Moparts

Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On

Posted By: Big Bad Bee

Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/09/15 06:44 PM

Man! Tight squeeze! Looks like I might have an inch or so to the hood frame from the top of the choke box. Yikes! What are using for an air cleaner? I was going for an airbox type fresh air plenum but now I'm thinking I'd better get a 2" drop with a K&N filter lid.

I asked the question last summer when the engine was out and I could only guess what space I'd have but now it's go time!

Posted By: Mr.Yuck

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/09/15 06:54 PM

How do you get it to run upside down?
Really you'll need a drop base and you'll be fine.
Posted By: Row_your_own

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/09/15 07:34 PM

I ran same combo in a Dart several years back, I used this...

Attached picture 8454400-knn-66-3040_xl.jpg
Posted By: JohnRR

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/09/15 07:50 PM

Lose the choke and choke tower , the filter lid doesn't work for bleep if it's pressed up against the underside of the hood.

Another reason I prefer low decks , you get an extra 3/4" clearance ...
Posted By: shart70rt

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/09/15 07:55 PM

I have a drop base with the foam lid. Both are new, tried to get them to work with a very tall single plane couple of years ago but was too tight. Ended up switching to a dual plane dual carb setup, and it came with a filter. These have been sitting on the shelf since then. $50 plus freight.

Stephen
PM me here
Posted By: shart70rt

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/09/15 08:08 PM

you can also gain a little more clearance by putting spacers between the k member and frame. Dont want to drop it too much or you can have ground clearance problems, or steering component clearance problems.
Posted By: JohnRR

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/09/15 08:23 PM

Quote:

you can also gain a little more clearance by putting spacers between the k member and frame. Dont want to drop it too much or you can have ground clearance problems, or steering component clearance problems.



there won't really be a ground clearance problem , the K frame and components bolted directly to it will not get closer to the ground , but you will put a side/bending load on the end of the torsion at the rear Xmember
Posted By: bordin34

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/09/15 08:31 PM

I have a 1973 Charger with a flat hood, performer rpm and holley. This may not apply to you but this is what I did.
K&N 85-3545 drop base.
14"x3" round paper air cleaner. To find this look up the filter for a ~1970 high performance chevy small block.

This give just enough clearance to not interfere.
Posted By: Big Bad Bee

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/09/15 09:13 PM

Quote:

Lose the choke and choke tower , the filter lid doesn't work for bleep if it's pressed up against the underside of the hood.

Another reason I prefer low decks , you get an extra 3/4" clearance ...



I was wondering who the first person would be to recommend milling off the choke tower. You win, John. It's a last resort. Don't want to mess up a good Avenger if I don't have to and I would REALLY like a choke. I really wanted to build a 451 stroker but this 440 presented itself as a less expensive alternative. Plus it looks awesome.
Posted By: Big Bad Bee

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/09/15 09:19 PM

Quote:

How do you get it to run upside down?
Really you'll need a drop base and you'll be fine.



Fixed it. Weird. It was right side up on my phone... Maybe I've been holding my phone upside down all these years???
Posted By: JohnRR

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/09/15 11:38 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Lose the choke and choke tower , the filter lid doesn't work for bleep if it's pressed up against the underside of the hood.

Another reason I prefer low decks , you get an extra 3/4" clearance ...



I was wondering who the first person would be to recommend milling off the choke tower. You win, John. It's a last resort. Don't want to mess up a good Avenger if I don't have to and I would REALLY like a choke. I really wanted to build a 451 stroker but this 440 presented itself as a less expensive alternative. Plus it looks awesome.



is there such a thing as a good running avenger ?

Does proform make a main body for the avenger series ?
Posted By: b54406barrel

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/10/15 05:26 PM

Looks really nice under there, Lindy! Good job.
Posted By: StealthWedge67

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/10/15 05:43 PM

Drop the base all you want, but the lid is still gonna be right on top of the choke tower. In order to get it to breath, you're either gonna have to lose the choke, or the RPM intake; one or the other.
Posted By: burdar

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/10/15 06:41 PM

Could the carb flange on the intake be milled down? That would lower the carb.
Posted By: Big Bad Bee

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/11/15 07:48 PM

Quote:

Looks really nice under there, Lindy! Good job.



Thank you Rex!

Quote:

is there such a thing as a good running avenger ?

Does proform make a main body for the avenger series ?



That's a little unnerving. I thought they were good carbs.
Posted By: dogdays

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/12/15 12:26 AM

If God Almighty manufactured carburetors, somebody on this forum would post that they were crap.

I had absolutely spectacular results with my 570 using it as designed, as a street carb.
On the race Engine page, Dunnuck reported a very hard time getting a 670 to have a decent fuel curve. He ended up modifying the primary metering block. (Possibly a 3310 replacement metering block would work better.) No reason to not believe the guy.
I haven't heard a word about the 770 and 870 carbs. I have most of a 770 that's waiting for an engine big enough for it, or for someone to want it worse than I do.

But don't take the first negative comment too seriously, almost everything has been dissed on this forum.

R.
Posted By: Pool Fixer

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/12/15 12:49 AM

68 Charger, 440, RPM, Mighty demon carb. Hood clearance same as what you show in those pics. Wasnt any better with an edelbrock 1407 I used to run. I use a stock 68 unsilenced air cleaner. Due to the odd diameter of the stock mopar lid, the usual suspects for drop base won't work. I had to buy a complete ford motorsports air cleaner on ebag. I just used the drop base from it. plenty of clearance now. this was years ago and maybe someone has come up with a drop base thats the right diameter. As an aside, I ran a holley projection for a while and that TB was definitely shorter than a normal carb. I was able to run the standard base that came with the unsilenced.
Posted By: rarefish

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/12/15 01:51 AM

I ran into the same problem on my 64 Belvedere wagon with the RPM manifold. I ran out and bought a cheap MR Gasket drop base air cleaner as a temporary fix. That was 12 years ago and the dam thing is still under the hood....

Attached picture 8456951-WagonEngine.jpg
Posted By: 383man

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/12/15 03:48 AM

Here is the setup I am using because I dont have much hood clearance on my 63. I bought this air cleaner from Jegs and its a Spectre brand and I even cut tabs in the base where the float adjustment nuts are to get it as far down on the carb as I can. It works great for me as its a 9" air cleaner that like the K & N also breathes through the top. I did not want a larger diameter drop base as I feel the larger ones hold more eng heat around the carb bowls and the eng heat has been a problem with the cheap pump gas we use today. This works very good for me. Ron

Posted By: Big Bad Bee

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/12/15 04:38 AM

Dogdays, thanks for the positive input. I respect JohnRR's knowledge and opinion, although I must say that if I did everything he told me I should do, I would have $50K involved in my car and it would be bulletproof.

DKN 1997, Rarefish and 383man, are any of you running a holley with choke tower? If so, how's the performance with that drop air cleaner?

Since we are going there, have any of you removed a choke tower? if so, what did you use?
Posted By: Pool Fixer

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/12/15 06:01 AM

Quote:

Dogdays, thanks for the positive input. I respect JohnRR's knowledge and opinion, although I must say that if I did everything he told me I should do, I would have $50K involved in my car and it would be bulletproof.

DKN 1997, Rarefish and 383man, are any of you running a holley with choke tower? If so, how's the performance with that drop air cleaner?

Since we are going there, have any of you removed a choke tower? if so, what did you use?



my demon has no choke tower...as for performance, I couldn't say, I've had it on for so long I can't remember if there was any difference
Posted By: 68KillerBee

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/12/15 12:30 PM

Like someone else said, the ford motorsports air cleaner was the one to get. But I'm pretty sure it's been discontinued for at least 5 years.
Glad to see how this car has came along. Do you know what ever happened with your old barracuda/cuda?
Posted By: dogdays

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/12/15 05:50 PM

I agree that the choke airhorn needs to go. Airflow around it, under the tallest air cleaner you can fit, will mess with the carburetor flow patterns.

If you had a milling machine you could use that, it's the sophisticated way.

If you don't have a milling machine, a hacksaw and a couple of files will achieve the same result. The zinc material the carb is made of is relatively soft. You can just chop it off, but it'll look better (maybe work better too) if you radius all the square corners. Think of the top of a Holley HP carb. You don't have to go that far, but easing the corners will give it a finished look.

R.
Posted By: Big Bad Bee

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/12/15 07:05 PM

Quote:

Like someone else said, the ford motorsports air cleaner was the one to get. But I'm pretty sure it's been discontinued for at least 5 years.
Glad to see how this car has came along. Do you know what ever happened with your old barracuda/cuda?



Yes I do! I sold the Quickfish to a guy from Germany who makes regular trips to Seattle to get cars to restore. Big time Concourse de Elegance guy. He flipped it to a nice mopar guy up in British Columbia named Mike. Mike has the body repaired and painted and the engine back in, top back on and interior getting done last time I checked. He didn't do a complete resto but then if you saw the underside of the car you'd know why. Really clean car. He had a baby on the way and the car took a back seat. Haven't talked to him in a year. He went original B5/white with it.
Posted By: Ludington1

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/12/15 08:52 PM

I went with the older Performer, non-RPM, for just this reason on my 69 R/T with Ramcharger hood... not sure if you're looking for every last HP, but that might be an option for you.

Darren
Posted By: sunroofgtx

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/13/15 12:10 AM

Street Dominator intake. I wish mine was not a spread-bore. Sorry..
Posted By: 383man

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/13/15 05:46 AM

Yes my 850 has all the choke tower on it as all I did was remove the choke blade. Here it is on the old eng but I still use this same carb just like this. One day I will pull the carb and have the air horn (choke tower) milled off and see if it helps any. Ron

Posted By: 383man

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/13/15 05:48 AM

Here is a closer pic of my air cleaner. Ron

Posted By: BSB67

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/13/15 01:30 PM

I believe that the OPs choke tower is taller than the choke tower on the typical 4781, 850 DP like Ron's.
Posted By: 67Satty

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/13/15 06:26 PM

'67 Satellite with 440, RPM, 850 DP Holley with choke horn milled off, 1/2" carb spacer, Moroso drop base air cleaner - good clearance with stock hood. Runs the same exact time in the 1/8 mile with or without air cleaner.
Posted By: Big Bad Bee

Re: Got a 68-70 B with 440, RPM Intake and Holley? Read On - 03/13/15 10:33 PM

Quote:

I believe that the OPs choke tower is taller than the choke tower on the typical 4781, 850 DP like Ron's.



I believe you're right. Looking like I'd better call the guys down at the CNC lab (I work at a technical college).
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