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B Body Brake System Recommendations

Posted By: duckblind

B Body Brake System Recommendations - 10/17/14 07:19 PM

Hi,
I am a 68 Charger that has had brake issues for a long time. I have a hodgepodge of brake parts...unknown front spindles, 73 B Body calipers, 75 E Body master cylinder, Ford Cobra Rear disc brakes. I have decided to do a complete changeout and fix my issues for good. Any recommendations on a good system that will not break the bank?
Thanks,
Jason
Posted By: RapidRobert

Re: B Body Brake System Recommendations - 10/17/14 08:42 PM

no recommendation, but post what's going on as there are some knowledgeable people here & we are here to fix problems & if not then Doctor Diff can likely fix you up with a good setup. What symptoms/when did they start etc
Posted By: duckblind

Re: B Body Brake System Recommendations - 10/17/14 08:51 PM

ok. Maybe I will try to get in touch with Doctor Diff. They started around 13 years ago when the car got delivered to my house. I never could get them to work right. Doctor Diff is the one who recommended the master cylinder that I have own it. The brakes just don't stop the car all that well. A friend of mine recommended that I take the car to a speed shop near my house (Southern Hotrod) and they said I just have to much of a mismatch of parts. The system that they were recommending was around $2800 in parts alone so I am trying to find something less expensive. They were recommending a wilwood system.
Posted By: RapidRobert

Re: B Body Brake System Recommendations - 10/17/14 10:21 PM

Alright, No way I'd spend 2800 on a brake system. I'll just toss some thoughts out there: iirc 4 wheel discs need a large bore MC to feed the large vol of the calipers (as opposed to wheel cyls) & no prop valve so equal psi to all 4 corners (I may be wrong on that last one but that's what I remember). either the MC ain't supplying enough vol for 4 calipers/pedal leverage is wrong (when applied how far is the pedal from the floor "pedal reserve" and how much travel does the pedal have/blockaqe in the line so the vol ain't reaching the corners/wrong sized calipers/mechanical issue with the caliper(s) themselves. I have (had till it got Tboned) a 65 dart with 74 A discs/10" drums & it'd put me in the windshield if I wanted it too. I'm gonna add discs to an 8&3/4 for a future project. I've heard both ways that 4 wheel discs ain't that great & others say it's a killer setup . Holler back when you can. The other guy had a brake issue

Attached picture 8303547-key005.jpg
Posted By: terzmo

Re: B Body Brake System Recommendations - 10/17/14 11:57 PM

I've used 73 A body spindles and everything else new from napa. Total cost around 400 without a prop valve or power booster. I've never had any problems by adding/switching a prop valve
Posted By: Challenger 1

Re: B Body Brake System Recommendations - 10/18/14 12:12 AM

Quote:

Hi,
I am a 68 Charger that has had brake issues for a long time. I have a hodgepodge of brake parts...unknown front spindles, 73 B Body calipers, 75 E Body master cylinder, Ford Cobra Rear disc brakes. I have decided to do a complete changeout and fix my issues for good. Any recommendations on a good system that will not break the bank?
Thanks,
Jason



Could you get a 68 charger from the factory with front disc brakes?

If so I would use all stock disc brakes parts. I think it's cheap?, they work real good and there already designed, no guessing.

I did that, took a drum brake car to a front disc and used all stock disc brake parts and drums in the rear, the brakes are great, just like my other cars with stock disc brakes.
Posted By: Challenger 1

Re: B Body Brake System Recommendations *DELETED* - 10/18/14 01:00 AM

Post deleted by Challenger 1
Posted By: Fab64

Re: B Body Brake System Recommendations - 10/18/14 01:40 AM

Why don't you submit a question to Rick Ehrenberg? He seems very knowledgeable about this stuff. Just give him a thorough explanation of what you've currently got and how it is behaving:

http://www.moparaction.com/Tech/questions/Street_form.html
Posted By: therocks

Re: B Body Brake System Recommendations - 10/18/14 03:42 AM

You dont want to run 68 B body discs. Parts are super pricey and some hard if not impossible to get.I know they were repopping pads and some parts for those goofy setups.Only a total resto should have those.Rocky
Posted By: ahy

Re: B Body Brake System Recommendations - 10/18/14 04:12 AM

To get a good result, a little research is needed first. What is wrong with the brakes now? Won't lock?, uneven? ect.

Also, you really need to know what spindles and front brake setup you have now. A really good and low cost setup starts with late A/E/B or maybe FMJ spindles (debatable). How to tell? I do not know the pn's but one approach is to purchase a set of bearings for a 1974 Challenger or 1975 Dart. If they fit with your spindles/hubs, you have the desirable later spindles. If not, I'd go ahead and get a set of the late A spindles. MP brakes and others sell re-pops. From there, see the attached link for "disk-o-tech" covering how to use common parts to get good brakes.

MP brakes and Dr Diff also sell complete kits. The MP brake kits, from memory use the smaller 10.x/11" rotors and the late A used 11.75" rotors. Bigger is better on the front rotors.


http://www.moparaction.com/tech/archive/disc-main.html
Posted By: duckblind

Re: B Body Brake System Recommendations - 10/21/14 01:48 AM

Thanks everyone for your opinions. I think I am going to stay away from the wilwoods that the shop was trying to sell me. Like I said, their price was $2800 and that did not even include the correct spindles. I spoke to Dr. Diff today. He may end up making a kit for me. If I go with later spindles, say from an A body as suggested, would I need to change the upper and lower control arms? I plan on changing mine as they are the original ones (or at least really old) but need to make sure they will bolt to the car without any modifications.
Posted By: OzHemi

Re: B Body Brake System Recommendations - 10/21/14 01:50 AM

No need to change control arms at all...Maybe just do new bushings and ball joints if you have everything apart ?


(You change the uppers on early A bodies when going to big bolt pattern is all)
Posted By: duckblind

Re: B Body Brake System Recommendations - 10/21/14 02:06 AM

so if I were to say change everything on the brakes, what should I go with?
Posted By: ahy

Re: B Body Brake System Recommendations - 10/21/14 03:08 AM

For the front (if running 15" wheels), suggest an 11.75" kit with OE style parts like this one from Dr Diff. If you are running 14" wheels, there is a similar kit with smaller rotors.

For the rear, I'd personally just get the OE drum setup in good shape and run it... although disk kits are available for the rear as well.

Does your car have power brakes now? If so, probably best to replace the master with a new one in correct size for this setup. If not, I'd get the parts to convert to power (Dr Diff likely has them) since a B is kinda heavy for non-power discs.


http://www.doctordiff.com/front-disc-brake-kit-for-11.75-on-disc-knuckles.html
Posted By: duckblind

Re: B Body Brake System Recommendations - 10/21/14 07:17 PM

I like your suggestion of going with Dr. Diffs kit and rear drum brakes. I think I may go back to manual brakes with disc on the front, drum on the back and a hydroboost. Does anyone have a good recommendation for a hydroboost for a setup like this? Vacuum brake booster doesn't work well on my car because of the cam and I do not like to hear the vacuum pump (I tried it).
Posted By: ahy

Re: B Body Brake System Recommendations - 10/22/14 01:36 AM

There are lots of ways to put a hydroboost system together with used or reman parts (some Chevy Astrovans had it). It takes some engineering and adjustment... probably more than my personal appetite with brakes.

Hydratech offers an engineered new system for older MOPARs which looks nice... just spendy.

Just for reference, how low is your idle vacuum?

http://www.hydratechbraking.com/
Posted By: duckblind

Re: B Body Brake System Recommendations - 10/22/14 12:59 PM

I have not put a vacuum gauge on the manifold to know what it is. The brake booster would work fine if I were cruising say above 30 mph and stopped, but after the brakes were pressed once the booster would not accumulate vacuum again until rpms picked up again. The hydratech system looks pretty descent.
Posted By: skicker

Re: B Body Brake System Recommendations - 10/22/14 02:02 PM

Quote:

I like your suggestion of going with Dr. Diffs kit and rear drum brakes. I think I may go back to manual brakes with disc on the front, drum on the back and a hydroboost. Does anyone have a good recommendation for a hydroboost for a setup like this? Vacuum brake booster doesn't work well on my car because of the cam and I do not like to hear the vacuum pump (I tried it).



If you decide to go back to a manual disc-drum set-up you won't need the hydro-boost deal.
Posted By: duckblind

Re: B Body Brake System Recommendations - 11/26/14 02:12 PM

I ordered the 11.75 inch disc brake kit from Doctor Diff yesterday. I am going to stick with the disc brake rotors that are on the rear right now and see how things work (Doctor Diff's recommendation). I am also planning on ordering a hydrobooster for the brakes, probably hydratech. I will let yall know how things turn out.
Posted By: duckblind

Re: B Body Brake System Recommendations - 01/23/15 02:13 AM

So I have installed the disc brake kit from Doctor Diff along with a hydratech brake booster and now the car stops like a dog running and hitting the end of a rope. It is awesome. I don't think I will have to worry about the brakes for a long time and after many years can now drive the car again.
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