NAG1 controller finally on market. Just found this...

I was doing some research on the NAG1 and reading about how people having a rough time with controlling the NAG1 transmission. Well, I just found this site: http://soundgermanautomotive.com/pcs/

I don't know anything about this company/ controller yet, but I will try to find out more, including posting on the other sites. Has anyone else heard of this unit/company?

I was looking into this also going over the issues of this trans, but the one that seams to be the biggest is no u-joint-slip-yoke out back of trans. With the way it is now the rear axel will have to be stationary. Does anyone make a different output for this trans?

Why not just get a driveshaft made then with a slip joint in it?

Driveshafts with slips are very common in jeeps etc, shouldn't be an issue to have one made that way.

I think my Crossfire has a NAG1 tranny.

Cudaman - member Darius had someone make an aluminum adapter that mounts to the back of the trans and then you can use the slip joint front. He has a big build thread over at forbbodiesonly.com Plenty of pics too.

I heard back from Russell at Sound German Automotive. He has a facebook page with more info and reviews from customers. Looking at the website, you have two programs, which you can switch on the fly. It is a little pricey and has options you can get. He quoted me about $1200 for a kit for an older car. Here is some info he sent me:

It requires a RPM, TPS value and shifter status in addition to the the supplied driveshaft speed sensor kit I supply as a minimum to operation the transmission.

It works with all year NAG1 transmissions, plus he can control some Mercedes and Porsche transmissions.

That $1200 doesn't include the transmission, does it?

Is there something wrong with just grabbing all the OEM computers and transmission from an autowrecker?

Quite likely a minefield there. I haven't really looked into it yet.

I do know that the engine and transmission controllers communicate with one another. The engine controller also communicates with the body controller for engine run authorization.

There are eleventy billion computers in today's cars and they are all interconnected in one way or another.

It's great that someone finally did this for people who would want a NAG1 in an old car. I'm sticking with the 545RFE that's already mounted in my Duster. Much easier and cheaper....and it's still a 5 spd.

I'm 100% sure that price doesn't include the transmission.

Heck, I'm trying hard to stay under that price with my 46RE controller

Price doesn't include the transmission, but data logging software and is fully programmable. Yes, I know it is pricey but it works. If you don't want to cut up your tunnel (to fit the 545RFE) and want the extra power to handle a 6.1, 392, etc., this controller is the only game in town (that I found so far). I don't know how hard it is to make the factory TCU work, as some have tried to do so and failed. Of course that would be the least expensive way to go. I think you have to use the rear out of a new car for the sensors or something? Even Modern Muscle and another co. (can't remember off hand) have shelved the idea of making a separate controller (had difficulty in making it work) for now.
Anyway, I just thought I would pass it on that there is a working controller on the market. Hopefully the price can come down some as more and more people get them.

There is ABSOLUTELY something wrong with it.....IF you don't insure the tone rings and speed sensors are there also.
I went that whole route. It is on my build thread on FBBO in the projects section title "B Body Stiffening"

Another note on this PCS NAG1 controller, it was originally designed to use in the new Gen LX ,LC platform cars for those who were building the GenIII hemis to race. They wanted the transmission to handle massive horsepower etc.
I believe the applications we are trying to use it for need more than what the original designers were thinking about initially. Once they started to see the demand for older car swaps they had to regroup.
This is purely MY interpretation based on conversations with several folks who have had some exposure to the issues around it. I believe they will develop a product that will increase in demand , particularly once word starts getting around that there is a product available to enable this swap.
I have looked HARD for this solution and it appears I must be one of the first to go down this route....at least the first to have it posted on the most visited Mopar Forums anyway. I know I have not seen it in any of the Mopar magazines, but I don't read every one of them either. Most of those editors are stuck in the past anyway.

any build pictures, I used a 545rfe with my 6.4 build. i heard they can handle 550-600hp all day

Here is a link to my build post on FBBO 17 pages TONS of pics and tales of woe and frustration;-)

http://www.forbbodiesonly.com/moparforum/showthread.php?1121-B-Body-stiffening

Is the trans up shifted by electrical servos or by hydraulic like the old 727? If elec then why not just use micro switches to up shift and down shift( full manual ). The speed sensor iis inside trans and works with the abs sensors plus main controller. Reason I know the mechanic next door spent two months with the help from the Dodge shop trying to find the problem with a 2011 Charger. The trans would go into limp mode, tried everything, two trans, new sensors, changed tires. Come to find out the previous owner had changed to an SRT8 rear(3.06 ratio) and main controller was programmed for a 2.65, so the sensors couldn't jive and kicked it into limp, even the main engineers from Chrysler couldn't figure this out. Changed back to an original rear and trans worked fine.But chrysler did say the tires had to be within 5% of stock size to work properly(same as changing gear ratio). We think the rear package came with a chip box but was lost with selling the car to dealer to used dealer. As far as using Jeep trans I think they are independent (bolted solid to frame) so no u-joint either, I didn't see the type of slip u-joint you used in your build up pics other than the aluminum piece.
Edit; got the original trans and going to pull it down to see if my idea would work.

WOW>>>Darius..I just read your build, nice Job! sorry about your wiring troubles ..

I am NO expert ,in fact very novice, about exactly how transmissions work, particularly the new computer controlled ones but....I do know that Russell had us save a file of how the thing was working and send it, the computer itself, the rear gear, and the tire diameter when he re-programmed my unit. Obviously all of these components have to line up like the stars for everything to work properly. There was some discussion (mostly talking from Russell) about pressures and signals so I am pretty sure it is a combination of both that actually cause the transmission to shift when it does.
I should have this thing re-installed sometime next week so I can report on performance.....or not.

Have you talked to Chris at hotwireauto????

Hotwire has a kit out there for NAG1 use in a GenIII swap. The NAG1 is more difficult to swap because the TCM is separate from the PCM, unlike most RFE applications. This requires the FCM to regulate the CAN bus so the two can talk, not to mention all the other inputs from the CAN bus the NAG1 requires to not go into limp mode.

BlackFish, what car did you put the 545 into? Any build pics, or thread somewhere? Any pitfalls/problems you encountered? Thinking about doing a 545 behind a 5.7L in a 73 Ebody.

I believe I talked to Chris. At that time, they did not have anything for this swap. This is why we ended up at PCM. In my opinion and experience ,there is no SINGLE source for EVERYTHING required for this swap if indeed you are using a donor car and want everything from that same donor.

I just went to the hotwire site and looked at their kit. It says right on their list of what is included/needed that you MUST have the tone rings AND speed sensors from the rear axle installed.
THIS is what I have been telling everyone on every thread I have responded to on two different forums was MY problem! It is EXTREMELY difficult if not damn near IMPOSSIBLE to mount stock tone rings on an 83/4 axle assembly!

Has anyone looked into Powertrain Control Solutions? It appears they have a controller that works with the NAG1.
Edit: my bad, the original link is for a PCS controller......DERP!

I saw a video of a guy with (probably a GM) transmission he set up like that. Had two (or three?) toggle switches on the dash. For every shift, he had to select the proper orientation up/down, down/down, etc. Every. Single. Shift. No thanks

That being said, it's probably feasible, just not practical.


If the controllers require the speed sensor and tone rings, I wonder how hard it would be to generate those from another sensor that's easier to mount

If the trans can be shifted by switches that way I would figure out a way to paddle shift it with relays.

There are NO sensors on the rear axel housing or half shafts, the hubs-brakes have abs sensors from where the signal comes from ( explanation from Chrysler). Just went thru all this with the 2011 Charger
Edit, the main speed sensor is inside the trans,pull the valve body and servos and there is the hole dead center with a sensor taking the signal off a slotted ring. By the way I have the new third member ass. setting in the floor with half shafts for sale(3.06 ratio) same rear under SRT8s. Make me an offer.

The tone rings were mounted on the end of the axle/1/2 shaft assy on the 07 I personally took them off of. So, yes. they were not on the housing BUT...the sensor mount was on the housing as I recall, that would be the easiest ting to solve. My point is, if you don't figure a way to mount a sensor/tone ring on the rear axle somehow (assuming you are not moving the newer rear assembly over) you are going to have problems. Maybe they have built something into the newer units, yours is 4 years newer than my donor.
It would make the swap real easy if the sensor was mounted on the transmission somehow as that is exactly what the PCS controller does.

So the PCS controller doesn't need the tone ring on the axle?

This is some info I received from Russell:

It requires a RPM, TPS value and shifter status in addition to the the supplied driveshaft speed sensor kit I supply as a minimum to operation the transmission.