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413 motorhome engine ???"s
#651550
03/26/10 06:12 AM
03/26/10 06:12 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,567
Ky
jt4406
OP
pro stock
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OP
pro stock
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,567
Ky
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Had the opportunity yesterday to buy a 413 engine out of a motorhome. It was complete with a holley carb (looked to be one with a governor). I passed on it. It had the industrial waterpump setup on it so I figured the heads, intake, carb, exhaust, were all basically useless. It had a small diameter balancer, didn't look to be externally balanced, but not the same diameter as a steel 440 crank would have had. Do you guys know if the block, crank and rods were useful in an automotive application?  thanks Jess
Yeah, it's hopped up to over 160...
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: RC91]
#651554
03/26/10 10:30 AM
03/26/10 10:30 AM
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 15,995
RI Deep in the rust belt
chargervert
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 15,995
RI Deep in the rust belt
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I have a 413 Motor home engine,and it says 265 horsepower right on the air cleaner lid.
70 Charger R/T SE 472 Hemi
70 Charger R/T convertible
70 Charger R/T V Code Sixpack
69 Charger R/T SE Sunroofcar
68 Charger 383
68 Charger 318
71 Charger R/T
70 Challenger convertible
71 Challenger convertible
71 Cuda 340
09 Challenger R/T Classic
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: Challenger 1]
#651556
03/26/10 12:31 PM
03/26/10 12:31 PM
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
dOc !
The village idiot's idiot
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The village idiot's idiot
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
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Quote:
Where's Doc fiberglass? I bet he knows.
You rang ? .. 
To the OP ... you passed on it ? .. how much were they asking for it? I have seen a JY asking as much as 1000$ ...and as little as 125$(with a trans) in a burned-out MH .... toasted because the Berry crab started leaking like a sieve ....and burned the front half of the MH almost to-the-ground !!!
IS this motor usable in a car .....as-is ? If you want a GRUNT motor and if you want to heavily modify the exh mans .. sure. But the entire combo is more suited to a motorhome/truck application.
Should you toss all those parts you mention? ... YEAH ... TOSS 'EM over here ! I am doing some serious R%D with this combo and am saving all these parts I can.
Are the parts that you mention worth saving? ... I say yes. Are they as good as a typical 440 HP combo ? ... probably not - as some would suggest.
But then did the smaller-bore Max-Wedge run pretty good ?
Yup ! .. 
""""""""""Had the opportunity yesterday to buy a 413 engine out of a motorhome. It was complete with a holley carb (looked to be one with a governor). I passed on it. It had the industrial waterpump setup on it so I figured the heads, intake, carb, exhaust, were all basically useless. It had a small diameter balancer, didn't look to be externally balanced, but not the same diameter as a steel 440 crank would have had. Do you guys know if the block, crank and rods were useful in an automotive application? """""""""""
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: dOc !]
#651557
03/26/10 12:55 PM
03/26/10 12:55 PM
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 15,995
RI Deep in the rust belt
chargervert
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 15,995
RI Deep in the rust belt
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The one I have is complete,carb to pan,with trans,and it runs. The first person to put $400.00 in my hand can take it.
70 Charger R/T SE 472 Hemi
70 Charger R/T convertible
70 Charger R/T V Code Sixpack
69 Charger R/T SE Sunroofcar
68 Charger 383
68 Charger 318
71 Charger R/T
70 Challenger convertible
71 Challenger convertible
71 Cuda 340
09 Challenger R/T Classic
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: chargervert]
#651559
03/26/10 03:03 PM
03/26/10 03:03 PM
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
dOc !
The village idiot's idiot
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The village idiot's idiot
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
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Quote:
The one I have is complete,carb to pan,with trans,and it runs. The first person to put $400.00 in my hand can take it.
In my experience .... your hand is going to be OUT THERE a long LONG time ! 
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: RC91]
#651560
03/26/10 03:05 PM
03/26/10 03:05 PM
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
dOc !
The village idiot's idiot
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The village idiot's idiot
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
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Quote:
Dodge 1971/72 V8- 413-1 4 BBL 4.188 X 3.75 7.5 to 1 265 @ 4000 445 fp @ 2400 Sodium Ex. Valves
Dodge 1971/72 V8- 413-3 4 BBL 4.188 X 3.75 7.5 to 1 238 @ 3600 407 fp @ 2000 Sodium Ex. Valves
Dodge 1973 V8- 413-3 4 BBL 4.188 X 3.75 7.5 to 1 190 @ 3200 355 fp @ 2000 Sodium Ex. Valves
Dodge 1976 V8- 413-3 4 BBL 4.188.X 3.75 7.54 to 1 175 @ 3200 325 fp @ 2000
WHERE did you come up with these #'s ?
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: wildfish72]
#651564
09/13/10 11:44 AM
09/13/10 11:44 AM
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 223
Poplar Bluff, Missouri
partfiler69
Still Wondering
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Still Wondering
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 223
Poplar Bluff, Missouri
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I just picked one of these up, and I am wondering what can be used? I have a 2bbl 383 out of a 70 polara for parts, can I use the 413 intake on the 906 heads? This is a budget build for right now. I just want to know what to hang on to, and what to toss on the scrap trailer.
Back from hiatus
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: jt4406]
#651567
09/13/10 01:20 PM
09/13/10 01:20 PM
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 223
Poplar Bluff, Missouri
partfiler69
Still Wondering
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Still Wondering
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 223
Poplar Bluff, Missouri
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I'm sorry, let me try this again. I want to take the oil pan, pickup tube, heads and water pump housing from the 383 and put it on the 413. Did I forget anything?
Back from hiatus
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: partfiler69]
#651568
09/13/10 01:41 PM
09/13/10 01:41 PM
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
dOc !
The village idiot's idiot
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The village idiot's idiot
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
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Quote:
I'm sorry, let me try this again. I want to take the oil pan, pickup tube, heads and water pump housing from the 383 and put it on the 413. Did I forget anything?
YES ... it will work .. but you can do better. Get a set of small chambered heads for more compression(the MH 413 is very weak in that area). And a set of regular 383 heads(906's?) will not help.
In this swap ... watch out for the top two ports of the water pump in the block. On the 413 - using those "goofy" heads ... these ports are more-than-likely plugged with sediment.
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: dOc !]
#651569
09/13/10 01:43 PM
09/13/10 01:43 PM
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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much easier just to take a felt marker and write
"413" on the 383's valvecovers... no?
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: dOc !]
#651570
09/13/10 01:50 PM
09/13/10 01:50 PM
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 223
Poplar Bluff, Missouri
partfiler69
Still Wondering
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Still Wondering
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 223
Poplar Bluff, Missouri
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Ok, thanks for the tip. What would be a better head to use instead of the 906's. What if I had the 906's flat milled .040?
Back from hiatus
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
#651571
09/13/10 01:53 PM
09/13/10 01:53 PM
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
dOc !
The village idiot's idiot
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The village idiot's idiot
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
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Quote:
much easier just to take a felt marker and write
"413" on the 383's valvecovers... no?
WH .....???? ... whatchoobeensmokin?
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: partfiler69]
#651572
09/13/10 01:56 PM
09/13/10 01:56 PM
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
dOc !
The village idiot's idiot
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The village idiot's idiot
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
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Quote:
Ok, thanks for the tip. What would be a better head to use instead of the 906's. What if I had the 906's flat milled .040?
What do you plan on doing with the engine combo ? ... have you pulled the heads off that 413 ? ..... the 906's can not be milled enough to get decent compression with that shortblock.
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: dOc !]
#651573
09/13/10 02:03 PM
09/13/10 02:03 PM
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 223
Poplar Bluff, Missouri
partfiler69
Still Wondering
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Still Wondering
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 223
Poplar Bluff, Missouri
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It will be replacing the tired 318 in my wifes 73 satty. It is just a weekend cruiser. Nothin radical or extreme.
Back from hiatus
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: partfiler69]
#651578
09/13/10 03:21 PM
09/13/10 03:21 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,067
Irving, TX
feets
Senior Management
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Senior Management
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,067
Irving, TX
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Be sure to cut the intake side of the heads to keep the geometry the same. You can't slam .060" off the intake ports. It requires a different amount and possibly a different angle to keep things the same.
We are brothers and sisters doing time on the planet for better or worse. I'll take the better, if you don't mind.
- Stu Harmon
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: feets]
#651579
09/13/10 09:12 PM
09/13/10 09:12 PM
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 223
Poplar Bluff, Missouri
partfiler69
Still Wondering
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Still Wondering
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 223
Poplar Bluff, Missouri
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Well, from what I am reading about the low compression of this beast, it seems to have BOOST written all over it!
Back from hiatus
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: dOc !]
#651581
09/14/10 09:06 AM
09/14/10 09:06 AM
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 223
Poplar Bluff, Missouri
partfiler69
Still Wondering
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Still Wondering
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 223
Poplar Bluff, Missouri
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Thanks for the help, everybody.  I'm also wondering, is it possible to put a set of 383 pistons in it, or do I need 426W pistons?
Back from hiatus
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: dOc !]
#651583
09/14/10 05:45 PM
09/14/10 05:45 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,336
South-Central (Sebring), FL
Commando1
master
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master
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,336
South-Central (Sebring), FL
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Quote:
383 pistons will work ... but you will have about 4 to ONE compression ratio ..
..
Hey, the way the quality of gas keeps deteriorating, that may be a good thing....
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: partfiler69]
#651585
09/14/10 07:28 PM
09/14/10 07:28 PM
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
dOc !
The village idiot's idiot
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The village idiot's idiot
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
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Quote:
Quote:
383 pistons will work ... but you will have about 4 to ONE compression ratio ..
Can't I just have the heads flat milled .010?
MORE LIKE .....1.100 !!
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: partfiler69]
#651588
09/15/10 04:01 PM
09/15/10 04:01 PM
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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I think someone did some measuring and figured out that 383 pistons would work in a 413 (bored to 4.25) with a 4.15 stroker crank. Not sure anyone has ever actually tried it, though.
That would make it a 472, BTW.
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
#651589
09/15/10 04:35 PM
09/15/10 04:35 PM
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 15,487
Florida
scratchnfotraction
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 15,487
Florida
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a 440 crank in a 400 block makes a 470 stroker would be sweet to make a 413/472 strokers as well I think I will swing by and pick up that MH 413 thats for sale in my town I think the odd looking wp and tall heads would deff be kool looking in my 85 truck should be fine for towing my 440 truck around instead of the 318 sb thats in it is 300$ a bad deal?,it runs and moves the MH down the road good,no smoke,noise..ect.. its just a PITA to pull out,hope they want to scrap it so I can 
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: scratchnfotraction]
#651590
09/15/10 05:13 PM
09/15/10 05:13 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,067
Irving, TX
feets
Senior Management
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Senior Management
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,067
Irving, TX
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$300 is pretty good for a running 413. It'll definately make that 318 feel anemic.
Remember that the water pump is a larger diameter than normal B/RBs. That's why rebuild gasket kits come with that weird oversize WP gasket. Those weird shape WP housing to block gaskets fit the industrial motors too.
The spark plugs are different as well.
We are brothers and sisters doing time on the planet for better or worse. I'll take the better, if you don't mind.
- Stu Harmon
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: feets]
#651591
09/15/10 08:37 PM
09/15/10 08:37 PM
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 223
Poplar Bluff, Missouri
partfiler69
Still Wondering
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Still Wondering
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 223
Poplar Bluff, Missouri
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$300 don't sound too bad, I gave $350 for mine, but was told it was a 440 and I didn't know any better at the time. And I never heard it run because the guy I got it from left the key on and burned up the points. But even with a budget build, it should do much better than that whipped 318 did. Or the orig 400 for that matter. I say go get it and be different.
Back from hiatus
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: scratchnfotraction]
#651593
09/15/10 09:28 PM
09/15/10 09:28 PM
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 223
Poplar Bluff, Missouri
partfiler69
Still Wondering
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Still Wondering
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 223
Poplar Bluff, Missouri
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IMO, you done good, mine also has an 8 bolt crank, It's a 1972 413. as far as any other differences, water pump and housing, heads, trans are a shorty style, don't know about the oil pan. I have heard the oil pans are MH specific, but we'll prolly have to wait 'till the Doctor is in.
Back from hiatus
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: partfiler69]
#651594
09/15/10 09:41 PM
09/15/10 09:41 PM
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
dOc !
The village idiot's idiot
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The village idiot's idiot
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
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Quote:
IMO, you done good, mine also has an 8 bolt crank, It's a 1972 413. as far as any other differences, water pump and housing, heads, trans are a shorty style, don't know about the oil pan. I have heard the oil pans are MH specific, but we'll prolly have to wait 'till the Doctor is in.
Bryan ... if that is a 8 bolt crank .. that is the first-one I have heard of anyone actually getting one. ALL I have ever seen is 6 bolts .. me-self. The oil-pans ? .. are for that chassis but most anything will work. The underneath is so open and has EZ access.
Mike .... is there anything else good off that MH ? .. like roof air and propane frig? ....maybe even fresh water tanks?
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: feets]
#651595
09/15/10 09:48 PM
09/15/10 09:48 PM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 21,813
Kirkland, Washington
Pacnorthcuda
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 21,813
Kirkland, Washington
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Quote:
That's why rebuild gasket kits come with that weird oversize WP gasket. Those weird shape WP housing to block gaskets fit the industrial motors too.
OMG---I was just going through my spare gaskets and thinking what the hell are these for?????? Thanks Feets! Now I know. I cut one up for another purpose thinking I sure ain't gonna use this for anything else! 
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: dOc !]
#651596
09/15/10 09:51 PM
09/15/10 09:51 PM
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 223
Poplar Bluff, Missouri
partfiler69
Still Wondering
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Still Wondering
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 223
Poplar Bluff, Missouri
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I'll check again tomorrow. I THOUGHT it had an 8 bolt crank but my memory is really not that great. I know it is nothin special. Just a 72 413 out of a 23ft class 3 MH
Back from hiatus
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: dOc !]
#651598
09/15/10 10:13 PM
09/15/10 10:13 PM
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 15,487
Florida
scratchnfotraction
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 15,487
Florida
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Doc,i remember you had asked about that when I got the 440 they have it pretty much gutted right now,I asked about them for ya though..nothing left,sorry they did have a small rv in the back,not sure on it,i will ask about it also for ya I am gonna go back and check what axle it has in it also so does a RB 440 intake swap on to it or was that a no? think it had a 2-v,I was   for got to take a good look at the carb and intake wanna check those mannys,and see if they work for me in a 85 truck,would be the only thing to hold me back i think IIRC no headers on those heads correct? 
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: dOc !]
#651599
09/15/10 10:20 PM
09/15/10 10:20 PM
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 223
Poplar Bluff, Missouri
partfiler69
Still Wondering
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Still Wondering
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 223
Poplar Bluff, Missouri
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This is bad, since i removed the flexplate today(the guy i bought it from cut one end off with a sawall removing the trans)but i don't remember how many bolts were on yhe crank, it just seemed like a lot. but like i said, i will check tomorrow.
Back from hiatus
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: dOc !]
#651600
09/15/10 10:23 PM
09/15/10 10:23 PM
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 2,042
Leucadia, Ca.
vdriver
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 2,042
Leucadia, Ca.
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Quote:
There were rumors flying-around that there WERE some MH/truck 413's with 8-bolt-cranks .. but I have never seen one OR heard of someone actually having-one. And I have quite-a-few of 'em ...me-self !!
BUT ..it could be ...
I own one. It came outta my old 413 Marine. The 8 holes are NON-threaded; it used bolts & nuts to hold the flywheel on.
Also, the rear flange - what the 'wheel bolts to - is extended an extra 3/4" rearward.
I might have a pic floating around....lemme check.
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: scratchnfotraction]
#651602
09/15/10 11:27 PM
09/15/10 11:27 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,067
Irving, TX
feets
Senior Management
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Senior Management
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,067
Irving, TX
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Quote:
so does a RB 440 intake swap on to it or was that a no?
think it had a 2-v,I was for got to take a good look at the carb and intake
wanna check those mannys,and see if they work for me in a 85 truck,would be the only thing to hold me back i think
IIRC no headers on those heads correct?
It should have a 2 bbl carb. The typical RB intake won't work on those heads. They use a wet intake with coolant passages.
I dropped one in a 1980 D100. The manifolds were TIGHT due to the straight down center dump and flange. The oil pan, dipstick, and mounts had to be changed.
I never got to fire mine up. I ran out of time and was moving out of state. I stored it at a buddy's place. His father took it to the salvage yard because it had locked up.
I distinctly remember mine being a cross bolted block. It was the first time I had ever laid eyes on that setup. I guess it was a unicorn because everybody tells me they weren't made like that. It came out of a big 1973 MH. That was back in 1993 and I don't recall all the details. However, I do recall looking at main bolts sticking out the side of the block.
We are brothers and sisters doing time on the planet for better or worse. I'll take the better, if you don't mind.
- Stu Harmon
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: vdriver]
#651603
09/15/10 11:59 PM
09/15/10 11:59 PM
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
dOc !
The village idiot's idiot
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The village idiot's idiot
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
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Quote:
I own one. It came outta my old 413 Marine.
v-guy ... ahhh .... marine .. I have zip experience with that - 'CEPT the stuff I am putting together with the Nicson mounts
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: feets]
#651604
09/16/10 12:18 AM
09/16/10 12:18 AM
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
dOc !
The village idiot's idiot
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The village idiot's idiot
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
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Quote:
Quote:
so does a RB 440 intake swap on to it or was that a no?
think it had a 2-v,I was for got to take a good look at the carb and intake
wanna check those mannys,and see if they work for me in a 85 truck,would be the only thing to hold me back i think
IIRC no headers on those heads correct?
It should have a 2 bbl carb. The typical RB intake won't work on those heads. They use a wet intake with coolant passages.
I dropped one in a 1980 D100. The manifolds were TIGHT due to the straight down center dump and flange. The oil pan, dipstick, and mounts had to be changed.
I never got to fire mine up. I ran out of time and was moving out of state. I stored it at a buddy's place. His father took it to the salvage yard because it had locked up.
I distinctly remember mine being a cross bolted block. It was the first time I had ever laid eyes on that setup. I guess it was a unicorn because everybody tells me they weren't made like that. It came out of a big 1973 MH. That was back in 1993 and I don't recall all the details. However, I do recall looking at main bolts sticking out the side of the block.
ON this post ...
ANY RB intake will work on these "goofy" heads - even a tunnelram! YES .. there was a 2bbl intake made for this motor ... but all I have ever seen them on is irrigation pumps !! And YES .. you can get headers for those heads.
feets ... the intake deal. That coolant passage is the SAME as the exh heat crossover. I have personally swapped-out a Streetmaster and SP2P intake on the 413 ... but you have to make sure the exh crossover is clean as a 
It is also advised to make up a tube that runs from the exh (very hot)side of the water pump ...into the intake to properly heat-it. On my Project-413 grunt/tow/mpg motor ... I am going to INSULATE the intake against heat LOSS.
Cross bolted(4 bolt mains) block ? .... I have never seen that 
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: dOc !]
#651605
09/16/10 01:44 PM
09/16/10 01:44 PM
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 223
Poplar Bluff, Missouri
partfiler69
Still Wondering
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Still Wondering
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 223
Poplar Bluff, Missouri
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My apologies, I went out there today, and it has a 6 bolt crank. Not an 8 bolt.Not to turn this into a swapmeet, but if anybody wants the 4bbl intake or heads off this 413, PM me. They are free to anybody who wants to pick them up or we can work out shipping if it is worthwile.
Back from hiatus
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Re: 413 motorhome engine ???"s
[Re: partfiler69]
#651606
09/16/10 01:52 PM
09/16/10 01:52 PM
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
dOc !
The village idiot's idiot
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The village idiot's idiot
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
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Bryan ...uNless someone is closer and/or can pick-them-up quicker ... I would like to have those parts that you don't need. I might be rolling-through the area on my way to TX, then to LA ...then to FL. Shipping this stuff would be a killer as far as costs ... BTW ....what are you going to do with the water-pump and exh mans? ... the intake is just scrap-metal.
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Doc?