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EBODY 3SPEED WIPER PARK POSITION

Posted By: kingkt

EBODY 3SPEED WIPER PARK POSITION - 06/18/10 06:14 PM

WONDERING IF ANYONE KNOWS HOW A 3 SPEED WIPER IS SUPPOSE TO GO INTO A PARK POSITION? IVE WORKED ON 2 SPEED WIPERS IN THE PAST AND I UNDERSTAND HOW THOSE WORK UT THE 3 SPEED ARM HAS NO USHING ATTACHED TO THE ARM/MOTOR. ALSO THE MOTOR I HAVE INSTALLED IS A NOS MOTOR. AND IT SEEMS TO ONLY HAVE 1 SPEED...FAST... THE RALLY SWITCH MOVES SMOOTHLY INTO EACH SETTING UT THE SPEED OF THE WIPER DONT CHANGE. AND INPUT IS APPRECIATED. THANK YOU
Posted By: cuda-sweden

Re: EBODY 3SPEED WIPER PARK POSITION - 06/18/10 07:11 PM

i think the variable/3speed parks with the stuff thats under the lid/a kind of breaker point attatched under the lid and a jadajadajada.its all in the service manual,even different tests you can do to check whats wrong.also i think PASSIONFORMOPARS.COM has some info on her site how to test the motor.if you not have the oem wiring i would check that out.also do you have all screws in your left interior pod that holds the switches,it must be grounded.
Posted By: Evil Monkey

Re: EBODY 3SPEED WIPER PARK POSITION - 06/19/10 05:34 AM

I'm going off some old memories, but I had my 3 speed wiper on my Cuda break on me back in the '90's so that it would not go into Park. It was fairly easy to pull apart and figure out what the problem was, and I found the part I needed to repair it in a junkyard. Here's what I remember:

There is a nylon gear inside the wiper unit that has a track in it, and when the wiper is in one of the 3 speed settings, the gear rotates in one direction (at different speeds for each setting), and the track in the gear connects to the arm on the outside of the wiper unit, which connects to the wiper linkage and causes the wipers to go back and forth. When you turn the wipers off, you are not killing the power to the wiper motor, what is happening is you are reversing the motor, which causes the nylon gear to reverse. The wipers will instantly stop and move in the other direction when this happens (if the wipers were halfway through their sweep going down when you turn the switch to the off position, they will instantly start moving up). There is a small tab in the track in the nylon gear, and when the internal piece that connects the gear to the outer arm hits this tab, it causes it to go into a small 'side' track that has a shorter radius than the 'normal' track. The gear is orientated so that this 'side' track comes in play when the wipers are at the bottom of their travel. Going into the 'side' track is what actually parks the wipers - the shorter radius of the 'side' track causes the wipers to go down further in to the park position. Once it goes a short distance down the 'side' track, it will bump against a set of breaker points, opening the points and killing the power to the wiper motor. The 3 'forward' speeds for the wiper motor do not go through the breaker points, so when you turn the wipers back on, the wiper motor spins in it's 'forward' direction, it will come out of the 'side' track into the 'normal' track, and the wipers will run back and forth.

What happened when mine broke, was the small tab on the nylon gear broke off. When I turned the power off to the wipers, the motor reversed, but it never went into the 'side' track, so the wipers just went back and forth in reverse, never parking and never shutting off. And, wipers going back and forth in reverse look just like wipers going back and forth in forward, so it was very hard to tell what was really going on until I took it apart and reverse engineered it. When I figured out that the tab had broken off of the nylon gear, I found another gear in a junkyard and replaced it, and my wipers have worked fine since.

Hopefully this makes sense - it's a long winded explaination that would be much easier to explain if I had a picture of the nylon gear so I could draw arrows and circles on it
Posted By: Evil Monkey

Re: EBODY 3SPEED WIPER PARK POSITION - 06/19/10 05:49 AM

Quote:

also do you have all screws in your left interior pod that holds the switches,it must be grounded.




Cuda-Sweeden is right about this - this could be the cause of only having one speed. One of the screw holes in the switch pod has a metal grouding tab on it, and when you screw the pod in place, it grounds the pod to the dash frame. If I remember right, not having this screw in will cause it to run in one speed only.
Posted By: kingkt

Re: EBODY 3SPEED WIPER PARK POSITION - 06/19/10 04:40 PM

thank you for your input. but it sounds like your speaking of the 2 speed motor... as the 3 speed does not have that nylon gear/bushing. the wiper arm linkage on a 3 speed connects directly to the Z bracket on the wiper motor without having the nylon. it is held on to the post with a rubber washer and normal clip. the 2 speed is held on the post by a spring.
Posted By: cuda-sweden

Re: EBODY 3SPEED WIPER PARK POSITION - 06/19/10 06:17 PM

i think evil monkey is talking about the big nylon gear inside a 3 speed/variable motor,the parking meccanism is there to,inside the motor wich reverses the motor so it parks.
Posted By: kingkt

Re: EBODY 3SPEED WIPER PARK POSITION - 06/19/10 06:44 PM

oh ok welli never opened the motor ut i know there a nylon gear inside the cowl where a 2 speed arm connects to the motor. ill remove the motor today and check that out hopefully i can fix this damn thing. thank you
Posted By: cuda-sweden

Re: EBODY 3SPEED WIPER PARK POSITION - 06/19/10 07:08 PM

mine didnt park either but it shows how to test the motor in the service manual,very helpfull and easy with a couple of jumper wires,and www.passionformopars.com has those very same diagrams on her site,i think.with those cables you can test if it will park without being attatched to the switch.
Posted By: Evil Monkey

Re: EBODY 3SPEED WIPER PARK POSITION - 06/20/10 03:39 AM

Quote:

i think evil monkey is talking about the big nylon gear inside a 3 speed/variable motor,the parking meccanism is there to,inside the motor wich reverses the motor so it parks.




Yes, that is the gear I was talking about. The 3 speed wiper units basically have a motor and a gearbox, and if you open the gearbox, there's a nylon gear that is 2 or 3 inches in diameter.
Posted By: kingkt

Re: EBODY 3SPEED WIPER PARK POSITION - 06/20/10 04:42 AM

THANX FOR THE INFO. i looked it up and did the test. seems as tho the nos motor i installed is defective and wont park when tested. i have several other motors and found 1 that tested fine. i installed it and now the damn thing not only wont park but wont shut off. i disconnected the harness at the switch and it shut off i reconnect it while switch is off and the motor wont run but when i turn the switch it runs but wont shut off. and it wont park. and theres still no 3 speed to the motor. im determined top get this thing working right. but before buying a bunch of unneeded parts i hope there is one of you mopar guys who have the answer. thank you all. your help is very much appreciated! but i am abit frustrated at this damn thing.
Posted By: Evil Monkey

Re: EBODY 3SPEED WIPER PARK POSITION - 06/20/10 05:34 AM

Quote:

i reconnect it while switch is off and the motor wont run but when i turn the switch it runs but wont shut off. and it wont park.




That sounds like what happened to mine when it broke - it still ran in the off position. Try doing this and let us know the results - it will tell us weather the motor is reversing or not.


With the wipers running in any of the on positions, wait until the wipers go down all the way and just start back up again, and then turn the switch to the off position and watch what happens to the wiper blades.

Do they immediately reverse direction and go down when the switch is turned off (without going up all the way first), and then go back up again when they reach bottom?

OR

Do they continue going all the way up after you turn the switch off, and then start going down?


The answer to this will tell us if the motor is reversing. If it is reversing but the wipers won't park, then the large nylon gear is probably broken like mine was. If the motor is not reversing, then we can try to figure out why it isn't, and it will probably park and shut off once we get the motor to reverse.
Posted By: cuda-sweden

Re: EBODY 3SPEED WIPER PARK POSITION - 06/20/10 06:42 PM

Quote:

THANX FOR THE INFO. i looked it up and did the test. seems as tho the nos motor i installed is defective and wont park when tested. i have several other motors and found 1 that tested fine. i installed it and now the damn thing not only wont park but wont shut off. i disconnected the harness at the switch and it shut off i reconnect it while switch is off and the motor wont run but when i turn the switch it runs but wont shut off. and it wont park. and theres still no 3 speed to the motor. im determined top get this thing working right. but before buying a bunch of unneeded parts i hope there is one of you mopar guys who have the answer. thank you all. your help is very much appreciated! but i am abit frustrated at this damn thing.


if you have the switch pod hanging off the instrument panel while testing,remember to use a jumper cable between switch pod and ground,instead of the pod mounting screw(ground) thats not there when the pod,s not installed
Posted By: kingkt

Re: EBODY 3SPEED WIPER PARK POSITION - 06/20/10 06:58 PM

ok tried it. with no change. the motor wont turn off. it does however seem to go to a lower speed when i shut the switch off. i did do some research and in 1970-71 the rally package was a variable switch and the 72-74 was a 3 speed switch. i have the 3 speed switch with a 70-71 cluster. i found a blog wherepeople say a 3 speed switch works fine in a variable. i noticed that the rally wires have 2 plug in harness's. the manual says the 4 prong harness is for the 3 and the 2 prong is for the 2. with both being able to pug into the switch. but the only way the 4 prong will fit the switch is if the 2 prong wont at the same time. since i tested the motor outside the car and it parked fine and ran fine.im starting to think its the switch.

Attached picture 6046330-pijj001.JPG
Posted By: kingkt

Re: EBODY 3SPEED WIPER PARK POSITION - 06/21/10 05:16 AM

i did run a jumper for the ground. but it was working as i does when i did not use the jumper.
Posted By: Evil Monkey

Re: EBODY 3SPEED WIPER PARK POSITION - 06/21/10 09:32 AM

It sounds like the mismatched switch might be the problem then. If the motor parks fine when you bench test it, I would think it will work on the car too. I'm pretty sure the 3 speed motors are interchangable between all the years, but I don't know one way or the other if you can use a variable switch with the 3 speed wiring.

I don't know if it would be possible to trace the wires that you jumper during the bench test back to the switch, and then jumper them there at the switch connector. If you can, and the motor works correctly when you bench test it from the switch connector, then the problem would be isolated to the switch only.
Posted By: kingkt

Re: EBODY 3SPEED WIPER PARK POSITION - 06/22/10 03:17 AM

welli been shopping for a switch and found one in the shop that looks liKe a rally switch But seems to have only 2 speeds. i plugged it in and theres 1 post not on the switch thats on the other but figured what the heck give it a shot.... anyway it starts the motor and turns it off with no speeds. when i turned it to the 2nd speed the motor shuts off and when i shut it off the motor shuts ofF and seems to want to go into park but wont make it the whole way.i did find a switch and its on the way ....should be here by weeks end. now.... i have another issue with the fuel gauge.... i beleive i have a 71 rally harness because the wires going to the gauges dont match the colors in the 1970 manual. manial says that theres a dark blue wire going to the fuel gauge. i dont have a dark blue but instead theres a purple. i know it says theres a violet going to the temp gausge and i have thatone. and i have a light gray wire .the purpleis the only other one i have that could work. when i hooked it up the gauge is pegged. now the 70 manual says to hook the 3 black wire to the right post and i had the purple there.i reversed them according to the manual and i have no gauge at all. ill tell you guys i have some trouble shooting before on these cars but this thing has got me super frustrated. im not one to throw things around the shop but i found myself ready too. please thRow some option at me PLEASSSSSEEEE
Posted By: ConcoursCreation

Re: EBODY 3SPEED WIPER PARK POSITION - 06/22/10 10:37 AM

OK i'm officially confused
You have:
3spd Motor
3spd/varspd switch
Part # on crank that bolts to back of motor?
Part # stamped in link that goes from crank over to drivers side wiper arm pivot?
I suspect the crank and the link from what I read.... skimmed over...but like I said...I'm
If you provide just this info we can get ya fixed.
Posted By: JulesdaWiperman

Re: EBODY 3SPEED WIPER PARK POSITION - 06/22/10 11:08 AM

kingkt

According to your picture you are using a 3 speed switch from 72 and up.
You need a variable speed switch with the wiring plugs you have.
72 and up uses a different wiring plug configuration.
This is a 70-71 variable speed plug setup.

Attached picture 6048949-variablespeedwiperplugs004.jpg
Posted By: JulesdaWiperman

Re: EBODY 3SPEED WIPER PARK POSITION - 06/22/10 11:14 AM

Make sure the switch you will be getting ends in 380.
Make sure the switch is grounded properly and make sure your motor is clocked
correctly for an e body.
See below. The switch plate on your motor should be in the 077 position.
Getting the correct switch does not necessarily mean it will work.
These switches are 40 years old and many times they need to be overhauled.
Make sure your motor is grounded to the firewall properly also.
Jules

Attached picture 6048960-wiperswitchdiagram.jpg
Posted By: JulesdaWiperman

Re: EBODY 3SPEED WIPER PARK POSITION - 06/22/10 11:16 AM

This is the plug for your 72 and up 3 speed switch.

Attached picture 6048963-72-743speedswitch(2).JPG
Posted By: kingkt

Re: EBODY 3SPEED WIPER PARK POSITION - 06/23/10 12:38 AM

thank you for your help. i got the variable switch being delivered tomorrow and ill let you know how i make out. thanx again
Posted By: kingkt

Re: EBODY 3SPEED WIPER PARK POSITION - 06/23/10 04:49 PM

YA HOOO....WHABAM!!!! the variable works perfect!!!! but wouldnt you figure... after looking in my shop for 5 days for a variable switch and then having to shop for one and then buy it and wait for it to show... it showed 5 minutes later i installed it and it worked great.... then 5 minutes later i found one in my shop.. never fails that crap happens to me ALOT.
soooo the wiper issue is fixed... i fixed the ebrake light last nite... all thats left is the fuel gauge issue and i got everything solved. i thank you guys a ton for all your help!!!
Posted By: Evil Monkey

Re: EBODY 3SPEED WIPER PARK POSITION - 06/24/10 03:49 AM

Good deal - glad to hear the variable switch solved the problem.
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