Oiling Issue im stumped on.

Hey guys, I have been working on an issue for two days now. Ill try to make it short and sweet to the points and issue:

- the engine I am running is a 360 magnum
- heads I just put back on it for the second time in two weeks. The first time I ran them the valves ceased on some of the guides after about 5 minutes time. The valves ceasing in the head, bent a few of the push rods, and then those lifters popped out. When the valves bent and lifters popped out of the galley, the oil pressure dropped to 0 on the gauge. I shut the car off fairly quick after the oil pressure dropped.
- some of the lifters got damaged as well so I replaced them with Hughes EDM Mopar/AMC lifters for pushrod oiling.
- I put everything back together, and I can not get oil up my pushrods to the rockers. I can see the EDM hole dumping oil onto the camshaft, but nothing through the top pushrods/rockers.
- If i pop out a lifter and prime the engine, I can see oil dumping through the lifter hole in the galley.
-*** The oil gauge shows 75 psi idle and 100 psi reving it slightly. I tried to fire the car up and let it run for a couple of minutes and still nothing.

Im worried about letting it run any longer with no top end lubrication happening. I know the gauge is showing high oil pressure, but could the oil pump be messed up? I definitely don't want to tear the pan off and replace the pump if its not broken.

The only other thing I could think of is the oil galley being cracked from the lifters popping out somewhere bleeding off enough pressure not to allow the oil to travel up the pushrods.

Im out of patience, time, money, and ideas. Any help would be appreciated.

Thank you,

Stupid question, but do your pushrods have holes for oiling in them?

You have very high psi in the horizontle gallery (the pass side one at least) so the disconnect between the gallery and the rocker arms has to be no oiling hole in the pushrods as SC mentioned or lifter issue (wrong ones as far as oil hole location but Hughes is top notch). Not sure if the lifters have to be at a certain window of "height" for the side recessed band/oil hole to be exposed to the gallery. You might take off the pushrods & prime & see if oil is coming out the top of the lifter profusely (all of em as they will be at different heights as far as that being a potential cause). also the pushrod might have to be in compression so the oil doesn't leak out the lifter/pushrod interface. I had a problem with that myself & had to preoil for a long long time to get oil up top. never did quite figure out what was going on but want ed to share my exp with this

Actually that's a good question, but the answer is yes. 13 of the 16 pushrod's are the same ones I was using before the all these problems. They all have oiling holes through them. Just a parts reference:

Howards Cams pt#91718 EDM lifters.
Comp Cams pt#7963 oiling push rods.

Rapidrobert, I thought about the gallery and lifter location / side band location, so I tried to move the lifter with my fingers up and down while I was priming it to get oil to shoot out of the top of the lifter. I could feel the lifter pressurizing and I could see it coming out of the EDM hole, but not out of the top of the lifter.

I used a 3/8 drill forever trying to prime it, no go. I switched over to a 1/2 drill and ran it till it literally burned the engine up on it, no go. I tried to run the engine for a few minutes to see if it would prime, no go.

Im going to call hughes on Monday, but im beginning to wonder if those lifters dont work in a Magnum block.

Looked at the Summit website, they have a 360 degree view of those lifters, they show an oiling hole for the pushrods. It is also listed for AMC's, which require that oiling hole too. It is listed for all big block and LA mopars, but not the Magnum engines.

But they are listed as mechanical lifters, not hydraulic.

yeah with 100 psi hitting the side of the lifter(s) there should be a nice flow out of the top oiling hole

Before the heads..did u have this problem and was the block recently been rebuilt?

I would make sure those push rods are open, could have been damaged or got something plugged in them. A 360 magnum has roller lifters, with a retaining plate, how did the lifters "pop out"? Are you using a non roller cam, with AMC lifters, in a magnum block? What year engine do you have?

Just a little more information:

The class I run this engine in does not allow for roller cams. I have been running magnum blocks with solid cam / lifter combos for years. I am using the AMC lifters in the magnum block with a solid cam.

When I changed the lifters, I changed three of the pushrods that are new. I can check the pushrods, but I don't think anything is blocking them.

I called the lifter company and didn't get any useful information. I asked them if I was priming the engine and took a pushrod off if it would oil shoot up from the top of the lifter and they said yes. Meaning - It doesn't require a pushrod pressuring it. No oil comes out of lifter while priming even if I move the lifter up and down in the lifter hole.

Does anyone have a good oiling diagram for a magnum block? I need to see the exact pathway the oil takes from the pickup and the diagrams I have seen are pretty horrible.

If oil is coming out the bottom of the lifter, the EDM hole, and not the top it's probable the hole is not drilled thru in the top.

Solid lifters? Pull one out, used compressed air on the side hole to see if it's coming out the top. Check position of hole in side by using a tape measure, slide down lifter bore to top of cam lobe and measure oil passage in block, rotate cam to full lift measure again. Check measurements to hole on side of lifter. Cam might have to be up a little to expose this hole on lifter. The reason is I'm not sure the passage is still in the same place as a early 360 block, never checked for myself. I'll do this when I get home since I have both blocks. Lifter also rotates so the hole could be on opposite side from passage, is there a groove around lifter body like a hydraulic lifter?

X2 With 100 psi hitting the side of the lifters & no/little oil out the top (of the lifter) then it has to be an internal (lifter) blockage (dia) prob. I'd open one up & inspect/measure.

The hole is drilled in the top. I was able to take a lifter out and put air to the side hole and feel it coming out of the top...

I have no doubt there is a connected passage there but it might not be big enough but you wouldn't think there'd be an error with that. I'd call Hughes & see what Dave has to say. EDIT You might clean up & toss in another lifter from your stash & preoil again just to see what you get for flow. wont hurt nothing, you ain't running it, just repeating the preoiling to see how a different lifter flows

What RR said, air is "thinner" than oil and will flow places oil will not.

Are the lifters loose in the bore? That will cause the oil to spill around the lifter and not travel through it.
A loose lifter can feel okay by hand but still be a bad fit. Sometimes it takes a good micrometer to get the proper dimensions.

Feets, no they are not loose in the bore. Sometimes its just easier to show people what i'm talking about instead of trying to explain. So far I have tried:

- 3 different types of lifters (All AMC/Chrysler oiling)
- 3 different kinds of rockers
- 3 different oil filters
- 2 types of push rods
- 2 types of oil types Brad Penn 20/50 and Mobile 1 5w30
- checked the oil pressure coming out of the china wall (85 psi)
- made a custom oil pressure lifter tool to check the oil pressure in the galley. (85 psi)
- 3 different types of drills to prime. One 3/8 drill which i ran forever getting 80 psi. One 1/2 drill which i ran till it literally burned the engine up. One Extra heavy duty 1/2 which I ran forever with the same results as the other two. (80-85 psi).
- Verified oiling holes in push rods.
- Verified oiling holes in lifters.
- Hand primed each lifter with oil.
- Tried filling pushrods while sitting on lifters with oil.
- Called Howards Cams and verified with them I should see oil coming out of the lifters when just sitting in the lifter bore with no pushrod.

I can feel the lifter pump up with oil when its priming. I have put air to the side of the lifter and felt it coming out the top.

I am completely out of answers, I have never seen anything like this before. Anyone have any ideas? It almost is impossible...

Please watch the video to see for yourself:
https://youtu.be/mNdvF_rde1k

20/50

definitely alot of flow and psi in the horizontle gallery. I'm thinking the height of the lifter machined band around the perimeter and oil hole that that interface is connected. this might be a stretch but I'm thinking all that is left is the drilled passages INSIDE the lifters ain't big enough (assembly line error?). I'd take a junk lifter & open it up & enlarge its passage(s) inside of it & see what you then get for flow. I would assume 20/50 is pretty thick?? but you tried the thin oil also. if the outside of the lifter is getting hit with that much psi but there is minimal flow out the top of the lifter then it (the restriction) HAS to be inside the lifter

Hyd. or sould lifter cam?