1970 440 HP Convertor Weights

After nearly three hours of searching I cannot find anything definitive about the torque converter weights for a 1970 440 HP. I can find tons of information on cast crank weights but not the forged crank heavy rod 440's. Does the converter for a 440 HP have weights? If so how much weight? Is there a weight kit for this (can't find an application in Mopar Performance). Does it straddle the drain plug like the typical converter weight?

First thing to do is make sure your engine is externally balanced by checking if it has the balance weight on the front of the harmonic balancer. If it does according to the Mopar Performance catalogue you will need to buy a neutral balance torque converter and then buy weight kit part # P4120241. This kit is for externally balanced cast cranks as well as the externally balanced 1970 & 1971 440 six pack engines and all other 440's with heavy rods[all have forged cranks]. Kit comes with a template and instructions.

Yes they have wights and they are located on either side of the drain

I saw that kit during my search and every time it popped up the application was listed as:

Torque Converter Balance Weight & Positioning Template Kit
Fits Most 1971-'79 383/440 (with cast crank)
Fits 1971-'92 360
Fits 1971-'76 340 (with cast crank)

There is no mention of the '70 heavy rod steel crank 440. Do you have a copy of the instructions or some other documentation that indicates this kit has this coverage? Appreciate the help.

I had a '70 440 HP (I think that is the "F" code?) in the '69 convertible when I bought it, but it was a 4-speed. I don't recall any balance stuff on the flywheel? I think the flywheel and clutch assembly is still in a box around here. I sold the engine/trans to a guy doing a superbird clone.
The 505" stroked 440 in my car is the '69 "E" code engine.

The flywheel in 70 has no weights added. It has material that is removed to achieve the balance.

You can buy a flex plate with the proper weights on it to balance the motor and then use a neutral balance converter.

The B&M plate has a notch cut to compensate for the imbalance the heavy rods create. It can only be assembled one way.

Then you are not tied to converter welding.

This is what we used on our 70.

Joe

That sounded like a real plan until I checked. Anyone I could find did not have an application for a forged crank externally balanced engine. Cast crank yes, forged no. Maybe I'll just have to start calling.

That is strange because our B&M flexplate with the notch doesn't look
like the ones they're showing, ours has a much smaller notch.

We bought ours maybe 10 years ago.

Maybe it has been discontinued, I'm going to see if I can contact B&M for an answer.

Joe

Talked to a rep at B&M this AM and he was at a loss as to the difference in
flex plate appearance from mine to what it shows now.

But ours is a forged steel crank and all is well as far as we can tell.

Sorry I couldn't help, Joe

Bee,I have the drive train out of my 70 R/T at home.It's a 440 u-code car that still has the original motor and trans. I can take a pic of the face of the converter if you want me to.Let me know. John.

I thought the torque converters on forged crank 440's were all neutral balance, 6pack rods or not? I think the external balancing on 6 pack rod engines was done on the harmonic balancer

John, that would be great. I've sent you a PM.

Joe, thanks for going the extra step and calling B&M. I was planning on doing that this morning but you doing it was much better. You could start the conversation with "I bought this flexplate from you..." If I had been asked any details I'd been dead in the water.

The B&M number is 10238

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/bmm-10238

6PakBee here is a link to the Mopar performance catalogue. Go to the auto trans section and look at the torque converter application chart page 91. There they tell you to use the weight kit P4120241 with the 440 six pack with heavy rods.
http://www.mopar.ca/assets/pdf/restoration/CATALOGUEDERESTAURATION2007.pdf

Aha, good find John, that's what ours looks like.
Now why the B&M guy didn't know about it????

You're all set now 6PakBee...

Joe

EDIT, the ad from Summit says "Not available" What the He__!

B&M 10238 is the correct flexplate for the forged crank, heavy (6 pack) rod 440 that is externally balanced.

It looks like they don't make it anymore? I've checked every website and no one has it (jegs, summit, mancini, etc.)...B&M's own website no longer shows it.

I may still have one out in the shop. The motor I ran it with ('71 HP 440) is now in a 4 speed car...when I freshened up the motor I had it internally balanced so I wouldn't have to deal w/ that ext. crap anymore.

Thanks for the link! It's somewhat disturbing that one has to go to a 10 year old catalog but I guess that is progress! Thanks again.

And not available. This is kind of like being on the last lap and running out of gas 50' from the finish line. John, thanks for digging this up. I may just post a wanted ad as this topic is going to come up again and it's nice to have another solution in addition to welding weights.

OOPS. Didn't notice they were NLA.

Perhaps somebody who has a 10238 flexplate could make a tracing of the cutout and make it available so that the full-circle 10230 flexplate could easily be notched to duplicate it.

HAHAHA! John, great minds travel in the same gutters.

The 70 and up 440 large rod motors are eternally balanced at the harmonic balancer AND the torque convertor/flywheel

I found an NOS Mopar Performance set I had part #5249843. They are in the box with instructions that say they are for a 93 and newer Magnum that are 14 oz out of balance. It also states that the Non-Magnum 360 was 19 oz out of balance and uses #4120241. No mention of the 440.

Our engine is out at the moment, I can get some measurements in a day or so.

Joe

Here are a few pics - showing both 10238 driveplates. One with the weigth and one with the cutout - 180 degrees from where the weight would be. I'll post the tracing in a bit.

more pics

The 1.635" dimension, is that from the edge of the hole?

John, thanks for the pictures and dimensions of the converter weights. If I go this route, I definitely have enough information to do it correctly. Appreciate the help.

6PakBee - yes - from the edge of the hole.

Thanks for the detailed sketch. If I can't get hold of one of the flexplates, I'm sure I can lay it out using your drawing.

Just to close this thread out, Transman has the machining capabilities to convert the B&M neutral balance 10230 flexplate to the external balance 10238. He did two for me and now I am set. Thanks so much!!

Glad you got squared away!

Good information