Moparts
FBO Ignition system toubleshooting
Posted By: Robbins
FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/03/11 10:11 PM
I have less than 500 miles on the system. It just died in the garage from driving around town, lucky I know. Now no fire. The dizzy has 365 ohms.....ignition 1 and 2 at the ballast is good. The ballast has .9 ohms.
The coil is hot on both sides(12 volts) though, this doesn't seem right to me. Isn't the negative side of the coil supposed to blink with a test light when spinning over. It's just as hot as the positive side even just sitting not turning the motor over.
Also when key is on I have less than 4 volts coming from the ignition box to the dizzy, not sure if that's correct or not.
Any help would be appreciative, thanks.
Posted By: mikemee1331
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/03/11 11:22 PM
FBO ignition? which components exactly?
Posted By: Robbins
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/04/11 12:55 AM
It's an older (a couple of years ago now) system I guess, cause the website shows some different boxes now. Mine looks like the regular mopar style brain box, but it's black. I got the box, coil & ballast with it.
Posted By: mikemee1331
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/04/11 01:41 AM
all things being equal i would say the ballast went south, do you have spark at all from the coil? do you know what ohm the ballast is supposed to be rated at (should be stamped on it somewhere). can you just run a temporary jumper wire and bypass the ballast and see if it starts.
Posted By: Sinitro
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/04/11 03:10 AM
Make sure the ignition module is grounded well.
It needs to be screwed down tite, metal-to-metal..
Especially its rear side...
Also double check the reluctor gap should be 0.008 using a brass feeler gauge...
Just my $0.02...
Posted By: Robbins
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/04/11 04:38 AM
Quote:
all things being equal i would say the ballast went south, do you have spark at all from the coil? do you know what ohm the ballast is supposed to be rated at (should be stamped on it somewhere). can you just run a temporary jumper wire and bypass the ballast and see if it starts.
Thanks,
No spark at all, not sure it will being that its hot on both sides of the coil. My stock set up only has 6 volts in the run position with only 1.2 volts or so on the negative side of the coil.
I'll try jumping it tomorrow, just to try it.
Posted By: mikemee1331
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/04/11 12:57 PM
i didn't realize you had a spare coil. jump the ballast, see if it starts. if yes, the ballast is bad, if no leave the jumper in place and swap out the coil. if it starts then the coil is bad and most likely the ballast too (ballast failed, overheated/shorted the coil)and then you will have to decide what to do. i don't know if the FBO ecu requires the ballast or if it only there to protect the coil. being that the ECU is faily new i suspect the ballast is only there to protect the coil but you would have to contact FBO about that.
Posted By: YO7_A66
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/04/11 01:06 PM
Don told me that his original ECU could not handle 12v and that is why he had it redesigned with the new 12v coil.
I ran his old ECU with another brand 12v coil (no ballast) on the street for about 6 months with no issue. That ECU "might" last for a while with 12v on it.
I bought his new 12v ECU/Coil but I only have about 4 weeks driving time on them, but so far no problems.
Posted By: mikemee1331
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/04/11 02:14 PM
Quote:
Don told me that his original ECU could not handle 12v and that is why he had it redesigned with the new 12v coil.
I ran his old ECU with another brand 12v coil (no ballast) on the street for about 6 months with no issue. That ECU "might" last for a while with 12v on it.
I bought his new 12v ECU/Coil but I only have about 4 weeks driving time on them, but so far no problems.
good info here 
and do check what Sinitro suggested.
Posted By: gtsdude
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/04/11 03:11 PM
I had same issue with my ballast blowing, try an MSD ballast, have never blew one of those yet, been 5 years now.
Posted By: mikemee1331
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/04/11 03:42 PM
Quote:
I had same issue with my ballast blowing, try an MSD ballast, have never blew one of those yet, been 5 years now.
his ignition is all matched. your suggestion is all well and good if the ohms are the same ballast to ballast.
Posted By: Robbins
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/04/11 03:49 PM
I haven't had a chance to go outside this morning, but it doesn't seem wrong to have 12 volt on the negative side of the coil?
Posted By: Ronnman
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/04/11 04:04 PM
You have 12 volts on both terminals because its is not being grounded by the ECU. The ECU may not be receiving a signal from the distributor module or the ECU has a problem, maybe grounding as mentioned, or is bad. If you disconnect the distributor 2 prong connector and tap the male connect on the harness side that goes to the ECU, that should trigger the ECU to fire the coil.
You are reading the "dead end" 12V on both terminals because there is no current flow. If no current flow through a resistor (coil) the voltage drop will be zero, thus the presence of 12V on each terminal.
Ron
Posted By: 469runner
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/04/11 04:29 PM
That box is probably bad. I had the same issue and replaced the box. I barely had 2000 miles on this set up. That stuff is all hype. It won't produce one more horsepower. "Yap, yap, yap,my stuff is better than everyones elses, all made in the USA." Yeah, tell that to the guy that spent 200 dollars on your stuff and is now sitting on the side of the road. OK, rant off. Just get a mopar performance setup. You'll be happier.
Posted By: JohnRR
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/04/11 06:55 PM
Quote:
That box is probably bad. I had the same issue and replaced the box. I barely had 2000 miles on this set up. That stuff is all hype. It won't produce one more horsepower. "Yap, yap, yap,my stuff is better than everyones elses, all made in the USA." Yeah, tell that to the guy that spent 200 dollars on your stuff and is now sitting on the side of the road. OK, rant off. Just get a mopar performance setup. You'll be happier.
And carry a spare ECU and a ballast ....
Posted By: gtsdude
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/04/11 11:10 PM
I had the same FBO system, MSD Ballast is what they suggested after i blew two of the regular ballasts.
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Posted By: abodyjoe
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/05/11 12:14 AM
i know a few guys that had issues with FOB ecu and ballasts on the older units. don suggested the msd ballast and it cured the one guys problems. the other went through like 2 ecu's. fbo did stand behind his product and get him another one out. what ever you decide always carry an extra ecu and ballast with you. i carry a ecu,coil and a ballast in my trunk at all times. never know when you may need it. cheap insurance.
Posted By: gtsdude
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/05/11 12:23 AM
yep, me too. Had the FBO coil crack where the plug wires goes in. Was almost a year after I installed it, Don sent one out free of charge and no questions asked. Great to deal with.
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Posted By: Robbins
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/05/11 03:50 AM
Thanks guys, I'll be calling him and see what he says next week.
Posted By: Robbins
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/06/11 09:52 PM
Well...........I called him. I'm out on warranty by a day or two. But he did give some info....I shouldn't have 12 volt with the key in the on position like I do.
Well as soon as I plug into the ballast I get 12 volts, I'm not sure how or why. Unplug the pink wires from the ballast and no voltage. My blue wire is supposed to have 12 volts, but the pink two wires on the other side in the run position shouldn't have until you turn the key to ignition two. When I ohm the resister it shows 1.2 ohms.
What I'm missing here?
Posted By: 383man
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/06/11 10:26 PM
Quote:
You have 12 volts on both terminals because its is not being grounded by the ECU. The ECU may not be receiving a signal from the distributor module or the ECU has a problem, maybe grounding as mentioned, or is bad. If you disconnect the distributor 2 prong connector and tap the male connect on the harness side that goes to the ECU, that should trigger the ECU to fire the coil.
You are reading the "dead end" 12V on both terminals because there is no current flow. If no current flow through a resistor (coil) the voltage drop will be zero, thus the presence of 12V on each terminal.
Ron
That is 100% correct. To add if the ballast was bad you would not have voltage to the coil as it goes thru the ballast in the run position. And you said it read .9 ohms. Do the test where you touch the male end of the dist harness to ground and see if it sparks. If it dont you need the ECU and it it does its not seeing the dist signal. Ron
Posted By: mikemee1331
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/06/11 10:34 PM
Quote:
Quote:
You have 12 volts on both terminals because its is not being grounded by the ECU. The ECU may not be receiving a signal from the distributor module or the ECU has a problem, maybe grounding as mentioned, or is bad. If you disconnect the distributor 2 prong connector and tap the male connect on the harness side that goes to the ECU, that should trigger the ECU to fire the coil.
You are reading the "dead end" 12V on both terminals because there is no current flow. If no current flow through a resistor (coil) the voltage drop will be zero, thus the presence of 12V on each terminal.
Ron
That is 100% correct. To add if the ballast was bad you would not have voltage to the coil as it goes thru the ballast in the run position. And you said it read .9 ohms. Do the test where you touch the male end of the dist harness to ground and see if it sparks. If it dont you need the ECU and it it does its not seeing the dist signal. Ron
what he said and did you find out what ohm the ballast is supposed to be? did you make sure the ECU is grounded?
Posted By: Robbins
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/06/11 11:40 PM
Ok, I was trying to learn to trouble shoot with the ohm meter and look at stuff. Don at FBO I was talking again this afternoon and done some more trouble shooting and we ended up trying another box that I had on my dad's van that wasn't too old. It fired right up so it was the box. Once running the positive side of the coil had 6 volts on it. Why the RC read differently than my shotbed I don't know.......both work so.
Anyway he cut me a deal on one of his newer units & sent it out the door today. Thanks Don.
Thanks everybody for your feedback.
Posted By: Robbins
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/06/11 11:42 PM
Quote:
Quote:
You have 12 volts on both terminals because its is not being grounded by the ECU. The ECU may not be receiving a signal from the distributor module or the ECU has a problem, maybe grounding as mentioned, or is bad. If you disconnect the distributor 2 prong connector and tap the male connect on the harness side that goes to the ECU, that should trigger the ECU to fire the coil.
You are reading the "dead end" 12V on both terminals because there is no current flow. If no current flow through a resistor (coil) the voltage drop will be zero, thus the presence of 12V on each terminal.
Ron
That is 100% correct. To add if the ballast was bad you would not have voltage to the coil as it goes thru the ballast in the run position. And you said it read .9 ohms. Do the test where you touch the male end of the dist harness to ground and see if it sparks. If it dont you need the ECU and it it does its not seeing the dist signal. Ron
Ron, thanks I'll do that next time.......I guess I missed that in the other post to try that. Sorry.
Posted By: mikemee1331
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/07/11 12:13 AM
i don't mean to beat a dead horse but did you find out about the ballast resistor? is he sending a new one? does his new ECU require one and does the current coil?
Posted By: Robbins
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/07/11 12:18 AM
Well, it (ballast) worked with a different brain box. So.........I'm not sure what it should ohm out to. Today is was reading 1.2 where the other day it was .9 This is my Fluke meter.
The newer system doesn't require a ballast and he says to tie them together, I would probably do a nice jumper so I can go to regular system on the fly if need to.
Just so you know he says that you can run the older box with the older and the newer style for 30 minutes or so to get home if need be.
Posted By: mikemee1331
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/07/11 12:30 AM
at the risk of starting the 'Holy Ballast Resistor' war again, i think you should call him and make sure the coil he sold you is a true 12v or is internally ballasted (is that a word?). if its a 9v coil and you run it without a working ballast you will cook it after awhile. and telling me what ohms your meter is reading doesn't help as i don't know what the ballast is rated for. something caused your old ECU to burn out after only 500 miles
..................
Posted By: Robbins
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/07/11 02:12 AM
Quote:
at the risk of starting the 'Holy Ballast Resistor' war again, i think you should call him and make sure the coil he sold you is a true 12v or is internally ballasted (is that a word?). if its a 9v coil and you run it without a working ballast you will cook it after awhile. and telling me what ohms your meter is reading doesn't help as i don't know what the ballast is rated for. something caused your old ECU to burn out after only 500 miles ..................
Don was saying that both units take the same coil, I'm guessing that the new unit is done internally? Once it comes in I'll found out more. I'll post what I find....
Posted By: YO7_A66
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/07/11 11:44 AM
""i think you should call him and make sure the coil he sold you is a true 12v or is internally ballasted (is that a word?)""
The new FBO coil #HR688 is a true 12v coil. (Reference, the coil can be mounted in any direction, per Don.) It looks just like the old FBO coil (size and shape) except for the writing on the coil is different. The old coil/ECU could handle 12v for a short time period (Don designed it this way for his drag car) and the new coil/ECU was designed for 12v all the time.
I know for a fact that the new coil and the old coil are not the same unit. I started emailing Don in the Spring of 2010 to see if he was going to come out with a 12v coil and he had already been testing one for a while. Last fall (2010) when I wanted to swap to a 12v coil, I emailed him again about his 12v coil and it was still not ready. Then this past Spring I emailed him again and it was being tested but still not ready. This past Summer he started selling them and I now have one and I have been running it now for about 6 weeks. Don's ignition parts may be a little more expensive, but Don sells a very nice Mopar ignition system.
Posted By: Robbins
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/07/11 11:31 PM
Thanks, I'll call him.
Posted By: mikemee1331
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/07/11 11:33 PM
Quote:
Thanks, I'll call him.
Posted By: Robbins
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/25/11 12:32 PM
I haven't called him yet, but the new box is on and working here are a couple of pictures of the newer box.
Posted By: Robbins
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/25/11 12:33 PM
pix two
Posted By: Robbins
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/25/11 12:34 PM
pix three
Posted By: Robbins
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/25/11 12:35 PM
last one
Posted By: Hemi ragtop
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/25/11 02:41 PM
I waited for over 2 months for the latest Box from FBO. This one does away with the ballast altogether. When I tried to fire up my new 540" HEMI, I had nothing coming out of the box.
Called the next day, described replacing FBO with $30 auto parts box and heard a bunch of BS about not getting the pins lined up from the plug to the box.
Funny, I had NO issues with the el cheapo auto parts plug interface!
![Attached picture 6841441-0727090725[1].jpg](https://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/upload2/6841441-0727090725[1].jpg "6841441-0727090725[1].jpg")
Posted By: NachoRT74
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/25/11 05:29 PM
pretty box but REALLY EXPENSIVE for what it looks is built inside:
https://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/show...e=3#Post6838807( check the link I posted there )
Posted By: Robbins
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/26/11 03:07 AM
.....that's just messed up.
Who ever posted that on that site......thanks for the heads up.
Posted By: NachoRT74
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/26/11 04:04 AM
maybe IS TRUE the GM HEI module inside is nothing like a stock unit and really a Performance piece, but still on that way!!! I still can get a Performance GM kind HEI unit ( Moroso or Accel like I have foudn on the ebay ) and built into a stock original box like I posted there
Posted By: drago
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/26/11 04:12 AM
Holy heck - hei four pin module hidden inside a box? that's uncool.
Posted By: Hemi ragtop
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/26/11 11:17 AM
This story about the FBO box sounds just like mine. Again, how can the harness or connection of the harness be questioned when (like me), he was able to plug in a stock box and his engine would run?
Posted By: abodyjoe
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/26/11 11:40 AM
Quote:
pretty box but REALLY EXPENSIVE for what it looks is built inside:
https://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/show...e=3#Post6838807
( check the link I posted there )
interesting. i bought this set up http://designed2drive.com/ to put HEI on my car. still haven't gotten around to installing it.. its a lot cheaper then that FBO box...
Quote:
According to Don it's not, and it doesn't operate like one either, it just happens to look similar to one, but you would have to ask him yourself for further explination or perhaps a better description. He also stated that most of the cost for the unit is tied up in the billet Mopar style box, and not the part that's in it.
who knows what it really is. lol
Posted By: Robbins
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 09/26/11 10:35 PM
The funny thing is that I almost took the back off and looked at it. Oh, well it's water under the bridge now.
Thanks again Nacho for posting that other post for us.
Posted By: Robbins
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 10/07/11 02:43 AM
Well, I'm having issues already. Once warmed up it doesn't want to start, no fire. I'm going to call him tomorrow.
Joe, I had thought about buying the one that you posted a long time ago when I first seen it. The first time I think that I seen anything like it....I was at an early Hemi guy's place...Kent Redd.....he had one under a plate behind the carb on a 271 Dodge Hemi. "Just run four wires" he said.
Other than the box is a little expensive in my opinion, I like the idea of it looking stock and not having to rewire....seeings I just done a ton of rewiring under the hood on this thing. It looks like the aftermarket has tons of these modules...looks like MSD has one now that looks like a stock GM piece.
I've got a pix of the back of this that I'll pm to anybody if they are wanting to see what it looks like.
Just to be clear, I never was posting anything in this thread to bash Don! I was just posting a question on trouble shooting ideas. Which I got some thanks Moparts.
Posted By: Robbins
Re: FBO Ignition system toubleshooting - 10/07/11 08:44 PM
Quote:
Well, I'm having issues already. Once warmed up it doesn't want to start, no fire. I'm going to call him tomorrow.
Well, I told him what was happening and he had me tighten up the pickup to reluctor clearance in the dizzy and wala.
Thanks Don.