Moparts
Neon rings
Posted By: 71birdJ68
Neon rings - 03/09/14 05:36 PM
Ok, here is the deal. My 95 Neon is down on compression, and one cylinder is way down, and drinking oil. All I want to do is rough up the holes with a dingle berry hone, and put new rings in. That's all I can afford at this time. The factory only offers standard size, and they are very expensive, so what is ya'lls opinion? Just do that or go to the next size parts store rings, and file down the gap so they fit? If that is the route, who makes the best replacement rings? I'm just going to pull the head, and pan, and do it with the motor in the car. Car has 454,000 miles, so there will be some cylinder wear, but it has been on Mobil 1 all its life.
Posted By: DaveRS23
Re: Neon rings - 03/09/14 06:45 PM
It might be best to tear it down and figure out the exact cause of the problem. Then assess your options.
Posted By: AARCONV
Re: Neon rings - 03/09/14 06:51 PM
with that amount of miles and you want to go cheap buy an oversize set and file it down..but the funny thing is that you asked who makes the best rings????you might open a can of worms..
Have you considered just replacing the engine with a lower mile salvage engine? You should be able to find a motor from the salvage yard with less than 150k for 400 to 500 bucks. Id get a salvage unit, slap on a new timing belt and water pump and stick it in there. It may be cheaper by the time you buy all of the stuff to fix or should I say patch yours.
Posted By: gdonovan
Re: Neon rings - 03/09/14 07:42 PM
Standard rings are $40 at rock auto.
Posted By: 71birdJ68
Re: Neon rings - 03/10/14 12:13 AM
This is the original eng, and I want to wring it out for as long as it will go. I know exactly what I have with the rest of the engine. The bearing are good as new. And I know why the rings are letting go. It blew two head gaskets between #1, and 2, and both times all the water went out the tale pipe. I limped home both times, and it got hot, so the rings have just lost their tension. I'm just wondering weather to use standard, or file a set of oversize.
Posted By: stumpy
Re: Neon rings - 03/10/14 12:27 AM
Measure the cylinder bore and you will know what to use. We can't tell from here.
Posted By: Supercuda
Re: Neon rings - 03/10/14 12:56 AM
Quote:
Measure the cylinder bore and you will know what to use. We can't tell from here.
got the feeling he doesn't want it down long.
The moly rings at rock auto are $80+, factory rings are moly, that's why you got the miles you did, not Mobil. That being said, a quicky job like it seems you want would be better done with cast rings as they seal up easier in less than adequate hone jobs than moly.
Posted By: 71birdJ68
Re: Neon rings - 03/10/14 01:23 AM
You're right I can't have it down very long,my only other car is a 75 /6 Dart, and it drinks the gas. Factory rings are a $125 a hole, I don't know anybody with a bore gauge. Maybe if I look hard I might find someone with one. Yes, it is the Moble 1 that has made it last. The last time the head gasket blew I checked the rod bearing, and they checked the same as new clearance, plus here is one of the rod bearings to look at it had 370,000 when I took the picture. There was just a faint hone pattern in one or two cylinders. The reason I ask about which brand of rings are good, I haven't bought any of that stuff since the 70s. I'm trying to finish up my Road Runner is the reason I don't have any spare money.
Posted By: TJP
Re: Neon rings - 03/10/14 02:27 AM
Quote:
Have you considered just replacing the engine with a lower mile salvage engine? You should be able to find a motor from the salvage yard with less than 150k for 400 to 500 bucks. Id get a salvage unit, slap on a new timing belt and water pump and stick it in there. It may be cheaper by the time you buy all of the stuff to fix or should I say patch yours.
Good advice
Posted By: hemicar1971
Re: Neon rings - 03/10/14 02:39 AM
Quote:
Quote:
Have you considered just replacing the engine with a lower mile salvage engine? You should be able to find a motor from the salvage yard with less than 150k for 400 to 500 bucks. Id get a salvage unit, slap on a new timing belt and water pump and stick it in there. It may be cheaper by the time you buy all of the stuff to fix or should I say patch yours.
Good advice
I would also agree. It is easier to change the motor and do the water pump and timing belt while it is out of the Vehicle and get another 150 K out of this motor.
Posted By: rallye73
Re: Neon rings - 03/10/14 02:54 AM
You will have a hard time finding a low milage used engine for first gen neon. Those cars are really getting used up. The circle track guys are also snapping them up.
I counted several used engines in Tennessee salvage yards with under 150K in the 4 to $500 price range on
www.car-part.com FWIW.
Posted By: 71birdJ68
Re: Neon rings - 03/10/14 03:08 AM
Yes, they are getting hard to find. And the motor would be a gamble on the condition inside.
Posted By: hemicar1971
Re: Neon rings - 03/10/14 03:09 AM
Quote:
You will have a hard time finding a low milage used engine for first gen neon. Those cars are really getting used up. The circle track guys are also snapping them up.
Your post started me asking questions. Is it a DOHC or a SOHC motor. The big problem being the year. 1995 you have the OBD1 system in a 1995 Neon. Most if not all censors are different from 96,97,98,99 first gen motors and second gens are a no go. Finding a motor could be hard to do. Now go to Rock Auto and take a look around for parts.
Posted By: 71birdJ68
Re: Neon rings - 03/10/14 05:04 AM
It's a sohc and a obd1, that's why I asked about the ring options. I'm not going to change out the motor, I know what I have. All I'm going to do is rough up the bores, but who is making good replacement rings now a days, and should I get cast or moly?
Posted By: rallye73
Re: Neon rings - 03/10/14 06:00 AM
Total Seal makes rings for neons. Most of the outlets that cater to neons have carried them for years.
Posted By: 71birdJ68
Re: Neon rings - 03/10/14 06:41 AM
Thanks everybody.
Posted By: gdonovan
Re: Neon rings - 03/10/14 02:47 PM
Quote:
It's a sohc and a obd1, that's why I asked about the ring options. I'm not going to change out the motor, I know what I have.
With 454k on the clock I'd be concerned with the rods failing before a set of inexpensive aftermarket rings.
With that sort of number on the short block if you are planning to keep it and boneyard motor might not be a bad suggestion if something with low miles is available.
Posted By: DaveRS23
Re: Neon rings - 03/10/14 03:18 PM
Have you been over to Neons.org yet? There is a ton of info there, but it is populated by younger guys and you have to sort through a lot of opinions to get to good experienced knowledge. But there is more info there on these cars than anywhere else.
I think that the reason you are not getting a lot of experienced answers to your question is because there have been plenty of good, used inexpensive Neon engines available. And most guys are more comfortable with a used engine than with going into their old engine.
Couple that with the fact that most guys would want to do a lot more to their old engine than just re-ring it, and swapping the old one out is cheaper and quicker. For them.
I am not attempting to change your mind, just pointing out why there are few, if any guys with experience rebuilding these engines answering you.
Posted By: dogdays
Re: Neon rings - 03/10/14 03:23 PM
Actually, moly rings require less surface roughness to seat. And to the OP, the factory moly rings are CERTAINLY a factor in why the engine has lasted this long. They are easier on the cylinder walls than plain cast iron rings, much easier than chrome.
File fitting is great, but you still have to deal with the taper in the cylinder. If you have 0.007" taper, for example, it will be on the top end of ring travel. But on the bottom end of ring travel it may be close to standard size. So if you gap the rings properly at the top, they may have problems a the bottom of the stroke.
Total Seal rings in standard size sound like a good crutch for this engine.
R.
Posted By: 71birdJ68
Re: Neon rings - 03/10/14 03:59 PM
I'll go over to Neons.org and see what they say. It's more entraining here, and I on here all the time, so this was my first stop.
Posted By: gdonovan
Re: Neon rings - 03/10/14 04:36 PM
Quote:
I'll go over to Neons.org and see what they say. It's more entraining here, and I on here all the time, so this was my first stop.
As a retired Chrysler tech, I'd say either slap it together as cheap as possible or replace with a used engine.
The rods are a ticking time bomb, I'm amazed they have gone this far. Just a matter of time before they let go from fatigue and its best to have as little as possible invested when they do.
If I recall correct, Chrysler would sell pistons only with rods attached, there was a reason for it...
Posted By: DaveRS23
Re: Neon rings - 03/11/14 01:41 AM
Quote:
Quote:
I'll go over to Neons.org and see what they say. It's more entraining here, and I on here all the time, so this was my first stop.
As a retired Chrysler tech, I'd say either slap it together as cheap as possible or replace with a used engine.
The rods are a ticking time bomb, I'm amazed they have gone this far. Just a matter of time before they let go from fatigue and its best to have as little as possible invested when they do.
If I recall correct, Chrysler would sell pistons only with rods attached, there was a reason for it...
I was thinking that the reason the "rings" were so expensive from Mopar was because it was actually the piston, rings, and rod. But I am not sure anymore. It's been a long time since I priced any of these parts.
Posted By: 71birdJ68
Re: Neon rings - 03/11/14 02:32 AM
$125 just for the rings, per hole.
Posted By: Supercuda
Re: Neon rings - 03/11/14 02:44 AM
Quote:
$125 just for the rings, per hole.
ROCKAUTO.COM
Sealed Power moly $75 for a set, of four piston's worth, not one hole and those are the expensive sets.
Posted By: 71birdJ68
Re: Neon rings - 03/11/14 02:46 AM
Yes, thanks, I noticed them earlier today. I think that is what I might do.
Posted By: stumpy
Re: Neon rings - 03/11/14 03:07 AM
Some thing isn't right on your pricing from Mopar. There is no way in hell a set of rings would cost $125 per cylinder.
Mopar parts America pricing.
ENGINE / PISTONS, RINGS & BEARINGS / PISTONS, RINGS & BEARINGS / PISTON RING SET
PISTON RING SET Neon 2.0L, SOHC
Complete Set Of Rings For 4 Pistons.
MSRP Core ? Online Price
$170.00 $0.00 $122.40
Posted By: 71birdJ68
Re: Neon rings - 03/11/14 03:24 AM
Ok, I'll look at that again. My dealer was the one that said per cylinder.