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thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI

Posted By: hemi68charger

thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/07/14 08:49 PM

Hello All,
Looking to see what the difference in thickness of the 69 and earlier440 steel crank dampner versus the OEM 426 HEMI. I bought a set of 69 and later hemi pulleys. MY 426 HEMI has a 440 steel rotating assembly, hence the thinner dampner. I need to fabricate a spacer. I bought the spacer w/bolts sold by Hoovers Auto, but it is too thin.

Thanks again for all the help on this latest project of mine...
Posted By: JohnRR

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/07/14 09:34 PM

Ok re read , you are using Hemi pulleys on a wedge balancer , Mopar used to sell ... still sells ? .... a spacer because they put a wedge balancer on crate Hemis , if I remember right it's 3/4" thick.

You could have saved yourself a bunch of money and used wedge pulleys , only you and your hairdresser would have known ...


Posted By: hemi68charger

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/08/14 03:03 AM

Quote:

Ok re read , you are using Hemi pulleys on a wedge balancer , Mopar used to sell ... still sells ? .... a spacer because they put a wedge balancer on crate Hemis , if I remember right it's 3/4" thick.

You could have saved yourself a bunch of money and used wedge pulleys , only you and your hairdresser would have known ...






Thanks John. Your input is appreciated. But, I am pretty much bald, so I could give a rats hiney what any potential hairdresser thinks. Secondly, I am the most important person and I do want it to look as OEM correct as possible, period.. I will investigate the 3/4 spacer. Didn't see anything earlier in the catalog.
Posted By: JRepucci

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/08/14 03:51 AM

Troy. 2 9/16

Attached picture 8065694-DSC00636.JPG
Posted By: JRepucci

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/08/14 03:52 AM

2nd pic

Attached picture 8065697-DSC00637.JPG
Posted By: JRepucci

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/08/14 03:53 AM

I don't have a 440 damper here to measure.

Attached picture 8065699-DSC00638.JPG
Posted By: hemi68charger

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/08/14 05:00 PM

Thanks Jason........ I appreciate the info and you taking the time to take the pictures.....
Posted By: Triggerfish

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/08/14 05:49 PM

Troy, my balancer, part #3614371 (72 forged crank 440?), measures
1 7/8".

Attached picture 8066216-440balancermeasured.jpg
Posted By: hemi68charger

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/08/14 10:30 PM

Thanks guys.... Can someone take a measurement of the thickness of the main part of the balancer? I am taking it the both a 440 and 426 dampner would be inserted into the timing chain cover is about the same. I am thinking the difference in thickness between the two is the thickness I need?

I see there are sites with difference thickness and someone replied on a post here on moparts stating he could make custom thicknesses...... I looked again this morning for the item John mentioned about the 3/4" thick spacer from Mopar, but couldn't find it.....
Posted By: JRepucci

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/08/14 10:38 PM

The difference between the 2 measurements is 11/16...give or take the tongue on a metal tape measure 3/4 would suffice.
Posted By: hemi68charger

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/09/14 05:29 AM

Quote:

The difference between the 2 measurements is 11/16...give or take the tongue on a metal tape measure 3/4 would suffice.



Thanks Jason.....

I put a straight edge to the front face of the water pump pulley and positioned it down to the crank pulley. The distance from the leading edge of the water pump pulley and the front rim of the aft pulley on the crank was about 3/4's of an inch. So, looks like the .750 spacer is what I need... The water pump pulley lines up with the alternator pulley well....... Sooooooo, now the search for a 3/4" spacer....
Posted By: sthemi

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/10/14 12:56 AM

Why dont you just put a Hemi balancer on it? These are evenly balanced around the diameter unlike cast crank motors.
Since Mopar used 440 balamcers on Hemis, you should be able to go the other way..
Posted By: B5 Bee

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/10/14 01:05 AM

Quote:

The difference between the 2 measurements is 11/16...give or take the tongue on a metal tape measure 3/4 would suffice.



Tape measures are designed with a 'tongue' that moves so when measuring inside or outside, the distance is the same.
Posted By: hemi68charger

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/10/14 03:04 AM

Quote:

Why dont you just put a Hemi balancer on it? These are evenly balanced around the diameter unlike cast crank motors.
Since Mopar used 440 balamcers on Hemis, you should be able to go the other way..



Being that I don't know the dynamics of it all, I would have to ask the guy I got the motor from. But, in all honesty and this is not a smart-ass question; why is the dampner on a Hemi so much bigger than the dampner of a 440 HP of '69? There has to be a reason....... I am truly trying to learn and not make unwise decisions.
Posted By: JohnRR

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/11/14 04:58 PM

Quote:


I am the most important person and I do want it to look as OEM correct as possible, period.. I will investigate the 3/4 spacer. Didn't see anything earlier in the catalog.



If that is the case there is nothing even remotely stock Hemi looking about a wedge balancer , pony up the 400 bucks and buy the right balancer then ???

problem solved ...
Posted By: rick@laysons

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/11/14 06:45 PM

Quote:

why is the dampner on a Hemi so much bigger than the dampner of a 440 HP of '69? There has to be a reason......



I think it has to do with the weight of the rotating mass. The rotating mass of the hemi is greater than the rotating mass of the 440, so the hemi has to have a dampner with more mass to account for the greater weight.
Posted By: hemi68charger

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/11/14 07:17 PM

Quote:

Quote:

why is the dampner on a Hemi so much bigger than the dampner of a 440 HP of '69? There has to be a reason......



I think it has to do with the weight of the rotating mass. The rotating mass of the hemi is greater than the rotating mass of the 440, so the hemi has to have a dampner with more mass to account for the greater weight.



That is my logic too responding to the suggestion of ject replacing the 440 dampner with a HEMI dampner when the crank and rods in the hemi are from a '69 440 HP.....
Posted By: rick@laysons

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/11/14 07:19 PM

But the hemi pistons are heavier than the wedge pistons.
Posted By: hemi68charger

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/11/14 07:28 PM

Quote:

But the hemi pistons are heavier than the wedge pistons.



Adds fuel to "can't just swap out dampners"......

I think I may have gotten what I need.. I'll see here in the next couple of days.......
Posted By: JohnRR

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/11/14 07:34 PM

Quote:

But the hemi pistons are heavier than the wedge pistons.



And added to the mix is he used 440 rods which are shorter than hemi rods so he either has a heavier piston because it is .100 or so taller , or he has lower compression because the piston isn't up as high as it should be ... unless he used a 12.0 piston ? then there was the weight added to the crank to balance for a hemi ???
Posted By: hemi68charger

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/12/14 01:36 AM

Quote:

Quote:

But the hemi pistons are heavier than the wedge pistons.



And added to the mix is he used 440 rods which are shorter than hemi rods so he either has a heavier piston because it is .100 or so taller , or he has lower compression because the piston isn't up as high as it should be ... unless he used a 12.0 piston ? then there was the weight added to the crank to balance for a hemi ???



Lower compression would be the correct answer............. and my hairdresser is impressed............. Oh wait, I don't have one of those........
Posted By: cudaman1969

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/13/14 12:19 AM

I bet the guy used stock hemi rods and pistons on the 440 crank. I hope the guy rebalanced the crank too! If you are trying to make it look correct, use the hemi balancer, it'll cost the same to make a spacer. Its just bolt on and go(a longer bolt is needed).
Posted By: 71birdJ68

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/13/14 12:37 AM

I would suggest finding out just what you have. Then if I remember what you said you have Hemi pullies, right? You can get a Pro Race brand blancher that is the same thickness as a Hemi one. They are better, and after it is painted you really can't tell the difference. Thats what I did.
Posted By: JohnRR

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/13/14 03:12 PM

Quote:

I would suggest finding out just what you have. Then if I remember what you said you have Hemi pullies, right? You can get a Pro Race brand blancher that is the same thickness as a Hemi one. They are better, and after it is painted you really can't tell the difference. Thats what I did.



I have that balancer for my hemi , painted it will look somewhat correct but it has wedge depth hub , will still need the spacer.
Posted By: 3twos

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/13/14 05:18 PM

Quote:

The difference between the 2 measurements is 11/16...give or take the tongue on a metal tape measure 3/4 would suffice.



So what is the dimension of the thick part of the hemi balancer or the part that is visual? And what is the dimension of the 440 balancer that was referenced?
Posted By: HPMike

Re: thickness; '69/earlier 440 forged steel versus 426 HEMI - 03/13/14 09:15 PM

Quote:

Quote:

The difference between the 2 measurements is 11/16...give or take the tongue on a metal tape measure 3/4 would suffice.



So what is the dimension of the thick part of the hemi balancer or the part that is visual? And what is the dimension of the 440 balancer that was referenced?



Wedge 15/16"

Hemi 1-5/8"

Pictured is a factory dimensioned Hemi balancer that is fully degreed..Ive had it for 25 years..Prob an old DC piece..

MB

Attached picture 8072756-hemibalancer(Medium).jpg
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