Moparts
Question on porting. **PICS**
Posted By: Pyper70
Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/08/10 04:18 PM
So I am out in the garage and I wanna clean up my Edelbrock heads a little bit. I went ahead and bought a bunch of stones, wheels, and polishing bits for my dremel. I have some pics below and need some opinions. I have never cut into a set of heads before so some advice would be much appreciated.
Picture #1. Its a water jacket. There seems to be some casting blocking the passageways, a few of the water ports are like this. Can I trim this flashing away?
Picture #2. Exhaust ports. I am using RemFlex exhaust gaskets and the exhaust port of the Eddy head is 1.6425". The exhaust port on the gasket is 1.8890". Should the exhaust port match perfectly with the exhaust gasket?
Picture #3. Intake Ports. I am guessing that the folks at Edelbrock opened these up as far as they will go with the gaskets they supplied. There seems to be very little to cut away. Should I leave this side of the head alone since it is opened so much?
Picture 1.
Picture 2.
Picture 3.
Posted By: Pyper70
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/08/10 04:22 PM
One more question....I noticed this as I was moseying around. It looks like the stock Champions are mismatched to these heads
I have the Champion RJ12YC
How far should the spark plugs be sticking into the chamber?
Posted By: mojavered
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/08/10 07:11 PM
That is the wrong plug. That one is only 3/8" long. You need a 3/4" plug, RC12YC.
Posted By: earlybee
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/08/10 08:24 PM
Since you never done porting before just clean up the casting flash.
Posted By: RoyceFlo73
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/08/10 08:32 PM
I dunno. Even somebody who hasn't done a lot of porting could port to match the gasket. It definalty wouldn't hurt to do. It's not going to be any real night and day difference but it will help.
Posted By: Neil
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/08/10 08:49 PM
The exhaust gasket being bigger than the exhaust port is fine. Most of the time people don't do much to the exhaust port runner size unless they are trying to turn a lot of rpm.
Match the intake manifold opening and the intake port opening to the intake gasket size by using a colored marker and a scribe to outline the shape. Gradually blend the cutting back into the ports rather than leaving a sharp angle.
Posted By: Pyper70
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/08/10 09:07 PM
Quote:
The exhaust gasket being bigger than the exhaust port is fine. Most of the time people don't do much to the exhaust port runner size unless they are trying to turn a lot of rpm.
I won't be spinning too high...Normally because I have a Gear Vendors and 3.55's I'll be driving 3000rpm. If I get the GV out of it and wanna play the highest rev I go is about 4800. I am more about getting maximum torque than high rpm's.
Posted By: Neil
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/08/10 09:41 PM
When I say high rpm I'm talking about 7-8k or more. Most street driven big blocks can't go that high anyways.
I wouldn't do anything to the exhaust ports other than smooth the casting flash and bumps down.
Posted By: Pyper70
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/08/10 09:47 PM
Quote:
That is the wrong plug. That one is only 3/8" long. You need a 3/4" plug, RC12YC.
Will the NGK BKR5E work in this case?...I highly doubt anyone in Greece sells Champion plugs.
Engine is 10:1 Flat Top Pistons, Hedman Shorty's, Dual 500cfm Edelbrocks. Isky 480.
How do Denso plugs work in this case?
Perhaps a Bosch plug?
Posted By: mojavered
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/08/10 09:56 PM
Just find something like an Autolite that has these specs. The heat range could change depending on plug.
14mm Thread Size, 19mm (3/4") Reach, 5/8" (16mm) Hex Size, Gasket Seat, Resistor, Copper Core, Projected Tip, Heat Range 12
Posted By: forphorty
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/08/10 10:04 PM
Don't open up the exhaust port to gasket size. Those Hedman shorties you have are likely smaller than the gasket.
Posted By: Pyper70
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/08/10 10:20 PM
Quote:
Don't open up the exhaust port to gasket size. Those Hedman shorties you have are likely smaller than the gasket.
Yeah...You got a point there....The Hedman's have an exhaust port of 1.5905...Looks like the exhaust port will flow right into the header flange. Might be some turbulence since the gasket is that much wider...Thanks for pointing that out.
Quote:
Just find something like an Autolite that has these specs. The heat range could change depending on plug.
14mm Thread Size, 19mm (3/4") Reach, 5/8" (16mm) Hex Size, Gasket Seat, Resistor, Copper Core, Projected Tip, Heat Range 12
Got it...I was finding both resistor and non-resistor, v-shaped, and what not....I'll hit up the parts store monday for those spec's you listed..Thanks
Posted By: HotRodDave
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/08/10 11:16 PM
NGK and Nippon Denso make great plugs and you should be able to find one of those that work. Bosche plugs are the worst plug on the market, I have seen countless times where someone will do their own tuneup then bring us the car and can't figure out why it runs worse instead of better, get rid of the bosche with pretty much any other plug and the car is all better.
Posted By: Stanton
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/09/10 02:16 AM
Since flow also has a lot to do with port volume as well as knowing what the hell you're doing I'd say leave them alone and take all that junk you bought back for a refund.
But since you won't take that advice ...
Leave the exhausts alone.
The flash in the water jackets is insignificant, grind it if it makes you happy.
As for the intake ports, blend where they left off into the rest of the port - That looks like it probably causes more turbulence than anything.
If you're going to spend time on the intakes then you'd better get the intake manifold involved too. Gasket-match the heads then bolt everything on the motor and match the manifold to the heads.
Frankly I think you'd pick up more speed by giving the car a good wax job - oh, and by putting the right plugs in those heads!
Posted By: Pyper70
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/09/10 09:30 AM
Quote:
Since flow also has a lot to do with port volume as well as knowing what the hell you're doing I'd say leave them alone and take all that junk you bought back for a refund.
But since you won't take that advice ...
Leave the exhausts alone.
The flash in the water jackets is insignificant, grind it if it makes you happy.
As for the intake ports, blend where they left off into the rest of the port - That looks like it probably causes more turbulence than anything.
If you're going to spend time on the intakes then you'd better get the intake manifold involved too. Gasket-match the heads then bolt everything on the motor and match the manifold to the heads.
Frankly I think you'd pick up more speed by giving the car a good wax job - oh, and by putting the right plugs in those heads!
Talk about tough love...GEEZ... 
I'll blend the intakes back a bit today and clean up the water jackets, I'll leave the exhaust side alone. I'll check on the Intake manifold as well.
As for returning the tools....I'll keep em. I don't like returning tools when there is nothing wrong with them.
Posted By: moper
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/09/10 12:32 PM
I dont think I could add much to Stanton's post. Leave the exh smaller, I like to remove the CNC "seam" from the intake ports... They do not enlarge them, simply machine the port in the right spot. Core shift can be an issue with them so some heads get ugly there. So I blend that. If you dont know what you're doing, leave it alone. That is the best instruction...lol.
Posted By: joedust451
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/09/10 02:06 PM
Alittle more tough love, What the hell kind of hack job is on those intake ports, i hope you didn't do that, or is that just the photo angle?
Posted By: Pyper70
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/09/10 03:38 PM
When I took those pictures they were how the factory sent them....
Just finished
I went through and cleaned the intake ports with a tungsten carbide bit, followed through with 120 grit sanding drum, finally ended up polishing them with a mini wheel buff first course, then medium....
Cleaned up any casting flash in the exhaust side (down inside there was some)...
Cleaned up the water jackets and hit those with a 120 grit sanding drum.
I am gonna go to the "Jap store" tomorrow (Thats really the name of it) and see if they can get me some NGK's BKR5E or some Denso K16PR-U. With any luck I may have these installed by the coming weekend. Still battling a damaged Ulnar nerve in my left arm
Posted By: BSB67
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/09/10 04:27 PM
Quote:
When I took those pictures they were how the factory sent them....
Just finished
I went through and cleaned the intake ports with a tungsten carbide bit, followed through with 120 grit sanding drum, finally ended up polishing them with a mini wheel buff first course, then medium....
Cleaned up any casting flash in the exhaust side (down inside there was some)...
Cleaned up the water jackets and hit those with a 120 grit sanding drum.
I am gonna go to the "Jap store" tomorrow (Thats really the name of it) and see if they can get me some NGK's BKR5E or some Denso K16PR-U. With any luck I may have these installed by the coming weekend. Still battling a damaged Ulnar nerve in my left arm
Did you completely disassemble the heads when you did this?
Posted By: Pyper70
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/09/10 04:37 PM
Uhhhhhhh,,,
No...
I shoved a wet shop rag in the intake port before I started and before I finished each port I blew it out with compressed air. Pulled out the rag, blew it out again, then ran through each port with a pressurized can of solvent and then blew that out with compressed air as well. Wiped everything down and put duct tape over all the ports.
I have all the tools to remove the valve springs. Should I go ahead and remove that while I am at it, clean em up again and see how well the valves move in the guides?
Posted By: Stanton
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/09/10 06:42 PM
See, the hole just keeps getting deeper ! Told you to leave the friggin' things alone but n-o-o-o-o-o ...
Posted By: moper
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/09/10 08:10 PM
You will more than likely have aluminum and abrasive stuck in the assembly lube Edelbrock uses. Should have disassembled them. To do it now, you'll also need new valve seals because the seals will get trashed taking the valves out to clean them... So you might pull the psrings and using brake clean clean off the head of the valve, the seat, and the guide areas without removing the valve. As was said... this is part of why you here "have them corrected" at a shop instead of running them out of the box.
Posted By: Pyper70
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/09/10 09:04 PM
Quote:
See, the hole just keeps getting deeper ! Told you to leave the friggin' things alone but n-o-o-o-o-o ...
Why ya gotta be so mean?
Posted By: Stanton
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/09/10 09:10 PM
Quote:
To do it now, you'll also need new valve seals because the seals will get trashed taking the valves out to clean them...
They're most likely umbrella seals and there's no reason you shouldn't be able to reuse them.
Posted By: Pyper70
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/09/10 09:12 PM
Quote:
You will more than likely have aluminum and abrasive stuck in the assembly lube Edelbrock uses. Should have disassembled them. To do it now, you'll also need new valve seals because the seals will get trashed taking the valves out to clean them... So you might pull the psrings and using brake clean clean off the head of the valve, the seat, and the guide areas without removing the valve. As was said... this is part of why you here "have them corrected" at a shop instead of running them out of the box.
Even though I shoved a wet rag and did all what I wrote before AND had a towel covering the valve train? I dont see how abrasive dust and aluminum would have gotten anywhere. Sure maybe very little...but I went through with brake cleaner and pressurized air through the head twice and taped it off and put a valve cover on.
Posted By: BSB67
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/10/10 01:25 AM
I would take them apart. Tootsie roll grit is unforgiving
Posted By: Pyper70
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/10/10 06:06 AM
Quote:
I would take them apart. Tootsie roll grit is unforgiving
Got it...I'll strip em today and clean em all up.
Posted By: joedust451
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/10/10 06:40 AM
Quote:
Quote:
I would take them apart. Tootsie roll grit is unforgiving
Got it...I'll strip em today and clean em all up.
VERY wize choice!! Remember, you still will have fine hot shavings get down in some areas that can't be seen (& they "stick" there), even though you stuff a wet rag into the ports, pulling them out & blowing compressed air in the valve area (when the valve is on the seat) is a BIG NO NO, you can/will force any tiny shavings around the seat area & they will stay there, then once the valve starts opening it'll most likely end up between the seats of the valve & fuse there, do you know what that means 
. Please do it "right" & disasemble them completely, then clean them very well before assembly.
Posted By: 1_WILD_RT
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/10/10 06:55 AM
The plug you want is either ND Q16PR-U11 or NGK NGKR5672A-8
Posted By: Pyper70
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/10/10 12:58 PM
Quote:
The plug you want is either ND Q16PR-U11 or NGK NGKR5672A-8
They didn't have a R5672....Said special order of 10 days and about $6.50 / plug
Got the factory cross reference for the Champion...the NGK BKR5E.
When I get to the States I'll buy 2 sets of the one you mentioned and have them on hand.
Thanks for the number
Posted By: 1_WILD_RT
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/10/10 04:38 PM
Factory plugs are designed for stock heads.. Edelbrock heads require 3/4" reach plugs..
Posted By: Pyper70
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/10/10 05:00 PM
The BKR5E are the 3/4" threads...for the 3/4" threaded Champions
Posted By: moper
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/10/10 09:16 PM
The valve stems shred the interior (sealing surface) if you remove them totally and pull the lock groove thru them. This would be why new seals come with the sleeve for the valve stem. They are not standard seals. I just buy the Edelbrocks for peace of mind.
Posted By: Pyper70
Re: Question on porting. **PICS** - 05/10/10 09:49 PM
Quote:
The valve stems shred the interior (sealing surface) if you remove them totally and pull the lock groove thru them. This would be why new seals come with the sleeve for the valve stem. They are not standard seals. I just buy the Edelbrocks for peace of mind.
So I could in theory just take the valve keepers off, remove the spring, push the valve a little off the seat, put in some carb spray and blow air in it, then dry it with a lint-free cloth and reassemble it. It'll take 3 weeks before I can get another set of seals.