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Mild 470 street / strip motor on the dyno #2392408
10/24/17 04:31 PM
10/24/17 04:31 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,675
Mt. Eden Ky.
Hemi Allstate Offline OP
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Hemi Allstate  Offline OP
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I built this engine years ago to put in my mother's 68 road runner in place of the original 383. It has been on the stand for a long time as garage art. LOL
It has now been 10 years and I wanted to see what it makes for HP and torque. So, it went on the dyno yesterday.
The rotating assy is 440 Source, Ross pistons, the block zero decked, Edelbrock RPM heads were checked out and had some minor bowl work. Rockers are Comp Pro Magnums, Edelbrock Performer RPM intake, gasket matched . The Comp Cam XE282 S solid FT, Smith Bros. push rods.
The cam was from Dwayne Porter and specked for the 3.23 gear and original RR torque converter.
I chose a Quick fuel 780 SS carb with vac. secondaries .
I also took with me my Race Demon RS 1050 carb to test.
I calculated 10.73 -1 compression and ran the test on pump gas.
I really wasn't sure what to expect for output, and I think it did pretty well.
What would be decent HP and torque numbers for this mild build ?
I will post the results later.
Thanks,
Mark

HPIM4650.JPG

http://marsh-racing.com/Mark%20Mahorney-Allstate.htm
1996 Ram 1500 Sport
1968 road runner
1952 Sears Allstate licensed, pump gas, Hemi 5.98 @ 115.73 1.33 60 ft. The best is yet to come. Painless Performance / Street RODDER magazine Top 100 for 2019
Re: Mild 470 street / strip motor on the dyno [Re: Hemi Allstate] #2392411
10/24/17 04:45 PM
10/24/17 04:45 PM
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Posts: 2,094
central texas
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krautrock Offline
top fuel
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just a wild guess here since I'm posting to say, I'm glad to see this here because I want a build a very similar motor. thanks for posting.

538hp @ 6200
568tq @ 4800

Re: Mild 470 street / strip motor on the dyno [Re: Hemi Allstate] #2392413
10/24/17 04:47 PM
10/24/17 04:47 PM
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Oregon
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AndyF Offline
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I had an engine like that in my Coronet for a few years. Nice engine combo that was easy to build and ran really strong. Mine made 550 hp on the engine dyno and 475 rwhp on the chassis dyno.

Re: Mild 470 street / strip motor on the dyno [Re: krautrock] #2392415
10/24/17 04:49 PM
10/24/17 04:49 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
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Mt. Eden Ky.
Hemi Allstate Offline OP
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I guess it would help to post the cam specs.

244* intake 252* exh. @ .050"
.520 int .540 exh.
110 Lobe sep
Howard's EDM lifters

Last edited by Hemi Allstate; 10/24/17 04:51 PM.

http://marsh-racing.com/Mark%20Mahorney-Allstate.htm
1996 Ram 1500 Sport
1968 road runner
1952 Sears Allstate licensed, pump gas, Hemi 5.98 @ 115.73 1.33 60 ft. The best is yet to come. Painless Performance / Street RODDER magazine Top 100 for 2019
Re: Mild 470 street / strip motor on the dyno [Re: Hemi Allstate] #2392438
10/24/17 05:34 PM
10/24/17 05:34 PM
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Oregon
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I ran a MP .528 solid in mine. I tried some slightly larger cams like you have but they didn't make anymore power in my engine. Looks like you have good dyno headers in the picture so that might help out a bit. I ran HP manifolds on my engine.

Re: Mild 470 street / strip motor on the dyno [Re: Hemi Allstate] #2392439
10/24/17 05:38 PM
10/24/17 05:38 PM
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So. Burlington, Vt.
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fast68plymouth Offline
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I'd be looking for "around" 540hp/560tq, based off what I've seen from similarly built 446's, and adjusting for the added cubes.

I was talking to a friend of mine while we were dynoing a 505 he built for a customer about how there can be a fairly noticeable difference in what the dyno sheet says depending on where you go.........for a host of different reasons.

He reminded me of a 2bbl circle track motor he had years ago that he had tested, completely unchanged, at 3 different shops.
The high to low spread was about 30hp......on a motor that barely made 300hp.

It was something like 285/300/315.

Edit- I see you'll be running an elec water pump..... So add a few for that.


68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123
Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
Re: Mild 470 street / strip motor on the dyno [Re: fast68plymouth] #2392468
10/24/17 06:31 PM
10/24/17 06:31 PM
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Oregon
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AndyF Offline
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I think a lot of the difference comes from how the exhaust is handled as well as how good the intake air quality is. Other things to look at would be the weather conditions between different shops.

I've found that our dyno over corrects on the correction factor so if I'm trying to do A-B testing I have to confine myself to testing days where the weather is the same. I usually only test if the correction factor is close to 1.00 since the bigger correction factors don't seem to be accurate.

I'm not sure if there is any difference in power between the different brands of dynos. Acceleration rate and inertia factor and stuff like that can make some small differences but I think exhaust is probably the biggest issue most shops have.

Re: Mild 470 street / strip motor on the dyno [Re: AndyF] #2392512
10/24/17 07:59 PM
10/24/17 07:59 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,675
Mt. Eden Ky.
Hemi Allstate Offline OP
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It has been years since I had an engine on this dyno, but it was not at all generous with the numbers on the two Hemi engines I put on it in the past. In fact I was really disappointed with the out come on both of those engines.
I hear what you guys are saying, and I am just going to post what I have. Maybe you can look at the information and share your observation of the data. I am glad to learn from your experience.
Andy, I have your book and read about your cam testing on the 470, with exhaust manifolds.
These dyno headers were 2" diam. and I am going to use 1 7/8" TTI headers.

Mark


http://marsh-racing.com/Mark%20Mahorney-Allstate.htm
1996 Ram 1500 Sport
1968 road runner
1952 Sears Allstate licensed, pump gas, Hemi 5.98 @ 115.73 1.33 60 ft. The best is yet to come. Painless Performance / Street RODDER magazine Top 100 for 2019
Re: Mild 470 street / strip motor on the dyno [Re: Hemi Allstate] #2392533
10/24/17 08:40 PM
10/24/17 08:40 PM
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Posts: 6,591
Canton, Ohio
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Sport440 Offline
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You don't have a lot of duration, and are using the RPM intake so that should hold the HP back some but have some Great torque, IMO So, I will say about 535 HP and 565# of torque. Should be a great running engine with your gear and stock vert.

Re: Mild 470 street / strip motor on the dyno [Re: Hemi Allstate] #2392543
10/24/17 09:07 PM
10/24/17 09:07 PM
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CT
GTX MATT Offline
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That cam seems to produce really strong flat torque curves and "overachieve" a little on HP. I think the guesses given so far, 530-540 HP and 560-570 ft lbs are right on. I've seen a few dyno results for stock stroke engines with this cam and they seem make about 520 HP and 540 ft lbs.

At first glance it looks a little small for a solid cam using the old rule of thumb of 6-8 degrees of the .050 number for a solid vs hydro. The lash on those XS lobes is tighter than alot of other cams though, so I think its a little deceiving.


Now I need to pin those needles, got to feel that heat
Hear my motor screamin while I'm tearin up the street
Re: Mild 470 street / strip motor on the dyno [Re: GTX MATT] #2392604
10/24/17 10:25 PM
10/24/17 10:25 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,675
Mt. Eden Ky.
Hemi Allstate Offline OP
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I asked the shop owner for his estimate, as well as the dyno operator just for the fun of it. The shop owner said 550, the dyno operator guessed 550 to 570, based on similar sized BBC engines he had tested with "good" heads.
Here are the results.
First is Demon 1050
The second is the Quick fuel 780 carb.
Last is Demon 1050
Mark

470 Dyno graph.jpg470 Dyno with QF carb.jpg470 dyno with Demon carb.jpg

http://marsh-racing.com/Mark%20Mahorney-Allstate.htm
1996 Ram 1500 Sport
1968 road runner
1952 Sears Allstate licensed, pump gas, Hemi 5.98 @ 115.73 1.33 60 ft. The best is yet to come. Painless Performance / Street RODDER magazine Top 100 for 2019
Re: Mild 470 street / strip motor on the dyno [Re: Hemi Allstate] #2392634
10/24/17 11:17 PM
10/24/17 11:17 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,094
central texas
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krautrock Offline
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Dang that thing is making alot of torque.

Re: Mild 470 street / strip motor on the dyno [Re: Hemi Allstate] #2392638
10/24/17 11:21 PM
10/24/17 11:21 PM
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Canton, Ohio
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Sport440 Offline
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Man, Hard to believe it can make those kind of numbers with only a actual 238* of intake duration @ .050 with the lash considered in. But it makes torque down low and torque makes HP. The heads flow enough at those rpms to make those numbers possible, but just never seen that before with a combo like that. If those numbers can really be trusted of being real, you have one heell of a runner there.

Re: Mild 470 street / strip motor on the dyno [Re: krautrock] #2392641
10/24/17 11:24 PM
10/24/17 11:24 PM
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davenc Offline
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Where any carb changes made during the session? The 780 is leaner than the 1050.

Re: Mild 470 street / strip motor on the dyno [Re: davenc] #2392651
10/24/17 11:40 PM
10/24/17 11:40 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,675
Mt. Eden Ky.
Hemi Allstate Offline OP
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Yes the quick fuel was leaned out 2 numbers front and 4 on the rear. I would have to do some checking to see the actual sizes.


http://marsh-racing.com/Mark%20Mahorney-Allstate.htm
1996 Ram 1500 Sport
1968 road runner
1952 Sears Allstate licensed, pump gas, Hemi 5.98 @ 115.73 1.33 60 ft. The best is yet to come. Painless Performance / Street RODDER magazine Top 100 for 2019
Re: Mild 470 street / strip motor on the dyno [Re: Hemi Allstate] #2392654
10/24/17 11:44 PM
10/24/17 11:44 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,479
So. Burlington, Vt.
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fast68plymouth Offline
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About all I can come up with is......
Great call on the cam choice smile


68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123
Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
Re: Mild 470 street / strip motor on the dyno [Re: fast68plymouth] #2392661
10/24/17 11:52 PM
10/24/17 11:52 PM
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NEW JERSEY
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dynamite Offline
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Nice combo Mark.. Lets see some pics of mom's runner .. Larry

Re: Mild 470 street / strip motor on the dyno [Re: dynamite] #2392673
10/25/17 12:18 AM
10/25/17 12:18 AM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,675
Mt. Eden Ky.
Hemi Allstate Offline OP
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Hemi Allstate  Offline OP
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You got it Larry !

August 14 2016 Kittens and RR 016.JPG

http://marsh-racing.com/Mark%20Mahorney-Allstate.htm
1996 Ram 1500 Sport
1968 road runner
1952 Sears Allstate licensed, pump gas, Hemi 5.98 @ 115.73 1.33 60 ft. The best is yet to come. Painless Performance / Street RODDER magazine Top 100 for 2019
Re: Mild 470 street / strip motor on the dyno [Re: fast68plymouth] #2392687
10/25/17 12:47 AM
10/25/17 12:47 AM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,675
Mt. Eden Ky.
Hemi Allstate Offline OP
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Originally Posted By fast68plymouth
About all I can come up with is......
Great call on the cam choice smile


I am inclined to agree Dwayne. smile

Thanks,
Mark

Last edited by Hemi Allstate; 10/25/17 12:47 AM.

http://marsh-racing.com/Mark%20Mahorney-Allstate.htm
1996 Ram 1500 Sport
1968 road runner
1952 Sears Allstate licensed, pump gas, Hemi 5.98 @ 115.73 1.33 60 ft. The best is yet to come. Painless Performance / Street RODDER magazine Top 100 for 2019
Re: Mild 470 street / strip motor on the dyno [Re: Hemi Allstate] #2392708
10/25/17 01:26 AM
10/25/17 01:26 AM
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Texas, USA
ChrgrCuda Offline
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Bad ass RR.


68 Cuda Notchback [Email]10.86@120[/Email] 69 Charger R/T 440/505 2009 Challenger SRT8
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