3.3 water pump ?

Posted By: dOc !

3.3 water pump ? - 05/24/11 01:18 AM

2003 Caravan ..... anything uNusual to look out for ? I heard somewhere you need a special tool for the serp belt ...what is the time factor in a R&R ? .... what is the most reasonably priced lifetime pump ? ... AZ ?

Posted By: dOc !

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 05/25/11 03:42 AM

Posted By: HotRodDave

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 05/25/11 03:51 AM

Real easy to do, no special tools required for the serp belt, they are available and can make it just a tad easier but definately not a "need".

Posted By: dOc !

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 05/25/11 03:54 AM

How about the other Q's Dave ?

Posted By: Blown71X

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 05/25/11 12:26 PM

`03 is a rear mount pump, and while not really hard, not as easy as `00 back.
The bolted on pulley has cutouts in it to slide over the pump drive, the pulley and pump have to come out and go in together as there is not enough room between the pump and frame rail to get the pulley off seperately.
Depending on engine placement you will probably have to slightly pry the engine towards the driver side for the pump to clear.
The tensioner rquires a 1/2" square drive, not enough room for a normal ratchet so it has to be thin. If you get creative, it can be done with a pry bar.
All has to be done from the bottom, wheel off, splash shield off.

Rick

Posted By: dOc !

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 05/25/11 02:51 PM

Hay Rick .. would a 1/2" breaker-bar fit on the tensioner ? Also ... I hear that the pass side motor mount should be uNconnected ...and the motor dropped down slightly ... ??

Posted By: Blown71X

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 05/25/11 05:38 PM

Quote:

Hay Rick .. would a 1/2" breaker-bar fit on the tensioner ? Also ... I hear that the pass side motor mount should be uNconnected ...and the motor dropped down slightly ... ??

Doubtfull on the breaker bar, unless it is real thin..You only have maybe a inch in that area.

I`m cheap so rather than buy the trick ratcheting ones, I made my own out of 1/2 square stock and a piece of 3/16 x 1" flat stock.

I personally don`t take the mount loose..that is taking WAY more off than needed...I never even open the hood until I refill it.

Rick

Posted By: Todd

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 05/25/11 05:44 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Hay Rick .. would a 1/2" breaker-bar fit on the tensioner ? Also ... I hear that the pass side motor mount should be uNconnected ...and the motor dropped down slightly ... ??

Doubtfull on the breaker bar, unless it is real thin..You only have maybe a inch in that area.

I`m cheap so rather than buy the trick ratcheting ones, I made my own out of 1/2 square stock and a piece of 3/16 x 1" flat stock.

I personally don`t take the mount loose..that is taking WAY more off than needed...I never even open the hood until I refill it.

Rick

Thats how I do them. All from the bottom.

And be very carefull not to break off the bolts holding the water pump on! If they dont want to come out, A little heat on the housing helps.

IIRC they pay around 1.7 hours to do.

Posted By: dOc !

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 05/25/11 06:05 PM

THX guyz .....

So does that tensioner/idler for-sure have that 1/2" hex hole ? ... I was told by AZ that the 03 did not have one. ... ???

So is the AZ pump the plan? .. from the quality and warranty stand-point ?

What I am trying to do is get all my ducks in row before I start on this minor project.

Posted By: mikemee1331

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 05/25/11 06:19 PM

Quote:

What I am trying to do is get all my ducks in row before I start on this minor project.

regardless of what you have heard, you'll never be able to get ALL the ducks lined up. very short attention spans and when you herd them on one side, they scatter to the other

Posted By: Todd

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 05/25/11 06:20 PM

You can do it with a wrench also.

Attached picture 6650357-tensoiner.gif

Posted By: dOc !

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 05/25/11 06:25 PM

THX Todd ... I have never even had the splash shield off yet to eyeball this myself. And the Chilton manual I have is not a whole lot of help either ....

Posted By: HotRodDave

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 05/25/11 07:36 PM

I use the wrench method, a thin breaker bar can also be used, tight fit but I have one I got from GM good wrench that works, barely, I would imagine it could be imposible with the motor or sheet metal slightly shifted either direction.

Warranty time is 1.5 hours.

I don't know enough about the quality of different aftermarket brands to say if AZ has a good one or not, they all change vendors and re-builders so fast it is hard to say what you will get. I would just get the cheapest NEW pump I could find unless the price differance was HUGE then I would get a lifetime reman

Chilton and haynes both suck!

Posted By: gtx6970

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 05/25/11 07:40 PM

put a 3/4" wrench on the tensioner as shown to loosen the belt.

I take the pulley bolts out of the pump then use a prybar on the upper mount to push the engine towards the drivers side ( slightly as you don't need but maybe 1/2" at the most )
The pulley will drop out, then remove pump as normal.

Be very carefull, those little water pump bolts are notorious to break off in the hsg.

Posted By: dOc !

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 05/25/11 08:06 PM

BE CAREFUL with those little bolts ? ....since I don't think you can get an impact gun in there ..... your suggestion would be what? ...and if one of them breaks off ... will that O-ring still seal OK ?

Posted By: therocks

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 05/26/11 01:32 PM

Doc the pump I got from Advanced had a Mopar sticker on it.It was a new one.Ive had a few on the bolts stuck.I just work them back and forth real easy with some good penatrating oil sprayed on them.They always come out with some paitiance.I always use antisieze when I reinstall them.I always get a new pump when I replace them.For the little they cost remans arent worth it.Rocky

Posted By: gtx6970

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 05/26/11 01:39 PM

Rust penetrant and one of those small torchs are your friends.

If the bolt feels real tight,,,, STOP. warm up the area around said bolt and spray some penetrant on it. let it sit and try again.

SOME will still break and they have to be driled out and tapped.
It will leak if you leave one out thinking the O-ring will seal it, trust me

Posted By: Magnumguy

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 05/26/11 03:41 PM

Not sure if this helps, I changed one on a 3.3 in our Dynasty, it was one of the easier pumps, time-wise, to do. My first east-west pump change and it went well.

BE patient with it!! Hope it works out ok.

Posted By: dOc !

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 05/26/11 04:00 PM

THX guyz ....all I have done on this so-far on a V6 is change the oil and filter. JUST trying to have all my "bases" covered as well as possible.

Worst case .... if one of those bolts break ... what kind of a process is it to remove the housing from the block ? ...and would it be better to remove the whole combo from the block instead of the pump alone?

Posted By: Blown71X

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 05/26/11 05:24 PM

Quote:

Not sure if this helps, I changed one on a 3.3 in our Dynasty, it was one of the easier pumps, time-wise, to do. My first east-west pump change and it went well.

Unfortunally this doesn`t count in this case, After 2000 they moved the pump to the rear (or right for you north/south guys) and with it being right next to the frame rail it adds a level of difficulty....The old front mounts were a piece of cake

Rick

Posted By: dOc !

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 05/28/11 04:56 AM

....on the WP housing Q ..

Posted By: dOc !

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 06/11/11 11:34 PM

Doing this project tonite ...along with some other stuff to prep for the trip.

In addition to what I asked .... can you get the pulley off the pump by uNconnecting the pass side motor-mount?

Posted By: Todd

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 06/12/11 01:28 AM

After you get the belt off and the coolant drained, remove the pulley bolts and leave the pulley in there. Leave the mount in there. Then remove the water pump bolts. Then use a large pry bar and pry the engine over to the left to have adequate room to remove both at the same time. You'll be done in no time. As long as you don't break off any bolts

Posted By: dOc !

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 06/12/11 03:30 AM

NOT KNOWING bolt sizes etc ... I have coasted along. Right now I am stopped at the WP bolt at 10 oclock. I am going to have to modify a box wrench to get at that. The other WP bolts so far were EZ... BUT a PITA. I dropped the pass side mount as far as it would go .... 1.5 inches ... that exposed the pulley and WP bolts better.

What a LOUSY @$$ design this is ..... oleHAM must have had his hand in this.

Pry Bar ? .... move the motor to the left(rear) ? .... NOT to the front? BTW Todd ... just in case someone else is reading this ... how do you handle a broken bolt?

Posted By: Todd

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 06/12/11 04:43 AM

Quote:

NOT KNOWING bolt sizes etc ... I have coasted along. Right now I am stopped at the WP bolt at 10 oclock. I am going to have to modify a box wrench to get at that. The other WP bolts so far were EZ... BUT a PITA. I dropped the pass side mount as far as it would go .... 1.5 inches ... that exposed the pulley and WP bolts better.

What a LOUSY @$$ design this is ..... oleHAM must have had his hand in this.

No need to take the mount off.

If you pry the engine to the left (drivers side) the water pump/pulley assembly will have enough room to come out.
To get out the broken bolt , drill and easy out if it's flush. Alot of times just the head breaks off and has enough left to get some vise grips on with a little heat on the housing.

Pry Bar ? .... move the motor to the left(rear) ? .... NOT to the front? BTW Todd ... just in case someone else is reading this ... how do you handle a broken bolt?

Posted By: dOc !

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 06/12/11 05:01 AM

What was that all about Todd .... ??

There HAS TO BE an EZier way to R&R that 10 oclock bolt ... it is almost out ... but all I can turn it is maybe 1/4/1/8 turn at-the-best......

I am working with a "lame" left hand ... but still ....

Posted By: Todd

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 06/12/11 05:06 AM

Sorry! I replied to the last on my iPod.

I usually use a 10mm gear wrench and a 1/4" ratchet.

Posted By: dOc !

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 06/12/11 05:15 AM

.....yeah that's the ticket ... who makes a FINE-tooth 10mm gear wrench ?

I have been using a 1/4 ratchet on the rest. How many of these have you done? ... I would think it would be EZier on a lift. I am doing this on a concrete floor. A 3 ton jack-stand ... a floor jack and TWO bottle jacks ...

One bottle jack uNder the oil pan and the other tweaking the tensioner ...

Posted By: Todd

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 06/12/11 06:09 AM

I've always done them on a lift. I'm guess I'm spoiled. Done quite a few over the years. While your under there take a peek at the tube going to the lower radiator hose. They like to pin holes in them.

Posted By: dOc !

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 06/12/11 07:42 AM

FINALLY got it out and prepped everything for the install. If I had RTVed the O-ring on the WP earlier I would have stayed up and finished it.

Oh ....I wire-brushed the bolts and put a dab of anti-seize on them and ran them in ...and then out ... SHOULD go together much EZier ....

That lower tube ? ... looks almost new

Posted By: Todd

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 06/12/11 01:34 PM

Thats good about the lower tube. They like to rust out right around the attachment tab.

Posted By: dOc !

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 06/12/11 11:35 PM

I looked at that tube better ..... that tab area could be a concern. I might pop-it-off and do a REpaint with some good engine enamel.

That 10 oclock bolt ....

I crank-it-in 20 or so times(1/8 of a turn) and then I have to take a break(my arm cramps-up) .... this really ticks me off ...

Posted By: dOc !

Re: 3.3 water pump ? - 06/15/11 05:15 AM

JUSTa followup .... for some that might have been following this ....

all is well .... I cut a 10mm box wrench down to about 3.5" long and I could get it to swing about 2/3 of a turn ...

But a ratchet wrench would have worked better..... and BTW .... if you are located in the midwest ....near a Meijer store .. they have a SLICK set of these wrenches ON SALE this week. 10 piece set - 53 beans.

And these are the NICE ONES .... I think 70 clicks on a 360. Does anyone remember the KD ones ... that were maybe 12 or so ...for a 360 ? ..

Talked to a Bud of mine who is a mechanic who is a recent Mopar convert .... his SNAPon set he thinks was almost 200$.