Posted By: 69MOPE
Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/25/09 02:33 AM
Ordered a rebuild kit from Brewers and it came today, opened the box to find bearings "made in China". Should I use them or send the kit back?
Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit?
Posted By: wheelsup68dart
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/25/09 02:38 AM
Wayne knows his stuff, 
If he did'nt trust it then you would have never recieved it.
If he did'nt trust it then you would have never recieved it.
Posted By: Dan Brewer
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/25/09 02:53 AM
No one makes a 308SG8 Brg in the USA anymore. There are several mfg of the Chinese brgs, I have had zero problems with the ones we sell. It sucks I know, I made offers to several mfg's to buy very large qty here in the states.
Posted By: JohnRR
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/25/09 01:44 PM
Quote:
No one makes a 308SG8 Brg in the USA anymore. There are several mfg of the Chinese brgs, I have had zero problems with the ones we sell. It sucks I know, I made offers to several mfg's to buy very large qty here in the states.
But how long have they been in service ???
Chinese bearings scare me. I needed new bearings for my billet MSD , the ones I got were chinese, I'm not feeling warm and fuzzy using them .
Posted By: Sixpak
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/25/09 03:04 PM
If you can find a Japanese made Bower/BCA, SKS or European Timken bearing I'd take those over any chinese bearing. Years back I installed chinese wheel bearings on an a body and they wore out ridiculously fast. They just did not get the hardness treatment correct on the rollers. I'll never use another chinese bearing again.
Posted By: Stanton
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/25/09 03:15 PM
Quote:
I needed new bearings for my billet MSD , the ones I got were chinese, I'm not feeling warm and fuzzy using them
Kinda makes you wonder about the quality of the original bearings doesn't it ?!?! Considering these turn at half the speed of the crank and the load on them is virtually nothing !!!
Posted By: JohnRR
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/25/09 03:37 PM
Quote:
Quote:
I needed new bearings for my billet MSD , the ones I got were chinese, I'm not feeling warm and fuzzy using them
Kinda makes you wonder about the quality of the original bearings doesn't it ?!?! Considering these turn at half the speed of the crank and the load on them is virtually nothing !!!
No kidding , no country of origin on them and the one that went bad was the one at the top , the one in the bottom , oil splashed , isn't crunchy like the top.
There isn't any other source now for 308SG , a standard 308 is not the correct width , maybe a spacer could be made so a standard 308 could be used ???
Posted By: 69L78Nova
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/25/09 04:31 PM
Quote:
opened the box to find bearings "made in China".
What a damn shame. Its disgusting what this country has come to
Posted By: Magnum
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/26/09 02:17 AM
Alot of junk is "Made in China" Mostly found at the dollar store and Walmart. Is this China's fault, no. It's the consumer who buys it. You buy, they make.
Four dollar Christmas toys and bearings are not in the same catagory. They only thing they share is the country they are assembled in.
As for the bearings. I work on high speed lamp making equipment. This stuff is running 24 hours, 6 days a week. 90% of the bearings we use are McGard, Made in China. Some of the machine is cooled by AC, some of it is 900deg F. These bearings never fail.
Four dollar Christmas toys and bearings are not in the same catagory. They only thing they share is the country they are assembled in.
As for the bearings. I work on high speed lamp making equipment. This stuff is running 24 hours, 6 days a week. 90% of the bearings we use are McGard, Made in China. Some of the machine is cooled by AC, some of it is 900deg F. These bearings never fail.
Posted By: Michael
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/26/09 04:24 AM
NEVER use a China bearing!!! 
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? *DELETED* - 11/26/09 04:45 AM
Posted By: jake4cars
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/26/09 06:32 AM
I fully understand everyone's distaste for chinese bearings but....I have known the Brewer's for many years, Wayne and Dan are two of the best guys in the business to deal with, if they believe these bearings would work I believe them. I can only imagine Waynes frustration with this issue but he is not big enough of a company to push the issue with the bearing makers. Don't you just love these cockroaches that decide to outsource everything.
Happy Thanksgiving!
Joey
Happy Thanksgiving!
Joey
Posted By: Snoopy
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/26/09 07:42 AM
I wonder where the worlds largest military buys their bearings?
Posted By: rbstroker
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/26/09 12:12 PM
I met Wayne about a month ago when I bought a '65 727 from him. I got the impression that if he had a choice, he would have all American made parts. Seemed like an up front guy to me.
Posted By: 62maxwgn
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/26/09 01:09 PM
Quote:
I wonder where the worlds largest military buys their bearings?
You can only buy them from someone who makes them.If we (USA) don't you will have to live with what's availiable.
I guess my six old N.O.S. Timken 308SG's are as you would say,"priceless".
Posted By: JohnRR
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/26/09 03:51 PM
Quote:Quote:
I wonder where the worlds largest military buys their bearings?
You can only buy them from someone who makes them.If we (USA) don't you will have to live with what's availiable.
they are only priceless till you put a price on them . I remember that Passon had a few sets of USA 308's left a year or so ago at carlisle and the price for them was double ... which made sense since you can't get the good ones anymore ...
Posted By: 62maxwgn
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/26/09 07:11 PM
Quote:Quote:Quote:
I wonder where the worlds largest military buys their bearings?
You can only buy them from someone who makes them.If we (USA) don't you will have to live with what's availiable.
they are only priceless till you put a price on them . I remember that Passon had a few sets of USA 308's left a year or so ago at carlisle and the price for them was double ... which made sense since you can't get the good ones anymore ...
Actually John,mine are worthless,they're are not for sale.
Posted By: Sinitro
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/26/09 08:12 PM
Why not contact Wayne directly and pose the question..
Wayne is certainly one of the most informed people that is knowledgible about the A833s..
We have bought many transmissions and parts from Wayne, he is a straight-shooter..
But again if there is no USA manufacturer of the bearing, the Chinese one is likely the only available choice on the supply side..
Kinda like the A833 reverse lite switch, pay $12-20 for the Chinese version or $60-80 for the NOS USA/Canadian one. Our A833s are now almost 50 years old and certain new renewal parts made in the USA are just not commonly available any more..
Just my $0.01..
Wayne is certainly one of the most informed people that is knowledgible about the A833s..
We have bought many transmissions and parts from Wayne, he is a straight-shooter..
But again if there is no USA manufacturer of the bearing, the Chinese one is likely the only available choice on the supply side..
Kinda like the A833 reverse lite switch, pay $12-20 for the Chinese version or $60-80 for the NOS USA/Canadian one. Our A833s are now almost 50 years old and certain new renewal parts made in the USA are just not commonly available any more..
Just my $0.01..
Posted By: Sub95
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/26/09 09:11 PM
Quote:
If you can find a Japanese made Bower/BCA, SKS or European Timken bearing I'd take those over any chinese bearing. Years back I installed chinese wheel bearings on an a body and they wore out ridiculously fast. They just did not get the hardness treatment correct on the rollers. I'll never use another chinese bearing again.
the chinese bearings are hit or miss
Posted By: 62maxwgn
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/26/09 11:09 PM
And don't just look at the automotive suppliers.There are two companies in my area,Erie Bearing and Bearings Inc.Specalize in bearings only.Thats where I found most 0f mine.Used in farm equipment and just any piece of equipment you can think of.A lot of places have old stock still on the shelves.
Posted By: 1_WILD_RT
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/26/09 11:33 PM
Quote:
Why not contact Wayne directly and pose the question..
Since Dan Brewer was the second person to respond to this thread I suspect they have looked into it & other than finding old stock on a shelf somewhere the US bearing manufacturers just aren't servicing that bearing anymore....
Posted By: Snoopy
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/26/09 11:35 PM
Does anyone the what class bearing was used in the A833 transmissions?
Posted By: 6PakBee
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/28/09 03:44 PM
Quote:
....There isn't any other source now for 308SG , a standard 308 is not the correct width , maybe a spacer could be made so a standard 308 could be used ???
Do you know what the width is of both the 308SG and the 308? I have tried internet searches and am just confusing myself.
Posted By: Snoopy
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/28/09 06:11 PM
308SG - .825"
Posted By: 6PakBee
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/28/09 07:25 PM
Thanks Snoopy
Posted By: Snoopy
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/28/09 11:23 PM
I wonder if the 308 bearing has the groove for the snap ring? Maybe that is what the SG stands for? Strange about the lack of information on the web concerning these bearings.
Here is the information that's on the bearings I got from Brewer's a few years ago.
SKF - BB1-1308 NRVBEF2 - USA - FA 14 345X
Here is the information that's on the bearings I got from Brewer's a few years ago.
SKF - BB1-1308 NRVBEF2 - USA - FA 14 345X
Posted By: 74chargr
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/29/09 11:39 AM
Try these guys. They support good quality parts if you want them. If there is an american manufacturer they will find them. http://www.applied.com/
Posted By: JohnRR
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/29/09 02:39 PM
Quote:
I wonder if the 308 bearing has the groove for the snap ring? Maybe that is what the SG stands for? Strange about the lack of information on the web concerning these bearings.
Here is the information that's on the bearings I got from Brewer's a few years ago.
SKF - BB1-1308 NRVBEF2 - USA - FA 14 345X
the 308 has the snapring groove , I don't think the overall bearing is as wide as the SG , I have a bearing spec catolog at work , I'll look at it tomorrow and see what it says. I rebuilt my first hemi 4 spd using the regular 308 15 yrs ago , didn't know there was a difference. I did end up selling it to a guy that just flipped it so I never heard if there was any problems with it ?
Posted By: 70Cuda383
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/29/09 02:40 PM
Quote:
I wonder where the worlds largest military buys their bearings?
Probably in China...Since that's where the worlds LARGEST military is.
That's the scary truth. Hope we never piss them off and keep them on our good side. They own us financially, and their military strength is either equal to, or greater than ours. --I say "strength", because IF we have any technological advantages, they COULD overcome the fact that they have the "million man army" but even that's up for debate, as they are constantly developing newer and higher tech weapons
Anyway, back on topic...I'm sure Brewers is supplying the best quality parts that he can find for now. they don't seem like the type to "cheap skate" and provide lesser quality just to make a buck.
Posted By: rtidd440
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 11/30/09 05:21 AM
Wayne and his son are one of the best venders we have. If they could source a domestic made bearing I'm sure that is what they would use. As far as I know 833 is the only app for that bearing[could be wrong]. Any domestic one is old stock and supply will probably dry up soon. We are lucky we can get any at all.
Posted By: 6PakBee
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 12/01/09 02:25 AM
Quote:
308SG - .825"
I had NAPA order what they called the equivalent of the 308SG, a 6308NRJ. It came in tonight and measuring the width of the outer race it is......0.910". Now I am really confused.
Posted By: Snoopy
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 12/01/09 03:52 AM
I just went out in the garage and remeasured the bearing. It's still .8257" measured with a 0-1' micrometer.
I measured the bearings that I got from Brewer's and they measure .8244"
Here is a picture of the bearing. I believe it is the original bearing, .8257".
I measured the bearings that I got from Brewer's and they measure .8244"
Here is a picture of the bearing. I believe it is the original bearing, .8257".
Posted By: 6PakBee
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 12/01/09 11:08 AM
Snoopy, thanks again. I wonder if John found his bearing book?
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 12/01/09 11:12 AM
Quote:Quote:
I wonder where the worlds largest military buys their bearings?
Probably in China...Since that's where the worlds LARGEST military is.
That's the scary truth. Hope we never piss them off and keep them on our good side. They own us financially, and their military strength is either equal to, or greater than ours. --I say "strength", because IF we have any technological advantages, they COULD overcome the fact that they have the "million man army" but even that's up for debate, as they are constantly developing newer and higher tech weapons
Anyway, back on topic...I'm sure Brewers is supplying the best quality parts that he can find for now. they don't seem like the type to "cheap skate" and provide lesser quality just to make a buck.
One of their military generals did a speech where he stated they had the capability to hit us with a biological weapon but were waiting until the time was right. They need our land and resources.
Posted By: Snoopy
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 12/01/09 01:46 PM
Quote:
One of their military generals did a speech where he stated they had the capability to hit us with a biological weapon but were waiting until the time was right. They need our land and resources.
There has been a change in plans. Now their just going to send a boat load of lawyers here to evict us for non-payment.
Posted By: johnedod
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 12/01/09 02:05 PM
Quote:
Quote:
One of their military generals did a speech where he stated they had the capability to hit us with a biological weapon but were waiting until the time was right. They need our land and resources.
There has been a change in plans. Now their just going to send a boat load of lawyers here to evict us for non-payment.
Maybe Somali pirates will get the boat load of lawyers before they get here. (Yes this post has drifted far off topic.)
Posted By: Triggerfish
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 12/01/09 02:24 PM
Quote:Quote:
Quote:
One of their military generals did a speech where he stated they had the capability to hit us with a biological weapon but were waiting until the time was right. They need our land and resources.
There has been a change in plans. Now their just going to send a boat load of lawyers here to evict us for non-payment.
Maybe Somali pirates will get the boat load of lawyers before they get here. (Yes this post has drifted far off topic.)
It drifted off course because the Somali pirates lost their bearings....(Chinese bearings??)
Posted By: JohnRR
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 12/01/09 02:55 PM
Quote:
Snoopy, thanks again. I wonder if John found his bearing book?
what's the OD and ID of this bearing , I found the book , just now
, but it's not an SKF number
Posted By: JohnRR
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 12/01/09 03:01 PM
Quote:
I just went out in the garage and remeasured the bearing. It's still .8257" measured with a 0-1' micrometer.
I measured the bearings that I got from Brewer's and they measure .8244"
Here is a picture of the bearing. I believe it is the original bearing, .8257".
that's all within tolerance , I have 4 of them I got a number of years ago from a bearing supply house in Oregon , I'll have to dig them out ... no they aren't for sale ...
Posted By: Snoopy
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 12/01/09 03:45 PM
O.D. - 3.542"
I.D. - 1.376"
Measured with 6" dial caliper.
I.D. - 1.376"
Measured with 6" dial caliper.
Posted By: 6PakBee
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 12/01/09 04:07 PM
Quote:
O.D. - 3.542"
I.D. - 1.376"
Measured with 6" dial caliper.
Look at this:
http://www.sizes.com/built/ball_bearings.htm
If I read this right a 308 should be 0.906" thick, 3.544" OD, 1.575" bore.
Posted By: Snoopy
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 12/01/09 04:20 PM
According to the chart, you are correct.
According to the actual bearing, the chart is wrong.
This is from Timkens website.
This is for a 308LOE bearing and not a 308SG.
Part No: 308LOE
Description Value
Bore (B) Inches 1.378
Bore (B) MM 35
OD (D) Inches 3.5433
OD (D) MM 90
Width (W) Inches 0.7874
Width (W) MM 20
According to the actual bearing, the chart is wrong.
This is from Timkens website.
This is for a 308LOE bearing and not a 308SG.
Part No: 308LOE
Description Value
Bore (B) Inches 1.378
Bore (B) MM 35
OD (D) Inches 3.5433
OD (D) MM 90
Width (W) Inches 0.7874
Width (W) MM 20
Posted By: Snoopy
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 12/01/09 04:59 PM
The 308SG seems to be a hybrid bearing.
It shares it's I.D. and width with the 307 bearing and it's O.D. with the 308.
It shares it's I.D. and width with the 307 bearing and it's O.D. with the 308.
Posted By: Bob_Fromm
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 12/01/09 05:39 PM
Anyone check Jamie Passion to see what he is using?
Posted By: JohnRR
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 12/01/09 06:20 PM
Quote:
Anyone check Jamie Passion to see what he is using?
The Chinese bearings , a member bought a couple of the last sets of USA bearings Jamie had , and he was getting a premium for them.
Posted By: JohnRR
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 12/01/09 06:28 PM
Quote:Quote:
O.D. - 3.542"
I.D. - 1.376"
Measured with 6" dial caliper.
Look at this:
http://www.sizes.com/built/ball_bearings.htm
If I read this right a 308 should be 0.906" thick, 3.544" OD, 1.575" bore.
this is what I am finding and it's standard numbers for a 308 bearing , but as snoopy states Timken shows it being narrower which I think is the problem which ebooger ... i think ... stated years ago in an article on rebuilding 833's .
also I think some have a different snap ring groove width .
Posted By: JohnRR
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 12/01/09 06:29 PM
Quote:
According to the chart, you are correct.
According to the actual bearing, the chart is wrong.
This is from Timkens website.
This is for a 308LOE bearing and not a 308SG.
Part No: 308LOE
Description Value
Bore (B) Inches 1.378
Bore (B) MM 35
OD (D) Inches 3.5433
OD (D) MM 90
Width (W) Inches 0.7874
Width (W) MM 20
this is the problem , the 308SG is a hybrid and the only other available bearing is this incorrect 308LOE
Posted By: 6PakBee
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 12/01/09 08:51 PM
Quote:Quote:
Anyone check Jamie Passion to see what he is using?
The Chinese bearings , a member bought a couple of the last sets of USA bearings Jamie had , and he was getting a premium for them.
What is "a premium"? The 6308NRJ that NAPA had (that I asked them to return this morning) was $66. How much worse could it get?
Posted By: JohnRR
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 12/01/09 09:48 PM
Quote:Quote:Quote:
Anyone check Jamie Passion to see what he is using?
The Chinese bearings , a member bought a couple of the last sets of USA bearings Jamie had , and he was getting a premium for them.
What is "a premium"? The 6308NRJ that NAPA had (that I asked them to return this morning) was $66. How much worse could it get?
I found that bearing , in my SKF book , TOO wide as you found out .
I want to say about 80 a pop , but he didn't have alot left , this MIGHT have been 2 summers ago .
Posted By: Snoopy
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 12/01/09 10:54 PM
Are there different thicknesses of snap rings that retain the bearing on the input shaft? I just measured the bearing surface on an 18 spline input shaft and it was about .800" from the front gear surface to the snap ring groove. This would place the inner bearing race .026" into the snap ring groove.
Snap ring groove is approximately .118" wide. Which would make the .097" snap ring the closest match for my application. Ideally I would need one that is .104" thick to match the bearings I got from Brewers.
The snap ring installed with the original bearing was .091" thick.
Snap ring groove is approximately .118" wide. Which would make the .097" snap ring the closest match for my application. Ideally I would need one that is .104" thick to match the bearings I got from Brewers.
The snap ring installed with the original bearing was .091" thick.
Posted By: JohnRR
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 12/02/09 01:28 AM
as you can see yes there are different snap rings , you'll have to shim the bearing or grind down a couple rings if you want a .104 snap ring because it looks like it does not exist .
Posted By: 64dodge572
Re: Chinese bearings in Brewers 4-speed kit? - 12/02/09 02:03 AM
We have shims available in .003 .005 and .010 to take up the slack between the bearing/snap ring, as the thicker selective snap rings have fallen victim to NS1 from Ma Mopar. As with the 308 bearings, we have had no luck with having the snap rings made. Best quote was for minimum of 10,000 pieces, and they would NOT mix thicknesses.
Wayne
Wayne