Considering an O2 sensor
#2567442
10/21/18 07:49 PM
10/21/18 07:49 PM
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Considering an O2 sensor and I don't think I just want a gauge to look at. I think I'd rather have something that I can use with a TPS so I can look at and graph throttle opening against A/F ratio.
Is there something out there? I thought Innovate had something but I don't see it any more. Or am I better off looking at something an RPM on board data logger?
Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
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Re: Considering an O2 sensor
[Re: JAMESDART]
#2567578
10/22/18 12:20 AM
10/22/18 12:20 AM
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The innovative lm2 has rpm and I think some other inputs that can be logged. I got one brand new on eBay pretty cheap.
The sniper sounds cool I just wish it didn’t look like a Fitech. The 4500 stealth sniper isn’t all corny looking. Any reason I can find the LM2 for sale online, but I can't find it on the Innovate web site?
Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
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Re: Considering an O2 sensor
[Re: AndyF]
#2567580
10/22/18 12:21 AM
10/22/18 12:21 AM
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By the time you buy that stuff you'll be half way to the price of a Sniper kit. The Sniper kit comes with an O2 sensor as well as full data logging. Plus you'll be able to control your ignition system...... Thanks Andy but I can't tell you how disinterested in any type of FI I am. It just doesn't impress me, or interest me, or excite me.
Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
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Re: Considering an O2 sensor
[Re: madscientist]
#2567642
10/22/18 02:14 AM
10/22/18 02:14 AM
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State of confusion
Thumperdart
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By the time you buy that stuff you'll be half way to the price of a Sniper kit. The Sniper kit comes with an O2 sensor as well as full data logging. Plus you'll be able to control your ignition system...... Thanks Andy but I can't tell you how disinterested in any type of FI I am. It just doesn't impress me, or interest me, or excite me. You're not alone here about EFI  and I bought a single Innovate years ago but I HEARD the FAST unit is great for the money and does what you need for down loading etc......Too funny, most of the time when someone asks a carb question some come on here like "just go efi" gotta love it......... 
Last edited by Thumperdart; 10/22/18 02:15 AM.
72 Dart 470 n/a BB stroker street car `THUMPER`...Check me out on FB Dominic Thumper for videos and lots of carb pics......760-900-3895.....
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Re: Considering an O2 sensor
[Re: Thumperdart]
#2567647
10/22/18 02:22 AM
10/22/18 02:22 AM
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By the time you buy that stuff you'll be half way to the price of a Sniper kit. The Sniper kit comes with an O2 sensor as well as full data logging. Plus you'll be able to control your ignition system...... Thanks Andy but I can't tell you how disinterested in any type of FI I am. It just doesn't impress me, or interest me, or excite me. You're not alone here about EFI and I bought a single Innovate years ago but I HEARD the FAST unit is great for the money and does what you need for down loading etc......Too funny, most of the time when someone asks a carb question some come on here like "just go efi" gotta love it......... I spent more than enough time screwing with MFI so I know if anything add wiring to it, I'm going to hate it. I even thought I'd never consider an O2 sensor because I just don't want the wring and crap that goes with it, but I suspect that since I'm a data freak I'd probably enjoy using it, along with continuing to read plugs.
Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
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Re: Considering an O2 sensor
[Re: JAMESDART]
#2567648
10/22/18 02:23 AM
10/22/18 02:23 AM
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It's right on the products page This proves why I'm not a big fan of technology. I've been to the web site four times and I STILL can't find it. Can you do an old man a favor and post a link? Thanks in advance.
Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
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Re: Considering an O2 sensor
[Re: madscientist]
#2567760
10/22/18 12:00 PM
10/22/18 12:00 PM
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Thanks for the link. I'm going to go back on the web to the innovate site and see if I can find it. Just to see if I can find it.
Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
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Re: Considering an O2 sensor
[Re: madscientist]
#2567766
10/22/18 12:06 PM
10/22/18 12:06 PM
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Tulsa OK
Bad340fish
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Just my opinion but I don't know that logging the TPS position will give you much good info. Logging a map sensor to monitor manifold vacuum will give you more usable data in my opinion and I do not know if the LM2 can do that or not?
That being said I might have an Innovate TPS sensor setup for a holley carb. If I do you can have it, i bought it and never used it before I went EFI. If you are interested let me know and I will see if I still have it.
68 Barracuda Formula S 340
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Re: Considering an O2 sensor
[Re: Bad340fish]
#2567837
10/22/18 02:44 PM
10/22/18 02:44 PM
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Just my opinion but I don't know that logging the TPS position will give you much good info. Logging a map sensor to monitor manifold vacuum will give you more usable data in my opinion and I do not know if the LM2 can do that or not?
That being said I might have an Innovate TPS sensor setup for a holley carb. If I do you can have it, i bought it and never used it before I went EFI. If you are interested let me know and I will see if I still have it. So we don't clog the thread, would you mind sending me a PM and explaining why you don't think logging with a TPS is worth the effort? I'm going off memory from probably 3, maybe 4 years ago when a friend (doesn't post here) told me to do it. I don't remember if I'm leaving out some other things he told me to do. OTOH, it might be interesting to others to read your thoughts on the topic. Either way, I'd appreciate your thoughts. Thanks
Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
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Re: Considering an O2 sensor
[Re: madscientist]
#2567844
10/22/18 03:04 PM
10/22/18 03:04 PM
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Bad340fish
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This is just my opinion, I am no pro tuner. The manifold vacuum is what talks to the carb more or less and gives a better indication of engine load. With any kind of decent horsepower you are either at very little throttle driving around on the street, or you are wide open.
My car has EFI and it runs "speed density" so it only uses the TPS for accel enrichment. It uses manifold vacuum for an engine load reference and bases fueling off of that.
I bought the TPS setup for a carb when my EFI controller was running the ignition only and not the fuel. I didn't put it on right away and after reading some data logs from the track and street I realized I wouldn't gather much from it.
68 Barracuda Formula S 340
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Re: Considering an O2 sensor
[Re: AndyF]
#2567870
10/22/18 04:07 PM
10/22/18 04:07 PM
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GTX MATT
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Anyone younger than 30 doesn't even know what a carb looks like...... FALSE - I'm under 30, I have a carb, and tune EFI Madscientist, I'm not trying to convince you or say you're wrong. But you're a data freak and you don't want EFI? EFI will give you tons of data! I think YOU would like tuning EFI. I think most people who have really tuned a carb and distributor would like it. I agree that alot of technology is junk, and over complicates stuff that's just not necessary. But EFI nowadays is pretty straight forward. Once you calibrate it (and I would do it manually, not the self learn that Holley's systems have) if you target 12.2:1 you will hit it, if you target 12.8:1 you will hit it, within a few percent. And you can have a digital timing curve! That said, I understand if you don't want EFI on your 50 year old car. I don't have it on mine, but have considered it. Honestly I will probably go EFI before I buy another carb for my car, but not ready to make the switch yet. The digital timing curve is actually a bigger deal to me than the Fuel Injection. To answer your original question, if you get a TPS that outputs a 5V serial signal you should be able to log it with a laptop with a WB02 (I like AEM but many people also like Innovate). You just have to figure out how to convert those serial output signals, and read them on your laptop. But what about RPM?
Last edited by GTX MATT; 10/22/18 04:17 PM.
Now I need to pin those needles, got to feel that heat
Hear my motor screamin while I'm tearin up the street
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Re: Considering an O2 sensor
[Re: GTX MATT]
#2567872
10/22/18 04:23 PM
10/22/18 04:23 PM
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Anyone younger than 30 doesn't even know what a carb looks like...... FALSE - I'm under 30, I have a carb, and tune EFI Madscientist, I'm not trying to convince you or say you're wrong. But you're a data freak and you don't want EFI? EFI will give you tons of data! I think YOU would like tuning EFI. I think most people who have really tuned a carb and distributor would like it. I agree that alot of technology is junk, and over complicates stuff that's just not necessary. But EFI nowadays is pretty straight forward. Once you calibrate it (and I would do it manually, not the self learn that Holley's systems have) if you target 12.2:1 you will hit it, if you target 12.8:1 you will hit it, within a few percent. And you can have a digital timing curve! That said, I understand if you don't want EFI on your 50 year old car. I don't have it on mine, but have considered it. Honestly I will probably go EFI before I buy another carb for my car, but not ready to make the switch yet. The digital timing curve is actually a bigger deal to me than the Fuel Injection. To answer your original question, if you get a TPS that outputs a 5V serial signal you should be able to log it with a laptop with a WB02 (I like AEM but many people also like Innovate). You just have to figure out how to convert those serial output signals, and read them on your laptop. But what about RPM? Thanks for the replies guys. I'm asking because when I start adding up the LM2 (just the single) I'm close to what I think I can buy a data logger for. And the I can measure RPM and drive shaft speed and use it to tune my clutch. Since this is just my street car, I'm not wanting to make it too much like a race car, or I will hate it and sell it. Seems like there is a tipping point where I go berserk and what should be a simple deal it becomes a whole 'nother deal where the car becomes too much like a race car. I sold the race car because I was tired of going to the track and all the other associated crap I didn't like dealing with. I don't want my street car to become that. So I'm shy when I comes to adding stuff to the car. It's like being a heroin junky. Once you start down the slippery slope...
Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
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Re: Considering an O2 sensor
[Re: madscientist]
#2567883
10/22/18 04:39 PM
10/22/18 04:39 PM
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ZIPPY
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I take the f.a.s.t. display box and stick it to the windshield or wherever, using a suction cup/smart phone holder from ebay. That way it only takes a second to pop off when I get tired of looking at it. I think it will log like a 15 or 30 minutes or something like that and it plays back right on the same screen, which is a feature I wanted because I'm not ready to drag a laptop around with me everywhere I go just yet. The display is a little obnoxiously bright at night, but perfect during the day. It could easily be stuck on another surface where you don't have to stare at it. I can't remember if it will read a TPS... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=buNPjVzYTxI&t=3s
Rich H.
Esse Quam Videri
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Re: Considering an O2 sensor
[Re: JAMESDART]
#2567990
10/22/18 08:15 PM
10/22/18 08:15 PM
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I also installed an Innovate unit in my car. I don’t data log or anything and only have used it for getting a heavy drinking Holley 950 to a substantially leaner fuel curve. There’s no way I could have tuned the carb to where it’s at now without the O2 sensor. I still want to go EFI eventually, but it’s good enough for what it is and it has decent mph at the track. The bad things I’ve heard from some who’ve converted to EFI is that their cars slowed down and they ended up switching back to carb. I’ve spent a lot of time tuning the Holley and if I threw EFI on and got it all tuned correctly and it was slower than my carb, I’d be ticked! But I’d bet the idle and mid range would be better. New systems are constantly being released so I’m gonna hang back and see how much better they get in a year or two maybe.
'69 Dart 417 pump gas with 200-4R 10.49@128
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