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Splicing Wires???
Posted By: mopowers
Splicing Wires??? - 04/04/13 08:38 PM
What's the best way to splice two wires together?? Do you guys prefer to use bare butt splice connectors, then solder them, and insulate with a wrap of electrical tape and some heat shrink?
Or is it better to just twist the stripped wires together and solder them WITHOUT using a butt splice connector, and give them a wrap of tape and some heat shrink???
Posted By: hooziewhatsit
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/04/13 08:50 PM
I got a good sized bag of these:
http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/31818/A0951-ND/172790then use a Channel Lock #909 to make the crimps.
Then heatshrink tubing over all of it. Digikey also has heatshrink for MUCH cheaper than any parts store.
Edit: I would dab each wire in dielectric grease before putting them in the butt connector.
Posted By: RapidRobert
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/04/13 09:32 PM
Either twisting the wires together real tight & soldering or crimping the wires into each end of a bare metal butt connector then soldering then a wrap of tape over it then slide the shrink tube back over the joint & heat it to shrink it & since your soldering there's no need to use/waste a butt connector
Posted By: mickm
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/04/13 10:07 PM
i expose about 3/8" of wire on each side. slip a piece of shrink tubing over one end that will cover the exposed space of the splice. it should be a size that will shrink tightly around the exposed wire. i then slip a piece of shrink tubing on the other end that will cover the whole thing with some space on either end.
i then push the ends together, and with my fingers or pliers crimp down any strands so they merge together as best as possible, and are as round as possible. i then solder the connection.
then slip the smaller tubing over the exposed wire and heat it. that should bring the thickness close to what the wire is with it's insulation.
i then slide the bigger piece over and shrink it. this makes for a cleaner looking splice, as with only one piece of tubing it dips in where the insulation is missing where the actual splice took place.
a few more minutes of work, but makes for a nice splice.
Posted By: 67Satty
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/04/13 10:15 PM
1. Put your shrink wrap over one of the wires to be spliced.
2. Bend each wire into a J hook shape.
3. Hook wires together, then twist/wrap excess ends around itself.
4. Try pulling apart the two wires, if you hooked it right, they won't budge much and not enough to break the electrical connection, unlike if you just twisted strands together which could be pulled all the way apart easily.
5. Now do your soldering, then slip shrinkwrap over and heat that.
Step 3 is the most important.
Posted By: OzHemi
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/04/13 10:24 PM
Quote:
I got a good sized bag of these:
http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/31818/A0951-ND/172790
then use a Channel Lock #909 to make the crimps.
Then heatshrink tubing over all of it. Digikey also has heatshrink for MUCH cheaper than any parts store.
I use the same style connectors myself (they come in various sizes) when doing wiring looms on the various cars I've done. I do not solder any connections either...those with a proper crimp and heat shrink tubing.
I do try and not use those in general when ever possible though and just do a new run of wire (instead of joining a couple up) when it can't be done...those are my style of choice.
Same with various weatherpack or other style end connectors. A proper crimp is all.
Posted By: mickm
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/04/13 11:18 PM
Quote:
3. Hook wires together, then twist/wrap excess ends around itself.
Step 3 is the most important.
that makes sense. i'm going to start doing that...
Posted By: frank
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/05/13 02:47 AM
I use un-insulated tined butt connectors with heat shrink. I usually don't solder. Splice must be good; invest in a quality crimper. I use Klein. Electrical tape is fine but self fusing silicone tape (F4) is better. Always check to make sure you don't put power on without the connector being insulated; you risk a ground short and you could easily burn something up like I just did in my GTX.
Posted By: therocks
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/05/13 12:11 PM
Ive used all of the answers.I prefer to twist the wires together and solder,shrink wrap.My hands are bad now so I get my son to twist them together.He can get them so good there is basically no bulge and they are so tight you cant pull them apart.Proper soldering is the important thing.Rocky
Posted By: jcc
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/05/13 01:20 PM
Quote:
Ive used all of the answers.I prefer to twist the wires together and solder,shrink wrap.My hands are bad now so I get my son to twist them together.He can get them so good there is basically no bulge and they are so tight you cant pull them apart.Proper soldering is the important thing.Rocky
I do not agree with the j hook style connection. I ideally want little or no increase in wire cross section. If soldered correctly, the mechanical aspect of the connection adds almost nothing. The problem with an oversized mechanical connection, is the abrupt added stiffness, added to by soldering, which makes the connection a prime location a vibration/flexing induced stress fracture. Additionally, any connection that needs heat shrink, should have 2 layers, both different colors to visibly indicate future abrasion, and 2 different lengths of HS to spread out any added wire stiffness from HS, based on my first point. 
Posted By: Cab_Burge
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/05/13 06:30 PM
Twist, solder, cover and make sure to secure the wires so they don't vibrate or hang loose
Posted By: Hrtbkr
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/05/13 06:42 PM
The "J", hook, and twist method is called the Western Union splice. It's a recommended method in the aircraft industry. The step everyone omits is a cleaning after the solder connection (you can use iso alcohol or a blast of brake clean will do). This removes the corrosive flux that was in the core of the solder.
Posted By: mopowers
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/05/13 06:50 PM
Well, I was able to solder some of the connections. But there are two more that are deep under the dash. I tried soldering them, but it wasn't happening. So, I'm just going to use uninsulated butt splice connectors, some dielectric grease, a wrap of electrical tape, and some heat shrink. Hopefully that'll work.
Thanks for all the input guys.
Posted By: jcc
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/05/13 08:04 PM
Quote:
The "J", hook, and twist method is called the Western Union splice.
I didn't know that.
How fast did western Union run? 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Union_splice
This source says developed for mainly wires under stress/tension (western union telegraph?), solid rather stranded, originally was not intended to be soldered, only notes testing on 22 and 16g, and makes no note of vibration induced failures.
Posted By: RapidRobert
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/05/13 08:20 PM
Quote:
The step everyone omits is a cleaning after the solder connection
I'm gonna start doing that
Posted By: RobX4406
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/05/13 08:24 PM
I strip both wires equilength, meeting in the middle,form an X, and twist them back on each other.
Solder and couple heat shrink wraps.
Posted By: jamesc
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/05/13 08:27 PM
for heat shrink use what's referred to a "dual wall", it has a thin coat of sealant inside it that seals the connection better than standard heat shrink 2¢
Posted By: mopowers
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/05/13 08:43 PM
Believe me, I would definitely solder them if I could. It's just really tight under the dash, not to mention I don't the steadiest hands. I'm hoping a good crimp will be good enough. At least I was able to get good solder joints on all of the wires inside the engine bay. (not sure if I mentioned it, but this is all for the bulkhead/alternator bypass like the MADD article.
Posted By: RapidRobert
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/05/13 09:07 PM
Quote:
not sure if I mentioned it, but this is all for the bulkhead/alternator bypass like the MADD article.
that's a critical joint, are you sure you cant get up under there with a pencil soldering iron?
Posted By: mopowers
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/05/13 09:33 PM
Which is critical? For the charging circuit, I ran a 10g wire directly from the alternator to the starter relay. Then I ran a red and black 10g wire directly to the dash bypassing the bulkhead connector. I was able to get a really good soldered splice connecting the two wires from the back of the ammeter. The two connections I'm having problems with are the ones circled in yellow.
Posted By: RapidRobert
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/05/13 11:30 PM
alright I missed that your ran the alt directly to the starter relay. I was thinking that you just (only) did Nacho's bulkhead bypass so yes what you have circled is less critical than it would have been but I'd sure try to move the loom down so I could solder it & if not make the crimps TIGHT
Posted By: mopowers
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/06/13 12:14 AM
Quote:
alright I missed that your ran the alt directly to the starter relay. I was thinking that you just (only) did Nacho's bulkhead bypass so yes what you have circled is less critical than it would have been but I'd sure try to move the loom down so I could solder it & if not make the crimps TIGHT
Instead of splicing them with butt connectors, would it be better to just install male and female connectors and use the bulkhead connector to join them?? Or is the butt connector a better joint???
Thanks for all you help. Electrical work is kinda foreign to me. So, I really appreciate your input.
Posted By: RapidRobert
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/06/13 01:35 AM
I think it'd be pretty close especially with some new fresh brass terminals crimped/soldered; NAPA 725145 female and 725147 male and in addition with them crimped the right amount so they fit together TO EACH OTHER tight along with some dielectric grease & they would give you ease of dissassembly if ever needed but I'd still prefer a good soldered joint either 2 wires together or both wires crimped/soldered to each end of a butt connector
Posted By: 63stabamatic
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/08/13 12:45 PM
I have seen too many crimp butt connectors fail due to corrosion in outside radio installations. I either solder the butts or just twist the wires together, solder and shrink wrap. The "J" hook has a very small surface area of connection so never use that. Believe it or not wire nuts work great if it's out of sight. FWIW on outside connections like tail-lights etc. we have used for years Scotch 23, self vulcanizing tape, covered with Scotch 33. Ultraviolet light attacks the Scotch 23. Works great on communications antennas on towers or underground.
Posted By: mopowers
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/08/13 04:31 PM
Since I couldn't get comfortable under the dash with my soldering iron, I just used un-insulated butt connectors with some di-electric grease and a good crimper. Then I gave them a wrap of electrical tape followed up by some heat shrink. Since it's up under the dash, I think the should fine. If they fail, the fusible link should it's job.
Posted By: jcc
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/08/13 04:34 PM
Yes you should be fine but the fusible link comment opens another can of worms goggle it read about the downsides
Posted By: mopowers
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/08/13 04:45 PM
Quote:
Yes you should be fine but the fusible link comment opens another can of worms goggle it read about the downsides
Yeah, I know they aren't the most popular things in the world, but it's what I had laying around. Would I be better off installing inline fuses? If so, what amp rating would I need. I basically wired the ammeter bypass just as the MAD article suggested.
Posted By: bboogieart
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/08/13 05:56 PM
Didn't the factory just use crimped connections? The only soldered connectin I know of is in the main harness under the hood.
This is all I've ever used, and have had no issues. Just need to weather-proof anything exposed to the elements.
Posted By: bronco9588
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/09/13 02:19 PM
Just an FYI, dielectric grease does NOT conduct electricity, nor should you ever use a grease that conducts electricity in an automotive application. I would recommend that you look into using flux instead of dialectic grease for your connections. I am sure the dialectic may perform like a flux but a flux is more in line with what you are doing.
Posted By: RapidRobert
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/09/13 02:38 PM
do you mean an additional special flux for the solder during the soldering process or something special to put on the soldered connection when you're done soldering before you tape/shrink wrap it or do you mean a special flux to put on the brass terminals' interface before you push em together
Posted By: mopowers
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/09/13 02:39 PM
Quote:
Just an FYI, dielectric grease does NOT conduct electricity, nor should you ever use a grease that conducts electricity in an automotive application. I would recommend that you look into using flux instead of dialectic grease for your connections. I am sure the dialectic may perform like a flux but a flux is more in line with what you are doing.
It does help prevent corrosion though, right? That's the reason I use it. I only use flux when I solder. Is this completely wrong? It's just how I was taught.
Posted By: denfireguy
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/09/13 02:45 PM
Quote:
What's the best way to splice two wires together?? Do you guys prefer to use bare butt splice connectors, then solder them, and insulate with a wrap of electrical tape and some heat shrink?
Or is it better to just twist the stripped wires together and solder them WITHOUT using a butt splice connector, and give them a wrap of tape and some heat shrink???
My rule of thumb is to never splice anything larger than 14 gauge. If it is 12 gauge or larger, I rewire from end to end. For stuff 14 to 18 I solder and wrap. Smaller than that, butt splice, solder, whatever is handy.
I came up in the two way radio world. Two things you never ever spliced: The A lead to the battery (usually 8 to 10 gauge) and coax cable.
Craig
Posted By: bronco9588
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/09/13 03:51 PM
Dielectric grease is great for connections that don't have solder (i.e. a pin to pin connection that is just metal to metal.) From what it sounded like, you were planning on greasing up a pair of wires and then soldering. The purpose of flux is to prevent oxidization of the wires while they are heated yet not covered by solder yet. Corrosion increases at hot temperatures and will prevent good flow of solder. I like what the avionics guy mentioned about cleaning the connection. Properly heat shrinking a (clean) connection prevents future water and atmosphere exposure. The junction should not corrode any longer; application of dialectic grease is unnecessary at a soldered junction.
On an aside, but related to the conversation, I solidly prescribe to the butt connection, solder, and shrink wrap methodology. Defiantly get the klein 1005 tool. From my understanding in aviation, they rarely if ever solder a connection for fatigue purposes. With that being said, they are using several hundred dollar crimping tools that can get the perfect pressure. I would rather suffer from fatigue (inside of heat wrap) several thousands of miles down the road than suffer from an improper crimp parting 2 miles down the road. A really good crimp should have a pull test and then a soldering.
As far as a soldered joint heating up causing the solder to melt... the wire insulation would melt before the solder would ever melt. If a junction/ terminal is doing this, it was improperly designed or created (with or without solder). I am not buying what is being sold. Whilst I am not a wire engineer, I think you will find that the solder decreases the locations resistance as current carrying material fills in all the voids. It will also increase the tensile strength of the junction.
Fatigue issues can be mitigated by proper support of the wire...
If for any reason you want to discuss these concepts, I would talk to Mark at MAD Electrical. The guy can talk your ear off about the smallest details.
Posted By: mopowers
Re: Splicing Wires??? - 04/09/13 04:12 PM
Quote:
Dielectric grease is great for connections that don't have solder (i.e. a pin to pin connection that is just metal to metal.) From what it sounded like, you were planning on greasing up a pair of wires and then soldering. The purpose of flux is to prevent oxidization of the wires while they are heated yet not covered by solder yet. Corrosion increases at hot temperatures and will prevent good flow of solder. I like what the avionics guy mentioned about cleaning the connection. Properly heat shrinking a (clean) connection prevents future water and atmosphere exposure. The junction should not corrode any longer; application of dialectic grease is unnecessary at a soldered junction.
On an aside, but related to the conversation, I solidly prescribe to the butt connection, solder, and shrink wrap methodology. Defiantly get the klein 1005 tool. From my understanding in aviation, they rarely if ever solder a connection for fatigue purposes. With that being said, they are using several hundred dollar crimping tools that can get the perfect pressure. I would rather suffer from fatigue (inside of heat wrap) several thousands of miles down the road than suffer from an improper crimp parting 2 miles down the road. A really good crimp should have a pull test and then a soldering.
As far as a soldered joint heating up causing the solder to melt... the wire insulation would melt before the solder would ever melt. If a junction/ terminal is doing this, it was improperly designed or created (with or without solder). I am not buying what is being sold. Whilst I am not a wire engineer, I think you will find that the solder decreases the locations resistance as current carrying material fills in all the voids. It will also increase the tensile strength of the junction.
Fatigue issues can be mitigated by proper support of the wire...
If for any reason you want to discuss these concepts, I would talk to Mark at MAD Electrical. The guy can talk your ear off about the smallest details.
I was able to solder all of the connections except for the 2 under the dash. For those, I just crimped, put a wrap of electrical tape and dielectric grease on it, then heat shrink. I think I'll be fine. Thanks for the input though.