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318 rering or not????????????

Posted By: Duster75

318 rering or not???????????? - 12/23/11 05:47 PM

I'm currently building a plow truck. have a 85 318 tore down going to bearing it, cam and chain and put some rebuilt 360 heads on it.Question being would it be worth it to rering with lets say total seal rings ? motor had 90,000 on it when pulled.thanks,Nate
Posted By: radar

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/23/11 08:16 PM

Did you leave the pistons in? How are the bores? Taper? Finish? How's the piston to cyl clearance?
Posted By: Duster75

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/23/11 08:34 PM

pistons in yet.... don't have a bore scope,inside mic. to check.Finish is smooth with no cross hatch I checked in as far as my caliper would reach and it was 3.9 I want too say I would say that would be too close to top though.nate
Posted By: RapidRobert

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/23/11 09:20 PM

Buy a moly ring set. Carefully cut the ridge. break it in hard to seat the moly rings on the smooth finish, change oil/filter & put it in use. Read "breakin secrets" at www.mototuneusa.com
Posted By: Duster75

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/23/11 10:55 PM

carefully cut ridge????? I assume you mean hone? Interesting article thanks, Nate
Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/23/11 11:48 PM

Quote:

carefully cut ridge????? I assume you mean hone? Interesting article thanks, Nate



Is the block on a stand or in the truck... I would
change rings... hit it with a ball hone/deglazer,
gap the rings and install
Posted By: Duster75

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/24/11 12:14 AM

on the stand..... having a hard time finding rings for some reason
Posted By: 340SHORTY

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/24/11 12:21 AM

you may loose low end torque with the 360 hesds. They have a larger combustion chamber..
Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/24/11 12:29 AM

Did you check Summit
Posted By: sportfury70

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/24/11 12:40 AM

http://chucker54.stores.yahoo.net/sealpower1.html
Posted By: MoparforLife

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/24/11 12:52 AM

Quote:

carefully cut ridge????? I assume you mean hone? Interesting article thanks, Nate

No - cutting out the ridge requires a special ridge cutter tool.
Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/24/11 01:02 AM

Quote:

Quote:

carefully cut ridge????? I assume you mean hone? Interesting article thanks, Nate

No - cutting out the ridge requires a special ridge cutter tool.



Yep... if there is a ridge you need to rent a ridge
reamer
Posted By: RapidRobert

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/24/11 01:11 AM

With it on the stand yes get a ball hone of the right grit for moly rings (may be #320). Moly rings are much better than cast iron but sometimes a bore w a great amt of taper and or out of round will seal better with cast iron. Didn't realize it was out of the truck/stripped to bare block. Sure you dont want to go a slight bit further & bore it? That'd give you a 318 that'd last (nearly) forever & only cost a slight bit more esp since you're already apart
Posted By: DaytonaTurbo

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/24/11 01:25 AM

A worn bore and a backyard hone'n're-ring job, I would be using plain old cast rings, not moly. Moly coated rings seal better and break in quicker but they are not as forgiving on a worn bore as cast rings. Hastings cast rings are a good choice for these types of builds IMO.
Posted By: scratchnfotraction

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/24/11 01:47 AM

Quote:

A worn bore and a backyard hone'n're-ring job, I would be using plain old cast rings, not moly. Moly coated rings seal better and break in quicker but they are not as forgiving on a worn bore as cast rings. Hastings cast rings are a good choice for these types of builds IMO.



100%

most 85 318 with roller cam #302 heads had the moly rings stock.

they do well on bore wear and tappor,MY 300,00 mile 88 is still in specs for a rering with used pistons.

i will slap a set of stock cast rings in wafter a dingle ball hone job to clean them up some.

if its in specs its in specs for a re-ring

i may not get another 300,00 but another 150,000 will work for the price.

Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/24/11 02:00 AM

Quote:

Quote:

A worn bore and a backyard hone'n're-ring job, I would be using plain old cast rings, not moly. Moly coated rings seal better and break in quicker but they are not as forgiving on a worn bore as cast rings. Hastings cast rings are a good choice for these types of builds IMO.



100%

most 85 318 with roller cam #302 heads had the moly rings stock.

they do well on bore wear and tappor,MY 300,00 mile 88 is still in specs for a rering with used pistons.

i will slap a set of stock cast rings in wafter a dingle ball hone job to clean them up some.

if its in specs its in specs for a re-ring

i may not get another 300,00 but another 150,000 will work for the price.





Yeah with the nickle content that the blocks have had
for a number of years it isnt the block that wears
Posted By: DaytonaTurbo

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/24/11 03:01 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

A worn bore and a backyard hone'n're-ring job, I would be using plain old cast rings, not moly. Moly coated rings seal better and break in quicker but they are not as forgiving on a worn bore as cast rings. Hastings cast rings are a good choice for these types of builds IMO.



100%

most 85 318 with roller cam #302 heads had the moly rings stock.

they do well on bore wear and tappor,MY 300,00 mile 88 is still in specs for a rering with used pistons.

i will slap a set of stock cast rings in wafter a dingle ball hone job to clean them up some.

if its in specs its in specs for a re-ring

i may not get another 300,00 but another 150,000 will work for the price.





Yeah with the nickle content that the blocks have had
for a number of years it isnt the block that wears




Plus the blocks that came factory with the moly rings wear the bores a lot less than the regular cast rings did. However that's not to say than an engine that came with moly rings from the factory is guaranteed to still have bores that would meet the requirements for a new set of moly rings.
Posted By: patrick

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/24/11 02:18 PM

hone and put new rings in...

when I did my 318, the local carquest charged $8/bore to toss it on their machine and hone it.
Posted By: Duster75

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/24/11 04:22 PM

Well,thanks for replies.I don't want to bore it cause I know where that will lead.....if your going that far you might as well line bore and turn crank etc. its just a 318 for a plow truck using up some parts to make a better than junkyard engine.Mancini has rings they didn't have cam I wanted so Jegs got my business, but they didn't have rings...so northen will be sending out rings. Guess I will go with cast. Will break in be the same with cast? Wish I had a local machine shop that would hone for me. Newbe to the hone ridge cuttting world. Thanks,Nate
Posted By: Duster75

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/24/11 04:28 PM

Quote:

Quote:

A worn bore and a backyard hone'n're-ring job, I would be using plain old cast rings, not moly. Moly coated rings seal better and break in quicker but they are not as forgiving on a worn bore as cast rings. Hastings cast rings are a good choice for these types of builds IMO.



100%

most 85 318 with roller cam #302 heads had the moly rings stock.

they do well on bore wear and tappor,MY 300,00 mile 88 is still in specs for a rering with used pistons.

i will slap a set of stock cast rings in wafter a dingle ball hone job to clean them up some.

if its in specs its in specs for a re-ring

i may not get another 300,00 but another 150,000 will work for the price.





No roller cam in this 85 block
Posted By: scratchnfotraction

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/24/11 04:45 PM

you will have that also.

my 85 318 from my 85 stepside had a slider cam/roller block with the #302 heads,molly rings.

my plymouth gran fury cop engine had a slider cam/roller block with 360 heads and q-jet.

is it a roller block?

if so would you like to go roller cam?

i use a lunati VooDoo roller cam with comp 901-16 springs in the 88-360 headed 318 in my 85 truck,runs strong and a great daily driver.

well I did just pull it out for a tear down and swaped the roller cam/springs over to a 91-318 with the #302 heads for the stepside now..

IMHO,roller cam is the way to go with the cam break in mojo not needed,the stock roller/valve gears works fine. mine had over 300,000 miles on it,not bad for stock valve gear.



Attached picture 6982392-smallblockengine.jpg
Posted By: Duster75

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/24/11 05:06 PM

Already committed on cam (ordered) purpleshaft R.V. 260/268 430/450 as far as it being a roller block have not seen one to be able to tell. I just know cam is not.300,000 now thats something!! Nate
Posted By: dogdays

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/24/11 05:53 PM

A roller block has threaded bosses in the middle of the valley for attaching the roller link holddown spider.

A ridge is at the top end of the cylinder. Run your fingernail up the bore and when you feel it catch really close to the top that is the ridge. On my '86 318 the ridge is minimal and mostly varnish. You need to get the ridge out so you won't break your rings when you slip the pistons into the block. I think mine are going to clean up with thinner and some hard rubbing. If your block has a ridge it is removed with a device called a ridge reamer. BEWARE!!! It is quite easy to take out more than necessary. the bottom of the ridge is the top of ring travel. If you cut into the ring travel area you'll be needing new pistons and an overbore. So you have to go really easy.

One thing you said...Line-honing on a relatively stock 318 build? Did the crank turn OK? Were the mains in pretty good shape? This is not a common step for a nearly stock rebuild. Others chime in here, but it just isn't something I expect to see.


I buy most of my 318 rings on the 'bay. Name brand stuff, better than retail prices.

R.
Posted By: Duster75

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/24/11 06:12 PM

I'll have to check block out as far as roller or not.crank is still in bearings I checked were o.k just saying I don't want this to snowball into a $1000 rebuild.was planning on changing bottom end 1 at a time not totally dismantaling the engine if you follow me.there is a small ridge nothing alittle scotch brite won't clean up I think. thanks,nate
Posted By: RapidRobert

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/24/11 06:44 PM

I would suggest a light cutting with a rented ridge reamer. Put a box end wrench on the center and pull the cutter around so the blade is always trailing your wrench. Use WD40. Do not remove all of the ridge as it does not cut concentric and if you remove all then it will be too far in some areas. Trick is PATIENCE and moving your body around the block multiple times so you are always direct line pulling the cutter toward you. push down on the center to hold the cutter flush to the top deck. Stop/check many times.
Posted By: patrick

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/25/11 06:28 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

A worn bore and a backyard hone'n're-ring job, I would be using plain old cast rings, not moly. Moly coated rings seal better and break in quicker but they are not as forgiving on a worn bore as cast rings. Hastings cast rings are a good choice for these types of builds IMO.



100%

most 85 318 with roller cam #302 heads had the moly rings stock.

they do well on bore wear and tappor,MY 300,00 mile 88 is still in specs for a rering with used pistons.

i will slap a set of stock cast rings in wafter a dingle ball hone job to clean them up some.

if its in specs its in specs for a re-ring

i may not get another 300,00 but another 150,000 will work for the price.





No roller cam in this 85 block



'85 up M body 2bbls are roller cam. 4bbl flat tappet, trucks flat tappet (but roller block) from '85-88
Posted By: Duster75

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/26/11 06:03 PM

Thats what mine is....85 truck engine and if roller motor means the 3 threaded bosses above cam thats what I have.Nate
Posted By: scratchnfotraction

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/26/11 06:52 PM

thats the way my 85 truck engine was and the 88-360 headed 4-v cop engine.

i used a lunati voodoo roller cam with stock 91 318 roller gear..

roller lifters
dogbones
spider
pushrods
rockers

and poped on a set of comp 901-16 springs

just swaped it all over to another 91 318 JY engine and running fine in the 85 stepside.

no break in is the big plus on all my junk
Posted By: DaytonaTurbo

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/27/11 04:53 AM

I've done a few re-ring jobs and never used a ridge reamer. I took the old pistons out the top, honed the entire cylinder with my drill mounted hone/deglazer, cleaned and oiled the cylinders and put it back together.
Posted By: Duster75

Re: 318 rering or not???????????? - 12/27/11 03:27 PM

That is my plan also....I went forward and used some paitence and some 120 emory cloth and removed ridge. Could have bought a ridge reamer for $60 but it was so minim. that emory took care of it.Now with cast rings hone with 120 right? thanks, Nate
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