Moparts
Upgrading an old disc brake swap
Posted By: General 68
Upgrading an old disc brake swap - 12/28/08 10:53 PM
My 68 Charger had a disc brake swap done to it years back. I want to upgrade this setup to bigger rotors and lighter calipers but also want to run 15" wheels.
The current setup is 11" rotors, rear mounted slider-type calipers with the 2,6" pistons and the recommended 4-9/16" tall spindles. The caliper adapters used seems to be the ones for the 11,75" rotors-which is confusing...They measure 3-3/8" from senter holes to a flat surface when standing.
Any ideas on what parts I will need for some good stopping? And brand- like Stainless steel brakes, Wilwood etc? The car will be mostly street driven.
Posted By: DAYCLONA
Re: Upgrading an old disc brake swap - 12/28/08 11:16 PM
bigger rotors, means bigger rims,.....no way around it.....if 15" rims is your limit, your pretty much at it!
IMHO....upgrade the rear to a SSBC rear disc set-up
Posted By: RapidRobert
Re: Upgrading an old disc brake swap - 12/28/08 11:20 PM
If you were Ok with stock parts for an upgrade then 11&3/4" rotors, adapters for them & 2.75" calipers(76 A body units) & some semi metallic pads(I got a set for $15) to my door & a proper bed in procedure.
Posted By: TC@HP2
Re: Upgrading an old disc brake swap - 12/29/08 01:38 AM
15" rims will limit you to 11.75 rotors if using stock parts. To lighten this up you can swap to FJM spindles to loose a few pounds and swap the stock calipers for Wilwoods using ARE adapters. This is about as light as you can get using stock rotors and you will loose around 7-10 pounds per corner and cost maybe $600.
If cost is no object, then a custom Wilwood 12.12 carbon rotor on a billet hub designed for a drum spindle and 4 piston racing calipers and adapters can drop 15-18 pounds per corner and cost you around $2500-3000.
Posted By: General 68
Re: Upgrading an old disc brake swap - 12/29/08 10:45 AM
Thanks! Any ideas how much weight loss a change to Wilwood calipers will provide? What adapters do the Wilwoods require (part #)? Would an aftermarket performance rotor be worth running?
Do the performance calipers actually provide more clamping force than the stock ones?
What difference does a 2,75" piston make compared to a 2,6" piston?
A lot of Q's! I have read through a lot of threads around this but can't really find the answers I need.
Posted By: RapidRobert
Re: Upgrading an old disc brake swap - 12/29/08 03:31 PM
Quote:
Thanks! Any ideas how much weight loss a change to Wilwood calipers will provide? What adapters do the Wilwoods require (part #)? Would an aftermarket performance rotor be worth running?
Do the performance calipers actually provide more clamping force than the stock ones?
What difference does a 2,75" piston make compared to a 2,6" piston?
(1) I do not know (2) I do not know (3) no (4) if the bore size(s) are the same no, their advantage is lighter weight (5) more piston surface area means more brake bias to the front
Posted By: General 68
Re: Upgrading an old disc brake swap - 12/29/08 06:12 PM
Thanks RapidRobert! Your sugestions might be the way to go.
Let's say I put on 11,75" discs and run an adjustable proportioning valve. Would the 2,75" piston caliper do any difference?
Also, the car now has 11" rotors and the pads seem to be in the proper position along the disc. What confuses me is that when measured end-to-center bolt hole the adapters measure 3-3/8" wich (from what I have read) tells they are 11,75" rotors. Any input on this? Just to know if I need different adapters to run the 11,75" rotors.
Posted By: MoparMarq
Re: Upgrading an old disc brake swap - 12/29/08 07:20 PM
Quote:
Thanks! Any ideas how much weight loss a change to Wilwood calipers will provide? What adapters do the Wilwoods require (part #)? Would an aftermarket performance rotor be worth running?
Do the performance calipers actually provide more clamping force than the stock ones?
What difference does a 2,75" piston make compared to a 2,6" piston?
A lot of Q's! I have read through a lot of threads around this but can't really find the answers I need.
IIRC, it's about 7 lbs/corner. Not sure though.
I had this exact setup on my '72 RR for about 7-8 years or so. Very happy with it. Plenty of clamping force for me (street driver), although I had power brakes at the time. Used my DC proportioning valve with the setup. I've since gone with Andy's Viper caliper setup, though I can't say yet how I like it, as the car's not done yet. I think I have a few pics of the old setup for eBay purposes. It'll probably be for sale next summer when I'm sure I'm happy with the new setup.
BTW, the Wilwoods don't have dust boots on the pistons, so they're not technically DOT legal. But I never had any problem with leakage or assymetric braking.
Posted By: MoparMarq
Re: Upgrading an old disc brake swap - 12/29/08 07:21 PM
Pic 2.
Posted By: RapidRobert
Re: Upgrading an old disc brake swap - 12/29/08 07:35 PM
Quote:
Let's say I put on 11,75" discs and run an adjustable proportioning valve. Would the 2,75" piston caliper do any difference? Just to know if I need different adapters to run the 11,75" rotors.
(1) definitely yes, going from 10.87" rotors to 11&3/4" rotors will give you a much longer lever arm & 2.60" to 2.75" will give you ~3/8" more total bore size, you'll feel the difference (2) the 11&3/4" rotors do need different caliper adapters. I remember the magazine article(MA I think) that had the pics/measurements & it might be in the archives where you can access it. I would also keep your factory proportioning valve & add an adjustable one in the rear line if you are presently redoing your lines & if not wait & see how off your bias is when you get it up & running/driving & decide then if you need to plumb one in. EDIT dont forget some better pads
Posted By: General 68
Re: Upgrading an old disc brake swap - 12/30/08 12:48 PM
Good info! Keep it coming!
I think I will get 11-3/4 rotors and a set of good pads. I want to try either 2,75" piston calipers or lighter aftermarked calipers.
Ii would be nice to know what aftermarked calipers that would work as good as the 2,75's on the street. It is tempting to shave off some unsprung weight here.
Also what should be a good source and brand for 11-3/4 rotors and good pads?
If I could get some input on what adapter measurements I am looking for it would be appreciated.
Posted By: jbc426
Re: Upgrading an old disc brake swap - 12/30/08 01:03 PM
Before you put your new "good" pads in, buy a cheap set of organic pads and run them for a thousand miles or so. After that, scuff the rotor lightly, clean it well, and install your fresh semi-metalic pads. This will help burn the oil and such out of the new rotors. I usually only bother with this on the fronts, but after doing it, it seems to enhance braking performance.
Posted By: bull
Re: Upgrading an old disc brake swap - 12/30/08 03:26 PM
I'm a little confused. You say you have 11" rotors now but as far as I know there's no such thing in the Mopar world. Are you just rounding up the 10.87" measurement?
Also, I'm curious why you want to "upgrade" the system. The worst disc brakes are a lot better than the best drum brakes and drum brakes are a lot better than nothing. Is it just a "cool factor" thing or is something actually broken/worn out/bent?
Posted By: General 68
Re: Upgrading an old disc brake swap - 12/30/08 06:55 PM
Yes, the car has 10,87" rotors. They work ok for the street, but it's a hobby, right! And after upgrading motor, driveline and suspention I don't think tossing a few bucks into better brakes with new disc's etc won't be a bad idea. And when already digging in it why not atleast put on bigger rotors and maybe shave off some weight with lighter calipers?
Besides- I think I have got some wrong info around how to find adapters for 11-3/4 discs. I need some info on how to measure a 11-3/4 adapter.
Posted By: AndyF
Re: Upgrading an old disc brake swap - 12/30/08 08:20 PM
The 11.75 upgrade is a good upgrade on a heavy B body car. Lightweight calipers work good for drag racing or autocrossing, not so hot for track use or road racing. Brakes are like clothes, put on what is appropriate for the situation.
The Viper calipers with 11.75 rotors is a good combination if you can find the calipers at a decent price. That is probably getting harder to do these days.
Posted By: RapidRobert
Re: Upgrading an old disc brake swap - 12/30/08 08:25 PM
Quote:
Brakes are like clothes, put on what is appropriate for the situation.
great minds think alike
Posted By: BDW
Re: Upgrading an old disc brake swap - 12/30/08 08:47 PM
Quote:
Yes, the car has 10,87" rotors. They work ok for the street, but it's a hobby, right! And after upgrading motor, driveline and suspention I don't think tossing a few bucks into better brakes with new disc's etc won't be a bad idea. And when already digging in it why not atleast put on bigger rotors and maybe shave off some weight with lighter calipers?
Besides- I think I have got some wrong info around how to find adapters for 11-3/4 discs. I need some info on how to measure a 11-3/4 adapter.
This tells you how to measure
http://www.moparaction.com/tech/archive/disc-main.html
Posted By: General 68
Re: Upgrading an old disc brake swap - 12/30/08 10:28 PM
Thanks! I'll go the 11-3/4 disc route and maybe rebuild a set of 2,75" calipers. Still would be nice to know what would be a good source for discs and pads.
Posted By: BDW
Re: Upgrading an old disc brake swap - 12/30/08 10:52 PM
I bought eveything for my Challenger at local Advanced Auto. You can get everything needed from Rock Auto.
raybestos caliper w/pad RC4103/4 $36.00
78 charger (slider)
outer bearing BR2 $6.00
78 charger
wearever rotor YH141132 $52.00
78 charger
dorfman banjo bolt 13938 $5.00
inner wheel bearing BR17 $8.00
77 charger
inner seal 19500 $2.00
77 charger
raybestos hose 4536755 $15.00
76 duster
Posted By: General 68
Re: Upgrading an old disc brake swap - 01/01/09 06:44 PM
Thanks for great info guys! I'll start with new and bigger rotors and go from there.