Moparts

BB 11" manual drum brakes

Posted By: MOPAULY

BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/02/13 11:47 PM

What exactly should manula drum brakes feel like? I have manual drum all the way around on my 68 charger, and the pedal goes almost to the floor unless pumped. I adjusted the shoes at all corners and its better, to the point where the brake warning light does not come on...the rears were way out. It's a reman master cylinder, and I have all new lines (soft and hard) plus all new wheel cylinders. The proportioning valve was disassembled and cleaned. No leaks anywhere, is this just how it is?
Posted By: 340SHORTY

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/03/13 12:23 AM

Bleed your system again. Manual brake systems dont have proportioning valve, they have distrubition blocks..
Posted By: Cab_Burge

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/03/13 01:26 AM

Quote:

What exactly should manula drum brakes feel like? No leaks anywhere, is this just how it is?

Properly set up(adjusted and bled) should have a rock hard peddle 1/4 to 1/3 of peddle travel from top It sounds like you still have some air in the brake system Start by bleeding the left front brake and then the R/F, next the left rear(don't forget to keep the master cylinder at least half full of brake fluid at all times ) If a wheel cylinder spits out fluid and then air bleed that cylinder until only fluid comes out Keep the fliud level in the master cylinder full for each cylinder bleeding Good luck
Posted By: therocks

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/03/13 03:33 PM

Cab thats backwards from all bleed sequinces Ive ever read.You always start RR then LR then the fronts.Only one differnt Ive done in over 40 years was the split diag systems.Then it was RR LF LR then RF.Rocky
Posted By: bonefish

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/03/13 03:42 PM

when i was younger i bled brakes in no particular order and they were fine.but sayin "WHOA NELLY BELL"was a different time and somtimes slow to react.
Posted By: Cab_Burge

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/03/13 06:21 PM

Quote:

Cab thats backwards from all bleed sequinces Ive ever read.You always start RR then LR then the fronts.Only one differnt Ive done in over 40 years was the split diag systems.Then it was RR LF LR then RF.Rocky

Your probally correct on the recommended sequence, I have always done things different My memory sucks OP, another easier way to bleed them is to use the gravity method(as long as the mater cylinder is above the wheel cylinders this will work) which involves opening one bleeder screw at a time and let it drip out for a while, not under pressure This method works fine as long as your not in a hurry, you can also put a piece of rubber tubing over the bleeder screws and put the other end in a glass jar or cup to catch the brake fluid so it doesn't eat up the paint on the backing plates and run down onto the wheels and tires
Posted By: RSNOMO

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/03/13 06:22 PM

Quote:

Properly set up(adjusted and bled) should have a rock hard pedal 1/4 to 1/3 of peddle travel from top



I'd agree with that...

Describes mine...

DOT 5 fluid...Shoes adjusted...

I bleed from the furthest point back...
Posted By: GTX MATT

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/03/13 07:43 PM

The sequence Cab recommended sounds backwards to me as well, but I recently heard/read somewhere else to do it that way. I always start furthest from the MC and work my way closer and I've never had a problem.

Pedal should be rock hard only slightly depressed, as described. You will never get these things anywhere near the floor once all setup correctly and bled.
Posted By: Pntastar69

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/03/13 10:23 PM

Bleed em again Paul. Must have air in the lines.
Posted By: MOPAULY

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/09/13 02:06 AM

Bought a HF power bleeder, seems like I'm not getting fluid to the front wheels, going to disconnect and blow out with air. What a PIA
Posted By: Oyvind Mopar

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/09/13 09:11 AM

On my 68 Charger I had new hoses that did not let the fluid pass through. I even tried to run a steel rod through them, OK, but It seemed like the ordinary brake fluid made them swoll and tighten up inside. I ended up installing the old hoses again, then it all worked out perfectly. The new hoses were made in India. My
Posted By: B5 Bee

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/09/13 01:30 PM

Are you sure you have the shoes adjusted correctly? If they are too far out of adjustment, the wheel cylinder runs out of travel before the shoes contact the drum and you have to pump it for more travel. The 11" on my cars are manual adjust, not self adjust, so they won't fix themselves like on most other brakes.

You mention the brake light coming on before you adjusted them last. I didn't think adjusting the brakes would have anything to do with the light, it's supposed to light up when there's a hydraulic problem.

If a brake re-adjust and re-bleed doesn't fix it, I'd try a new MC.
Posted By: MOPAULY

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/09/13 10:31 PM

Yep all 4 wheels are adjusted. With the power bleeder I cab barely pull anything at the front wheels. Hoses are new from summit but I will test them. Master cylinder was replaced by them once already, it's gotta be the hoses or something in the front lines.
Posted By: jburt

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/10/13 12:07 AM

just wondering what was all done to the brake system? did the pedal ever feel good for you before or did you get the car that way? was the master push rod ever changed with a wrong one?
Posted By: MOPAULY

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/11/13 02:36 AM

Car was off the road since 83. I think it may be the front rubber lines, I'll find out Thursday morning.
Posted By: RSNOMO

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/11/13 02:56 AM

Quote:

Car was off the road since 83. I think it may be the front rubber lines,



Don't even mess with 'em...

Replace 'em...
Posted By: MOPAULY

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/12/13 05:45 PM

I'm stumped. All new hard lines, soft lines, wheel cylinders, and on a second master cylinder from Summit.

I pulled a rubber line on the front and was able to draw a solid line of fluid from the hard line; I then placed the rubber line in a container and was able to pull solid fluid through it. I put it back together and I can only get a trickle from the front bleeder screws. I can't imagine I need a thread sealer on the bleeder screws!

Is it possible there is an issue with the junction block not working correctly? After all of this I still have to pump the brakes multiple times to build any pressure, it makes 0 sense. When I bled the rear I was able to pull solid fluid, at least one side.

There are no leaks yet I can't pull a solid line at the front wheels. F'n baffled.
Posted By: Erik

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/12/13 06:20 PM

Time to sell that POS '68 to me! LOL
Posted By: MOPAULY

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/12/13 06:26 PM

hahaha never! I want to be buried in that car
Posted By: RSNOMO

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/12/13 06:38 PM

At this point, you've got good fluid flow to the wheel cylinders, but only one will bleed???
Posted By: MOPAULY

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/12/13 06:46 PM

at least one rear gives a solid fill on the pump - I don't recall on the other. The front simply gives a trickle.
Posted By: RSNOMO

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/12/13 07:01 PM

Top off the master, get somebody out there with you...

Pump 'em up and crack a front bleeder...

If you've got good flow to the wheel cylinder, but little out of the bleeder, that really only leaves the wheel cylinder...

Are the bleeders clear???
Posted By: MOPAULY

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/13/13 04:04 PM

I have a power bleeder, no need for 2 people. Bleeders pull fluid just fine when tested, issue somehow must be with the wheel cylinders.
Posted By: buildanother

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/13/13 04:25 PM

Hope you're positive of the adjustment. The shoes need to ride pretty close to drums or pedal will be low.
Posted By: 451Mopar

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/14/13 08:00 AM

When I rebuilt the 11" manual drum brakes on my '69 Coronet, I got the springs and self adjuster kit for the '70 model to get rid of the manual adjusters.
I hope you bench bleed the master cylinder before installing it.
Posted By: MOPAULY

Re: BB 11" manual drum brakes - 09/15/13 07:00 PM

Adjustment seems good and it was bench bled. I've manually bled it a few times since the issue and its better. Not perfect, but better and driveable.
© 2024 Moparts Forums