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can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? #446838
08/23/09 10:12 AM
08/23/09 10:12 AM
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Illinois
moparmattkos Offline OP
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I need to know what the easist way to set a pinion angle with a 4 link system. I have been told to put a angel finder on the crank pulley and get the angle is that right?


www.sikosracing.net Heads up Drag racing
Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: moparmattkos] #446839
08/23/09 10:23 AM
08/23/09 10:23 AM
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On the south side of Nowhere
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Here's an online course.

"PINION ANGLE"

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: S/ST 3040] #446840
08/23/09 10:51 AM
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Just PM Quktree or sixpackgut


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Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: S/ST 3040] #446841
08/23/09 11:02 AM
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, PA
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Check out MOPARTS TECH archives. If its not there it should be seems like a weekly ? Or try search

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: moparniac] #446842
08/23/09 11:08 AM
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Just PM Quktree or sixpackgut




Yeah there is tech video on the here somewhere, very informative


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Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: DemonDust] #446843
08/23/09 12:48 PM
08/23/09 12:48 PM
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BROOK PARK, OH
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Do you still have my #









Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: moparmattkos] #446844
08/23/09 01:38 PM
08/23/09 01:38 PM
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Akron, Ohio
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Now where's that video Dram made?


1970 Challenger, all aluminum 528 Hemi, HDK suspension, Tremec 5 speed manual
Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: moparmattkos] #446845
08/23/09 01:43 PM
08/23/09 01:43 PM
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Polson, MT
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You are correct. Pinion angle is the relationship between the pinion centerline and the crank/transmission centerline.

Make the pinion parallel to the transmission as a base-line, then pivot the pinion downward 2-3 degrees. In other words, the resulting pinion angle will be 2-3 degrees under parallel (nose down) to the transmission centerline when the car is at rest.

BTW, there are some jokers around here who say I'm telling you to index the transmission angle relative to the pinion instead of the other way around.

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: DoctorDiff] #446846
08/23/09 01:53 PM
08/23/09 01:53 PM
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Quote:

You are correct. Pinion angle is the relationship between the pinion centerline and the crank/transmission centerline.

Make the pinion parallel to the transmission as a base-line, then pivot the pinion downward 2-3 degrees. In other words, the resulting pinion angle will be 2-3 degrees under parallel (nose down) to the transmission centerline when the car is at rest.

BTW, there are some jokers around here who say I'm telling you to index the transmission angle relative to the pinion instead of the other way around.




I see a movie being made now of drdiff by the haters

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: Quicktree] #446847
08/23/09 02:27 PM
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Cleveland
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No DR Diff hater here. I just wish he lived closer than BuzzardBreath Wyoming. I'd have a dana in my minivan !!


Join the quickest team in motorsports. Team FireCore. CustomWiresets.com
Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: sunroofgtx] #446848
08/23/09 05:05 PM
08/23/09 05:05 PM
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Bend,OR USA
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Quote:

No DR Diff hater here. I just wish he lived closer than BuzzardBreath Wyoming. I'd have a dana in my minivan !!


Bad excuse, UPS, Fed Ex abd others deliver get one now before Quicktree breaks all of them even Quicktree can't break a Dana 60


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: Cab_Burge] #446849
08/23/09 05:25 PM
08/23/09 05:25 PM
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Quote:

Quote:

No DR Diff hater here. I just wish he lived closer than BuzzardBreath Wyoming. I'd have a dana in my minivan !!


Bad excuse, UPS, Fed Ex abd others deliver get one now before Quicktree breaks all of them even Quicktree can't break a Dana 60




I am going to try like hell

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: Quicktree] #446850
08/23/09 05:28 PM
08/23/09 05:28 PM
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SE Michigan
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Quote:


I am going to try like hell




just wait for Ray to get back from his boon doggle with you know who and have him set it up.

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: TS3303] #446851
08/23/09 06:05 PM
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Quote:


I am going to try like hell




just wait for Ray to get back from his boon doggle with you know who and have him set it up.




yea but no thanks

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: DoctorDiff] #446852
08/23/09 09:28 PM
08/23/09 09:28 PM

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Quote:

You are correct. Pinion angle is the relationship between the pinion centerline and the crank/transmission centerline.

Make the pinion parallel to the transmission as a base-line, then pivot the pinion downward 2-3 degrees. In other words, the resulting pinion angle will be 2-3 degrees under parallel (nose down) to the transmission centerline when the car is at rest.............




I gotta say that I respectfully disagree with doing it that way........at least with a leaf spring car anyway.........

On my cars, and anything with decent power, especially with a stick, I'd always set the pinion down 7* with relationship to the driveshaft and it's ALWAYS worked great.......but, after reading here on Moparts how I need to set it to the crank centerline by Tony (Quicktree) so many times, I decided to do it that way on my just finished 68 GTS...........but first I've got to warn you that I did put 1" spacers between the K-frame and the body to lower the engine in the car which points the tail housing up a few degrees............

I set the pinion angle 7* down from the crankshaft center line and the car was fine until I let off the gas and it howled SO BAD I thought the rearend was was going to come apart.......... so, thanks to all the pinion angle threads on Moparts, I had to pull the rearend back out, cut the perches off, and reweld them back on.........this time with the angle 7* down from the driveshaft and it works GREAT now.........

So, I will NEVER set pinion angle that way again.........that's my on this.........

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? #446853
08/23/09 09:38 PM
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Quote:

Quote:

You are correct. Pinion angle is the relationship between the pinion centerline and the crank/transmission centerline.

Make the pinion parallel to the transmission as a base-line, then pivot the pinion downward 2-3 degrees. In other words, the resulting pinion angle will be 2-3 degrees under parallel (nose down) to the transmission centerline when the car is at rest.............




I gotta say that I respectfully disagree with doing it that way........at least with a leaf spring car anyway.........

On my cars, and anything with decent power, especially with a stick, I'd always set the pinion down 7* with relationship to the driveshaft and it's ALWAYS worked great.......but, after reading here on Moparts how I need to set it to the crank centerline by Tony (Quicktree) so many times, I decided to do it that way on my just finished 68 GTS...........but first I've got to warn you that I did put 1" spacers between the K-frame and the body to lower the engine in the car which points the tail housing up a few degrees............

I set the pinion angle 7* down from the crankshaft center line and the car was fine until I let off the gas and it howled SO BAD I thought the rearend was was going to come apart.......... so, thanks to all the pinion angle threads on Moparts, I had to pull the rearend back out, cut the perches off, and reweld them back on.........this time with the angle 7* down from the driveshaft and it works GREAT now.........

So, I will NEVER set pinion angle that way again.........that's my on this.........




ever think 7 maybe to much and I didn't invent the method. it is taught by people who run a lot faster than you or I will ever run. think about the purpose of setting pinion angle. setting it off of the drive shaft ignores the front ujoint totally. ever think the springs maybe wearing out letting the pinon go more than the desired amount? remember the guess of 7* down or what ever is just a guess. no way to figure out the perfect amount except trail and error or maybe some kind of video.

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: Quicktree] #446854
08/23/09 09:43 PM
08/23/09 09:43 PM

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Quote:



ever think 7 maybe to much and I didn't invent the method. it is taught by people who run a lot faster than you or I will ever run. think about the purpose of setting pinion angle. setting it off of the drive shaft ignores the front ujoint totally. ever think the springs maybe wearing out letting the pinon go more than the desired amount? remember the guess of 7* down or what ever is just a guess. no way to figure out the perfect amount except trail and error or maybe some kind of video.




Like I'd mentioned.......that was with a leaf spring car, and it does have slicks, and it does make close to 600HP, and I does launch like I stole it......and I doesn't want the driveshaft to smack the floor pan when I do........been there, done that.....

The thing you're forgetting is that a LOT of places recommend 6 to 7* pinion angle with a leaf spring car that's making some poop, and my car would not work doing it that way.............that's all I'm saying........

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? #446855
08/23/09 09:47 PM
08/23/09 09:47 PM
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NEVER had a 4 link ... but 7 degrees ?

On a suspension that should have ZERO change of pinion angle through the up and down movement.

That type of an angle is costing power.

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? #446856
08/23/09 09:50 PM
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Quote:

Quote:



ever think 7 maybe to much and I didn't invent the method. it is taught by people who run a lot faster than you or I will ever run. think about the purpose of setting pinion angle. setting it off of the drive shaft ignores the front ujoint totally. ever think the springs maybe wearing out letting the pinon go more than the desired amount? remember the guess of 7* down or what ever is just a guess. no way to figure out the perfect amount except trail and error or maybe some kind of video.




Like I'd mentioned.......that was with a leaf spring car, and it does have slicks, and it does make close to 600HP, and I does launch like I stole it......and I doesn't want the driveshaft to smack the floor pan when I do........been there, done that.....

The thing you're forgetting is that a LOT of places recommend 6 to 7* pinion angle with a leaf spring car that's making some poop, and my car would not work doing it that way.............that's all I'm saying........




another thing, not many if any leaf cars have a motor/tranny centerline angle going up.. just something to think about before you condem the method.

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: dOc !] #446857
08/23/09 09:51 PM
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What about leafspring caltracs


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Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: dOc !] #446858
08/23/09 09:52 PM
08/23/09 09:52 PM

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Quote:

NEVER had a 4 link ... but 7 degrees ?

On a suspension that should have ZERO change of pinion angle through the up and down movement.

That type of an angle is costing power.




In BOTH of my replies, I said LEAF SPRINGS.........

and with the pinion angle down 7* with a 4 link, it isn't losing an ET.......but that's for another thread.......

Quote:

another thing, not many if any leaf cars have a motor/tranny centerline angle going up.. just something to think about before you condem the method.





What's that got to do with anything? What's the output shaft angle in a jacked up 4 wheel drive truck in relationship to the pinion???? UP????


Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: moparniac] #446859
08/23/09 09:52 PM
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Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? #446860
08/23/09 09:56 PM
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B S ...I did not read each and every post in detail...I was responding to mm's topic ...and that several people were saying 7 degrees.

And I disagree ... 7 down will cost power(maybe not much) ...on something that does-not need-it.

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: moparniac] #446861
08/23/09 09:56 PM
08/23/09 09:56 PM

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I've seen that drawing here on Moparts a MILLION times and I understand it completely......but I did it that way, and it howled like a stuck hog when letting off the throttle.........so I'm not doing it that way ever again.........

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: dOc !] #446862
08/23/09 09:59 PM
08/23/09 09:59 PM

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Quote:

B S ...I did not read each and every post in detail...I was responding to mm's topic ...and that several people were saying 7 degrees.

And I disagree ... 7 down will cost power(maybe not much) ...on something that does-not need-it.





I said it wouldn't lose ET.......and that's all that matters........as long as it doesn't go above zero, you're peeing in the ocean to raise the tide and it's not even measureable.........

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? #446863
08/23/09 09:59 PM
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Quote:

Quote:

NEVER had a 4 link ... but 7 degrees ?

On a suspension that should have ZERO change of pinion angle through the up and down movement.

That type of an angle is costing power.




In BOTH of my replies, I said LEAF SPRINGS.........

and with the pinion angle down 7* with a 4 link, it isn't losing an ET.......but that's for another thread.......

Quote:

another thing, not many if any leaf cars have a motor/tranny centerline angle going up.. just something to think about before you condem the method.





What's that got to do with anything? What's the output shaft angle in a jacked up 4 wheel drive truck in relationship to the pinion???? UP????






have no idea, never drag raced a 4 wheel drive. I hear that brought up a lot but don't know why it's mentioned when setting up a drag car. bottom line you have to do what works for you

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: Quicktree] #446864
08/23/09 10:06 PM
08/23/09 10:06 PM

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Quote:



What's that got to do with anything? What's the output shaft angle in a jacked up 4 wheel drive truck in relationship to the pinion???? UP????






Quote:

have no idea, never drag raced a 4 wheel drive. I hear that brought up a lot but don't know why it's mentioned when setting up a drag car. bottom line you have to do what works for you




I compared it to them because you brought up me having lowered my K-frame which raised the tailshaft a few degrees.........

That's what I'm saying........it doesn't necessarily work.......There's a window where either way will work fine and NOBODY would be able to measure any ET difference anyway........I found out where the way you guys do it wouldn't work and I wanted to let people know......

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? #446865
08/23/09 10:08 PM
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Quote:



Like I'd mentioned.......that was with a leaf spring car, and it does have slicks, and it does make close to 600HP, and I does launch like I stole it......and I doesn't want the driveshaft to smack the floor pan when I do........been there, done that.....

The thing you're forgetting is that a LOT of places recommend 6 to 7* pinion angle with a leaf spring car that's making some poop, and my car would not work doing it that way.............that's all I'm saying........




I'll face the firing squad with ya Big I've kept my mouth shut while this subject has been debated here, but for 25+ years I've done it your way and never had a problem. For a leaf spring car, I line up the driveshaft with the pinion, then push the nose of the pinion down around 5 degrees. I just leave the u-bolts loose and push the rear end where I want it, then weld the perches.

Theory-craft and books are nice, but what works in practical application in the field and what the book says don't always jibe.

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: Quicktree] #446866
08/23/09 10:08 PM
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my way, Monte's way amd Wolfe race cars way http://www.wolferacecraft.com/pinionangle.aspx

enough said.

The Joker


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Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: sixpackgut] #446867
08/23/09 10:14 PM
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Quote:

my way, Monte's way amd Wolfe race cars way http://www.wolferacecraft.com/pinionangle.aspx

enough said.

The Joker




enough said if you buy into that, you can also find just as many who set it the other way. really I don't care how anybody sets theirs. people have to decide for themselves and learn the hard way I guess. now go make you another movie.

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: Quicktree] #446868
08/23/09 10:23 PM
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Quote:

Quote:

my way, Monte's way amd Wolfe race cars way http://www.wolferacecraft.com/pinionangle.aspx

enough said.

The Joker




enough said if you buy into that, you can also find just as many who set it the other way. really I don't care how anybody sets theirs. people have to decide for themselves and learn the hard way I guess. now go make you another movie.




untill you build a 4.70 1/8th mile stock suspension car i will keep listening to the guys who do. no need for a movie


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Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: sixpackgut] #446869
08/23/09 10:26 PM
08/23/09 10:26 PM
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Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

my way, Monte's way amd Wolfe race cars way http://www.wolferacecraft.com/pinionangle.aspx

enough said.

The Joker




enough said if you buy into that, you can also find just as many who set it the other way. really I don't care how anybody sets theirs. people have to decide for themselves and learn the hard way I guess. now go make you another movie.




untill you build a 4.70 1/8th mile stock suspension car i will keep listening to the guys who do. no need for a movie




have at it. cause I have no desire to build a stock suspension 4.70 car.

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: Quicktree] #446870
08/23/09 10:29 PM
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I have a dumb question as usual! What if a guy like me is putting in a dana 60 from previously having a 8 3/4 which I am and dont have a driveshaft yet to go off the driveshaft method cause I need to set the car on its suspension and roll the pinion down and weld in the perches and need the rear done to get actual measuremnet for a new driveshaft

Last edited by *WeDgiE*; 08/23/09 10:30 PM.

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Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: Quicktree] #446871
08/23/09 10:29 PM
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Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

my way, Monte's way amd Wolfe race cars way http://www.wolferacecraft.com/pinionangle.aspx

enough said.

The Joker




enough said if you buy into that, you can also find just as many who set it the other way. really I don't care how anybody sets theirs. people have to decide for themselves and learn the hard way I guess. now go make you another movie.




untill you build a 4.70 1/8th mile stock suspension car i will keep listening to the guys who do. no need for a movie




have at it. cause I have no desire to build a stock suspension 4.70 car.





why not u sceeeeered

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: moparniac] #446872
08/23/09 10:32 PM
08/23/09 10:32 PM
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Quote:

I have a dumb question as usual! What if a guy like me is putting in a dana 60 from previously having a 8 3/4 which I am and dont have a driveshaft yet to go off the driveshaft method cause I need to set the car on its suspension and roll the pinion down and weld in the perches and need the rear done to get actual measuremnet for a new driveshaft




pinion angle is the last thing you do no matter which method you use. so you will have a shaft by then or you wont be racing anyway

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: weedlayer] #446873
08/23/09 10:34 PM
08/23/09 10:34 PM
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Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

my way, Monte's way amd Wolfe race cars way http://www.wolferacecraft.com/pinionangle.aspx

enough said.

The Joker




enough said if you buy into that, you can also find just as many who set it the other way. really I don't care how anybody sets theirs. people have to decide for themselves and learn the hard way I guess. now go make you another movie.




untill you build a 4.70 1/8th mile stock suspension car i will keep listening to the guys who do. no need for a movie




have at it. cause I have no desire to build a stock suspension 4.70 car.





why not u sceeeeered




no not really, you sponsor it and I will build and drive it. how does that sound? when can I expect the first sponsor check?

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: Quicktree] #446874
08/23/09 10:38 PM
08/23/09 10:38 PM
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Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: Quicktree] #446875
08/23/09 10:40 PM
08/23/09 10:40 PM
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Charleston
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Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

my way, Monte's way amd Wolfe race cars way http://www.wolferacecraft.com/pinionangle.aspx

enough said.

The Joker




enough said if you buy into that, you can also find just as many who set it the other way. really I don't care how anybody sets theirs. people have to decide for themselves and learn the hard way I guess. now go make you another movie.




untill you build a 4.70 1/8th mile stock suspension car i will keep listening to the guys who do. no need for a movie




have at it. cause I have no desire to build a stock suspension 4.70 car.




so what do you desire? just pretending your a chassis guru?

wedgie's nonsensical chart

trans angle 2* down(like most mopars) set pinion angle 2* up. now the rear and trans centerline are in parallel. then what? what is the pinion angle at this point Mr Quicktree? is it ZERO? What if Calvert said to set pinion angle 2* down, ok, now the driveshaft is in a straight line with the pinion(a big no no on the chart) although not a big deal on a mopar because the engine is off center and there will still be movement inside the U joints BUT if the engine and rear are in line, this doesnt work. neither does setup on a stock suspension with just leaf springs.

i really wish you would explain your way better because the only lesson learned was big squeeze trying it your way and it doesnt work


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Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: sixpackgut] #446876
08/23/09 10:45 PM
08/23/09 10:45 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 32,394
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Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

my way, Monte's way amd Wolfe race cars way http://www.wolferacecraft.com/pinionangle.aspx

enough said.

The Joker




enough said if you buy into that, you can also find just as many who set it the other way. really I don't care how anybody sets theirs. people have to decide for themselves and learn the hard way I guess. now go make you another movie.




untill you build a 4.70 1/8th mile stock suspension car i will keep listening to the guys who do. no need for a movie




have at it. cause I have no desire to build a stock suspension 4.70 car.




so what do you desire? just pretending your a chassis guru?

wedgie's nonsensical chart

trans angle 2* down(like most mopars) set pinion angle 2* up. now the rear and trans centerline are in parallel. then what? what is the pinion angle at this point Mr Quicktree? is it ZERO? What if Calvert said to set pinion angle 2* down, ok, now the driveshaft is in a straight line with the pinion(a big no no on the chart) although not a big deal on a mopar because the engine is off center and there will still be movement inside the U joints BUT if the engine and rear are in line, this doesnt work. neither does setup on a stock suspension with just leaf springs.

i really wish you would explain your way better because the only lesson learned was big squeeze trying it your way and it doesnt work




I don't pretend to be anything, I am just an old bracket racer and do what works for me.

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: Quicktree] #446877
08/23/09 10:47 PM
08/23/09 10:47 PM
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Posts: 9,225
Charleston
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sixpackgut Offline
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Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

my way, Monte's way amd Wolfe race cars way http://www.wolferacecraft.com/pinionangle.aspx

enough said.

The Joker




enough said if you buy into that, you can also find just as many who set it the other way. really I don't care how anybody sets theirs. people have to decide for themselves and learn the hard way I guess. now go make you another movie.




untill you build a 4.70 1/8th mile stock suspension car i will keep listening to the guys who do. no need for a movie




have at it. cause I have no desire to build a stock suspension 4.70 car.





why not u sceeeeered




no not really, you sponsor it and I will build and drive it. how does that sound? when can I expect the first sponsor check?





car never make it off the starting line and you would be blaming all the horsepower you make to the guys cleaning up the gear oil


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Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: sixpackgut] #446878
08/23/09 10:50 PM
08/23/09 10:50 PM
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Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

my way, Monte's way amd Wolfe race cars way http://www.wolferacecraft.com/pinionangle.aspx

enough said.

The Joker




enough said if you buy into that, you can also find just as many who set it the other way. really I don't care how anybody sets theirs. people have to decide for themselves and learn the hard way I guess. now go make you another movie.




untill you build a 4.70 1/8th mile stock suspension car i will keep listening to the guys who do. no need for a movie




have at it. cause I have no desire to build a stock suspension 4.70 car.





why not u sceeeeered




no not really, you sponsor it and I will build and drive it. how does that sound? when can I expect the first sponsor check?





car never make it off the starting line and you would be blaming all the horsepower you make to the guys cleaning up the gear oil




oh yea? where have you ever seen me say anything about making big HP? thats something you have made up to be funny.my junk don't make a lot OF HP and I really don't care.

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: Quicktree] #446879
08/23/09 10:57 PM
08/23/09 10:57 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225
Charleston
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sixpackgut Offline
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Charleston
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

my way, Monte's way amd Wolfe race cars way http://www.wolferacecraft.com/pinionangle.aspx

enough said.

The Joker




enough said if you buy into that, you can also find just as many who set it the other way. really I don't care how anybody sets theirs. people have to decide for themselves and learn the hard way I guess. now go make you another movie.




untill you build a 4.70 1/8th mile stock suspension car i will keep listening to the guys who do. no need for a movie




have at it. cause I have no desire to build a stock suspension 4.70 car.





why not u sceeeeered




no not really, you sponsor it and I will build and drive it. how does that sound? when can I expect the first sponsor check?





car never make it off the starting line and you would be blaming all the horsepower you make to the guys cleaning up the gear oil




oh yea? where have you ever seen me say anything about making big HP? thats something you have made up to be funny.my junk don't make a lot OF HP and I really don't care.




are you feeding me for thanksgiving

Also, Big Squeeze, beautiful car

Last edited by sixpackgut; 08/23/09 11:09 PM.

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Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: sixpackgut] #446880
08/23/09 10:59 PM
08/23/09 10:59 PM
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Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? #446881
08/24/09 12:27 AM
08/24/09 12:27 AM
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Polson, MT
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Wayne,

7 degrees is too much negative pinion angle. If you are going to quote me, please post where I told you to run that much.

This isn't rocket science. Depending on the ride height and drivetrain angle of the car, setting pinion angle off the driveshaft is purely hit or miss.

For example, assume your race car's pinion angle is set perfectly and the car has no vibration.

If you raised the engine in the front 3 degrees, changing the drivetrain angle downward, the correct way to compensate for this would be to increase the pinion angle 3 degrees POSITIVE, because it keeps the pinion parallel to what you had before.

If you tried to set the pinion angle off the driveshaft alone, you would increase the pinion angle 3 degrees NEGATIVE, most likely causing a severe vibration because of U-joint binding.

BTW, this is also the correct method to set pinion angle on a lifted 4 x 4 truck with a 1 piece driveshaft:

1. Make the pinion parallel to the transmsission.
2. If pinion binds, lower transmission in the rear.
3. Reset pinion parallel to transmission.
4. If pinion still binds, install a CV joint on the transmission, and point the pinion directly toward the CV joint.

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: sixpackgut] #446882
08/24/09 02:06 AM
08/24/09 02:06 AM
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 4,384
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"oh yea? where have you ever seen me say anything about making big HP? thats something you have made up to be funny.my junk don't make a lot OF HP and I really don't care. "



So then your pinion angle is set wrong if you are breaking rear ends .

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: DoctorDiff] #446883
08/24/09 02:06 AM
08/24/09 02:06 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225
Charleston
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sixpackgut Offline
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Quote:

Wayne,

7 degrees is too much negative pinion angle. If you are going to quote me, please post where I told you to run that much.

This isn't rocket science. Depending on the ride height and drivetrain angle of the car, setting pinion angle off the driveshaft is purely hit or miss.

For example, assume your race car's pinion angle is set perfectly and the car has no vibration.

If you raised the engine in the front 3 degrees, changing the drivetrain angle downward, the correct way to compensate for this would be to increase the pinion angle 3 degrees POSITIVE, because it keeps the pinion parallel to what you had before.

If you tried to set the pinion angle off the driveshaft alone, you would increase the pinion angle 3 degrees NEGATIVE, most likely causing a severe vibration because of U-joint binding.

BTW, this is also the correct method to set pinion angle on a lifted 4 x 4 truck with a 1 piece driveshaft:

1. Make the pinion parallel to the transmsission.
2. If pinion binds, lower transmission in the rear.
3. Reset pinion parallel to transmission.
4. If pinion still binds, install a CV joint on the transmission, and point the pinion directly toward the CV joint.





your way, what is pinion angle when trans and rear are parellel? ZERO???? SOMEONE PLEASE ANSWER THIS QUESTION BECAUSE NO ONE EVER DOES


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Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: 493_DART] #446884
08/24/09 05:02 AM
08/24/09 05:02 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
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Quote:


"oh yea? where have you ever seen me say anything about making big HP? thats something you have made up to be funny.my junk don't make a lot OF HP and I really don't care. "



So then your pinion angle is set wrong if you are breaking rear ends .




the rear ends that broke had nothing to do with pinion angle, thats another myth made up by sixpackgut. they were 30 year old passenger car rears.

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: sixpackgut] #446885
08/24/09 05:04 AM
08/24/09 05:04 AM
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Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

my way, Monte's way amd Wolfe race cars way http://www.wolferacecraft.com/pinionangle.aspx

enough said.

The Joker




enough said if you buy into that, you can also find just as many who set it the other way. really I don't care how anybody sets theirs. people have to decide for themselves and learn the hard way I guess. now go make you another movie.




untill you build a 4.70 1/8th mile stock suspension car i will keep listening to the guys who do. no need for a movie




have at it. cause I have no desire to build a stock suspension 4.70 car.





why not u sceeeeered




no not really, you sponsor it and I will build and drive it. how does that sound? when can I expect the first sponsor check?





car never make it off the starting line and you would be blaming all the horsepower you make to the guys cleaning up the gear oil




oh yea? where have you ever seen me say anything about making big HP? thats something you have made up to be funny.my junk don't make a lot OF HP and I really don't care.




are you feeding me for thanksgiving

Also, Big Squeeze, beautiful car




yea I'll still feed you, but your probably not going to like the taste of what I am thinking about...

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: sixpackgut] #446886
08/24/09 05:11 AM
08/24/09 05:11 AM
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Quote:

Quote:

Wayne,

7 degrees is too much negative pinion angle. If you are going to quote me, please post where I told you to run that much.

This isn't rocket science. Depending on the ride height and drivetrain angle of the car, setting pinion angle off the driveshaft is purely hit or miss.

For example, assume your race car's pinion angle is set perfectly and the car has no vibration.

If you raised the engine in the front 3 degrees, changing the drivetrain angle downward, the correct way to compensate for this would be to increase the pinion angle 3 degrees POSITIVE, because it keeps the pinion parallel to what you had before.

If you tried to set the pinion angle off the driveshaft alone, you would increase the pinion angle 3 degrees NEGATIVE, most likely causing a severe vibration because of U-joint binding.

BTW, this is also the correct method to set pinion angle on a lifted 4 x 4 truck with a 1 piece driveshaft:

1. Make the pinion parallel to the transmsission.
2. If pinion binds, lower transmission in the rear.
3. Reset pinion parallel to transmission.
4. If pinion still binds, install a CV joint on the transmission, and point the pinion directly toward the CV joint.





your way, what is pinion angle when trans and rear are parellel? ZERO???? SOMEONE PLEASE ANSWER THIS QUESTION BECAUSE NO ONE EVER DOES




not sure what your asking is why you don't get an answer. how often do you run into that situation? maybe on a chassis car you would. and the only thing you do is roll the pinion down depending on what suspension you have.

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: DoctorDiff] #446887
08/24/09 08:29 AM
08/24/09 08:29 AM

A
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Quote:

Also, Big Squeeze, beautiful car



THANKS.......


Quote:

Wayne,

7 degrees is too much negative pinion angle. If you are going to quote me, please post where I told you to run that much.





I never said that you said to run that much, I only said that I did it that way and it didn't work that way with me using 7* on my leaf spring car......Yeah, obviously it was too much when doing it your way, or it wouldn't have howled like crazy ........What I am saying is that I've run that much for 15 years, doing it my way, in all kinds of cars and have NEVER had an issue with vibration..........


Quote:


This isn't rocket science. Depending on the ride height and drivetrain angle of the car, setting pinion angle off the driveshaft is purely hit or miss.



I AGREE.......and my theory is that as long as the pinion angle doesn't go over zero with the driveshaft and it's not low enough to howl, it's fine in a drag car and WON'T COST ANY ET or "rob horsepower", or even a street car, so it's always been a "hit" and not a "miss" with me........


Quote:

For example, assume your race car's pinion angle is set perfectly and the car has no vibration.




The problem with saying "perfect" is that there's a pretty large window where the thing won't vibrate and it would be called "perfect"......

From doing what I'd done, it's obvious to me that if I had a jacked up 4 wheel drive truck and the output shaft and pinion were parralel to each other......and the driveshaft were pointed down at a 45* angle, and I then rotated the pinion down 2, 4, or 6* or whatever, it would REALLY howl........

The point is that the way you guys do it works fine if the output shaft and driveshaft are relatively parralel to each other.......

When I'd set my pinion angle the way that the Moparts chart shows , I had 11 degrees negative pinion angle to the driveshaft.......but it was only 7* down from the output shaft, which is what that chart shows..........and man, did it howl like crazy......

So, my point with that is, let's say we have an extreme example.........and our race car with a 4 link was set up similar to my car in that the engine were facing downhill.......and the pinion angle to driveshaft angle ended up being 11* different just like my car, even though the pinion was only down 4 degrees from the outputshaft, I guarantee that it would howl like crazy.........

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: Quicktree] #446888
08/24/09 10:05 AM
08/24/09 10:05 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225
Charleston
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sixpackgut Offline
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Charleston
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Wayne,

7 degrees is too much negative pinion angle. If you are going to quote me, please post where I told you to run that much.

This isn't rocket science. Depending on the ride height and drivetrain angle of the car, setting pinion angle off the driveshaft is purely hit or miss.

For example, assume your race car's pinion angle is set perfectly and the car has no vibration.

If you raised the engine in the front 3 degrees, changing the drivetrain angle downward, the correct way to compensate for this would be to increase the pinion angle 3 degrees POSITIVE, because it keeps the pinion parallel to what you had before.

If you tried to set the pinion angle off the driveshaft alone, you would increase the pinion angle 3 degrees NEGATIVE, most likely causing a severe vibration because of U-joint binding.

BTW, this is also the correct method to set pinion angle on a lifted 4 x 4 truck with a 1 piece driveshaft:

1. Make the pinion parallel to the transmsission.
2. If pinion binds, lower transmission in the rear.
3. Reset pinion parallel to transmission.
4. If pinion still binds, install a CV joint on the transmission, and point the pinion directly toward the CV joint.





your way, what is pinion angle when trans and rear are parellel? ZERO???? SOMEONE PLEASE ANSWER THIS QUESTION BECAUSE NO ONE EVER DOES




not sure what your asking is why you don't get an answer. how often do you run into that situation? maybe on a chassis car you would. and the only thing you do is roll the pinion down depending on what suspension you have.




if your tranny is 2* down and the rear is 2* up then it should be in parallel, correct? AT THIS POINT, HOW DO YOU GET 0* ( ZERO ) PINION ANGLE? ANSWER THE QUESTION


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Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? #446889
08/24/09 10:05 AM
08/24/09 10:05 AM
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Posts: 8,016
Polson, MT
DoctorDiff Offline
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Polson, MT
I agree, there is a fairly large window that a driveshaft will not howl. That is why you can get away with setting pinion angle strictly off the driveshaft in some applications.

The pinion angle can go over zero under load a couple degrees however.

If your pinion was set 4 degrees under parallel to the transmission centerline, it probably would NOT howl like crazy.

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: sixpackgut] #446890
08/24/09 10:19 AM
08/24/09 10:19 AM
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Polson, MT
DoctorDiff Offline
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Once again...

Set the pinion parallel to the transmission as a base line, then pivot the pinion downward X degrees. X degrees is the pinion angle.

If the transmission slopes downward 2 degrees toward the rear and the pinion slopes upward 2 degrees toward the front (parallel), you have 0 degree pinion angle.

If the transmission slopes downward 2 degrees toward the rear and the pinion is level, you have 2 degree negative pinion angle.

If the transmission slopes downward 2 degrees toward the rear and the pinion slopes downward 2 degrees toward the front, you have 4 degree negative pinion angle.

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: sixpackgut] #446891
08/24/09 10:27 AM
08/24/09 10:27 AM
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Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Wayne,

7 degrees is too much negative pinion angle. If you are going to quote me, please post where I told you to run that much.

This isn't rocket science. Depending on the ride height and drivetrain angle of the car, setting pinion angle off the driveshaft is purely hit or miss.

For example, assume your race car's pinion angle is set perfectly and the car has no vibration.

If you raised the engine in the front 3 degrees, changing the drivetrain angle downward, the correct way to compensate for this would be to increase the pinion angle 3 degrees POSITIVE, because it keeps the pinion parallel to what you had before.

If you tried to set the pinion angle off the driveshaft alone, you would increase the pinion angle 3 degrees NEGATIVE, most likely causing a severe vibration because of U-joint binding.

BTW, this is also the correct method to set pinion angle on a lifted 4 x 4 truck with a 1 piece driveshaft:

1. Make the pinion parallel to the transmsission.
2. If pinion binds, lower transmission in the rear.
3. Reset pinion parallel to transmission.
4. If pinion still binds, install a CV joint on the transmission, and point the pinion directly toward the CV joint.





your way, what is pinion angle when trans and rear are parellel? ZERO???? SOMEONE PLEASE ANSWER THIS QUESTION BECAUSE NO ONE EVER DOES




not sure what your asking is why you don't get an answer. how often do you run into that situation? maybe on a chassis car you would. and the only thing you do is roll the pinion down depending on what suspension you have.




if your tranny is 2* down and the rear is 2* up then it should be in parallel, correct? AT THIS POINT, HOW DO YOU GET 0* ( ZERO ) PINION ANGLE? ANSWER THE QUESTION




Isnt that working angles and not pinion angles


Mopar Performance
Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: moparniac] #446892
08/24/09 10:41 AM
08/24/09 10:41 AM
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Polson, MT
DoctorDiff Offline
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Pinion angle is the relationship between the transmission centerline and the pinion centerline.

Working angle = driveshaft angle

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: DoctorDiff] #446893
08/24/09 10:49 AM
08/24/09 10:49 AM
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Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: DoctorDiff] #446894
08/24/09 10:57 AM
08/24/09 10:57 AM
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Newport, Mi
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Quote:

Pinion angle is the relationship between the transmission centerline and the pinion centerline.

Working angle = driveshaft angle




YEP


Free advice and worth every penny...
Factory trained Slinky rewinder.........
Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: moparniac] #446895
08/24/09 10:58 AM
08/24/09 10:58 AM
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Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: sixpackgut] #446896
08/24/09 12:21 PM
08/24/09 12:21 PM
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Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Wayne,

7 degrees is too much negative pinion angle. If you are going to quote me, please post where I told you to run that much.

This isn't rocket science. Depending on the ride height and drivetrain angle of the car, setting pinion angle off the driveshaft is purely hit or miss.

For example, assume your race car's pinion angle is set perfectly and the car has no vibration.

If you raised the engine in the front 3 degrees, changing the drivetrain angle downward, the correct way to compensate for this would be to increase the pinion angle 3 degrees POSITIVE, because it keeps the pinion parallel to what you had before.

If you tried to set the pinion angle off the driveshaft alone, you would increase the pinion angle 3 degrees NEGATIVE, most likely causing a severe vibration because of U-joint binding.

BTW, this is also the correct method to set pinion angle on a lifted 4 x 4 truck with a 1 piece driveshaft:

1. Make the pinion parallel to the transmsission.
2. If pinion binds, lower transmission in the rear.
3. Reset pinion parallel to transmission.
4. If pinion still binds, install a CV joint on the transmission, and point the pinion directly toward the CV joint.





your way, what is pinion angle when trans and rear are parellel? ZERO???? SOMEONE PLEASE ANSWER THIS QUESTION BECAUSE NO ONE EVER DOES




not sure what your asking is why you don't get an answer. how often do you run into that situation? maybe on a chassis car you would. and the only thing you do is roll the pinion down depending on what suspension you have.




if your tranny is 2* down and the rear is 2* up then it should be in parallel, correct? AT THIS POINT, HOW DO YOU GET 0* ( ZERO ) PINION ANGLE? ANSWER THE QUESTION




my god are you kidding me it's been answered at least a million times nothing else I can say

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: DoctorDiff] #446897
08/24/09 12:23 PM
08/24/09 12:23 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225
Charleston
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sixpackgut Offline
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Charleston
Quote:

If the transmission slopes downward 2 degrees toward the rear and the pinion slopes upward 2 degrees toward the front (parallel), you have 0 degree pinion angle.

If the transmission slopes downward 2 degrees toward the rear and the pinion is level, you have 2 degree negative pinion angle.





if your front U joint is 12" from the ground and the rear U joint is 13" from the ground, there is no way on gods green earth this is correct.


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Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: Evil Spirit] #446898
08/24/09 12:26 PM
08/24/09 12:26 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 32,394
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Quicktree Offline
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Quote:

Quote:

Pinion angle is the relationship between the transmission centerline and the pinion centerline.

Working angle = driveshaft angle




YEP




also and so do many more but they don't get involved because they are scared of being ridiculed by the naysayers. I could care less. and could also care less how many stupid movies they make or how many names they call. and I dam sure don't care how they set theirs up

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: sixpackgut] #446899
08/24/09 01:08 PM
08/24/09 01:08 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
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Polson, MT
DoctorDiff Offline
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Polson, MT
That scenario is very correct, and it illustrates why you can not always set pinion angle off the driveshaft.

Under power, you want the front and rear U-joint angles to cancel each other out (pinion parallel to transmission). You do not want both front and rear yokes pointing up or both pointing down.

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: DoctorDiff] #446900
08/24/09 01:32 PM
08/24/09 01:32 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
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Quote:

That scenario is very correct, and it illustrates why you can not always set pinion angle off the driveshaft.

Under power, you want the front and rear U-joint angles to cancel each other out (pinion parallel to transmission). You do not want both front and rear yokes pointing up or both pointing down.




can't be made any simpler. I see a doctordiff movie coming

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: DoctorDiff] #446901
08/24/09 02:38 PM
08/24/09 02:38 PM
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 2,128
sweden
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sshemi Offline
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sweden
Quote:

That scenario is very correct, and it illustrates why you can not always set pinion angle off the driveshaft.

Under power, you want the front and rear U-joint angles to cancel each other out (pinion parallel to transmission). You do not want both front and rear yokes pointing up or both pointing down.




The purpose with it is to have both u-joints rotating with the same speed.
I know this wont make sence to many but my english is not good enough to explain.
Maybe someone else can?

Re: can someone school me on setting pinion angle?? [Re: sshemi] #446902
08/24/09 03:27 PM
08/24/09 03:27 PM
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Posts: 32,394
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Quote:

Quote:

That scenario is very correct, and it illustrates why you can not always set pinion angle off the driveshaft.

Under power, you want the front and rear U-joint angles to cancel each other out (pinion parallel to transmission). You do not want both front and rear yokes pointing up or both pointing down.




The purpose with it is to have both u-joints rotating with the same speed.
I know this wont make sence to many but my english is not good enough to explain.
Maybe someone else can?




no use, we ae not going to change their minds nor are we trying. their MO is to belittle or bash those who choose to have a different opinion.

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