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What is the "normal" thickness of body panels? Welding? #74702 06/16/08 09:14 PM 06/16/08 09:14 PM
Joined: May 2005 Posts: 4,704 Florida BDW OP master
BDW OP master Joined: May 2005 Posts: 4,704 Florida	I'm teaching myself to weld. I started practicing of 22g steel. On the MIG site I've been asking questions, the common answer is 22g is too thin to do a good job on. So, what is the thickness of common body panels? Qtr panels, rear sail panel (between trunk and roof), fenders? Hope I'm not in over my head!

Re: What is the "normal" thickness of body panels? Welding? [Re: BDW] #74703 06/16/08 09:53 PM 06/16/08 09:53 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 6,988 Warren, MI J Jerry master
Jerry master J Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 6,988 Warren, MI	i usually use 20ga for older sheetmetal. the frames are 16ga. definitely not in over your head. make sure you use gas and good luck. Superior Design Concepts 2574 Elliott Dr Troy MI 48083 jerry@sdconcepts.com www.sdconcepts.com Facebook page: Superior Design Concepts www.bcrproducts.com

Re: What is the "normal" thickness of body panels? Welding? [Re: Jerry] #74704 06/17/08 01:13 AM 06/17/08 01:13 AM
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	Quote: definitely not in over your head. make sure you use gas and good luck.

Re: What is the "normal" thickness of body panels? Welding? #74705 06/17/08 09:50 AM 06/17/08 09:50 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 514 Buffalo, MN hydro super street
hydro super street Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 514 Buffalo, MN	Here's a trick that has worked well for me: Locate a few pieces of copper bar (surplus store or flattened copper pipe) and make some weld backers. I have some pieces of 1/8" and 3/16" bar that I found locally and I cut some pieces from those bars to shape as needed. A couple of spoon shapes work well for filling holes. Attach a piece to a magnet so that you don't have to hang on to it while you weld. When you weld the sheet metal have the copper behind and pressed against the weld area. It acts as a heat sink and the weld will not stick to it. When filling holes you can almost "weld to air". It's really amazing how well this works!

Re: What is the "normal" thickness of body panels? Welding? [Re: BDW] #74706 06/17/08 11:28 AM 06/17/08 11:28 AM
Joined: Apr 2005 Posts: 15,134 Kelowna, B.C. Canada D DPelletier I Live Here
DPelletier I Live Here D Joined: Apr 2005 Posts: 15,134 Kelowna, B.C. Canada	Most body metal is 22ga, but sure, the thicker it is the easier it is to weld. I'd go 20ga for patches when you can. Dave 1970 Super Bee 440 Six Pack 1974 'Cuda 2008 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Ram 3500 Diesel 2004.5 Ram 2500 Diesel 2003 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Durango Limited [url] http://1970superbee.piczo.com [/url]

Re: What is the "normal" thickness of body panels? Welding? [Re: hydro] #74707 06/17/08 06:30 PM 06/17/08 06:30 PM
Joined: May 2005 Posts: 4,704 Florida BDW OP master
BDW OP master Joined: May 2005 Posts: 4,704 Florida	Quote: Here's a trick that has worked well for me: Locate a few pieces of copper bar (surplus store or flattened copper pipe) and make some weld backers. I have some pieces of 1/8" and 3/16" bar that I found locally and I cut some pieces from those bars to shape as needed. A couple of spoon shapes work well for filling holes. Attach a piece to a magnet so that you don't have to hang on to it while you weld. When you weld the sheet metal have the copper behind and pressed against the weld area. It acts as a heat sink and the weld will not stick to it. When filling holes you can almost "weld to air". It's really amazing how well this works! Almost think I understand what your saying. I've been practicing on 22g, and there's no way I could do any kind of repair! Even on the lowest settings it burns right through. I did some on 16g and I was able to get a pretty good bead. I haven't used gas yet, just flux core wire. Does the gas make that much difference?

Re: What is the "normal" thickness of body panels? Welding? [Re: BDW] #74708 06/17/08 08:04 PM 06/17/08 08:04 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 6,988 Warren, MI J Jerry master
Jerry master J Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 6,988 Warren, MI	the gas makes a huge difference. flux core tends to burn hotter as well. i wouldn't do body work without it. that being said, i will do frame work with flux core for the extra penetration. Superior Design Concepts 2574 Elliott Dr Troy MI 48083 jerry@sdconcepts.com www.sdconcepts.com Facebook page: Superior Design Concepts www.bcrproducts.com

Re: What is the "normal" thickness of body panels? Weld [Re: Jerry] #74709 06/17/08 08:17 PM 06/17/08 08:17 PM
Joined: Apr 2005 Posts: 12,271 Overpriced Housing Central RobX4406 I Live Here
RobX4406 I Live Here Joined: Apr 2005 Posts: 12,271 Overpriced Housing Central	Best of luck using flux core. Flux core burns too hot. i know guys that can do panel repair with flux wire, but, they are way more skilled than I. make it easy on yourself. Get a tank of 75/25 gas mix and .023 wire. You can turn it down low enough to make small spot welds and not burn through. The copper backing is an excellent recommendation. I use copper plumbing tubing 3/8-1/2", cut it long ways and form it.

Re: What is the "normal" thickness of body panels? Weld [Re: RobX4406] #74710 06/18/08 03:50 PM 06/18/08 03:50 PM
Joined: Feb 2007 Posts: 230 Long Island, New York T Tony H enthusiast
Tony H enthusiast T Joined: Feb 2007 Posts: 230 Long Island, New York	Don't expect to run a Bead. you have to 'spot her, then move down an inch then spot there. do that in a few areas then go back by the first area. Can't let an area get hot. '75 CJ5 with all glass body and a 350 Chevy SB '85 Chevy Stepside (the wife's) '89 Volvo All 100% maintained by me. '70 valiant DD for my son '74 Dart Swinger..Latest endeavor http://home.lyse.net/brox/TonyPage4.html

Re: What is the "normal" thickness of body panels? Welding? [Re: hydro] #74711 06/18/08 05:30 PM 06/18/08 05:30 PM
Joined: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,128 Tulsa, OK 7 73cudaproject super stock
73cudaproject super stock 7 Joined: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,128 Tulsa, OK	Quote: Here's a trick that has worked well for me: Locate a few pieces of copper bar (surplus store or flattened copper pipe) and make some weld backers. I have some pieces of 1/8" and 3/16" bar that I found locally and I cut some pieces from those bars to shape as needed. A couple of spoon shapes work well for filling holes. Attach a piece to a magnet so that you don't have to hang on to it while you weld. When you weld the sheet metal have the copper behind and pressed against the weld area. It acts as a heat sink and the weld will not stick to it. When filling holes you can almost "weld to air". It's really amazing how well this works! Without a doubt as a novice welder the copper bar as a backer has been the best tip I learned here at moparts. Along with lots of other welding this is a picture of my '73 to AAR project with two qtr. panel patches: This picture shows an upper and lower butt patch. The cross is due to a heat warp which I tried to relieve with a horizontal cut. I ended up having to cut the vertical weld and redo the weld taking care not to get in a hurry This picture show the other side were I had to weld in the qtr patch panel plus a side marker patch from a donor Besides the copper bar I love the small clamps which hold two panels in alignment with a small gap. I have searched the Harbor Freight web site but cannot find a picture. These clamps along with a copper bar work great. One thing for sure is you have to have patience...

Re: What is the "normal" thickness of body panels? Weld [Re: Tony H] #74712 06/18/08 08:08 PM 06/18/08 08:08 PM
Joined: May 2005 Posts: 4,704 Florida BDW OP master
BDW OP master Joined: May 2005 Posts: 4,704 Florida	Quote: Don't expect to run a Bead. you have to 'spot her, then move down an inch then spot there. do that in a few areas then go back by the first area. Can't let an area get hot. I did notice the 22g warped like a mother! How do you know how much to "spot" and how long to wait before going back?

Re: What is the "normal" thickness of body panels? Weld [Re: BDW] #74713 06/18/08 08:35 PM 06/18/08 08:35 PM
Joined: Aug 2006 Posts: 662 Tampa FL H hemibeep mopar
hemibeep mopar H Joined: Aug 2006 Posts: 662 Tampa FL	22g is too thin. I truely think it lands between 18-20g. I always keep and old hood or fender around to use for patch panels. at least that metal was made in USA!. Yes, spot, skip an inch, spot, skip inch....etc. let it cool to avoid the warp. mig welding is all about clean metal and good ground.

Re: What is the "normal" thickness of body panels? Weld [Re: BDW] #74714 06/18/08 08:39 PM 06/18/08 08:39 PM
Joined: Apr 2005 Posts: 12,271 Overpriced Housing Central RobX4406 I Live Here
RobX4406 I Live Here Joined: Apr 2005 Posts: 12,271 Overpriced Housing Central	Grab some scrap and practice. Maybe a one count.

Re: What is the "normal" thickness of body panels? Weld [Re: RobX4406] #74715 06/19/08 04:44 AM 06/19/08 04:44 AM
Joined: Jul 2006 Posts: 106 Waterloo Iowa 8 80mirada member
80mirada member 8 Joined: Jul 2006 Posts: 106 Waterloo Iowa	I have done body work with flux core and with patience it turned out okay. That being said I would recommend not even attempting that. Buy the gas an some 024 wire and practice. quenching is also handy when doing sheet metal. It speeds up the job, but you still need to be careful. If you can find an inexpensive automatic helmet it make learning easier. I use mine for most projects. unless I'm doing a lot of heavy work then I switch back to a flip lens helmet. What is kind of welder are you using(make and model). I personally like Miller/Hobarts, but most of the machines on the market now are pretty good.

Re: What is the "normal" thickness of body panels? Weld [Re: 80mirada] #74716 06/19/08 06:01 AM 06/19/08 06:01 AM
Joined: May 2005 Posts: 4,704 Florida BDW OP master
BDW OP master Joined: May 2005 Posts: 4,704 Florida	Thx all for the tips, http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200342924_200342924 This is the welder, they had 20% off last month so it was only $360. I'll try the gas and thinner wire. I've been using the 032 flux core that came with it. Unless the gas makes a huge difference, I don't think 22g welding is in my future. I've been practicing with it and it either burns right through or no penetration. I practiced on some 16g and did pretty good. I have the auto-dark helemt, works great.

Re: What is the "normal" thickness of body panels? Weld [Re: BDW] #74717 06/20/08 10:18 AM 06/20/08 10:18 AM
Joined: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,128 Tulsa, OK 7 73cudaproject super stock
73cudaproject super stock 7 Joined: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,128 Tulsa, OK	Quote: Thx all for the tips, http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200342924_200342924 This is the welder, they had 20% off last month so it was only $360. I'll try the gas and thinner wire. I've been using the 032 flux core that came with it. Unless the gas makes a huge difference, I don't think 22g welding is in my future. I've been practicing with it and it either burns right through or no penetration. I practiced on some 16g and did pretty good. I have the auto-dark helemt, works great. When I bought my welder I was not setup for gas and everything I welded looked like Swiss cheese. Absolutely the best thing I did was buy a medium sized tank plus a regulator (my welder came equipped with this sort of no gauge regulator with a pop up device when low. It was junk...). I also learned the value of cleaning the metal. Even though I still have some trouble getting the weld to "hook" right off the start without some popping everything goes so much better when I take the time to really clean both pieces. Don't give up until you try the gas. One more tip is I was using a small extension cord. Someone here at moparts recommended buying a heavy gauge extension cord and while expensive just having the larger cord helped my welding.

Re: What is the "normal" thickness of body panels? Weld [Re: 73cudaproject] #74718 06/24/08 08:33 AM 06/24/08 08:33 AM
Joined: Jul 2007 Posts: 66 NW 'Burbs Chicago, IL A_Roldan member
A_Roldan member Joined: Jul 2007 Posts: 66 NW 'Burbs Chicago, IL	This thread is great. I just bought a welder and I'm going to pick it up tomorrow to get started on my car. The information on here is good for those of us who don't have knowledge and/or experience. I just can't figure out if I can save this thread as a favorites or somehow save it in my account? Anyone? EDIT: Never mind. I figured it out. It was the obvious link at the bottom that said, "Favorite Topic! (toggle)". LOL! Thanks. Last edited by A_Roldan; 06/24/08 08:38 AM.

Re: What is the "normal" thickness of body panels? Welding? [Re: BDW] #74719 06/24/08 01:14 PM 06/24/08 01:14 PM
Joined: Apr 2004 Posts: 1,396 Mass dgc333 pro stock
dgc333 pro stock Joined: Apr 2004 Posts: 1,396 Mass	FWIW, I took an adult education class in welding at the local trade high school. All but one of the folks in the class was there because they needed to learn to weld auto sheet metal with a MIG welder. The class was 2 hours twice a week for 10 weeks. By the 8th week I was able easily butt weld 22 gauge sheet metal without burning through or warping the metal. It's great having some one that really knows what they are doing looking over your shoulder. The welders were large production class machines which I would never get to use at home so the last two weeks of class I spent using the small 120 volt units they had that were similar to the Lincoln unit I have at home. Took a couple of hours more practice but by the end of the class I was able to work with a machine that didn't have infinatly varible voltage and do just as good. If you have the opportunity to sign up for a class at a local trade school I highly recomend it and practice, practice, practice. Dave Clement Pembroke, MA 03 PT Cruiser GT Turbo 99 Dakota SLT+ CC 4x4 68 Barracuda sport coupe http://home.comcast.net/~dgc333/

Re: What is the "normal" thickness of body panels? Welding? [Re: BDW] #74720 06/24/08 08:12 PM 06/24/08 08:12 PM
Joined: Feb 2008 Posts: 233 NH Fastback67 enthusiast
Fastback67 enthusiast Joined: Feb 2008 Posts: 233 NH	Quote: I haven't used gas yet, just flux core wire. Does the gas make that much difference? Flux core is not for thin sheet metal, much too violent. Flux core works great on thicker metals, especially if their a little dirty. Gas creates a shield around the outer area of the weld, but flux core shields from within, driving out impurities... hence all the splatter. Gas is a much better way to go with sheet metal, but if you�re welding a couple of old rusty angle irons together, break out the flux core.

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