Posted By: ledft79
Drive by wire in an E body - 04/12/10 02:48 AM
I don't understand this at all. How does drive by wire work? What is the change over process for my 5.7 into a 71 challenger. What all do I need, can I get every thing from a doner car, or a junk yard?
Posted By: dragrdan
Re: Drive by wire in an E body - 04/12/10 02:59 AM
Drive by wire has a sensor on the accelerator pedal, that tells the computer how fast you want to go. The computer then controls the actual throttle opening with a stepper or servo motor. I don't see why it couldn't be retrofit(with time and money all things automotive are possible).
Posted By: ledft79
Re: Drive by wire in an E body - 04/12/10 03:17 AM
I still don't understand, can I just get the gas pedal from a vehicle that matches my motor and mount it to the floor boards of my car, then plug in the harnes, and away I go. I have the engine, computer, and harness, am I just lacking the right pedal?
Posted By: pishta
Re: Drive by wire in an E body - 04/12/10 03:33 AM
I cant answer this but I got a question, why would you want this? Seeing Toyota has their issues with runaway throttles...I would trust a cable over a wire. good luck on what ever you choose, and be safe.
Posted By: dragrdan
Re: Drive by wire in an E body - 04/12/10 03:35 AM
Thats where you're gonna have to figure it out. Look at both setups, and figure out which would be better or easier (and within your skill level). You could adapt the newer pedal and sensor to your car, or adapt the sensor to the existing pedal.
Posted By: ledft79
Re: Drive by wire in an E body - 04/12/10 03:39 AM
That is how this engine is designed to be operated, [electronicaly] I'm not sure if normal cabel operation is even a realistic option. Like I said, I don't know any thing about drive by wire, that is why I'm asking.
Posted By: OzHemi
Re: Drive by wire in an E body - 04/12/10 03:50 AM
I had put a drive by wire engine into a GM before (6.0 liter gen III into a '69 Camaro) and imagine a Mopar would be similar. Assuming you are talking about an engine that is already drive by wire being retrofitted into your E body. You'll need the throttle pedal along with all wiring and computers that go with the engine. Just a matter of mounting the pedal to the firewall then.
If you are talking about retrofitting drive by wire to an early engine, I personally would not bother...
Posted By: gtx6970
Re: Drive by wire in an E body - 04/12/10 03:53 AM
I know someone who did it to a 68 Barracuda.
5.7 hemi with all the drive by wire controls , he said it was a piece of cake to do. Just a matter of mouning the pedal to the floor/firewall
Posted By: OzHemi
Re: Drive by wire in an E body - 04/12/10 04:04 AM
Use the pedal that matches what the engine came out of as well...(Incase of differences year to year or body style to body style ?)
Not sure if Mopar uses them or not, but GM has a seperate drive-by-wire control computer that goes along with the PCM and engine loom as well.
Posted By: ledft79
Re: Drive by wire in an E body - 04/12/10 11:01 PM
Thanks for all the help. More questions later.
Posted By: OzHemi
Re: Drive by wire in an E body - 04/13/10 12:04 AM
Sure there are others out there who did it with a Hemi, but I can try and help in general at least
(I ended up pulling the 6.0 drive by wire engine out of the car, and went whole-hog and did this:
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2682662 )
Posted By: Mr.Yuck
Re: Drive by wire in an E body - 04/13/10 01:13 AM
Dude do yourself a big fat favor and use an old school cable. Thses cars are DOGS because of the "drive by wire" Maybe if it was a 4 speed...
Posted By: Mr.Yuck
Re: Drive by wire in an E body - 04/13/10 09:09 PM
They make carb'd intakes for new Hemi's so I don't see why not. The problem is the lag between when you waffle it and when it goes. Even w/ programing it's lazy. and the dealers want that. I was told since 2005 driveline warrenty work has been reduced a ton.
Posted By: ledft79
Re: Drive by wire in an E body - 04/14/10 12:24 AM
There is no way that I will ever concider putting a carb on it. Lag or not, the efi stayes. If there is a simple solution to using the cable, insted of the drive by wire, then ok. My goal is a very driveable, dependable car that I can do a 5,000 mile vacation with, if and when I want to. It will never be on the track, but I definately will
on it from time to time. I do appreciate all the different views and opinions. If there is an realistic, inexpensive option to run my original set up, that would great, especiallly if it gives quicker response. Thanks every one.
Posted By: OzHemi
Re: Drive by wire in an E body - 04/14/10 12:29 AM
Glad you are sticking with the EFI...I never understood the idea of getting rid of injection when doing a late engine swap...why go backwards in technology
(I am doing an LS1 swap into my Torana right at the moment, and the idea of injection was one of the reasons to go through it all)
Posted By: ZIPPY
Re: Drive by wire in an E body - 04/14/10 12:57 AM
There are several cable throttle bodies that will bolt right on, MP has a direct fit part and there is an FAST adapter usually seen on ebay that allows an ls1 TB to bolt on.
The issue then becomes 'which pcm do I use?', because drive by wire was the only thing used in production....if you want to use a stock computer, you're also stuck with drive by wire.
So, converting to a cable operated throttle body means also converting to an aftermarket pcm. There are plenty of them out there to choose from that will all work fine, but not all of them have an off the shelf harness. If you want to modify the engine and need tuning capability, consider that approach. Usually after a guy has sent his stock computer out a few times at $400 bucks a pop, this option starts to look good.
Staying with the drive by wire and production style pcm creates another potential issue not brought up yet....what trans are you going to use? If the trans requires throttle pressure/kickdown input from the throttle, then check out the Bouchillon setup/'03 DR based pedal assembly (it isn't on their website, call them up).
'03 DR pedal assembly uses a short cable connected to a black box which then sends signal to the TB. All other years and models don't have the cable or other moving parts, and could be used with mtx or applications that don't need throttle pressure/KD linkage....the extra moving parts of the '03 truck setup makes for a handy place to set up a kickdown cable for the trans.
I'm not a naysayer and I like FI, you can do this any number of ways depending on what makes sense to you...
But I have to say I'm also partial to a carb setup because it reduces the cost and complexity so much. You get a carb which you probably already have, an intake, msd box, msd harness, and you're done...it runs, and you can set the timing and fuel anywhere you want whenever you want instead of sending the OE computer out and hoping they get it right which does not happen every time.
Posted By: ledft79
Re: Drive by wire in an E body - 04/15/10 03:44 AM
Posted By: Mr.Yuck
Re: Drive by wire in an E body - 04/15/10 12:17 PM
Fury, Zippy pretty much said the same thing.
"I'm not a naysayer and I like EFI, you can do this any number of ways depending on what makes sense to you..But I have to say I'm also partial to a carb setup because it reduces the cost and complexity so much. You get a carb which you probably already have, an intake, msd box, msd harness, and you're done...it runs, and you can set the timing and fuel anywhere you want whenever you want instead of sending the OE computer out and hoping they get it right which does not happen every time."
That's great if you can get all this to work. You know yor stuff and I'm sure you know how to make it all work. It is a very complex swap. People equate EFI to move drivable. Any well tuned carb'd engine is just as effefficient, drivable and dependable. The OP's post was about drive by wire, I suggested using a carb becuase it is going to save him lots of time and money. Carbs are not for every application, I'd like to build a boosted 440 next that will have EFI. I probably would have on this build but I'm at 11:1 so I spent my money on the 6-pack.
Posted By: SixBBL69Boy
Re: Dealer Information - 04/15/10 08:23 PM
Looking for anyone that may own or have info on a Chrysler/Plymouth dealer named Bill Swad Chrysler/Plymouth in Columbus Ohio on Hamilton Road. My dads car was sold new there and need to know the address and dealer number. Any help would be great. PM or email
sixbbl69@hotmail.com Thanks Jason
Posted By: Mr.Yuck
Re: Drive by wire in an E body - 04/16/10 11:59 AM
A 440 EFI set up would be much much much easier, cheaper and you'd probably end up w/ more HP and torque.
http://www.fbthrottlebodies.com/
Posted By: gdemon
Re: Drive by wire in an E body - 04/16/10 01:08 PM
Mine is drive by wire. I went with the black box under hood from and 04 ram. I couldnt come up with a way to mount the electronic pedal that felt comfortable to me. You can see the box in the pic by the power brake booster.
Posted By: Fury Fan
Re: Drive by wire in an E body - 04/16/10 03:32 PM
And that's the easiest solution to DBW right there. The 'truck box' also allows a person to connect a KD cable to a hydraulically-controlled trans if they want.
Posted By: gdemon
Re: Drive by wire in an E body - 04/17/10 12:01 PM
The 04 ram should of had the Black box. You have to use the black box or and electronic pedal from a car or a newer ram. If you allready have your harness you need to know what it was made for because the wires will be in the wrong place and the connector might be different. I dont think the rams went to the electronic pedal until 05.Im using the stock gas pedal with a modified cable to attach to the balck box.