Moparts
How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans?
Posted By: cal_gecko
How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/03/06 02:37 AM
the shift shaft seal on the SuperCoupe is leaking pretty bad.. so I picked up a new one tonight, as well as a new trans pan gasket, in case I needed to remove that to get to the seal. ... what's the best way to replace this seal (trans is in the car)?
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/03/06 02:46 AM
R U sure it is this seal and not the small kickdown one ?
You can just put a deep pan on it ...and just lower the fluid level.
Posted By: cal_gecko
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/03/06 04:55 AM
Uh.... no, I'm not sure... I didn't realize there was another seal there for the kickdown... crap. I had to special order the shift shaft seal... I know they won't have the kickdown seal in stock. What's the best way to replace these seals?
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/03/06 05:05 AM
Can you see if it is leaking on the high or low part of the shaft ?
The lower seal is a complex one. The upper seal is just a simple rubber one.
How you thought about a deep pan?
Posted By: mrsmallblock
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/03/06 05:09 AM
the easiest way is going to be taking the valve body out. remove snap ring and washer to remove and replace the kickdown seal. if you are careful take the kickdown rod out without removing the rooster. then you can polish the shaft because that is what kills that seal, rust and corrosion. the case seal you can knock out from the bottom and use a big c clamp and washer to draw the new seal in. i have done this many times. not too big or a deal.
howard
mrsmallblock
Posted By: cal_gecko
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/03/06 05:20 AM
Quote:
the easiest way is going to be taking the valve body out. remove snap ring and washer to remove and replace the kickdown seal. if you are careful take the kickdown rod out without removing the rooster. then you can polish the shaft because that is what kills that seal, rust and corrosion. the case seal you can knock out from the bottom and use a big c clamp and washer to draw the new seal in. i have done this many times. not too big or a deal.
howard
mrsmallblock
what is 'the rooster'? I am not familiar with that term. I guess I'll see if I can get the rubber seal for the kickdown shaft too... I doubt I'll be able to find a parts store that has one in stock though.
Posted By: cal_gecko
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/03/06 05:21 AM
Perhaps I should see if I can locate a deep pan... this seems like it's going to be a PITA
Posted By: mrsmallblock
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/03/06 05:25 AM
the rooser is actually the piece that goes through the case seal and the kickdown shaft goes throught the inside of the rooser. it has a check ball and spring that serves as the detent selector for your gears. if you remove the rooster it is a [Edited by Moparts - Keep it clean] to get it back in with the check ball and spring unless you have the tool for it.
howard
mrsmallblock
Posted By: mrsmallblock
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/03/06 05:29 AM
i got censored for that comment? thats ridiculous. you can't say anything. not like i was directing the comment at somebody.
howard
mrsmallblock
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/03/06 05:40 AM
The deep pan is the plan .... just have the fluid show on the TIP of the stick.
Posted By: cal_gecko
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/03/06 06:14 AM
Thanks.. I'll give the deep pan a shot.. it'll still shift ok, even if the fluid is low?
Posted By: GoodysGotaCuda
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/03/06 06:42 AM
#1 of 2.
MASSIVE PICTURES (from TF 727 book..)
Posted By: GoodysGotaCuda
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/03/06 06:42 AM
#2
Posted By: cal_gecko
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/03/06 07:16 AM
Thanks, FluffyTwinkie!
Posted By: GoodysGotaCuda
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/03/06 07:18 AM
Quote:
Thanks, FluffyTwinkie!
No problem, its not all that hard to pull the valve body. It is helpful to have someone around thats done it before if you get in a jam though. 
Oh and the fluffytwinkie...im thinkin im due for a new name. 
Posted By: Andrewh
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/03/06 04:46 PM
if it is just the selector shaft seal
http://www.mytoolstore.com/kd/kdsusp05.htmlWill do it with it still in the car.
Posted By: 1100HPSmallBlock
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/03/06 04:49 PM
Quote:
the rooser is actually the piece that goes through the case seal and the kickdown shaft goes throught the inside of the rooser. it has a check ball and spring that serves as the detent selector for your gears.
mrsmallblock
Posted By: Snailpower
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/03/06 05:42 PM
IMO, the deep pan is a band aid for a bad seal on the trans. Fix it right the first time. You can do this seal replacement without pulling the valve body, dropping the pan and if the trans is clean you won't even get your hands dirty (much).
Take the kickdown and selector lever off the trans (both pinch bolts) and take a sharp pick to work the selector shaft seal out of it's hole and up the shaft. It's a press fit, so jab the pick through the top of the old seal and use leverage.
Take the new seal, lube it a little and slide it over the shaft until it sits evenly on the trans case, not cocked. Take a deep socket the same size as the seal and slide it over the shaft to rest on top of the seal. Tap the socket until the top of the seal is flush with the trans case. Re-install selector/kickdown levers.
I have done many this way. The worst I have had to do is un-bolt the trans crossmember to drop the end of the trans down for a little more room to work.
Jeff
Posted By: John_Kunkel
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/03/06 06:25 PM
Quote:
IMO, the deep pan is a band aid for a bad seal on the trans.
The deep pan won't have any affect on leakage since the FULL mark remains the same regardless of pan capacity.
Posted By: Kirk_Ingram
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/03/06 08:53 PM
Quote:
Quote:
IMO, the deep pan is a band aid for a bad seal on the trans.
The deep pan won't have any affect on leakage since the FULL mark remains the same regardless of pan capacity.
And the "band-aid fix" is to fill the trans with a couple quarts less. And the fill mark is now a GUESS. That will be a PITA for the next owner(s).
I doubt the shaft seal in the VB is the issue (but it has happened). See attached for a visual. (note: snap ring and washer removed) {If you want/need this seal, I'll mail one to you; I have more than I'll ever use)
Just pull the pan, valvebody and fix it properly, as others have stated. No reason to spend more money on an extra-capacity pan when it's not necessary. -K
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/03/06 09:14 PM
The deep pan is not the way to fix your problem! The seals are easy to change, just get the (KD) tool (Anderwh) listed and do it in the car. Drain some fluid out prior to doing it so you don't get covered in fluid. If you don't want to buy the tool, use a small screwdriver to pry out the old seal and a deep socket to hammer in the new seal.
Next time you need a small seal for your transmission, go to you local trans shop, they should have plenty of them.
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/03/06 09:15 PM
A deeper pan that has more capacity .... filled at the same height as a stock pan ?
How many larger capacity engine oil pans are approached this way ?
REcalibrate your dip-stick then.
And very true .... putting a deep pan on to avoid leakage is a band-aid - and it IS more proper to FIX the ailment. But to some people that are DIY ... this job could be over-their-heads.
Just my
Posted By: THBear
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/03/06 11:20 PM
We use the KD tool at our shop and it works great. There is a remover and installer included with the tool. The only part you have to remove is the shift levers. You can replace the smaller seal at the same time but you have to be careful after you remove the e-clip so that the shaft doesn't drop down into the pan. If it does it's not the end of the world, you just have to pull the pan off.
Posted By: cal_gecko
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/04/06 01:56 AM
I'll make a trip to a local tool store and see if they have this tool you guys are talking about.. if not, I'll order it from that website.
The other seal that you've mentioned, the kickdown seal... any suggestions where to get that?
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/04/06 02:53 AM
kd seal ? ...stop by any trans shop. They should have a bunch of them. Those seals are very rarely changed by most rebuilders.
Posted By: NotEnufGarage
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/04/06 06:14 AM
I may be running by a friends transmission shop tomorrow. If so, I'll see if he has a seal.
I'll PM you if I get one.
Posted By: cal_gecko
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/04/06 07:26 AM
Awesome, thanks! I already have the shift shaft seal.. .just need the kickdown seal
Posted By: John_Kunkel
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/04/06 06:29 PM
Quote:
And the "band-aid fix" is to fill the trans with a couple quarts less.
Not a good idea. The TF, unlike the engine, can suck air if the VB-to-case mating surface is exposed to the air.
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/04/06 08:20 PM
Quote:
Quote:
And the "band-aid fix" is to fill the trans with a couple quarts less.
Not a good idea. The TF, unlike the engine, can suck air if the VB-to-case mating surface is exposed to the air.
I have always wondered about that....but if that was a major "issue" - why wouldn't the OEM have put some O-rings or a gasket in there?
Posted By: Kirk_Ingram
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/04/06 10:03 PM
Quote:
Quote:
And the "band-aid fix" is to fill the trans with a couple quarts less.
Not a good idea. The TF, unlike the engine, can suck air if the VB-to-case mating surface is exposed to the air.
Good point! -K
Posted By: John_Kunkel
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/04/06 10:05 PM
Quote:
I have always wondered about that....but if that was a major "issue" - why wouldn't the OEM have put some O-rings or a gasket in there?
It's not a major issue if the mating surface stays submerged in fluid as it should with the correct fluid level.
Posted By: NotEnufGarage
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/06/06 05:11 AM
Sorry - my buddy usually gets them in seal or rebuild kits and he didn't have any in stock.
I've got a /6 904 you could take one out of, if you want to try reusing a used one.
Posted By: streetkit
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/06/06 02:17 PM
Mark,
Last time I needed one, Autozone (of all places) had them in stock.
Posted By: HealthServices
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/17/09 07:49 AM
I did this last year. Used a tool off ebay for less than $20
Something like this one
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/KD-TOOLS-...d=p4506.c0.m245I think I have pictures of the install posted a while back too. I had to use a C clamp because of the space limitations but I fixed it in less than an hour. No need to drop the pan.
Posted By: HealthServices
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/17/09 08:19 AM
Quote:
the shift shaft seal on the SuperCoupe is leaking pretty bad..
This is pretty bad...
Cleaned off.
Tool ready to remove seal...
Clamp to put pressure on seal while I turn the threads into the seal
After the tool takes hold of the seal you put the bolt into the top of the tool to pull the seal out....
click the picture for a larger view.
here is the picture of the seal removed
A closer look...
The new seal
New seal being installed with tool and clamp.
Linkage re installed.
Posted By: RUNCHARGER
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 09/17/09 09:09 AM
I just did this job on my son's Ramcharger yesterday. It took about an hour and a half. That included dropping the pan and valvebody, adjusting the bands, new filter. I find just about any old Mopar I buy needs this seal replaced. (and the trans always have a new pan gasket as that is what most people think is leaking).
Sheldon
Posted By: FastbackJon
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 06/21/17 11:50 AM
I am looking at replacing the shift shaft seal from the top with the extractor tool in my 1966 Charger 727.
I am hesitant in taking the two levers off (gear and throttle) from the shift shaft, not knowing if they are keyed are not. Or should I worry about this?
The throttle lever appears to be keyed but the gear lever, I can't tell. Will it just go back on the same as it came off and then I can just make minor adjustments to the horizontal rod to change shift selector (gear) position?
Thanks!
Posted By: bonefish
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 06/21/17 01:43 PM
I am looking at replacing the shift shaft seal from the top with the extractor tool in my 1966 Charger 727.
I am hesitant in taking the two levers off (gear and throttle) from the shift shaft, not knowing if they are keyed are not. Or should I worry about this?
The throttle lever appears to be keyed but the gear lever, I can't tell. Will it just go back on the same as it came off and then I can just make minor adjustments to the horizontal rod to change shift selector (gear) position?
Thanks!
they can only go on one way,youll see that when you remove them.
Posted By: TJP
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 06/21/17 04:27 PM
Nice instructive post,
Posted By: John_Kunkel
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 06/21/17 07:36 PM
Various shift levers and TP levers.
Posted By: bobby66
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 06/22/17 09:41 PM
Drop the valve body and tap out the seal from underneath. Pull the new one in with a piece of threaded rod, two nuts, and two washers. Easy project and a good time to adjust the bands, while you're already soaked with ATF.
Posted By: bobby66
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 06/22/17 09:42 PM
Drop the valve body and tap out the seal from underneath. Pull the new one in with a piece of threaded rod, two nuts, and two washers. Easy project and a good time to adjust the bands, while you're already soaked with ATF.
Posted By: Sixpak
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 06/25/17 04:19 AM
IIRC correctly there's TWO seals - one that seals the large shift lever shaft to the case, and a 2nd seal, an "o-ring" type of seal for lack of a better tem for it(and not a metal cased one) for the kd shaft that runs thru the center of the larger shaft that is sealed by the larger washer. I'd drop the valve body and change both, for piece of mind. The 2nd seal is under the e clip and washer.
Posted By: John_Kunkel
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 06/25/17 10:14 PM
The two seals.
Posted By: Chris2581
Re: How to replace shift shaft seal on 727 trans? - 06/26/17 09:37 PM
I just use a small pick and get them out.
click the picture for a larger view.
