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Hellcat help, someone smart explain #2547765
09/09/18 12:16 AM
09/09/18 12:16 AM
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AeroMonte Offline OP
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I am doing a Hellcat swap into a 71 Barracuda as you all know. I am using a Holley EFI computer and harness. The original blow off for the supercharger uses a Jeep throttle body that is controlled by the computer to relieve pressure back into the intake. The Holley system cannot duplicate this function. What I have worked out, and I am no engineer, is a vacuum controlled turbo blow off valve that is plumbed back to the intake just behind the engines throttle body into an extension we fabricated. Will this work or am I overlooking something? By moving the throttle body 6-8 inches farther away from the intake, will that affect anything? I've thought about this so much I am starting to second guess myself. I know one of you out there understands I hope and can explain the technical stuff for me.

20180530_183105.jpg20180705_170116.jpg
Re: Hellcat help, someone smart explain [Re: AeroMonte] #2547773
09/09/18 12:36 AM
09/09/18 12:36 AM
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I'd be interested to learn why the oem setup is that way. But wouldn't you be ok with a conventional bov that vents to atmosphere?


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Re: Hellcat help, someone smart explain [Re: AeroMonte] #2547810
09/09/18 04:18 AM
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A Holley dominator can control the factory bypass throttle body

Re: Hellcat help, someone smart explain [Re: AeroMonte] #2547822
09/09/18 09:23 AM
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Sounds like a basic diverter/recric valve setup. I don't see why a speed density setup couldn't run one just like a standard BOV.


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Re: Hellcat help, someone smart explain [Re: AeroMonte] #2547841
09/09/18 10:50 AM
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Isn’t it a bypass that opens and bypasses the rotor pack under light throttle so the supercharger isn’t trying to compress air when it’s not needed? It keeps the supercharger from heating up and working so hard (trying to suck through a partially open throttle body). It also helps gas mileage when it’s open because the blower is now just freewheeling and not compressing anything. How do you have the blow off valve hooked up? Can you set it up to open under vacuum? MMX has a vacuum operated bypass for the HC

Last edited by WO23Coronet; 09/09/18 10:53 AM.
Re: Hellcat help, someone smart explain [Re: AeroMonte] #2547849
09/09/18 11:07 AM
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AeroMonte Offline OP
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I was told that if it blows to atmosphere I have just created the worlds biggest vacuum leak. My understanding, which could be wrong, is that the stock setup works just as WO23Coronet explained but that my Holley setup would not perform this function. L4staero, I would like to know more if you could help. And Goody, I'll do some research on your idea also. This build has been fun but so many little details, technical things, have me rethinking. I want to get it right the first time. Thanks everybody and I'll keep checking for further feedback.

Re: Hellcat help, someone smart explain [Re: AeroMonte] #2547867
09/09/18 11:43 AM
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something in front of the throttle blade can't create a vacuum leak. But you'd have to cork the other part I suppose and use a conventional bov. The OEM system sounds like a nifty efficiency trick, great if the aftermarket ecu can control it.


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Re: Hellcat help, someone smart explain [Re: AeroMonte] #2547883
09/09/18 12:17 PM
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If you have the blow off valve setup to open under vacuum it looks like it would give a bypass around the rotor pack like the factory deal. Looks like it would work to me

Re: Hellcat help, someone smart explain [Re: furious70] #2547890
09/09/18 12:25 PM
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AeroMonte Offline OP
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Originally Posted By furious70
something in front of the throttle blade can't create a vacuum leak. But you'd have to cork the other part I suppose and use a conventional bov. The OEM system sounds like a nifty efficiency trick, great if the aftermarket ecu can control it.



I have it behind the throttle body. I was told it would damage the throttle body if it was in front of it at wide open then suddenly let off the throttle. I can't find a reference to an MMX bypass either.

Re: Hellcat help, someone smart explain [Re: AeroMonte] #2547919
09/09/18 01:41 PM
09/09/18 01:41 PM
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Should work....Rich at Fastmanefi did somthing similar.

Last edited by Dragula; 09/09/18 01:41 PM.

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Re: Hellcat help, someone smart explain [Re: AeroMonte] #2547927
09/09/18 02:00 PM
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By moving the throttle body farther away from my intake opening, how will that affect performance?

Re: Hellcat help, someone smart explain [Re: AeroMonte] #2547935
09/09/18 02:12 PM
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I don’t think it’ll affect it at all, just gives it abit more volume before the blower.
The MMX bypass is a brand new thing and probably isn’t on their website but is on Facebook (that’s where I saw it). They showed it as part of their Hellcat blower swap to a 6.4 kit

Last edited by WO23Coronet; 09/09/18 02:14 PM.
Re: Hellcat help, someone smart explain [Re: AeroMonte] #2547975
09/09/18 03:32 PM
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My life has been spent as a bodyman/painter and I do have decades of experience with mechanics but this new stuff makes me think a little harder. Rich at Fastman may be who I talked to about the setup I have fabricated. I can't remember at the moment. I have talked to so many on several forums and pages, ordered a ton of parts and somehow managed to get this far. It does run with my setup but have never driven it to test the full throttle reaction. A miscalculation could be a $20,000 mistake.

Re: Hellcat help, someone smart explain [Re: AeroMonte] #2548066
09/09/18 08:18 PM
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I was told the Holley system can control the bypass valve. I don't know that for fact, but I do know that the MS EFI can control the bypass valve as it has been used on resto mod hellcat/Hellcrate builds.


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Re: Hellcat help, someone smart explain [Re: AeroMonte] #2548077
09/09/18 08:37 PM
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If I'm seeing this correct, this thing will never make boost since you removed the bypass throttle body. The boost air will be returned to air inlet. Your BOV will do nothing since it already has no boost.

Last edited by R5P7Duster; 09/09/18 08:37 PM.

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Re: Hellcat help, someone smart explain [Re: WO23Coronet] #2548082
09/09/18 08:39 PM
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Originally Posted By WO23Coronet
I don’t think it’ll affect it at all, just gives it abit more volume before the blower.
The MMX bypass is a brand new thing and probably isn’t on their website but is on Facebook (that’s where I saw it). They showed it as part of their Hellcat blower swap to a 6.4 kit


Not brand new, Whipple uses them.


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Re: Hellcat help, someone smart explain [Re: DemonDust] #2548104
09/09/18 09:14 PM
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AeroMonte Offline OP
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Originally Posted By R5P7Duster
If I'm seeing this correct, this thing will never make boost since you removed the bypass throttle body. The boost air will be returned to air inlet. Your BOV will do nothing since it already has no boost.


The bypass has been hollowed out and capped off inside. Basically just using the modified body. Air goes into the supercharger, squeezed up into the plenum and down into the heads. I blocked the bypass at the bottom before the supercharger and added the tube for the BOV on the topside from the plenum. It is vacuum controlled and plumbed back behind the throttle body into the supercharger inlet. Under part throttle it should bleed off the pressure but under hard throttle it should close to build pressure. At least in my mind that's how I have it figured but just want to be sure. That's the best way I can describe it in my non technical way. That's why I'm here asking, because I know there are some really sharp people here that can tell me yes or no. I do appreciate all the input. I'm learning .

Re: Hellcat help, someone smart explain [Re: DemonDust] #2548135
09/09/18 10:22 PM
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Originally Posted By R5P7Duster
Originally Posted By WO23Coronet
I don’t think it’ll affect it at all, just gives it abit more volume before the blower.
The MMX bypass is a brand new thing and probably isn’t on their website but is on Facebook (that’s where I saw it). They showed it as part of their Hellcat blower swap to a 6.4 kit


Not brand new, Whipple uses them.


I mean it’s a new kit for MMX specifically for the Hellcat, I realize they’ve been used forever (Eaton used them way back in the 90’s and maybe even before that)

Re: Hellcat help, someone smart explain [Re: Dragula] #2550423
09/15/18 08:42 PM
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Originally Posted By Dragula
Should work....Rich at Fastmanefi did somthing similar.


Yes the Dominator will drive both the DBW throttle body and the bypass valve, but that is NOT what you want to do. The OEM ECU keeps the bypass closed most of the time. They open the bypass to control the rate of boost and serve as a blowoff valve on throttle release. The Dominator would drive the bypass valve proportionately (in a linear fashion) which you do not want to do.

I have done two Hellcat swaps and I replaced the bypass valve with a generic vacuum operated blowoff valve. That works GREAT and since the blowoff bleeds back into the same port that the bypass valve did, it's very quiet with no blowoff hiss. The Holley tune needs to take into consideration that the boost will come on quick and timing must compensate for any condition where the engine might be lugged at a lower RPM, but that's normal stuff.

Both cars are a blast to drive.

BTW: I have done this with both stock and Magnuson blowers and I tuned both knock sensors as a precaution because increasing the boost is very easy to do. Last one was 850 HP at the rears.

If you want more info just contact me.

Re: Hellcat help, someone smart explain [Re: Mopar_Rich] #2550597
09/16/18 12:53 PM
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AeroMonte Offline OP
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Originally Posted By Mopar_Rich
Originally Posted By Dragula
Should work....Rich at Fastmanefi did somthing similar.


Yes the Dominator will drive both the DBW throttle body and the bypass valve, but that is NOT what you want to do. The OEM ECU keeps the bypass closed most of the time. They open the bypass to control the rate of boost and serve as a blowoff valve on throttle release. The Dominator would drive the bypass valve proportionately (in a linear fashion) which you do not want to do.

I have done two Hellcat swaps and I replaced the bypass valve with a generic vacuum operated blowoff valve. That works GREAT and since the blowoff bleeds back into the same port that the bypass valve did, it's very quiet with no blowoff hiss. The Holley tune needs to take into consideration that the boost will come on quick and timing must compensate for any condition where the engine might be lugged at a lower RPM, but that's normal stuff.

Both cars are a blast to drive.

BTW: I have done this with both stock and Magnuson blowers and I tuned both knock sensors as a precaution because increasing the boost is very easy to do. Last one was 850 HP at the rears.

If you want more info just contact me.


Thanks Rich. The smart guy helping me with this build is Bervil Hillis. He has been in contact with you and will probably be again when he sets up the tune. We have a basic tune installed and the car runs but we have not driven it yet. Just happy to hear it run for now. I'll post pisc in a bit of the BOV setup we made. I would like your input if you don't mind.

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