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Well one of us doesn't know what you're talking about!

The reverse gear shaft only goes in from the back of the case and doesn't go through to the front. The back of the case is sealed to the tailstock with a gasket.

The "cluster" shaft does go through to the front but is a press-fit in iron cases so that should not be leaking either. On the other hand if its an aluminum case then that could very well be the source of your leak.

Anyhow, to move the trans back 1/" is possible. Get a couple longer bolts, take out one bolt at a time and put in the longer ones with the heads 1/4" protruding then slide the trans back. Support the tailstock so you don't f*** up either the crank bushing or the clutch disk if you happen to slide it back too far.

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Well one of us doesn't know what you're talking about!

The reverse gear shaft only goes in from the back of the case and doesn't go through to the front. The back of the case is sealed to the tailstock with a gasket.

The "cluster" shaft does go through to the front but is a press-fit in iron cases so that should not be leaking either. On the other hand if its an aluminum case then that could very well be the source of your leak.

Anyhow, to move the trans back 1/" is possible. Get a couple longer bolts, take out one bolt at a time and put in the longer ones with the heads 1/4" protruding then slide the trans back. Support the tailstock so you don't f*** up either the crank bushing or the clutch disk if you happen to slide it back too far.

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But if that is the source of the leak (and not the IBR gasket), I don't see how you can fix it without removing the transmission. And if its leaking badly enough from there, it could be an indication that countershaft is enlarging the hole, which will lead to failure of the trans eventually.

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If I un-bolt the tranny mount can I move a 4-speed off the bellhousing about 1/4"? Is there enough slack?

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(Just answer the question, boys)

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Thanks guys...

The trans is cast iron by the way (not rebuilt but from a low mileage car). It has been sitting for a very ling time since the car has been a 4 year project. It is nearing completion (this year) and would like nothing leaking. It is not a streaming leak but rather a drip that becomes a small puddle after 4 months.

I did take it apart and replace all gaskets/seals and have a trans specialist look at all the gears. It works and shifts just fine (reverse and 1st gear in and out the garage).

Could it be possible that once everything heats up the "gap" between the housing and shaft might close enough to stop the leak??

It might not be worth trying to fix since it sounds like a I'd be risking damage to other components...

Steve

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If I un-bolt the tranny mount can I move a 4-speed off the bellhousing about 1/4"? Is there enough slack?

I have a leak where the reverse gear cluster shaft enters the housing . My thought is that I can back it off enough to slide in a piece of gasket paper and silicone. The leak is coming from this area as there is no fluid around the shaft that goes into the bellhousing.

Thanks

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Thanks guys...

The trans is cast iron by the way (not rebuilt but from a low mileage car). It has been sitting for a very ling time since the car has been a 4 year project. It is nearing completion (this year) and would like nothing leaking. It is not a streaming leak but rather a drip that becomes a small puddle after 4 months.

I did take it apart and replace all gaskets/seals and have a trans specialist look at all the gears. It works and shifts just fine (reverse and 1st gear in and out the garage).

Could it be possible that once everything heats up the "gap" between the housing and shaft might close enough to stop the leak??

It might not be worth trying to fix since it sounds like a I'd be risking damage to other components...

Steve

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the shaft you are talking about is a light press fit meaning the of the shaft is BIGGER than the ID of the hole, it shouldn't be able to leak by design.

What oil are you using and did you put the same cluster gear pin back in the trans when it was put back together. I had the same leak point you think you have but I created it by using the cluster gear pin from an OD trans , it's a little shorter and it's not a press fit , I didn't know that at the time that I did it and the comapny that sold me the shaft didn't ask the trans type when I was ordering the rebuild parts .

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I don't recall the weight but it's Penzoil Synchromesh.

I didn't have the trans completely apart. I only removed the tailshaft from the housing w/ the gears attached. So the cluster gear pin should be the same that it left the factory with (unless the trans was rebuilt sometime in it's life).

Thanks!

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If I un-bolt the tranny mount can I move a 4-speed off the bellhousing about 1/4"? Is there enough slack?

I have a leak where the reverse gear cluster shaft enters the housing . My thought is that I can back it off enough to slide in a piece of gasket paper and silicone. The leak is coming from this area as there is no fluid around the shaft that goes into the bellhousing.

Thanks

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That sounds easy enough, but the face of the bell is not all flat unless you have a lakewood or quicktime bell. So sliding a piece of gasket material in there likely wouldn't do anything except cause the trans/bell to be out of parallel. Pull it out and make sure the oil isn't coming from the brg retainer. The countershaft pin needs to be sealed with silicone. They tend to weap if not sealed.
Dan

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Instead of the gasket maybe just a bit of silicone applied via paint scraper? A dab should be enough to fill the small gap and seal it.

I hate to put a band-aid on a problem but if that would take care of the leak maybe that's all it really needs.

Thanks for all the help guys!!!

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If I un-bolt the tranny mount can I move a 4-speed off the bellhousing about 1/4"? Is there enough slack?

I have a leak where the reverse gear cluster shaft enters the housing . My thought is that I can back it off enough to slide in a piece of gasket paper and silicone. The leak is coming from this area as there is no fluid around the shaft that goes into the bellhousing.

Thanks

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That sounds easy enough, but the face of the bell is not all flat unless you have a lakewood or quicktime bell. So sliding a piece of gasket material in there likely wouldn't do anything except cause the trans/bell to be out of parallel. Pull it out and make sure the oil isn't coming from the brg retainer. The countershaft pin needs to be sealed with silicone. They tend to weap if not sealed.
Dan

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Instead of the gasket maybe just a bit of silicone applied via paint scraper? A dab should be enough to fill the small gap and seal it.

I hate to put a band-aid on a problem but if that would take care of the leak maybe that's all it really needs.

Thanks for all the help guys!!!

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If I un-bolt the tranny mount can I move a 4-speed off the bellhousing about 1/4"? Is there enough slack?

I have a leak where the reverse gear cluster shaft enters the housing . My thought is that I can back it off enough to slide in a piece of gasket paper and silicone. The leak is coming from this area as there is no fluid around the shaft that goes into the bellhousing.

Thanks

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That sounds easy enough, but the face of the bell is not all flat unless you have a lakewood or quicktime bell. So sliding a piece of gasket material in there likely wouldn't do anything except cause the trans/bell to be out of parallel. Pull it out and make sure the oil isn't coming from the brg retainer. The countershaft pin needs to be sealed with silicone. They tend to weap if not sealed.
Dan

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Instead of the gasket maybe just a bit of silicone applied via paint scraper? A dab should be enough to fill the small gap and seal it.

I hate to put a band-aid on a problem but if that would take care of the leak maybe that's all it really needs.

Thanks for all the help guys!!!

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You will have to clean it of oil first, which means drain the trans, the silcone is not going to seal if what you are applying it to is covered with oil.

So you say the trans may have been rebuilt by a previous owner , when you get it back look to see that the cluster gear pin is pretty much flush with the end of the case , if it is an 1/8 or so in then it's an OD shaft. How do you know this is the leak ? when you took off the bearing retainer did you change the internal seal ? Was the seal surface on the input shaft good ?

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I was planning on draining it completely and spraying the area with brake cleaner to prep it. The pin is completely flush with the case so I don't believe this to be an OD pin. With the bellhousing inspection cover off you can see the entire area around the bearing retainer is clean and yes, the internal seal was replaced and all surfaces looked fantastic. The drip is isolated to the seam where the tranny meets the bellhousing. I figured this has to be the only reason I'm seeing this leak if everything around the bearing retainer is dry.

Thanks John

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(Just answer the question, boys)

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That's not how moparts works , instead you get told what you should do and how much of a moron or idiot you are for not thinking the same way as the derogatory responder.

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(Just answer the question, boys)

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That's not how moparts works , instead you get told what you should do and how much of a moron or idiot you are for not thinking the same way as the derogatory responder.

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PM sent to prevent thread from going OFF TOPIC.

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when you took off the bearing retainer did you change the internal seal ? Was the seal surface on the input shaft good ?

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when you took off the bearing retainer did you change the internal seal ? Was the seal surface on the input shaft good ?

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Holy crap, if it hasn't been used in 3 tears and its leaking from the input shaft, you have WAY too much fluid in it. It would be pouring out the tail end !!!

And as for that cluster shaft being "thinner" in the OD case, I "could" be wrong but I seriously doubt it. Yes, it is shorter than an iron case shaft however from a manufacturing standpoint it would make no sense to add a machining step to make the shaft thinner when all they had to do was make the hole in the case bigger. Can Passon's or Brewers shed some light on this?

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Of course you are NEVER wrong ... ...

It doesn't have a step, and no one said it did, it's just not as tight as it is in the OD case, the hole in the case is more than likely bigger in the OD case than the regular 4 speed case, and an OD shaft is shorter because there is a soft plug on the bell end of the trans to KEEP IT FROM LEAKING because it's not a press fit.

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(Just answer the question, boys)

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That's not how moparts works , instead you get told what you should do and how much of a moron or idiot you are for not thinking the same way as the derogatory responder.

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PM sent to prevent thread from going OFF TOPIC.

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John kissed it and made it feel all better.

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Of course you are NEVER wrong ... ...

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I hate to put a band-aid on a problem

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I'm not all that familiar with the car four speeds yet, but what fluid is recommended for the 833? I remember a Neon I used to have called for the pennzoil synchromesh fluid and it was pretty thin. I've seen some mention of gear oil all the way to ATF in an 833, so I'm not sure what's correct, but a little thicker oil might stop the leak too.

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I'm not all that familiar with the car four speeds yet, but what fluid is recommended for the 833? I remember a Neon I used to have called for the pennzoil synchromesh fluid and it was pretty thin. I've seen some mention of gear oil all the way to ATF in an 833, so I'm not sure what's correct, but a little thicker oil might stop the leak too.

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Whenever I've tried using the thinner 'synchromesh' fluids, I get leaks. I've always gone back to the thicker gear oil. If that's what you decide to do, make sure to use GL-4 rated gear oil - GL-4 is compatible with synchromesh transmissions. GL-5 rated gear oil is NOT designed for synchromesh transmissions, and will cause grinding while shifting.

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Same here , I used Mobil 1 in the trans I put the OD cluster pin in and it leaked like a stuck pig. I've had Mobil 1 634 , equivalent to 140wt gear oil, leak past NPT fittings that had telfon tape on them

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I'm not all that familiar with the car four speeds yet, but what fluid is recommended for the 833? I remember a Neon I used to have called for the pennzoil synchromesh fluid and it was pretty thin. I've seen some mention of gear oil all the way to ATF in an 833, so I'm not sure what's correct, but a little thicker oil might stop the leak too.

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Whenever I've tried using the thinner 'synchromesh' fluids, I get leaks. I've always gone back to the thicker gear oil. If that's what you decide to do, make sure to use GL-4 rated gear oil - GL-4 is compatible with synchromesh transmissions. GL-5 rated gear oil is NOT designed for synchromesh transmissions, and will cause grinding while shifting.

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Same here , I used Mobil 1 in the trans I put the OD cluster pin in and it leaked like a stuck pig. I've had Mobil 1 634 , equivalent to 140wt gear oil, leak past NPT fittings that had telfon tape on them

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Thanks! I think I'll try the GL-4 first before removing the tranny.

If that fix can stop the leak I'll be very

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I'm not all that familiar with the car four speeds yet, but what fluid is recommended for the 833? I remember a Neon I used to have called for the pennzoil synchromesh fluid and it was pretty thin. I've seen some mention of gear oil all the way to ATF in an 833, so I'm not sure what's correct, but a little thicker oil might stop the leak too.

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Whenever I've tried using the thinner 'synchromesh' fluids, I get leaks. I've always gone back to the thicker gear oil. If that's what you decide to do, make sure to use GL-4 rated gear oil - GL-4 is compatible with synchromesh transmissions. GL-5 rated gear oil is NOT designed for synchromesh transmissions, and will cause grinding while shifting.

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Same here , I used Mobil 1 in the trans I put the OD cluster pin in and it leaked like a stuck pig. I've had Mobil 1 634 , equivalent to 140wt gear oil, leak past NPT fittings that had telfon tape on them

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Mopar Beach: I just fixed the same leak last summer. Its not that uncommon for them to leak at this spot if the builder doesn't put a smear of RTV around the shaft during install.

I removed my tranny, cleaned the area REALLY well with brake cleaner/lacquer thinner etc. then filled it (it was a hollow depression to the shaft--maybe 1/16" deep) with "The right stuff".

But I also 'filled' the matching area of the bell housing with RTV to make it flush too. The face of the bell (mine anyway) has depressions in it--its not a completely smooth flat surface, and yep--one of the depressions fell right over the shaft position.

Yes, I think you could seal it the way you are thinking, Slide it back, clean really well, blow dry, goop it up, slam it home and be done with it. Course you'll also be gluing your tranny to the bell, but you could probably break that bond without too much difficulty if need be in the future.

I DON'T think a fluid change will solve it, mine leaked with 75w90 GL-4 petro, Pennszoil Syncromesh, and Red Line MTF.

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Of course if you assemble the rollers dry using something as a temporary spacer to hold them in place then you'd probably want to smear some rtv in the hole just before you tap the shaft in that last 1/2 inch.

Am I right AGAIN John-boy ?!?!?

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Just an update to anyone who followed this....Switching to a 90W gear oil fixed the leak 100%!!!

It has been over a week and no drips!!

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