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Re: SURGING Six Pack carbs
[Re: mopar346]
#310179
05/29/14 02:19 PM
05/29/14 02:19 PM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 18,157
Mass
DAYCLONA
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 18,157
Mass
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Quote:
I know it was a 440 center but I think the blokc and the bowl are from the 340 carb. That being said what issues could that cause? Again, I have had no issues with the way it actually runs, if it hadn't been for the surge I would not have started tweaking it at all. Granted it doesn't run like a EFI vehicle but I don't expect it to, most of my cars are carberated so I am well aware of the differences.
Sounds like you have a mongrel of a center carb, if your not aware of all the peculiarities between the assorted center carbs, and how simple even the wrong gasket can cause woes in the metering block, I'd suggests you either send your carbs out, or replace them with new....perhaps you have no major issues with the carbs, other than tuning them, your fooling yourself by thinking you can set up just the center, and not worry about the outboards until you've "straightened out" the center, they need to be all addressed at the same time, and even after your done, your not done, you need to go back and double check your settings/adjustments 
Mike
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Re: SURGING Six Pack carbs
[Re: mopar346]
#310181
05/29/14 04:48 PM
05/29/14 04:48 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 8,827
Houston, Tx
hemi68charger
master
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master
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 8,827
Houston, Tx
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Man, I guess I got lucky in the day.. My first v-code '70 Charger R/T always ran great, even as a daily driver for many many years ( that's why I'm sure ).
TroyHouston Mopar Connection Club'69 Charger Daytona 440 - auto - 4.10 Dana (now with 426 hemi) '69 Charger 500 440 - 4speed - 3.54 Dana '70 Road Runner 383 - 4speed - a/c (now with 440)
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Re: SURGING Six Pack carbs
[Re: hemi68charger]
#310182
05/29/14 05:22 PM
05/29/14 05:22 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,436
Blair County,PA
62maxwgn
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,436
Blair County,PA
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Quote:
Man, I guess I got lucky in the day.. My first v-code '70 Charger R/T always ran great, even as a daily driver for many many years ( that's why I'm sure ).
Troy, a lot of luck is common sense !! 
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Re: SURGING Six Pack carbs
[Re: 62maxwgn]
#310183
05/29/14 06:15 PM
05/29/14 06:15 PM
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 11,836
Florida
mopar346
Let me tell ya about fat chicks!
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Let me tell ya about fat chicks!
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 11,836
Florida
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Time out guys, you might remember the car ran extremely well, strated fine and even idled reasonably well before I started adjusting them. I built them, the engine and the car, it hadn't run in 20 years and the reason I started playing with it was that there was a slight surge at highway speeds, I don't think I am ready to scrape it or the carbs just yet. My statement about getting it to run like a normal car off of just the center is from Tom's document or at least that is how I read it. With everything hooked up it runs really well I was just concerned about the mixture being lean for the trip. My biggest issue write now seems to be stemming from the distributor, it appears the advance plate is stilling and the vacuum advance doesn't hold vacuum, this is on a brand new distributor, I have another one ordered. I really think that is my biggest issue. Since I haven't chased all the numbers I cant say for certain that the metering block and bowl are from the 340 but I have a 4791 base/body in the extra stuff and my ASSUMPTION was that it was bad and replaced with the 440 piece so I just built the 440 one cause that was the one that was on the complete set up when I bought it. I matched all the gaskets as I always do when building a carb so they are at least what was in there, right wrong or otherwise. I wil take some pictures of the block and bowl when I remove them. I've put over 800 trouble free miles on it since I fired it March 31st and plan to drive it over 3000 or so between next week end when I leave and after the Nats when I get home. Not trying to squeeze every ounze of power out of it just want it reliable and of course not doing itself any damage. The help so far has been appreciated so please keep that coming but I am not sure condemning it or me is in order just yet.
Careful, your character's showing!
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Re: SURGING Six Pack carbs
[Re: RapidRobert]
#310185
05/29/14 08:37 PM
05/29/14 08:37 PM
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 11,836
Florida
mopar346
Let me tell ya about fat chicks!
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Let me tell ya about fat chicks!
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 11,836
Florida
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You may be onto something, I did unplag the vacuum advance and saw little/no difference. Here is an additional item that I found a few minutes ago. With the vacuum advance leaking it has the plate almost locked so it doesn't move at all, in that position the ignition module is hitting the apex(s) of the distributor shaft, I wonder if it is bumping it and tweaking the timing and the spring in the advnace is pulling it back to do it all over again, essentially changing the timing a degree or 3 everytime it does it, in my thinking that could cause the surge. It also might explain way the idle went down hill once I started playing with it, not I was doing it but the can went bad/got progressively worse while I was tweaking, not necessarily related just coinsedence of timing.
What so you? Am I onto something? It obviously has to be fixed either way and there is no hope of adjusting everything else out with the distibutor issues.
Careful, your character's showing!
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Re: SURGING Six Pack carbs
[Re: RapidRobert]
#310187
05/29/14 09:58 PM
05/29/14 09:58 PM
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 11,836
Florida
mopar346
Let me tell ya about fat chicks!
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Let me tell ya about fat chicks!
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 11,836
Florida
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Thanks Robert,
Working on the distributor, I am gonna ground the apex(s) to solve that issue, I will find another vacuum advance tomorrow hopefully. I got a replacement distributor but the advance canister on it is now good as well, just a cheap set up I bought to house the Accel unit. Buy junk own junk, right. that is one of the sites I looked at when I was chasing the info this morning and using that as a guide mine was not running lean and in fact slightly rich with the 64s so that puts my mind at ease for one of my concerns. Do you see something different in my plug above? I am gonna post a picture on my plug thread of want they looked like after the 67s and then back to 65Hs and of course way too much timing, look in on that if you can.
Does anybody know what the H is for on the jets?
Thank you again.
Careful, your character's showing!
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Re: SURGING Six Pack carbs
[Re: mopar346]
#310188
05/29/14 10:09 PM
05/29/14 10:09 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040
Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
Circle Track
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Circle Track
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040
Lincoln Nebraska
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yeah according to Wallace your plug in the pic shows rich so you definitely would not want to go 4 sizes larger on the jets! Get that dist squared away & what apex are you going to grind on? Just WAG ing on the "H". decades ago a company was offering some different holley jets (hi tolerance) or something to that effect & it might be one of them. I dont think holley puts an "H" on their jets but I ain't really a holley guy. Holler how the dist change does
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: SURGING Six Pack carbs
[Re: RapidRobert]
#310189
05/29/14 10:30 PM
05/29/14 10:30 PM
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 11,836
Florida
mopar346
Let me tell ya about fat chicks!
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Let me tell ya about fat chicks!
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 11,836
Florida
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The apexes that would normally activate the points, I am using a light beam with a shutter window rotor. It's by Accel but it is basically a unilite.
Careful, your character's showing!
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Re: SURGING Six Pack carbs
[Re: mopar346]
#310190
05/29/14 10:33 PM
05/29/14 10:33 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040
Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
Circle Track
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Circle Track
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040
Lincoln Nebraska
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gotcha, I think you'll be in good shape in no time. I will check on the timing
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: SURGING Six Pack carbs
[Re: 62maxwgn]
#310191
05/30/14 12:42 AM
05/30/14 12:42 AM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 8,827
Houston, Tx
hemi68charger
master
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master
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 8,827
Houston, Tx
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Quote:
Quote:
Man, I guess I got lucky in the day.. My first v-code '70 Charger R/T always ran great, even as a daily driver for many many years ( that's why I'm sure ).
Troy, a lot of luck is common sense !!
?
I was trying to convey that I put on a new set of carbs ( put the old originals on the shelf ) and didn't do anything. Plug and Play and she ran great. I did have the original camshaft in it. The only mod I did was convert to an electronic distributor...
TroyHouston Mopar Connection Club'69 Charger Daytona 440 - auto - 4.10 Dana (now with 426 hemi) '69 Charger 500 440 - 4speed - 3.54 Dana '70 Road Runner 383 - 4speed - a/c (now with 440)
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Re: SURGING Six Pack carbs
[Re: ThermoQuad]
#310193
05/30/14 08:59 AM
05/30/14 08:59 AM
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 11,836
Florida
mopar346
Let me tell ya about fat chicks!
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Let me tell ya about fat chicks!
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 11,836
Florida
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I did put the 195* in and didn't see a difference but this again was as the distributor was failing so not a good idea what it did or didn't do for it. One thing I found interesting was adding the water wetter, I have run it in one of my other cars and it did drop the coolant temp around 10*. I agree 195* isn't hot, heard years ago that Nascar runs theirs at something like 220*, many modern cars trigger the fans at 212*.
Thank you for your input.
Careful, your character's showing!
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Take the time to look very closely at all the holes and passages in the main body and the metering block, then remove the jets and see if yours has the emulusion tubes in it like the 340 carb. metering blocks have 
