the original color, I don't think I will ever know for sure, but I am having a good time investigating.
Thanks for compliments on the silver - its a dodge viper color, The wheels are Edelbrock
wheels that they made for a very short time.
And Thanks for all Help/Advice!!
Posted By: hemibeep
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/19/10 11:04 PM
my car is a 69 999, with 98e, omaha orange. I have all documents and fender tag. Don't know if this will help you, but, when I was prep for repaint, 98E was written in marker on the lower rad support. driver side. I found this under the paint on the factory primer. But mine is a 69.
you should be able to find that orange all over hidden to prove that color.
Posted By: hemibeep
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/19/10 11:05 PM
also, my 69 build sheet shows 98e as paint code, not sure how that would work for 68.
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/19/10 11:16 PM
Yes they had YOUR paint code in 69 but 68 is is only 999.
Posted By: Diego (not Ted)
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/20/10 12:38 AM
Wasn't aware it wasn't indicated. I know in GMs it sometimes or usually is.
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/20/10 04:59 PM
Couple more pics of the car when it was purchased
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/20/10 05:00 PM
#2
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/20/10 05:01 PM
Some cop wheels that were on it for a bit after repaint
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/20/10 05:23 PM
Found the SO number in trunk.
It matches th radiator support and fender tag.
Heading to work for a bit.
I will try to take apart the interior and snap some pics tomorrow.
I am excited that this car appears to actually be a special order car.
Posted By: autoxcuda
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/20/10 06:35 PM
There is an original owner 68 RR car locally in So Cal. The car was bought new in So Cal. (Burbank C-P?) The car was featured in Mopar Collectors Guide a while back. He bought it right off the dealer lot. He did not special order it.
So not all 68 Omaha Orange cars were originally sold up in No Cal.
Yes, I reallize Scott did not say they all were up there. But there I've seen other people assume that.
http://www.autotraderclassics.com/articl...sationId=159631
Posted By: ademon
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/20/10 07:31 PM
it also has the rocker molding, which is rare in 68.
.jpg "5877120-68RR3834-speed(46).jpg")
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/20/10 08:14 PM
DAMN
Awesome Pics Cuda!
Thats what my car should look like!
Except with Vinyl Top and black stripes
Posted By: ScottSmith_Harms
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/20/10 08:43 PM
Quote:
Found the OS number in trunk.
It matches Rad support and fender.
Heading to work for a bit.
I will try to take apart the interior and snap some pics tomorrow.
I am excited that this car appears to actually be a special order car.
Also notice what color the paint is down inside those numbers
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/21/10 02:42 AM
I should have mentioned that when the car was painted silver it was just sanded down and sprayed. It was not taken down to bare metal or media blasted or anything like that. There is still lots of orange paint in the car; for example most of the trunk is still orange.
In this case, I am happy that there is still a good amount of original paint on the car. Hooray for cheap paint jobs!
Posted By: autoxcuda
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/21/10 04:11 AM
Quote:
DAMN
Awesome Pics Cuda!
Thats what my car should look like!
Except with Vinyl Top and black stripes
I think the black pin stripe on the car I pictured might be the black side stripes you mention? 
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/21/10 04:36 AM
Quote:
Quote:
DAMN
Awesome Pics Cuda!
Thats what my car should look like!
Except with Vinyl Top and black stripes
I think the black pin stripe on the car I pictured might be the black side stripes you mention?
Yes, I belive you are correct.
I did not notice the black stripe at first.
when I decoded the Fender tag it gave me:
"OTHER: Black Upper Door Frame Color. Black Horizontal Accent Stripe"
I mistakenly thought that meant it had stripes on the hood, but that wouldn't make sense since the hood had the performance blackout option.
These two cars seem to have been very similarly optioned. I believe that my car had the lower body mouldings as well. I do not have a pic tht shows it. My recollection was that there was some shoddy body work covering up the attachment points.
We picked up the car east of San Diego in Jamul (I think). The guy lived on a dirt road and the car had about 100 pounds of mud stuck to it.
Posted By: autoxcuda
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/21/10 06:12 AM
Quote:
These two cars seem to have been very similarly optioned. I believe that my car had the lower body mouldings as well. I do not have a pic tht shows it. My recollection was that there was some shoddy body work covering up the attachment points.
Would be interesting to see how the production date, VON, SPD, VIN of the 68 RR in the pictures above compares to yours.
Posted By: autoxcuda
A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, VON - 03/22/10 12:08 AM
Ok, I saw Doug's 68 Omaha Orange RR that he bought in 1968 this morning at the B&M car show. This is the car I posted pictures of above
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
BINGO !!! I had a hunch. Your car has a VIN just
EIGHT at the L.A. plant before Doug's 68 RR pictured above bought new at Glendale C-P. Yours is 167192 Doug's car is 167200 !! Both cars have the
same SPD fairly late in the model year, June 24, 1968.
The cars are VERY similarly equipped on the fender tag. Yours has y-6 and z-8 his doesn't. His has has axle code 45, yours is 4. His is 4 speed with different tire option.
The VON's (edit: S.O.'s) are way different. Anyone's thoughts on that??
Here is Doug's window sticker:
Posted By: autoxcuda
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, VON - 03/22/10 01:12 AM
Quote:
In 68 that would be an SO not a VON.
Dealers typically got their sales order forms from their sales reps. The reps had boxes of them that were in numeric order that they dispersed throughout their group of dealers that they called on. When the dealer got low on them they got the next numbers that the rep had. He may have given the previous numbers to your new batch to a dealer many miles away from your dealership. So in this case, the SO numbers for these cars could simply be a matter of the dealer running out of the cronological numeric forms and began writing orders on the new batch he got. There is no magic in it and trying to corrolate V.I.N.s with SOs or VONs sometimes works and sometimes not because of this.
Opps, I should have known that.
Could this car have been built to put into the sales bank without the dealer specifically spec'ing it out. I thought there were cars built that were not specifically intended for a particular dealer. The xxx200 car was not ordered by the customer. It was on the lot.
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 03:25 AM
Great Work AutoX!!
I feel like I have found my car's long lost twin. They were both built in the same plant on the same day, both 999 cars.
I got stuck watching the kids and wasn't able to play with the car, but I will soon.
Differences:
3 speed auto v 4 speed manual
Options only mine has:
Vinyl top
Peformance hood treatment
Driver's Outside Remote Operated Mirror
Options only his has:
Tach
I am amazed at how many things on the right side of that window sticker refer to safety this or safety that.
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 04:06 AM
This is what the interweb is giving me.
5 44 =
TRANSMISSION: 3-Speed Automatic
TIRES: F70x14 Red Sidewall, Steel Belted
3 46 =
TRANSMISSION: 4-Speed Manual Floor Shift
TIRES: F70x14 White Sidewall, steel belted
The tire code does not appear correct as the window sticker lists red streak tires.
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/22/10 04:21 AM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I disagree.
The code may specify a non-production color, but who's to say it's correct with *any* color?
I'd hate to have an owner with one of these regional CA cars paint it some other color and claim it's correct. In the end, the pedigree is lost unless a build sheet exists.
The fact that the current owner has found some orange on this car is pretty cool, though.
If it had a broadcast sheet it too would only show a 999 color code so it proves nothing regarding what the car was actually painted.
Sorry if I was vague in my response. I wasn't planning on repainting the car and claiming it was original. I was just thinking about the freedom allowed in choosing a color if the original could not be determined. I have no plans to repaint the car any time soon, so I guess it's a moot point.
At this point, it's a 999 car that was most likely Omaha Orange.
Posted By: Bull1tt
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/22/10 04:39 AM
Quote:
Couple more pics of the car when it was purchased
Just noticed no flat black on the rad support behind the grille. Maybe had a thorough repaint at some point in time?
Posted By: autoxcuda
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/22/10 04:52 AM
Quote:
Quote:
Couple more pics of the car when it was purchased
Just noticed no flat black on the rad support behind the grille. Maybe had a thorough repaint at some point in time?
From the picture I assumed it had been repainted. But you just need to pull up the carpet and feather edge sand to the bare metal to show all the layers of paint. Same for a the underside frame rails.
I think it pretty obvious this car was an Omaha Orange 68 RR. And the fact there is another 8 VIN's away batched with it even refutes it more.
Posted By: Bull1tt
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/22/10 04:59 AM
I would say it was an Orange car as well. But I would really look in the hard places for color.
I'm 92% at this point.
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 05:09 AM
Quote:
This is what the interweb is giving me.
5 44 =
TRANSMISSION: 3-Speed Automatic
TIRES: F70x14 Red Sidewall, Steel Belted
3 46 =
TRANSMISSION: 4-Speed Manual Floor Shift
TIRES: F70x14 White Sidewall, steel belted
The tire code does not appear correct as the window sticker lists red streak tires.
The only problem I see with the above decode info is - the tires were NOT "steel belted". They were "nylon ply" & I have not seen any evidence that anything other than a Goodyear "SPEEDWAY" tire was used in this application. The 44 code "red streak" F70-14 tire was STANDARD on the '68 383 Road Runner & the 46 code "white streak" F70-14 tire was a "NO COST" option. The fact that it doesn't appear on the window sticker MAY be as simple as it wasn't a "cost" item.
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 05:22 AM
interior pics 1
I just wiped it down with some waetr as it was pretty dusty.
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 05:22 AM
Interior 2
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 05:22 AM
As far as the S.O.#s being so off, you'd have to ask Doug a little about ordering the car.
#1 Was it a Chrysler employee, FLEET account or "Military Order"?
#2 What was the circumstance that caused the "SHIP TO" address to be different than the "SOLD TO" dealership?
#3 What/Who is "Dallas Smith"?
Funny thing
NO CHARGE for the "special order" OMAHA ORANGE.
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 05:23 AM
Interior 3
If there is a better way to post pics - someone let me know lol
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 05:23 AM
INT 4
Posted By: autoxcuda
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/22/10 05:23 AM
Quote:
I would say it was an Orange car as well. But I would really look in the hard places for color.
I'm 92% at this point.
Orange paint in the indentations of the body number stamping on the trunk and stamping on the radiator support. Orange paint fading to bare metal in the trunk rail right next the the body number stamping.
Edit: Those new interior pics seal the deal for me. Any questioning those?
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 05:26 AM
Int 5
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 05:26 AM
INt 6
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 05:27 AM
Int 7
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 05:28 AM
Int 8
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 05:29 AM
Int 9
Posted By: ScottSmith_Harms
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 05:31 AM
That was an orange car.....PERIOD! Anyone wanna argue?
When the time comes paint it any color you like......As long as it's Omaha Orange.
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 05:31 AM
Pop out one of those plugs in the trunk with the orange paint on them, the original "OMAHA ORANGE" paint will be in a circle surrounding the hole.
Posted By: A12
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 05:33 AM
Some other places are under the dash and kickpanels and under the headliner on the side and C-pillar as there should be some red oxide paint still there...
Posted By: autoxcuda
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 05:38 AM
Quote:
As far as the S.O.#s being so off, you'd have to ask Doug a little about ordering the car.
#1 Was it a Chrysler employee, FLEET account or "Military Order"?
#2 What was the circumstance that caused the "SHIP TO" address to be different than the "SOLD TO" dealership?
#3 What/Who is "Dallas Smith"?
Funny thing NO CHARGE for the "special order" OMAHA ORANGE.
IIRC, Doug said he bought his 68 RR right of the lot at Glendale C-P.
Yes, I noticed the paint wasn't an extra charge. Strange.
There's an article that Larry Jett wrote about 68 Orange cars. I think Scott Smith posted it once. I wonder if the region batched a group of these cars to distribute to various dealers. At first I thought these orange cars went up to northern California. But sounds like other dealers got some.
Can you tell by the window sticker numbers if the Glendale C-P car was special ordered car that someone maybe refused and was put on the lot, or did the dealer order it, or something else. Wonder if that ship to "Dallas Smith" is a link to the answer?
Isn't/Wasn't the Chrysler Parts Depot in Santa Fe Springs? Could there have been a holding lot there? It's mostly industrial there. Even more so in 1969.
Barry Washington's and others' opinions??
Posted By: A12
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 05:38 AM
note the steering column support is FF1 green but the kick panel area still is red oxide here...
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 05:45 AM
Trunk Plug 1
The pics dont show it that well, but there is a definite color difference. The original color is lighter and brighter.
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 05:46 AM
Does anyone know what happened to the OMAHA ORANGE "give-away" Road Runner from Restorations by Julius from the '95?? PACIFIC NATIONALS here in Las Vegas?
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 05:46 AM
trunk plug 2
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 05:47 AM
tp 3
Posted By: autoxcuda
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 05:50 AM
Quote:
Does anyone know what happened to the OMAHA ORANGE "give-away" Road Runner from Restorations by Julius from the '95?? PACIFIC NATIONALS here in Las Vegas?
Was that a 68 RR or a 69 RR?
There's a ton of orange 69's around. Two in our car club alone.
Posted By: Alaskan_TA
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 05:54 AM
I do not look at 1968 cars / documents in my research. That said......
I have never seen a cost for 999 paint, I do not think there was one.
There was a ship to point in Santa Fe Springs, newer documents say something about automotive pre-check if I remember right? I would have to do some serious digging to find it.
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 05:58 AM
I thought Julius' RR was a '68.
"Omaha Orange" started life as a fleet color "safety orange" and was used by many automobile & truck manufacturers for DOT vehicles and other state & federal agencies. Its popularity on some muscle cars namely California Road Runners, Barracudas, & Bengal Chagers led Chrysler to market a similar hue (EK2) with gold metallic in it as "Vitamin C" for the Plymouths and "Go Mango" for the Dodges starting in the spring of '69.
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 06:00 AM
the JETT letter .....
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 06:01 AM
paint chip - MOPAR
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 06:02 AM
paint chip - others
Posted By: Alaskan_TA
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 06:03 AM
The new (newer) name in Santa Fe with the dealer number;
53049
Automotive Precheck Corp.
12140 E. Slauson
Santa Fe Springs CA
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 06:03 AM
paint instruction tag from a '68 Barracuda (Scott Smith's?) with PPG's paint code
60436
Posted By: Alaskan_TA
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 06:09 AM
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 06:10 AM
Quote:
That was an orange car.....PERIOD! Anyone wanna argue?
When the time comes paint it any color you like......As long as it's Omaha Orange.
How about a real dark orange - also known as black.
just kidding.
Honestly I plan to fix my mechanical issues and just drive her.
Posted By: Alaskan_TA
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 06:15 AM
Quote:
I thought Julius' RR was a '68.
"Omaha Orange" started life as a fleet color "safety orange" and was used by many automobile & truck manufacturers for DOT vehicles and other state & federal agencies. Its popularity on some muscle cars namely California Road Runners, Barracudas, & Bengal Chagers led Chrysler to market a similar hue (EK2) with gold metallic in it as "Vitamin C" for the Plymouths and "Go Mango" for the Dodges starting in the spring of '69.
A clearer image of that page at this link;
http://www.hamtramck-historical.com/images/TSBs/1969/69-23-18.jpg
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 06:25 AM
Where was the LA MOPAR assembly plant? The Ford plant was in Pico Rivera, near Santa Fe Springs.
What's with the 6 digit ZIP CODE on Doug's window sticker?
Dodge used
960xxx Shipping Order Numbers for their 1968 "dealer anouncement cars".
Posted By: Alaskan_TA
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 06:27 AM
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 06:31 AM
Quote:
Dodge used 960xxx Shipping Order Numbers for their 1968 "dealer anouncement cars".
What is a dealer announcement car?
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 06:32 AM
Santa Fe Springs to Glendale ~ 21-miles
Google Maps did the car have miles on it when Doug purchased it? Does he remember the day/date when he purchased it?
LA assembly plant to Auto pre-check ~ 7-miles
Google Maps check out the satellite view.
Posted By: Alaskan_TA
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 06:35 AM
Dan, you lost me with that one, not sure what the 96xxxx car have to do with this thread? What did I miss?.
Posted By: Alaskan_TA
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 06:37 AM
Cars were delivered by rail & / or transport trucks back then. It should not have had more than a mile or two on it at the most when the selling dealership got it.
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 06:44 AM
I think he was referring to the SO number for my car being 960192
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 06:45 AM
Unless it was driven from Auto Pre-Check (if that was its destination in Santa Fe Springs?) to Glendale where Doug picked up his 999 '68 Road Runner when it was "NEW".
I know this is crossing Dodge/Plymouth lines, but the '68 Charger R/T pictured which I believe to be a "dealer announcement unit" with a SO# of
960172 VS. Jim's 999 '68 Road Runner's with a SO# of
960192.
& there are plenty of "special" early '69 Dodges & Plymouths with
96xxxx VONs.
Posted By: autoxcuda
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 07:00 AM
I'm going to have to get ahold of Doug and ask him some questions about the car when he got it.
I see the destination charge was like $149. Was the destination charge a flat fee at the point??
My dad said back in the 40's and 50's and before you could pick up a car in Detroit and save shipping costs. The farther your dealer was from Detroit, the more destination charge you paid. But at some time they did away with picking cars up in Detroit. Way before 1968 I'd think.
Quote:
Santa Fe Springs to Glendale ~ 21-miles Google Maps did the car have miles on it when Doug purchased it? Does he remember the day/date when he purchased it?
LA assembly plant to Auto pre-check ~ 7-miles Google Maps check out the satellite view.
Posted By: Alaskan_TA
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 07:10 AM
OK, I am on the same page now.
Once again, I do not look at '68 stuff much, but.....
If they are the same as later cars & the way the VONs worked, early 96xxxx cars would be sales bank / prodotional use. It may just mean special order later in the year.
If the orange cars were used at an event, or at dealerships to promote the new color, then that would be a promotional use even that late in the year. Libraries with old CA newspapers on microfiche would be the place to look for any promotional ads.
Posted By: Alaskan_TA
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 07:13 AM
Quote:
But at some time they did away with picking cars up in Detroit. Way before 1968 I'd think.
Special driveaway (plant pick up) was still available in the 1970s.
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 07:28 AM
Quote:
Was the destination charge a flat fee at the point??
Yes, the destination charge on a '68 Road Runner sold at Glendale CP should be the same no matter which plant it was built at.
The destination charge on a HEMI Road Runner built in Detroit would be the same as a 383 coupe built in Los Angeles, as well as a GTX convertible built in St. Louis. A-bodies were less & c-bodies were more. There may be a few more variables, but that is the jist of it. I have a chart with '68 shipping rates - somewhere.
Posted By: autoxcuda
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 07:32 AM
Quote:
OK, I am on the same page now.
Once again, I do not look at '68 stuff much, but.....
If they are the same as later cars & the way the VONs worked, early 96xxxx cars would be sales bank / prodotional use. It may just mean special order later in the year.
If the orange cars were used at an event, or at dealerships to promote the new color, then that would be a promotional use even that late in the year. Libraries with old CA newspapers on microfiche would be the place to look for any promotional ads.
Reading the Jett article, maybe they used promotional code to fake out the system to use the fleet color. Maybe that's a fleet SO # also.
Looks like they batched the Orange cars for paint booth purposes. I bet the eight cars between the two cars mentioned here were also 999 orange.
Posted By: Bull1tt
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/22/10 11:54 AM
Quote:
Quote:
I would say it was an Orange car as well. But I would really look in the hard places for color.
I'm 92% at this point.
Orange paint in the indentations of the body number stamping on the trunk and stamping on the radiator support. Orange paint fading to bare metal in the trunk rail right next the the body number stamping.
Edit: Those new interior pics seal the deal for me. Any questioning those?
The pics look good to me as well. I'm all in at 100% Omaha Orange!
Posted By: ScottSmith_Harms
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/22/10 12:37 PM
Yes Dan, that Paint instruction tag was found above the headliner in the 999 Omaha Orange 1968 Formula S Barracuda that I used to own (when I lived in Santa Rosa - 1986).
It would be interesting to see if there's a similar tag under the Road Runners headliner.
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, VON - 03/22/10 03:51 PM
Quote:
Quote:
In 68 that would be an SO not a VON.
Dealers typically got their sales order forms from their sales reps. The reps had boxes of them that were in numeric order that they dispersed throughout their group of dealers that they called on. When the dealer got low on them they got the next numbers that the rep had. He may have given the previous numbers to your new batch to a dealer many miles away from your dealership. So in this case, the SO numbers for these cars could simply be a matter of the dealer running out of the cronological numeric forms and began writing orders on the new batch he got. There is no magic in it and trying to corrolate V.I.N.s with SOs or VONs sometimes works and sometimes not because of this.
Opps, I should have known that.
Could this car have been built to put into the sales bank without the dealer specifically spec'ing it out. I thought there were cars built that were not specifically intended for a particular dealer. The xxx200 car was not ordered by the customer. It was on the lot.
That too is a possibility.
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 03:57 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Was the destination charge a flat fee at the point??
Yes, the destination charge on a '68 Road Runner sold at Glendale CP should be the same no matter which plant it was built at.
The destination charge on a HEMI Road Runner built in Detroit would be the same as a 383 coupe built in Los Angeles, as well as a GTX convertible built in St. Louis. A-bodies were less & c-bodies were more. There may be a few more variables, but that is the jist of it. I have a chart with '68 shipping rates - somewhere.
I disagree. Corporate determined where the car would be built depending on the closest plant to the dealer to be delivered to. However depending on what plant it was shipped from the shipping cost could vary depending on the distence to the dealership.
Posted By: hemicar1971
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/22/10 04:03 PM
I know a Dallas Smith.There is a very very very slight possiblity that he bought this car or had something to do with it. Dallas Smith was Bobby Orr's defence partner in 1968 Playing for the Boston Bruins. 1967 was an Expansion year in the NHL and maybe Dallas had something to do with the Califoria Golden Seals or the New NHL expansion teams but he never played for them. I know from experience with Mopars that one NHL hockey player that worked for Chrysler had a lot to do with ordering Chrysler built products for other NHL hockey players.
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: 1968 Road Runner - paint code 999 - VIN, VON confu - 03/22/10 04:17 PM
Quote:
Yes Dan, that Paint instruction tag was found above the headliner in the 999 Omaha Orange 1968 Formula S Barracuda that I used to own (when I lived in Santa Rosa - 1986).
It would be interesting to see if there's a similar tag under the Road Runners headliner.
I think I need to find a how-to article on headliner removal.
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/22/10 05:30 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Was the destination charge a flat fee at the point??
Yes, the destination charge on a '68 Road Runner sold at Glendale CP should be the same no matter which plant it was built at.
The destination charge on a HEMI Road Runner built in Detroit would be the same as a 383 coupe built in Los Angeles, as well as a GTX convertible built in St. Louis. A-bodies were less & c-bodies were more. There may be a few more variables, but that is the jist of it. I have a chart with '68 shipping rates - somewhere.
I disagree. Corporate determined where the car would be built depending on the closest plant to the dealer to be delivered to. However depending on what plant it was shipped from the shipping cost could vary depending on the distence to the dealership.
Please explain the $149 Destination Charge associated with the delivery of the Road Runner that was delivered 7 miles from the LA plant.
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/23/10 01:42 AM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Was the destination charge a flat fee at the point??
Yes, the destination charge on a '68 Road Runner sold at Glendale CP should be the same no matter which plant it was built at.
The destination charge on a HEMI Road Runner built in Detroit would be the same as a 383 coupe built in Los Angeles, as well as a GTX convertible built in St. Louis. A-bodies were less & c-bodies were more. There may be a few more variables, but that is the jist of it. I have a chart with '68 shipping rates - somewhere.
I disagree. Corporate determined where the car would be built depending on the closest plant to the dealer to be delivered to. However depending on what plant it was shipped from the shipping cost could vary depending on the distence to the dealership.
Please explain the $149 Destination Charge associated with the delivery of the Road Runner that was delivered 7 miles from the LA plant.
Don't know, probably some union thing.
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/23/10 02:55 AM
Quote:
Don't know, probably some union thing.
You disagree with my statement but offer nothing but I "don't know"! BRAVO!!
Chrysler did NOT handicap sales of full size, convertible, or HEMI cars (none built on the west coast) by having an excessive "DESTINATION CHARGE" VS. the much smaller selection/variety of cars assembled locally at the LA plant.
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/23/10 03:09 AM
Quote:
Quote:
Don't know, probably some union thing.
You disagree with my statement but offer nothing but I "don't know"! BRAVO!! Chrysler did NOT handicap sales of full size, convertible, or HEMI cars (none built on the west coast) by having an excessive "DESTINATION CHARGE" VS. the much smaller selection/variety of cars assembled locally at the LA plant.
Well, I sold them new and do know that the shipping charges were diferent depending on what plant the came from.
I understand what you are talking about a handicap and that was always something that I didn't understand. It has been 40 years, maybe I am remebering it wrong but I don't think so because it was something I always questioned at the time.
Posted By: A12
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/23/10 04:40 AM
Actually the fixed destination charge is more for the protection of the dealer network than to benefit the sale of certain models. It is (was) price protection so a close dealer couldn’t advertise a $150+ lower price than someone that may be just a few hours across a State line for example. It still goes on today; the local Ford truck plant still applies the same destination charge to the dealer that is ten minutes away as they do to one a hundred miles away. Price protection not certain model promotion.
Posted By: autoxcuda
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/23/10 05:35 AM
Quote:
Quote:
Don't know, probably some union thing.
You disagree with my statement but offer nothing but I "don't know"! BRAVO!!
Chrysler did NOT handicap sales of full size, convertible, or HEMI cars (none built on the west coast) by having an excessive "DESTINATION CHARGE" VS. the much smaller selection/variety of cars assembled locally at the LA plant.
That 68 Window sticker has the same exact delivery charge of $149. I see that car is Hemi car, so it would have not been built at L.A. plant. Still same charge.
Posted By: JimDiesel
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/24/10 04:50 AM
Is there a way to get the headliner off without destroying it (unlikely as I tend to break things)? It is in decent shape and so I'd rather not - but I will if I need to.
Anything else I should do to document the paint besides more pics?
Does the 999 Omaha Orange add much value to the car, or is it worth about what a modified road runner with a crate HEMI is worth.
Thanks
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/24/10 07:23 PM
OK, let me see if I understand what you guys are saying here. Your saying that in the interest of keeping things fair throughout the country that the destination charge was the same throughout the country on a given car? Yes that would make it fair on a national basis but totally unfair on a local level and would have promote MANY more factory pick ups by buyers which by the way was minimal in the grand scheme of things.
I can tell you that at the dealership I worked at 68-74 the destination charges were different from every assembly plant we got them from depending on the distance from our dealership. It was a regional thing that was the same for any dealer in that region. If as an example a Cal. dealer ordered a hemi car that had to come from St. Louis, all dealers in his region would have the same destination charge. However, a dealer in the St. louis region would have a much lower destination charge. People don't shop cars coast to coast, they shop within their region and it was fair to all within the region.
Posted By: autoxcuda
Re: A match!!: 1968 RR - paint code 999 - VIN, SO - 03/25/10 07:27 AM
Quote:
OK, let me see if I understand what you guys are saying here. Your saying that in the interest of keeping things fair throughout the country that the destination charge was the same throughout the country on a given car? Yes that would make it fair on a national basis but totally unfair on a local level and would have promote MANY more factory pick ups by buyers which by the way was minimal in the grand scheme of things.
I can tell you that at the dealership I worked at 68-74 the destination charges were different from every assembly plant we got them from depending on the distance from our dealership. It was a regional thing that was the same for any dealer in that region. If as an example a Cal. dealer ordered a hemi car that had to come from St. Louis, all dealers in his region would have the same destination charge. However, a dealer in the St. louis region would have a much lower destination charge. People don't shop cars coast to coast, they shop within their region and it was fair to all within the region.
The desination charge of that 68 4spd RR that went from the LA plant to Glendale was the same charge at the 68 RR Hemi car that went from St Louis/Detroit? to Arizona that 6bblgt posted the window sticker for. How could that have happened? Was California in AZ's region??