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Spark Plug Indexing Questions (updated with pic)

Posted By: BDW

Spark Plug Indexing Questions (updated with pic) - 05/11/09 11:52 PM

The other post on distributor phasing got me thinking about spark plug indexing.

1) On a 340, which way should the gap opening face? Towards manifold?
2) I see both "flat" and "tapered" washers for this? What's the difference?

Thx
Posted By: RapidRobert

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/11/09 11:57 PM

(1)I believe so (2) some plugs have tapered seats (for furd iirc), our plugs take flat washers
Posted By: 70sixpkrt

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/11/09 11:58 PM

Stupid question but what is spark plug indexing?
Posted By: runningman

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/12/09 12:05 AM

From what I understand indexing uses different sized washers so all of the plugs face the same direction when installed.
Posted By: RapidRobert

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/12/09 12:18 AM

Quote:

Stupid question but what is spark plug indexing?


Not a stupid question at all. It positions the plug when it's tightened so the ground strap is not in the way of the flame front spreading out into the chamber which makes a faster burn which needs less timing for the mixture to be spent at the perfect crank position for max power(less power wasted pushing the piston over the nose against the compression). You make a magic marker mark on the outside porcelean shell & use the right thickness washer so that when it's tightened that mark tells you that the ground strap that you now cannot see is not blocking the open part of the chamber
Posted By: 70sixpkrt

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/12/09 12:58 AM

Thank you for the explanation. Now back to the question.
Posted By: scratchnfotraction

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/12/09 01:10 AM

I have done it on just on a stock rebuild a few times and got a noticable gain in performance

I will add that its not just facing all the plugs the same way,it is faceing the plug the correct way for the cyl only

as in the valves move around in the head depending on the cyl

e,i,i,e,e,i,i,e looking at the exhast manny this is the valve arangement so to speak,so the plug would face the corrosponding direction

I have not done it in a while but,seems I allways faced the open part of the gap towards the cold intake charge

not real sure wich way now I thinks on it

but it what RR said

in shade tree lingo the plug gaps dont all face the front of the engine

they would face the correct direction per cyl

I will stop now...

I just wish I had wrote it down be fore I forgot

Posted By: scratchnfotraction

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/12/09 01:12 AM

oh and drilling the holes in the cap for ions to get out helps stop cross fire in the cap at high rpms

just not good for wet weather

and I only did that on chivy HEI dist on the BB mud truck

Posted By: BDW

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/12/09 02:51 AM

Ok, so I need to point the spark plug gap opening towards the intake valve, and away from the exhaust valve on each cylinder?
Posted By: Dusted_Ya

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/12/09 03:01 AM

point the opening directly towards the center of the combustion area.
Posted By: MNobody

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/12/09 05:36 AM

Which would be up, down,left or right?
Posted By: scratchnfotraction

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/12/09 11:11 AM

IMO,its best to set a head up for indexing while its off the block and you can see the comb chamber

then # the plug acordingly to the cyl

its free performance and a smoother running engine for some easy labor when puting one together

I have faced the plug opening towards the itake valve and have lined them all up in line with the little rectangle indent in the cc at the plug hole

but as stated...putting them in so the plug gap faces the expanding "wedge" makes for a complete burn and more leverage pushing down on the piston

thats why its called a "wedge head"

Posted By: BDW

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/12/09 11:34 PM

Ok, which way should the spark plug gap opening point in this pic?

Attached picture 5225342-sb_head.JPG
Posted By: scratchnfotraction

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/13/09 02:08 AM

ok

I have lined them up in line with the recessed pad area off the plug hole

and I have lined them up with the open gap of plug facing the intake valve

need to know which way the shape of the of the cc on the heart shaped closed chamber heads swirl the intake charge around to to get it positioned in the right spot on the #302 heads, IMO

now I have also thought on putting the gap faceing into the cyl,so the gap faces the large side of the wedge to fire it from the small side and burn towards the big side maximizing the wedge effect of the wedge head

which IIRC is the right way for it to be facing

maybe someone else will correct me if I am wrong

Posted By: Dusted_Ya

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/13/09 04:12 AM

Up. Directly towards the manifold. Remember that the intake is still open (slightly) when the the spark ignites the F/A mix so the fire is swirling from the intake (hence the term swirl port). Just point it directly towards the center of the combustion chamber. That makes the bulk of the incoming fuel charge pass by the spark.
Posted By: scratchnfotraction

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/13/09 11:35 AM

Posted By: Rug_Trucker

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/13/09 01:21 PM

I could have sworn on the slant site they said face the opening towards the exhaust valve.

I know I smooth out the pocket where the plug is for flame travel towards the exhaust when I grind the chambers.

From what I have read indexing is worthless on the street, and mild race applications.

Cutting the ground strap might do something.
Posted By: RapidRobert

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/13/09 01:38 PM

Quote:

Cutting the ground strap might do something.


thats what I did & though I dont know how much it helped as it was on a new build but I felt good about doing it
Posted By: Crizila

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/13/09 01:40 PM

Quote:

I could have sworn on the slant site they said face the opening towards the exhaust valve.

I know I smooth out the pocket where the plug is for flame travel towards the exhaust when I grind the chambers.

From what I have read indexing is worthless on the street, and mild race applications.

Cutting the ground strap might do something.


Don't know if I'd call it worthless, but it is well over-blown! The intake charge sure isn't taking the same path in to the combustion chamber at idle as it is at 6,000rpm.
Posted By: RacerGofKGB

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/13/09 02:00 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Cutting the ground strap might do something.


thats what I did & though I dont know how much it helped as it was on a new build but I felt good about doing it



OT What is this ground strap cutting that you speak of?
Posted By: Rug_Trucker

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/13/09 02:02 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Cutting the ground strap might do something.


thats what I did & though I dont know how much it helped as it was on a new build but I felt good about doing it




If you are like me you like tearing things up!

I think this type of mod is measurable. How did you cut the strap? And what does that do to my "V power" NGK's?
Posted By: RapidRobert

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/13/09 02:19 PM

Quote:


If you are like me you like tearing things up!. How did you cut the strap? And what does that do to my "V power" NGK's?


(1) I am not as bad as you(I hope) (2) I chopped it until there was just enough left to reach up to the edge of the center electrode but I left enough bend for future adjustments as the gap wore and the fact that I like to experiment w larger gaps especially after I reduced the rotor to cap gap with solder on the rotor. (3) NGK is a good plug & even though shortening the ground electrode would toss away the "V" I believe that unshrouding the gap is more beneficial(though as Crizila says nothing earth shattering) than split gaps or anything similar.
Posted By: GOLDMYN

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/13/09 03:15 PM

My application on a 383 is with Autolite AR72, they already have the ground electrode cut back, car seems to run better
Posted By: aarcuda

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/13/09 04:43 PM

Quote:

My application on a 383 is with Autolite AR72, they already have the ground electrode cut back, car seems to run better




i run the autolite AR53's with the cutback electrode too and like them a lot
Posted By: scratchnfotraction

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/13/09 05:18 PM



may be worthless on the street,I feel good doing it even though I run junk

I have cut the strap back also,only thing I got out of it was change the plugs more often,even split the ends like the splitfire plugs

home hawg porting the heads,gasket/port matching every thing down to drilling the oil pump to 1/2 and port matching it to the main cap all gave me good results,some better than others

it has been noticable to me after indexing, wont know till ya mojo,

thats my hobby anyways, homeporting/grinding and doing all the mods I can to make each one with my own mojo,how else am I gonna learn

I even bumped up the exhast valve in a #302 head to 1.60 and just hawged out the exhast port and left the rest untouched and added headers and got a gain in performance on a stock engine

why?,thats what I thought porting was about,getting the exhast to flow as close to the #s of the intake port as possiable,IMO it helped it and was worth the labor for free HP

the time spent hand massaging the engine is free performance with longevity

result may vary and often do,IMO

maybe its just me being rabid under the shade tree doin my hickabilly thing

self skoolin,runin junk,havin a good time,keepin the jy open stimulating the economy buying gaskets

runwhatyabrung

Posted By: BDW

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/13/09 09:19 PM

From NGK site: (Still doesn't answer the question)

This is for racers only !!
Indexing refers to a process whereby auxiliary washers of varying thickness are placed under the spark plug's shoulder so that when the spark plug is tightened, the gap will point in the desired direction.

However, without running an engine on a dyno, it is impossible to gauge which type of indexing works best in your engine. While most engines like the spark plug's gap open to the intake valve, there are still other combinations that make more power with the gap pointed toward the exhaust valve.

In any case, engines with indexed spark plugs will typically make only a few more horsepower, typically less than 1% of total engine output. For a 500hp engine, you'd be lucky to get 5hp. While there are exceptions, the bottom line is that without a dyno, gauging success will be difficult.
Posted By: scratchnfotraction

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/13/09 09:59 PM

translated...results may vary

starting out with 150 HP,I will take every 1 HP I can get for some free laobor

Posted By: BDW

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/13/09 10:13 PM

Here's the best thing I've found so far:

According to Dr. Christopher Jacobs (of Omni-Pak and Pro-Street ignitions from Jacobs Electronics), indexing sparkplugs 'never hurts and sometimes helps'. Indexing is especially useful if the combustion chamber has a 'squish' area where the piston almost touches the head. This squish area 'squirts' a high speed flow of mixture toward the spark plug. The Dodge Magnum heads do have a squish area (also sometimes called a quench area). The spark plug is at the 'outside' (toward the fender) of the head and the spark plug hole is angled toward the exhaust valve. The intake and exhaust valves are in the middle of the chamber. The squish area is 'inside' toward the intake manifold. The combustion chamber is not round. It is 'kidney' shaped with the tip of the indented 'v' of the kidney pointing toward the spark plug. The difference between 'round' and 'kidney' is the 'squish area' where the piston top almost hits the head at top dead center.
For indexing, Christopher Jacobs recommends that you mark the insulator of the sparkplug with a black magic marker (not a pencil as graphite conducts electricity). Draw a line on the insulator on the side where the gap is open - opposite the side where the ground electrode is. Seems like you could also scratch/grind a mark on the top metal electrical terminal so that you could see & feel it. To align the spark plug's open gap toward the quench area, you would need to have the marked line on the 'top' side - away from the fender on that side of the truck. If you are looking down on the installed sparkplug, this means the mark should lie at either 11 o'clock (if the plug went in angling slightly toward the front of the truck) or at 1 o'clock (if the plug went in angling slightly toward the rear of the truck).
In practical terms, any o'clock position between 10 o'clock and 2 o'clock would be in the ballpark. This would also mean that if the open gap's mark lay in positions between 4 o'clock and 8 o'clock it might be bad - the ground electrode would stand like a fence post partially blocking the spark gap from the squish area.
Jacobs sells washers to go onto the sparkplug's seat to cause the plug to line up this way. You can also file off a little bit at a time of the start of the first thread to cause the sparkplug to end up turned a little. If you have a lathe you could turn off just a bit of the seat.
Posted By: scratchnfotraction

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/13/09 10:39 PM




best thing yet,like i thought,I had the wedge thing backwards..it lights from the big side wedging across the piston to the quench side for leverage

and good quench,happens very fast and can actualy cool the air/fuel charge some for better ignition of the fuel.IIRC

and yes the angle of the plug and 10 to 2 "o-clock" would be in the ball park

worth checking any head IMO

just making sure the flame is not blocked on 1 cly or more per head would be a good thing,IMO

Posted By: Mofopar

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/14/09 02:03 AM

So what thickness wahsers are we using to subtract degress?

Where can I find them?
Posted By: screamindriver

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/14/09 02:12 AM

I index mine in the cuda...906 iron heads{oversized valves} on the 440...I run them straight up at 12:oclock position...They definitely look much cleaner and the "shadow" from the electrode is gone in this position...I have the index washers but I usually just buy a bunch of plugs then sort them out so I don't need to use them... ..I'm right around 500 HP and it seems to idle/run better with them indexed...FWIW..
Posted By: Rug_Trucker

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/14/09 02:21 AM

Quote:

Quote:


If you are like me you like tearing things up!. How did you cut the strap? And what does that do to my "V power" NGK's?


(1) I am not as bad as you(I hope) (2) I chopped it until there was just enough left to reach up to the edge of the center electrode but I left enough bend for future adjustments as the gap wore and the fact that I like to experiment w larger gaps especially after I reduced the rotor to cap gap with solder on the rotor. (3) NGK is a good plug & even though shortening the ground electrode would toss away the "V" I believe that unshrouding the gap is more beneficial(though as Crizila says nothing earth shattering) than split gaps or anything similar.




Slant rotors and V8's are the same piece. NAPA sells one that is longer. I can check with SSDan.
Posted By: BDW

Re: Spark Plug Indexing Questions - 05/14/09 10:39 AM

Quote:

So what thickness wahsers are we using to subtract degress?

Where can I find them?




Summit has them,

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail...mp;autoview=sku
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