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WHOA!!!! ....Problem has Been Solved...Finally!!!!! #494124
10/11/09 04:06 PM
10/11/09 04:06 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,530
Nunya CA
CR8CRSHR Offline OP
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CR8CRSHR  Offline OP
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Nunya CA
I have a post over on the General Board about my engine install yesterday but I need some Q&A with a problem I have encountered. First a brief rundown...

The motor is a 383 BB out of a 65 Monoco that was totaled so a rescue was done. The motor went into my 66 Satellite yesterday and quite smoothly I might add. A month or so ago I was reading a post here about the Oil Pan for a C Body not being able to clear a B Body K frame. It was suggested to obtain the "402" oil pan", of which I did, and a different Oil Pickup that would work with the 402 Oil Pan. I did the swap earlier last week and it appeared to be fine. However, yesterday when I went to bolt up the Torque Converter to the Flex Plate, I experienced a sudden stop as I rotated the front Crank Bolt to turn the flex plate to align the bolt holes. The Torque Converter rotates fine so I know that is not the problem. And I can rotate the Crank 360 degrees either way but I will still get a sudden "thunk" and it will stop. By process of elimination I have narrowed it down to the Crank stopping on some thing in the Oil Pan area. I know this because with the C Body Oil Pan and Pick up installed originally on the motor, the Crank would turn freely with no sudden stopping. I would occasionally turn the motor a few cranks while it was in storage and never had this occurrence. Now I have it...this sudden stop.... since swapping out the C Body Oil Pick up for the B Body Oil Pick Up and 402 Oil Pan. My question then is kind of multi in scope...

1. What is the correct oil pick up for the 402 Oil Pan?

2. Is it possible that I have the incorrect B Body Oil Pick Up and it is binding or hitting one of the Crank Journals? Remember I did not have this issue with the C Body Set Up.

3. What else could it be?

Now that the Motor has been installed, I will have to remove the Center Link to drop the Oil Pan to do a visual inspection. Not happy about that but I don't want to go through pulling the Motor again and that seems to be my only option to figure out what is taking place. And...This issue is mostly my doing as I neglected to OPs check my work while the Motor was on the stand which should have been done at that time. Isn't working on these MOPARS an on going thing???

OPINIONS and DISCUSSIONS Please....

Link to General Post:
https://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/show...e=0#Post5538507

Last edited by CR8CRSHR; 10/22/09 01:30 PM.
Re: WHOA!!!! Need some advise and opinions.... [Re: CR8CRSHR] #494125
10/11/09 04:26 PM
10/11/09 04:26 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 28,312
Cincinnati, Ohio
Challenger 1 Offline
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Cincinnati, Ohio
Is a torque converter bolt hitting the block?

Re: WHOA!!!! Need some advise and opinions.... [Re: Challenger 1] #494126
10/11/09 05:16 PM
10/11/09 05:16 PM
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Nunya CA
CR8CRSHR Offline OP
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No. No Torque Converter bolts have been installed. The sudden stop comes when the Crank Bolt on the front is rotated to move/rotate the Flex Plate. And it will do it 360 degrees in the opposite direction.

Re: WHOA!!!! Need some advise and opinions.... [Re: CR8CRSHR] #494127
10/11/09 05:21 PM
10/11/09 05:21 PM
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Posts: 32,909
Grand Prairie,Texas
stumpy Offline
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Drop the pan. You've got a rod or crank throw hiiting something.

Re: WHOA!!!! Need some advise and opinions.... [Re: stumpy] #494128
10/11/09 06:01 PM
10/11/09 06:01 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,530
Nunya CA
CR8CRSHR Offline OP
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Stumpy...Thanks a bunch. That is my take as well but thought I would ask here first cause most likely someone else has experienced the exact same thing. Oh well...Back on the concrete again. This time I will use some more padding....

Re: WHOA!!!! Need some advise and opinions.... [Re: CR8CRSHR] #494129
10/11/09 06:16 PM
10/11/09 06:16 PM
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Posts: 20,460
Eagle, Idaho
Neil Offline
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Never messed with a big block, but wouldn't the factory pickup fit every B engine? It's not like the block or crank is any different. If the oil pan wasn't the right one for the pickup you'd think that it wouldn't even go together????

Don't feel bad, I put a Milodon windage tray on my smallblock and found out that it was a hair too wide and the outer end of the rod would touch it when the engine was rotated over. You couldn't feel it, but you could just barely hear it. Would have made a nice $$$$ mess had I not noticed it.....

BTW everything on mine cleared just fine on the engine stand until the oil pan went on and it flexed the windage tray inward a little too far.

Last edited by Neil; 10/11/09 06:18 PM.
Re: WHOA!!!! Need some advise and opinions.... [Re: Neil] #494130
10/11/09 06:51 PM
10/11/09 06:51 PM
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Posts: 531
USA
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540DUSTER Offline
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USA
engine locked up on me once,and the bolts I used for the bottom pulley were too long and hitting the cover.

Re: WHOA!!!! Need some advise and opinions.... [Re: 540DUSTER] #494131
10/11/09 07:04 PM
10/11/09 07:04 PM
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Cooperstown, NY
jrlegacy23 Offline
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Quote:

engine locked up on me once,and the bolts I used for the bottom pulley were too long and hitting the cover.



Check the water pump pulley bolts also... I may have put a too long of a bolt in once.

Last edited by jrlegacy23; 10/12/09 02:56 AM.

[color:"#00FF00"]68 Fastback Barracuda with some stuff[/color]

Re: WHOA!!!! Need some advise and opinions.... [Re: 540DUSTER] #494132
10/11/09 09:58 PM
10/11/09 09:58 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 32,909
Grand Prairie,Texas
stumpy Offline
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Quote:

engine locked up on me once,and the bolts I used for the bottom pulley were too long and hitting the cover.



That's a possibility also and real easy to check.

Re: WHOA!!!! Need some advise and opinions.... [Re: stumpy] #494133
10/12/09 06:10 AM
10/12/09 06:10 AM
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South-Central (Sebring), FL
Commando1 Offline
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Quote:

Drop the pan. You've got a rod or crank throw hiiting something.





Re: WHOA!!!! Need some advise and opinions.... [Re: CR8CRSHR] #494134
10/12/09 10:06 AM
10/12/09 10:06 AM
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Cincinnati, Ohio
Challenger 1 Offline
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For the record, It sounds like it's something external. Good luck finding it and let us know.

Re: WHOA!!!! Need some advise and opinions.... [Re: Challenger 1] #494135
10/12/09 01:11 PM
10/12/09 01:11 PM
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Posts: 2,530
Nunya CA
CR8CRSHR Offline OP
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CR8CRSHR  Offline OP
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Nope..I seriously doubt it is an H2O pump bolt. As I said initially, with the C Body oil pan and pick up the motor would crank without any issues. This issue has come about after the swap to the 402 oil pan and pick up. As for an external cause, can you possibly be a little more specific in your point. I don't see where anything external that would interfere as I can clearly hear and feel it when I rotate the front crank bolt and listen for the stop...

Re: WHOA!!!! Need some advise and opinions.... [Re: Challenger 1] #494136
10/12/09 01:16 PM
10/12/09 01:16 PM

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Quote:

For the record, It sounds like it's something external. Good luck finding it and let us know.



yup. prolly the flex plate hitting the tranny housing.

Re: WHOA!!!! Need some advise and opinions.... #494137
10/12/09 01:21 PM
10/12/09 01:21 PM
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Ontario, Canada
Dodgem Offline
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My bet is the crank is hitting the oil pickup! you won't be the first to experience this! LOL!!
You should always check for 360 crank rotation when installing an oil pick up. probably a slight repositioning will solve it!!
Sucks to do on your back in the car!!
Have a hoist??

Re: WHOA!!!! Need some advise and opinions.... [Re: Dodgem] #494138
10/12/09 01:29 PM
10/12/09 01:29 PM
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Posts: 10,696
North Dakota
6PakBee Offline
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You mentioned the engine is a salvage engine. Did it turn over before you swapped pans/pickups? I'm going to throw my vote in with the "it's something external" group. If you have a stock big block pickup, and you were able to get a stock pan on without bending something, I'm having a real hard time seeing how the rotating assembly is hitting the pan or the pickup. I've never had an interference with stock parts. Now if you left a wrench in the oil pan.........


"We live in a time when intelligent people are being silenced so that stupid people won't be offended".
Re: WHOA!!!! Need some advise and opinions.... [Re: 6PakBee] #494139
10/12/09 02:38 PM
10/12/09 02:38 PM
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Posts: 4,861
Riverside, Ca
R70RUNNER Offline
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Quote:

You mentioned the engine is a salvage engine. Did it turn over before you swapped pans/pickups? I'm going to throw my vote in with the "it's something external" group. If you have a stock big block pickup, and you were able to get a stock pan on without bending something, I'm having a real hard time seeing how the rotating assembly is hitting the pan or the pickup. I've never had an interference with stock parts. Now if you left a wrench in the oil pan.........




if you got the 402 pan on with the correct pickup, honestly they fit only one way, IIRC the thing is interference fit as is if the pickup were rotated even a bit I don't see how you could've gotten the pan on!

Another vote for trying the external things first...release all the belts, back out the lower pulley bolts, flex plate bolts.


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Re: WHOA!!!! Need some advise and opinions.... [Re: 6PakBee] #494140
10/12/09 05:40 PM
10/12/09 05:40 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,530
Nunya CA
CR8CRSHR Offline OP
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CR8CRSHR  Offline OP
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Quote:

You mentioned the engine is a salvage engine. Did it turn over before you swapped pans/pickups? I'm going to throw my vote in with the "it's something external" group. If you have a stock big block pickup, and you were able to get a stock pan on without bending something, I'm having a real hard time seeing how the rotating assembly is hitting the pan or the pickup. I've never had an interference with stock parts. Now if you left a wrench in the oil pan.........




Yes it is a salvage motor/383. However it has been completely re-built with all new items except for the crank and rods. All else is brand new. And as I said in my OP the motor turned over fine with the C Body oil pan and pick up. Now with the 402 pan and pick it stops. But I will be as thorough on this. Also not hoist yet...got the shop, just no $$$$'s right now for the lift/hoist. I will jack the car up in the garage and use jack stands to make access as easy as possible...Keep it coming...

Re: WHOA!!!! Need some advise and opinions.... [Re: CR8CRSHR] #494141
10/12/09 09:06 PM
10/12/09 09:06 PM
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Posts: 10,696
North Dakota
6PakBee Offline
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Sorry. I missed your comment about it turning over freely with the 'C' body setup. I still can't believe it's the pan/pickup.


"We live in a time when intelligent people are being silenced so that stupid people won't be offended".
Re: WHOA!!!! Need some advise and opinions.... [Re: 6PakBee] #494142
10/13/09 01:05 AM
10/13/09 01:05 AM
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Posts: 3,319
Chicago Burbs
sthemi Offline
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My bet is the torque convertor bolts hitting the back of the block. The convertor can slide forward on in crank and if the bolts are not in tight they will hit and make the clunk you are hearing..
Pull the convetor bolts and check if the engine cranks...

Re: WHOA!!!! Need some advise and opinions....Urgent Update [Re: CR8CRSHR] #494143
10/17/09 06:09 PM
10/17/09 06:09 PM
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Posts: 2,530
Nunya CA
CR8CRSHR Offline OP
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Well...I just got through checking the bottom end after dropping the Center Link and Oil Pan. All is OK with no interference of the Oil Pickup, Windage Tray, or 402 Oil Pan. I have narrowed down the problem to the Rotating Assembly. Specifically there is a Piston that has some sort of blockage when the Crank is Rotated 360 degrees either way and causing the whole thing to stop. I am going to have to pull the Motor and tear it down to the block to see what is causing this. I know the Crank is fine as the inspection while the Pan was off did not produce any visual indications. Hopefully it is something minor and not a busted Piston Ring. Perhaps my builder left something in there but I cannot be sure till I get the heads off. And to add further insult to injury, the .020 head gaskets are out of stock with Summit Racing and the alternative is 159.00. Can I reuse the head gaskets if the Motor has never been fired? Is there a "crush factor" or if I re-use them on the respective bank and head should they be OK when re-torquing the head bolts? I have the .020 head gaskets on there already. What's a person to do??????

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