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A/C condenser: new or old?

Posted By: DGS

A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/12/19 04:57 PM

When adding A/C to your car would you rather get a new condenser (aluminum most likely) or use a nice original condenser (brass?)?
It seems the old ones are of a better quality?
Posted By: 135sohc

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/12/19 05:13 PM

Original always fits the best and most likely made better.
Posted By: CSK

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/12/19 05:52 PM

The new one that is made to use r134a, NOT R12 like the original one is.
Posted By: NachoRT74

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/12/19 05:57 PM

I have my original but will install a new aluminium replacement, but direct stock replacement, exactly same piece than original

this is for 73/74 Charger

https://www.ebay.com/itm/73-74-Dodge-Ply...aeVlC:rk:1:pf:0

Aluminium disipates better the heat so should be better to get more cold into the cab, I guess. I hope my car will be working this year to check it.
Posted By: a12rag

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/12/19 06:10 PM

I got an NOS unit for my car when I did it . . . . although the original in the car still looked good, I did not want to take a chance . . . pretty sure the OE and NOS unit were Aluminum . . .
Posted By: moparx

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/12/19 06:32 PM

Originally Posted By a12rag
I got an NOS unit for my car when I did it . . . . although the original in the car still looked good, I did not want to take a chance . . . pretty sure the OE and NOS unit were Aluminum . . .


i was going to say the same thing. back in my junkyard ownership days, [1972-1984] we sold radiators [brass/copper] and condensers [aluminum] separately for scrap.
i can't remember ever seeing a copper/brass condenser from any american manufacturer.
beer
Posted By: DGS

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/12/19 07:58 PM

Originally Posted By moparx
Originally Posted By a12rag
I got an NOS unit for my car when I did it . . . . although the original in the car still looked good, I did not want to take a chance . . . pretty sure the OE and NOS unit were Aluminum . . .


i was going to say the same thing. back in my junkyard ownership days, [1972-1984] we sold radiators [brass/copper] and condensers [aluminum] separately for scrap.
i can't remember ever seeing a copper/brass condenser from any american manufacturer.
beer


Good to know! I thought they were brass like the radiators are.
Posted By: NachoRT74

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/12/19 08:11 PM

my original ( Charger 74 ) IS NOT aluminium... is iron
Posted By: DaytonaTurbo

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/12/19 10:28 PM

I would use a new one unless you are charging the system with R12. R12 is a better refrigerant that R134A, so in order to dump the same amount of heat, R134A requires a more efficient condenser. Modern universal, retrofit and reproduction condensers are made for R134A so your vintage R12 condenser may not cool well especially at low speeds.
Posted By: Supercuda

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/12/19 10:53 PM

Now sure how a more efficient condenser would cool worse with R12 than R134.
Posted By: GoodysGotaCuda

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/13/19 04:34 AM

The increased surface area accompanied with a stacked plate [modern] style condenser is a more efficient design than a tube and fun [old].

Unless OEM-like aesthetics take priority, I don't see why you would run a tube and fin. Aside from potentially being cheaper.
Posted By: TooMany62s

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/13/19 03:24 PM

I converted my old pickup from r12 to r134 a long time ago. I also changed to a rotary compressor at that time. The AC worked OK but not as good as before. An AC expert friend of mine convinced me to change to a condenser designed for r134. I changed the condenser to one specifically intended for r134. The difference was remarkable. My pickup cools much better now.
Posted By: TooMany62s

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/13/19 03:26 PM

Originally Posted By NachoRT74
my original ( Charger 74 ) IS NOT aluminium... is iron
I think that would be the compressor?
Posted By: NachoRT74

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/13/19 04:12 PM

Originally Posted By TooMany62s
Originally Posted By NachoRT74
my original ( Charger 74 ) IS NOT aluminium... is iron
I think that would be the compressor?


no, I'm talking about the condenser. It got a crack once and was fixed at the Y on top passenger side. Is the same iron tube as far I could tell used on gas and tranny oil colling lines.

But definitelly is not aluminium
Posted By: NachoRT74

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/13/19 04:15 PM

Originally Posted By GoodysGotaCuda
The increased surface area accompanied with a stacked plate [modern] style condenser is a more efficient design than a tube and fun [old].

Unless OEM-like aesthetics take priority, I don't see why you would run a tube and fin. Aside from potentially being cheaper.


there are two kinds of these... serpent tube which is the original kind and parallel tubes which has being told is more efficient ?.



In my case I'm going original design but aluminium just right to keep same original look.
Posted By: moparx

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/13/19 07:22 PM

Originally Posted By NachoRT74
Originally Posted By TooMany62s
Originally Posted By NachoRT74
my original ( Charger 74 ) IS NOT aluminium... is iron
I think that would be the compressor?


no, I'm talking about the condenser. It got a crack once and was fixed at the Y on top passenger side. Is the same iron tube as far I could tell used on gas and tranny oil colling lines.

But definitelly is not aluminium


i have seen fittings of a type of steel silver soldered, or brazed, onto an aluminum condenser tube. the reason being, that steel and aluminum will corrode together, making removal of the threaded fitting impossible without destroying one, or both threaded fittings. we always chopped those off with bolt cutters before tossing them in the scrap pile. maybe your condenser was like that ? an iron condenser would weigh a ton [figuratively speaking], and i would think as thin as the tube mass is, would have cracking issues from vibrations that are always present. maybe export stuff was/is different than anything i have experience with ? shruggy or possibly, your condenser was a light weight steel tube design ? occasionally, we would run across one of those, but could immediately identify it based on just how heavy it "felt", as opposed to the "normal" aluminum condensers.
beer
Posted By: NachoRT74

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/14/19 03:58 AM

I have had both in hands, my original and the new aluminium one I have... the original IS NOT ALUMINIUM. tsk beer
Posted By: Supercuda

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/14/19 04:37 AM

put a magnet on it
Posted By: NachoRT74

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/14/19 05:26 AM

The fix/weld was made in fact with acetylene gas and copper wire! ( dunno how you call that kind of welding job ). That is not posible with aluminium.

( my car is 1k miles from home )
Posted By: moparx

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/14/19 06:18 PM

Originally Posted By NachoRT74
The fix/weld was made in fact with acetylene gas and copper wire! ( dunno how you call that kind of welding job ). That is not posible with aluminium.

( my car is 1k miles from home )


not doubting you at all nacho. just stating my personal experience.
today, there are so many methods of joining, or repairing, unlike materials, [with, or without heat] and since i wasn't there at the time, i can only guess.
my only question is whether your original was "iron".
i'll bet our individual interpretation of material is what is causing the confusion.
"iron" to me is usually a part made of the same [type] of material an intake or exhaust manifold is made out of, or brake master cylinder, of which parts are cast.
to cast, or form, an "iron" condenser would be quite the task, plus be brittle in use as i have previously stated.
steel, on the other hand, would be easy to fab into a condenser, and be very rugged in use. i'll bet that is what you have, and i have lost that fact in translation.
sorry if i have unnecessarily ruffled your feathers ! that was not my attempt. please forgive.
beer
Posted By: jbc426

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/14/19 07:16 PM

Originally Posted By csk
The new one that is made to use r134a, NOT R12 like the original one is.


This!

The refrigerant you plan on using dictates which condenser you need to use. I buy all my under hood stuff from NostalgicAC in Florida, and all my in cabin stuff from Vintage Air.

NostalgicAC has a much wider selection of condenser sizes and designs, and they are very helpful and knowledgeable in helping design a effective system.. I use condensors that are much larger than what available from Vintage Air to better fill my radiator opening.
Posted By: NachoRT74

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/15/19 06:01 PM

Originally Posted By moparx

my only question is whether your original was "iron".
i'll bet our individual interpretation of material is what is causing the confusion.
"iron" to me is usually a part made of the same [type] of material an intake or exhaust manifold is made out of, or brake master cylinder, of which parts are cast.
to cast, or form, an "iron" condenser would be quite the task, plus be brittle in use as i have previously stated.
steel, on the other hand, would be easy to fab into a condenser, and be very rugged in use. i'll bet that is what you have, and i have lost that fact in translation.


that could be, but under my understanding, steel is an iron aleation usually with carbon to make it harder so less ductile. While iron is simply iron. In Spanish, Steel ( no chemical symbol ) is acero, while iron is Hierro ( Fe as a chemical symbol LOL )

as mentioned, the original condenser I have is made with same tubes/pipes than the gas and tranny oil cooling lines, and those are not steel. Steel is not flexible. But call it whatever you want LOL

Originally Posted By moparx

sorry if i have unnecessarily ruffled your feathers ! that was not my attempt. please forgive.
beer


naaah, don't worry... beer
Posted By: moparx

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/15/19 06:07 PM

up
beer
Posted By: NachoRT74

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/16/19 02:29 PM

A prove the stock condenser is not aluminium. Note on this burnt Charger how all the aluminium parts got melted: quarter extensions, steering column which are aluminium aleation ( pot metal ) but not the condenser, not even partially!

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,134569.0.html
Posted By: moparx

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/16/19 08:31 PM

good pic nacho. must be what i would call a "steel" condenser.[ biggrin]
beer
Posted By: NachoRT74

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/17/19 01:17 AM

LOL
Posted By: Supercuda

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/17/19 01:35 AM

You think a radiator full of water might have shielded the condenser and prevented any melting?

Put a magnet on it, take a picture, post it.
Posted By: NachoRT74

Re: A/C condenser: new or old? - 01/17/19 04:10 PM

Is noticeable fire reached the front side
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