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1968 GTX vin / engine stamping questions #619366
02/21/10 12:30 AM
02/21/10 12:30 AM
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Dirk Offline OP
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Greetings all,
Thank you in advance for your help. I am a first time poster to this great site.
I have purchased an RR1 1968 GTX.
This is what is confusing me. Keep in mind I may be part of the problem!

Numbers right of distributor on machined pad: D440 10 9 2

Casting date on passenger side on block under head: 9*26*67

No machined pad or stamped number on passenger side above pan rail, rearward of mount.

There is a number stamped below the starter on the block. (lay on back, look up!) It is: PT440P22550878

Transmission stamped number @ top of bellhousing matches car VIN

My question is, what do I have? I realize it is a 440. I would like to decode the stamped number and any other information you could provide as I start the restoration.

Thanks again for your help!
Dirk

Re: 1968 GTX vin / engine stamping questions [Re: Dirk] #619367
02/21/10 12:37 AM
02/21/10 12:37 AM
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Spokane Washington
ScottSmith_Harms Offline
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Here you go

D = 1968 Model Year

440 = Cubic inches

10 9 = October 9th, 1967 Engine Assembly Date

2 = Second engine assembled that shift

9*26*67 = Engine Block Cast September 26th, 1967

PT = Trenton Plant

440 = Cubic Inches

P = Premium Fuel reccomended

2255 = Engine Short Block Assembled September 30th, 1967

0878 = Eight Hundred Seventy Eighth Engine Assembled

Transmission stamped number @ top of bellhousing matches car VIN As it should The engine should have the same number stamped on the top rear of the block adjacent to the oil sender on the lip of the pass side bell housing mating surface.

Re: 1968 GTX vin / engine stamping questions [Re: ScottSmith_Harms] #619368
02/21/10 01:11 AM
02/21/10 01:11 AM
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Dirk Offline OP
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Quote:

Here you go

D = 1968 Model Year

440 = Cubic inches

10 9 = October 9th, 1967 Engine Assembly Date

2 = Second engine assembled that shift

9*26*67 = Engine Block Cast September 26th, 1967

PT = Trenton Plant

440 = Cubic Inches

P = Premium Fuel reccomended

2255 = Engine Short Block Assembled September 30th, 1967

0878 = Eight Hundred Seventy Eighth Engine Assembled

Transmission stamped number @ top of bellhousing matches car VIN As it should The engine should have the same number stamped on the top rear of the block adjacent to the oil sender on the lip of the pass side bell housing mating surface.




Thanks much for the info!
I looked at the bellhousing to block mating lip and there is no number there? I can see about 60 degrees each way down the back.
Would this possibly mean a warranty block?
The build and assemble date seem to match the early, full numbered speedo.
I am trying to verify a claim that this is a matching numbers motor.
Also, since there was no "HP" on the pad by the distributor, does this mean it is not a Magnum?
Thanks again!

Last edited by Dirk; 02/21/10 01:12 AM.
Re: 1968 GTX vin / engine stamping questions [Re: Dirk] #619369
02/21/10 01:15 AM
02/21/10 01:15 AM
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Spokane Washington
ScottSmith_Harms Offline
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No problem. It sounds more like the original engine than a warranty engine, the numbers are often poorly stamped and hard to read, chipoff all the paint and have a harder look, it's probably there.

Re: 1968 GTX vin / engine stamping questions [Re: ScottSmith_Harms] #619370
02/21/10 01:22 AM
02/21/10 01:22 AM
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Dirk Offline OP
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Will do. I will let you know what I find.

Re: 1968 GTX vin / engine stamping questions [Re: ScottSmith_Harms] #619371
02/21/10 02:07 AM
02/21/10 02:07 AM
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1_WILD_RT Offline
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Another photo of the VIN Stamping..

And it's not uncommon for an engine built for an early 68 car to have no numbers... What is the Scheduled Production Date of your GTX?
With an engine assembly date of October 9th, 1967 the car was probably built in mid-late Oct 67

Re: 1968 GTX vin / engine stamping questions [Re: 1_WILD_RT] #619372
02/21/10 02:16 AM
02/21/10 02:16 AM
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ScottSmith_Harms Offline
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I have never seen a single example of a 68 with a trans stamping and no engine stamping. Not saying it never occured, but I'd say the chances are pretty slim regardless of what time in the 68 production year the car wa built. Also, I've had a pretty fair number of owners (some of them pretty knowledgable to boot) whom I've done personal inspections/verifications for who swore they had an original non stamped block only to discover that they actually did, they just couldn't locate them without help.


Re: 1968 GTX vin / engine stamping questions [Re: ScottSmith_Harms] #619373
02/21/10 02:21 AM
02/21/10 02:21 AM
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Quote:

I have never seen a single example of a 68 with a trans stamping and no engine stamping. Not saying it never occured, but I'd say the chances are pretty slim regardless of what time in the 68 production year the car wa built. Also, I've had a pretty fair number of owners (some of them pretty knowledgable to boot) whom I've done personal inspections/verifications for who swore they had an original non stamped block only to discover that they actually did, they just couldn't locate them without help.







If it's got one stamped both should be stamped.. What I'm saying is with early cars especially prior to 1/68 no stampings of engine/trans is not uncommon..

I just re-read the above, missed the part about the trans having the VIN stamped.. Look closer at the engine...

Last edited by 1_WILD_RT; 02/21/10 02:24 AM.
Re: 1968 GTX vin / engine stamping questions [Re: 1_WILD_RT] #619374
02/21/10 02:28 AM
02/21/10 02:28 AM
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Spokane Washington
ScottSmith_Harms Offline
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Quote:

What I'm saying is with early cars especially prior to 1/68 no stampings of engine/trans is not uncommon..






I know what you mean Wild, I've seen that notion prepetuated here on Moparts many times myself. Problem is that there are few who back it up with facts, I haven't seen a single example of an original (unstamped factory installed 68 engine) posted on Moparts, just stories of such.

I think allot of it boils down to wishful thinking on the parts of some people whom own cars with replacment engines and would rather it be deemed "acceptable as common place" so they can slide by with a "numbers matching" car regardless of the engine being swapped out in the past. If anyone is reading this and has such an original example please post it and all the supportive evidence/pics etc. I'm as eager to learn new things as anyone.


Re: 1968 GTX vin / engine stamping questions [Re: ScottSmith_Harms] #619375
02/21/10 02:37 AM
02/21/10 02:37 AM
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I've got a 5/67 cast 9/67 assemblied 440HP with no stamping... So where did it come from? I doubt it's warranty or over the counter.. It was installed in a 68 Charger R/T a friend wrecked in the 70's...

Re: 1968 GTX vin / engine stamping questions [Re: 1_WILD_RT] #619376
02/21/10 02:40 AM
02/21/10 02:40 AM
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ScottSmith_Harms Offline
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Awesome, please post some pics of all the stamped areas (and areas that should be stamped) and casting numbers.

Re: 1968 GTX vin / engine stamping questions [Re: ScottSmith_Harms] #619377
02/21/10 02:43 AM
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I'll get some pictures next time I'm at the storage..

Re: 1968 GTX vin / engine stamping questions [Re: 1_WILD_RT] #619378
02/21/10 02:49 AM
02/21/10 02:49 AM
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Sweeeeet (Cartman voice)

Re: 1968 GTX vin / engine stamping questions [Re: ScottSmith_Harms] #619379
02/21/10 02:54 AM
02/21/10 02:54 AM
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Dirk Offline OP
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Thanks for the responses guys.
Here is a pic of the area in question. You can see the VIN on the trans side but not on the block...
Now what? lol

5820238-DSC09094.JPG (258 downloads)
Re: 1968 GTX vin / engine stamping questions [Re: Dirk] #619380
02/21/10 03:09 AM
02/21/10 03:09 AM
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As it appears in your pic I'd say you have a non stamped block. I wouldn't stop looking just yet though, go a little further in each direction with your paint removal to be sure. I can see where a line worker may have stamped it only on one part (as opposed to both) in the case of an automatic car since they would be right next to one another. On 4 speed cars the trans stamp is in an entirely different area of the trans hence my earlier comment about finding one on the trans would mean the engine would also be stamped.

*BTW, in case you didn't already know, your engine should be the turquoise (same color that's under the current orange).

All of your other engine stamping codes (dates, etc.) align perfectly with your cars SPD, I remain confident that it's the original to your car. I can't say for 100% certain without a personal look but otherwise everything looks right.

Re: 1968 GTX vin / engine stamping questions [Re: Dirk] #619381
02/21/10 03:20 AM
02/21/10 03:20 AM
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My brother's 925 SPD St. Louis assembled 440 auto GTX has the VIN# stamped on the block (in location shown above).

RS23L8G155911 has a B03 SPD (Friday, November 3, 1967), what's your SPD & what's the assembly date of the transmission (driver's side pan rail)?

5820258-DSC08951.JPG (219 downloads)
Re: 1968 GTX vin / engine stamping questions [Re: ScottSmith_Harms] #619382
02/21/10 03:24 AM
02/21/10 03:24 AM
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Quote:

Here you go

D = 1968 Model Year

440 = Cubic inches

10 9 = October 9th, 1967 Engine Assembly Date

2 = Second engine assembled that shift





although some earlier "special" engines are numbered, I believe:

2 = second shift

Re: 1968 GTX vin / engine stamping questions [Re: 6bblgt] #619383
02/21/10 03:25 AM
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Yea, I agree Dan.hard to say without a pic of it.

Is there an HP stamped anywhere?

Re: 1968 GTX vin / engine stamping questions [Re: ScottSmith_Harms] #619384
02/21/10 03:28 AM
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Dirk Offline OP
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Quote:

As it appears in your pic I;d say you have a non stamped block. I wouldn't stop looking just yet though, go a little further in each direction with your paint removal to be sure. I can see where a line worker may have stamped it only on one part (as opposed to both) in the case of an automatic car since they would be right next to one another. On 4 speed cars the trans stamp is in an entirely different area of the trans hence my earlier comment about finding one on the trans would mean the engine would also be stamped.

All of your other engine stamping codes (dates, etc.) align perfectly with your cars SPD, I remain confident that it's the original to your car. I can't say for 100% certain without a personal look but otherwise everything looks right.




Much appreciated Scott. I will Remove the rest of the paint for a last look.

It is a rust-free Texas car with AC that I will do a quick survivor restore on so I can enjoy it for a summer and collect needed parts before a rotisserie later.
I will post it in "Projects" as well.

5820266-DSC09066.JPG (200 downloads)
Re: 1968 GTX vin / engine stamping questions [Re: 6bblgt] #619385
02/21/10 03:34 AM
02/21/10 03:34 AM
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There is a theory making the rounds that some plants only stamped "high performance" engines early in the '68 model year. If someone has an opportunity to inspect a couple of 440 c-bodies, more light may shine on the subject.

I have a "feeling" with no "HP" stamp and no apparent VIN stamping, this engine may simply be a good close date replacement.

Great looking car!! Both engine and trans are stamped in this 383 4bbl auto Hamtramck assembled Charger (324 SPD).

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