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Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger...
Posted By: Pale_Roader
Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/21/12 03:38 PM
Part 2 ov my welfare warrior quest. Headers.
70 Challenger, stock 67 383, 4-speed, NO power options at all. Stock suspension. Will be using a Lakewood skattershield and block saver though.
I have a barely used set o Hedman shorties for a big block B/E car. How bad are they performance-wise over the usual long-tubes (Hooker Comps lets say)? Closer to HP manifolds in performance? closer to longtubes? The exhaust behind them will not be a limiting factor... at all.
Any issues with installation in my combo? I cannot think ov an easier E-body big block install than mine...
How about changing spark plugs? They've GOT to be better than Hooker Comps...
Posted By: njdevil2
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/21/12 03:59 PM
I was thinking of doing this on my roadrunner. I don't need the hassle of long tubes. I beileve the loss over long tube is 4-8% hp. I'm not sure of torque. You definitly need the mini-starter. I'm not clear if there is a problem with power steering, which I have.
Any one else have more info on this?
Posted By: Pale_Roader
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/23/12 01:15 AM
Soooo.... not a popular item then...???
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/23/12 01:43 AM
Hedman 78030.
Fit great, cheap ($159.00 through summit), and virtually drop in.
Posted By: WO23Coronet
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/23/12 04:00 AM
Dulcich did a test on these exact headers, HP manifolds vs Hedman shorties vs long tubes. As expected the shorties fell in between the manifolds and long tubes. Do a search on the Mopar Muscle site, it's a good read
Posted By: bobs66440
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/23/12 04:12 AM
I have them on mine. Love them and they still look great. And, I installed the engine with them mounted! Lots of clearance and great access to the plugs too
As far as performance goes, they seem to be great, though I haven't done a side by side comparison with long tubes or manifolds. I did read the comparison mentioned a while back and they fell right in between, maybe a little closer to the long tubes than the manifolds.
They clear the PS box, but just barely. I dimpled the driver's side one where it was close just in case.
The ease of installation and access to the plugs are infinitely better than manifolds and especially long tube headers of course. Whatever you may lose over the long tubes, I don't think would be very noticeable on a street car and the convenience benefits definitely outweigh any loss in my opinion. I will definitely use them again...
Posted By: bordin34
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/23/12 04:26 AM
I see your tube is dented where the power steering box is. How much did you have to dent it?
Posted By: bobs66440
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/23/12 04:48 AM
Quote:
I see your tube is dented where the power steering box is. How much did you have to dent it?
It wasn't actually hitting the PS box, but it was really close. I just dimpled it in two places where it was close just in case. I heated it with a torch and pushed it in a little , maybe 1/8".
Posted By: bordin34
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/23/12 04:52 AM
Thanks. I have a set I am planning on putting on my 440 Power Steering Charger tomorrow. I got tired of the full length headers getting in the way of everything.
Posted By: WO23Coronet
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/23/12 04:57 AM
Posted By: Pale_Roader
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/23/12 04:06 PM
Cool. I either have that magazine and its lost in the stack, or i have an older one that did the same test with the shorties, manifolds and longtubes. I wasn't sure anyone else remembered. I should know better on this site. Haha
The shorties did better than i remembered. They give up quite a bit in the TQ dept, but i think the difference would be less on a mild 383 than a stout 440. The smaller primaries are better suited (though i'd still like 1 7/8") to a 383.
I wonder if the collector treatment is cause for much ov that loss? Looking closely at my set i've never liked how the collectors looked. They scream flow-impediment. Depending on how much room i have i was contemplating modifying them with a full size collector so all the primaries dont just jam into a tiny mass in front ov the 2 1/2" hole.
Posted By: 2boltmain
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/23/12 04:10 PM
Kudos to Hedman for making another option for mopar! The magazine dyno test was done on a pretty hot 440- 500hp plus. (mild by some peoples definition but even an old school HP 440, 509 cam, Torker intake, DP Holley ect did not make 500hp) On a milder 440 than the one tested the shorties will not have such a handicap to the long tubes. I say fit the shorties- ding where need then remove and have ceramic coated. I had a four into two GS1000 Suzuki exhaust system ceramic coated in satin black for $150. Place is only 25 miles from me to boot.
Posted By: Pale_Roader
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/24/12 02:25 PM
Hmmm... more and more these look like a great temp solution until i can afford real headers. I might just modify those collectors though... why not?
Posted By: bordin34
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/24/12 05:38 PM
I put the shortys on my 73 440 with power steering.
I had to dent the first tube on the drivers side a decent amount. I also needed a small ding on the last tube on the drivers side.
The passenger side needed nothing.
Posted By: 1_WILD_RT
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/24/12 07:18 PM
The one thing I try to point out is while they give up a little performance wise to long tubes the first time you bottom out those long tubes what ever advantage they had is no gone... If you like a car that sits up a foot off the ground no problem but I like my cars a little lower than stock....
Posted By: bobs66440
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/24/12 07:40 PM
Quote:
I put the shortys on my 73 440 with power steering.
I had to dent the first tube on the drivers side a decent amount. I also needed a small ding on the last tube on the drivers side.
The passenger side needed nothing.
Right. Same for me. First and last tube. You will like them though! especially when you have to work around them.
Posted By: Pyper70
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/24/12 09:51 PM
I like the color of mine...I hope I find some extra cash soon...I have had these Hedman's coated for 4 years now and I havent had the time to bolt them on. I used to have 2 1/8" Hookers on my 70 and I hated the tight clearances. I have the HP Manifolds right now and looking to pick up 10% more power with the swap.
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/24/12 10:30 PM
After reading this post and the Mopar Muscle article, I ordered a set of the shorties for my 59 413 Coronet. Power steering gearbox is further to the rear on it compared to later B and E bodies, so I think it will clear w/o any problem. Fingers are crossed.
Posted By: bordin34
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/25/12 02:49 AM
Spark plug access is nice with them. I can actually see where I am putting the plugs for once.
Posted By: Pale_Roader
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/25/12 02:10 PM
Quote:
Spark plug access is nice with them. I can actually see where I am putting the plugs for once.
That will be a nice bonus... My Charger had the wider 440, and Hooker Comps, and even with nothing else in the way (manual steering, no accessories) they were an absolute nightmare for plugs. Add to that the crop-duster 440's appetite for them...
Yeah... really dont miss that car.
Challenger, narrower 383, NO accessories at all, smaller headers, and hopefully (fingers crossed) the engine wont burn any oil. I'm already giddy...
Posted By: moparmarks
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/25/12 02:17 PM
Have them in my 72B which is the same motor bay as your E. I have a 440 so yours will sit in and down abit. Mine hit the P/S box just a little but should not hit your manual box. They don't capture the starter a like long tubes do.
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Posted By: moparmarks
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/25/12 02:18 PM
Nutter pic
Posted By: bordin34
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/25/12 09:28 PM
How did you guys get the dipstick tube to fit? Mine wants to go right where the header tubes are.
Posted By: Pale_Roader
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/26/12 02:38 AM
They bend.
Posted By: bobs66440
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/26/12 02:42 AM
Quote:
How did you guys get the dipstick tube to fit? Mine wants to go right where the header tubes are.
Hmmm. Mine fit without any modification. You can see it in my pics. you may be able to bend it as mentioned or get a different style...just make sure you keep the same length tube or the dipstick won't read correctly...
Posted By: Nukechargerboy
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/26/12 02:56 AM
I'd hafta check, but I sorta remeber changing the last 2 numbers to '38' gets the ceramic coating from the factory. I have them at my fathers house, I could check tomorrow if you want me to. 78038 gets the shiny ceramic coating, if memory serves me correctly.
Posted By: BEINGmeISaCRIME
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/26/12 03:25 AM
Quote:
I'd hafta check, but I sorta remeber changing the last 2 numbers to '38' gets the ceramic coating from the factory. I have them at my fathers house, I could check tomorrow if you want me to. 78038 gets the shiny ceramic coating, if memory serves me correctly.
78038 corresponds to Hedman Elite Longtube Headers
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/hed-78038
78076 is your ceramic shorty headers
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/hed-78076
Posted By: bordin34
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/26/12 04:10 AM
Quote:
They bend.
Im afraid of bending it too far and cracking it. I guess I'll keep going.
Posted By: Pale_Roader
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 11/26/12 12:44 PM
Quote:
I'd hafta check, but I sorta remeber changing the last 2 numbers to '38' gets the ceramic coating from the factory. I have them at my fathers house, I could check tomorrow if you want me to. 78038 gets the shiny ceramic coating, if memory serves me correctly.
I have the very trendy 'rat rod rusty' versions. As long as they flow as well...
Posted By: njdevil2
Re: Hedman B/RB shorty headers, 383 Challenger... - 02/21/13 03:25 AM
The shorties I found were Hedman 78070, from streetsideauto.com for $200.99. I got a discount code for 10% off and it's $190.99 delivered.
With all the part numbers bandied about, I want to be sure it's 78070 before I go all in. It says manual steering, but I see them fitting being dimpled and all that. If these are the ones, then the next call is to Eastwood for semi gloss black coating.