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Dragula's Quest for the 5's....on Pump Gas #2557318
10/01/18 11:25 PM
10/01/18 11:25 PM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 12,379
Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
Dragula Offline OP
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Well, this year is almost in the books, got one more race this weekend, but my bracket car is out for the season....And as usual, we went thru some parts, figured some stuff out, and just wished it had all come together at least at one of the races this year.

I really thought last weekend was it. The car was running awesome. The driver was dead on the tree, and it was looking promising in record good air. But it was not to be. Seems I got bit by everything at least once this year. From tow vehicle issues to you name it. Last week,the no oil pressure light came on just as I hit the return road on a good pass. Checked a couple things, and it looks like I didn't hurt anything, but the engine has to come out for a mild freshen up.

So with that said, I was really hoping for 6.0's or better this year out of our new 400/512...We are just under 11:1 and have EZ1 heads and a .680 roller cam. A Thumper 1050 dominator, and basically just a port match on everything...Its a nothing fancy bracket engine, but we had opted for the light weight crank option. Figured 6lbs off the rotating assembly should have been worth somthing...

What would you guys change? Go with better heads, or send these out?


'70 Cuda,...605 EFI Hemi Street Car (6.20 best pass, 1.33 60ft)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYw6RA-k5Bk (6.25 at 108.75mph from inside car)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zQEb9uxFng (6.25 at 108mph from outside car)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCvfzsC4NgM (9.9)

'66 Barracuda AWB Stretched nose Blown 440 Car in build stage

'71 Duster Drag Car 400 Low Deck 512 best 6.002 at 115.44mph
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Znuo3jMUXTk
Re: Dragula's Quest for the 5's....on Pump Gas [Re: Dragula] #2557390
10/02/18 02:05 AM
10/02/18 02:05 AM
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 154
Canada
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cuda499 Offline
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Originally Posted By Dragula
Well, this year is almost in the books, got one more race this weekend, but my bracket car is out for the season....And as usual, we went thru some parts, figured some stuff out, and just wished it had all come together at least at one of the races this year.

I really thought last weekend was it. The car was running awesome. The driver was dead on the tree, and it was looking promising in record good air. But it was not to be. Seems I got bit by everything at least once this year. From tow vehicle issues to you name it. Last week,the no oil pressure light came on just as I hit the return road on a good pass. Checked a couple things, and it looks like I didn't hurt anything, but the engine has to come out for a mild freshen up.

So with that said, I was really hoping for 6.0's or better this year out of our new 400/512...We are just under 11:1 and have EZ1 heads and a .680 roller cam. A Thumper 1050 dominator, and basically just a port match on everything...Its a nothing fancy bracket engine, but we had opted for the light weight crank option. Figured 6lbs off the rotating assembly should have been worth somthing...

What would you guys change? Go with better heads, or send these out?




Well how fast have you gone....... and how fast do you wanna go?

Re: Dragula's Quest for the 5's....on Pump Gas [Re: cuda499] #2557433
10/02/18 07:55 AM
10/02/18 07:55 AM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 12,379
Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
Dragula Offline OP
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Car went the quickest with the old 440/512 same heads and cam and carb. It went 6.13 at 111.9...The current based 400/512 has gone 6.17 at 110.8....60fts are real good with either. We are in the 1.35 range...

Car weighs 2920 with me in it.

Looking to go 5.95 at 113 or so...We had talked about going -1 heads with the 400 as it allowed a little extra room in the engine bay. Or maybe having Modern port them and maybe the intake as well.

Last edited by Dragula; 10/02/18 07:56 AM.

'70 Cuda,...605 EFI Hemi Street Car (6.20 best pass, 1.33 60ft)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYw6RA-k5Bk (6.25 at 108.75mph from inside car)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zQEb9uxFng (6.25 at 108mph from outside car)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCvfzsC4NgM (9.9)

'66 Barracuda AWB Stretched nose Blown 440 Car in build stage

'71 Duster Drag Car 400 Low Deck 512 best 6.002 at 115.44mph
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Znuo3jMUXTk
Re: Dragula's Quest for the 5's....on Pump Gas [Re: Dragula] #2557434
10/02/18 08:01 AM
10/02/18 08:01 AM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,049
Mo.
racerx Offline
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Looking to go 5.95 at 113 or so...We had talked about going -1 heads with the 400 as it allowed a little extra room in the engine bay. Or maybe having Modern port them and maybe the intake as well



Had this work did on my -1's and run a best of 6.00.2@114 , 3350bls.

Re: Dragula's Quest for the 5's....on Pump Gas [Re: Dragula] #2557436
10/02/18 08:24 AM
10/02/18 08:24 AM
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 570
UK
rb446 Offline
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Doing a few calcs and it looks like you need around another 60fwhp to go 5.90's, current 618>678, your 60's are good so not a great deal to be done there. As you said send them to Modern and see if you can get them to the 345cfm mark with some intake mods, not sure what they flow ootb though, 310?.....should be enough.

Different set up, but I went from 11.2@118.6 with stock 906's to 10.7@125 in the 1/4 with just a pair of BV 906's around 260cfm bolted on in a 3300lb 440ci car with a .650 solid cam.

Last edited by rb446; 10/02/18 08:43 AM.

1969 'Cuda 446ci, best 9.96@133.9 in 1990
1971 340 'Cuda, best 11.01@122.8 in 1987
Re: Dragula's Quest for the 5's....on Pump Gas [Re: Dragula] #2557444
10/02/18 08:54 AM
10/02/18 08:54 AM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 4,243
Charlotte, North Carolina
sgcuda Offline
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I think a full port job on your heads and intake should get you there. Maybe a set of 1.6 rockers if needed. Maybe consider an 1150 billet main body, too.


[image][/image]
Re: Dragula's Quest for the 5's....on Pump Gas [Re: Dragula] #2557480
10/02/18 10:44 AM
10/02/18 10:44 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,319
Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda Offline
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Marion, South Carolina [><]
I'd have the heads and manifold ported. Talk to Dwayne Porter.


CHIP
'70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60
'69 road runner, 440-6, 18 spline 4 speed, Dana 60
'71 Demon, 340, low gear 904, 8.75
'73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75
'90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt
'06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
Re: Dragula's Quest for the 5's....on Pump Gas [Re: Dragula] #2557541
10/02/18 11:28 AM
10/02/18 11:28 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 11,701
Portage,michigan
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To me the 60 foot is kinda soft for a car at that weight running that ET.
That translates to mid 9’s easily in the 1/4, to me could easily be 1.30ish.
I guess i compare it to 3350 pound S/S spring equipped car i had that ran 6.20’s/ 30’s typically and the same 60 foot. Lots heavier...... and slower.
Making the heads better will obviously help, the 60 will too.


69 Dart GTS A4 Silver All steel, flat factory hood, 3360race weight
418 BPE factory replacement headed stroker, 565 lift solid cam
Best so far, 10.40 @127 1/4
1.41 best 60 foot
6.60 at 103.90 1/8

Re: Dragula's Quest for the 5's....on Pump Gas [Re: B3422W5] #2589140
12/08/18 09:11 PM
12/08/18 09:11 PM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 12,379
Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
Dragula Offline OP
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Dragula  Offline OP
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Well the engines out...Oil pressure is back. Either the pickup got starved for oil on the hard braking shut down and and sucked some air and lost prime, or the pump pressure relief was lightly stuck and as soon as we put a wrench on it, came loose.

Left a message at modern to see about porting and or head options we should be looking at...


'70 Cuda,...605 EFI Hemi Street Car (6.20 best pass, 1.33 60ft)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYw6RA-k5Bk (6.25 at 108.75mph from inside car)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zQEb9uxFng (6.25 at 108mph from outside car)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCvfzsC4NgM (9.9)

'66 Barracuda AWB Stretched nose Blown 440 Car in build stage

'71 Duster Drag Car 400 Low Deck 512 best 6.002 at 115.44mph
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Znuo3jMUXTk
Re: Dragula's Quest for the 5's....on Pump Gas [Re: Dragula] #2589174
12/08/18 10:58 PM
12/08/18 10:58 PM
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 566
Texas
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RustyM Offline
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Texas
fwiw: We had Wilson port the indy single 4 intake and picked up over 35 hp and thats with a 4150 flange.
Its pretty amazing how much flow restriction/turbulence is in the intake's.

Just a thought.

We were looking for 6.41 this year at 3345 lbs and got to 6.37 .
Night we pulled the .37 i still had another carb formula in my pocket but ran out of time, pretty sure we could have pulled a .35- but i reckon i'm bench racing now- grin.

Re: Dragula's Quest for the 5's....on Pump Gas [Re: RustyM] #2589190
12/08/18 11:23 PM
12/08/18 11:23 PM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 12,379
Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
Dragula Offline OP
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Dragula  Offline OP
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Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
I have the 4500 flanged low deck one on this engine. What did that run you cost wise if you don't mind me asking?


'70 Cuda,...605 EFI Hemi Street Car (6.20 best pass, 1.33 60ft)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYw6RA-k5Bk (6.25 at 108.75mph from inside car)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zQEb9uxFng (6.25 at 108mph from outside car)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCvfzsC4NgM (9.9)

'66 Barracuda AWB Stretched nose Blown 440 Car in build stage

'71 Duster Drag Car 400 Low Deck 512 best 6.002 at 115.44mph
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Znuo3jMUXTk
Re: Dragula's Quest for the 5's....on Pump Gas [Re: Dragula] #2589197
12/08/18 11:38 PM
12/08/18 11:38 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,791
MI, usa
dvw Online content
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MI, usa
I've been very happy with my -1 heads from Modern. I run more cubic inch, cam, and compression. But the cross ram and Eddy carbs probably aren't as good as your stuff. That being said Jeff's heads have sent me to 5.73@121 3345lbs. Personally I think 1.35 60ft is pretty close for that ET.
Doug

Re: Dragula's Quest for the 5's....on Pump Gas [Re: Dragula] #2589211
12/09/18 12:23 AM
12/09/18 12:23 AM
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Posts: 11,701
Portage,michigan
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You could go small block and get where you want easily at that weight.
A good 4 inch indy headed small block should run 5’s easily. Even a W5 deal would.
Plus you would be shedding more weight


69 Dart GTS A4 Silver All steel, flat factory hood, 3360race weight
418 BPE factory replacement headed stroker, 565 lift solid cam
Best so far, 10.40 @127 1/4
1.41 best 60 foot
6.60 at 103.90 1/8

Re: Dragula's Quest for the 5's....on Pump Gas [Re: Dragula] #2589240
12/09/18 02:01 AM
12/09/18 02:01 AM
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Posts: 43,007
Bend,OR USA
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Are those EZ heads M.W. size or 440 port size? If 440 size have them enlarge to M.W. size up twocents
I saw 50 HP gain on my old pump gas 518 C.I. Duster motor by switching from a set of Indy SR with M.W. size intake ports that flowed 340 CFM at .700 to a set of MCH CNC ported 440-1 that flowed 370 CF @ .700 with every other parts the same shruggy
Switching the same heads onto my 526 RB higher compression ratio dyno test mule motor with a little bigger camshaft made 65 more HP than with the same set of SR heads, same compression ratio with both motors due to the CC being 76.0 on both sets of heads work
Both motors wanted more air and fuel, the single 1050 CFM Dominator carb was not enough carb. on either motor with the 400-3 or the 440-3 intakes whiney shruggy
More air and fuel equals more power grin

Last edited by Cab_Burge; 12/09/18 02:02 AM.

Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: Dragula's Quest for the 5's....on Pump Gas [Re: Cab_Burge] #2589312
12/09/18 01:19 PM
12/09/18 01:19 PM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 12,379
Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
Dragula Offline OP
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Small block W anything is really not in my future. I do however have a brand new set of G3 heads here all ported, but still looking for a 6.1 block. I might just bite the bullet and get the aluminum one if my tax return is any good.

The heads I have are the MW port size already. My thoughts are between the EZ295-325 & -1's at the moment. Mine flowed 327 at .600 and fell off after that. I run a .680 lift cam.

Last edited by Dragula; 12/09/18 01:44 PM.

'70 Cuda,...605 EFI Hemi Street Car (6.20 best pass, 1.33 60ft)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYw6RA-k5Bk (6.25 at 108.75mph from inside car)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zQEb9uxFng (6.25 at 108mph from outside car)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCvfzsC4NgM (9.9)

'66 Barracuda AWB Stretched nose Blown 440 Car in build stage

'71 Duster Drag Car 400 Low Deck 512 best 6.002 at 115.44mph
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Znuo3jMUXTk
Re: Dragula's Quest for the 5's....on Pump Gas [Re: Dragula] #2589325
12/09/18 01:36 PM
12/09/18 01:36 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,479
So. Burlington, Vt.
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fast68plymouth Offline
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So. Burlington, Vt.
Obviously, the -1’s would be the hardest of those three to outgrow.


68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123
Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
Re: Dragula's Quest for the 5's....on Pump Gas [Re: fast68plymouth] #2589335
12/09/18 01:52 PM
12/09/18 01:52 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,439
Val-haul-ass... eventually
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BradH Offline
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Val-haul-ass... eventually
Originally Posted By fast68plymouth
Obviously, the -1’s would be the hardest of those three to outgrow.

And, from what I understand, EZ295s wouldn't be much of an improvement over some basic hand porting to the OPs current EZ1s.

Re: Dragula's Quest for the 5's....on Pump Gas [Re: BradH] #2622282
02/16/19 08:05 PM
02/16/19 08:05 PM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 12,379
Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
Dragula Offline OP
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Dragula  Offline OP
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Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
And so the upgrades are starting to come together...Heads will stay the same for now...My next build is hopefully a procharger motor...


KIMG0982=1.jpgKIMG0983.JPG
Last edited by Dragula; 02/16/19 08:06 PM.

'70 Cuda,...605 EFI Hemi Street Car (6.20 best pass, 1.33 60ft)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYw6RA-k5Bk (6.25 at 108.75mph from inside car)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zQEb9uxFng (6.25 at 108mph from outside car)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCvfzsC4NgM (9.9)

'66 Barracuda AWB Stretched nose Blown 440 Car in build stage

'71 Duster Drag Car 400 Low Deck 512 best 6.002 at 115.44mph
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Znuo3jMUXTk
Re: Dragula's Quest for the 5's....on Pump Gas [Re: Dragula] #2622291
02/16/19 08:16 PM
02/16/19 08:16 PM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 12,379
Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
Dragula Offline OP
I Live Here
Dragula  Offline OP
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Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
Intake is ported a little further...Couldn't afford any of that nice high dollar professional porting...

KIMG0990.JPGKIMG0989.JPGKIMG0987.JPGKIMG0986.JPG

'70 Cuda,...605 EFI Hemi Street Car (6.20 best pass, 1.33 60ft)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYw6RA-k5Bk (6.25 at 108.75mph from inside car)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zQEb9uxFng (6.25 at 108mph from outside car)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCvfzsC4NgM (9.9)

'66 Barracuda AWB Stretched nose Blown 440 Car in build stage

'71 Duster Drag Car 400 Low Deck 512 best 6.002 at 115.44mph
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Znuo3jMUXTk
Re: Dragula's Quest for the 5's....on Pump Gas [Re: Dragula] #2622430
02/17/19 02:21 AM
02/17/19 02:21 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,439
Val-haul-ass... eventually
B
BradH Offline
Taking time off to work on my car
BradH  Offline
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Posts: 15,439
Val-haul-ass... eventually
Originally Posted By Dragula
And so the upgrades are starting to come together...Heads will stay the same for now...My next build is hopefully a procharger motor...

You're leaving a significant amount of power on the table by not spending any money on the heads. I guess I don't understand what your goal is, since it seems to have changed from the original post.

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