Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2
Can H beam rods be rebuilt? #2538699
08/19/18 09:43 PM
08/19/18 09:43 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 304
Portland, Oregon
D
Digger73 Offline OP
enthusiast
Digger73  Offline OP
enthusiast
D

Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 304
Portland, Oregon
I have a set of H beam rods that have been exposed to heat due to bearing issues. The bearings didn't spin but they were ruined because of tight clearance. So I am trying to find out if the rods can be rebuilt? Also, could they be trusted in a very healthy 500" stroker?

Thanks,
Digger73 (Mike)


I live with fear everyday but, sometimes she lets me race!
Re: Can H beam rods be rebuilt? [Re: Digger73] #2538706
08/19/18 09:52 PM
08/19/18 09:52 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 4,243
Charlotte, North Carolina
sgcuda Offline
master
sgcuda  Offline
master

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 4,243
Charlotte, North Carolina
If the rod discolored, I would replace it. If it is a cracked cap design, maybe not. Don't know if they can be machined flat and rehoned. As far as durability in your stroker, you get what you pay for.


[image][/image]
Re: Can H beam rods be rebuilt? [Re: sgcuda] #2538711
08/19/18 09:59 PM
08/19/18 09:59 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,665
North Dakota
6PakBee Offline
I Live Here
6PakBee  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,665
North Dakota
Originally Posted By sgcuda
If the rod discolored, I would replace it. If it is a cracked cap design, maybe not. Don't know if they can be machined flat and rehoned. As far as durability in your stroker, you get what you pay for.


If you didn't spin the bearings I'd be tempted to reuse them. If you have no discoloration that's good but I'm not sure discoloration would be a problem. I've had many B/RB rods assembled by using a rod furnace to expand the small end of the rod on a pressed pin assembly. As to cracked cap rods, I thought the only way you could rebuild them was to bore them oversize and use the oversize bearings. As to durability in a stroker, I agree with sgcuda. shruggy


"We live in a time when intelligent people are being silenced so that stupid people won't be offended".
Re: Can H beam rods be rebuilt? [Re: Digger73] #2538839
08/20/18 03:54 AM
08/20/18 03:54 AM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,007
Bend,OR USA
C
Cab_Burge Offline
I Win
Cab_Burge  Offline
I Win
C

Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,007
Bend,OR USA
What brand are these rods?
Metal is metal, correct? work
My message is the rods are machined from unfinished to finished so they been size once incorrectly so why not have them magnaflux to see if they are cracked or not scope If they magged okay have the bolts replaced and them resize the big end and use them twocents


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: Can H beam rods be rebuilt? [Re: 6PakBee] #2538876
08/20/18 08:51 AM
08/20/18 08:51 AM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 4,243
Charlotte, North Carolina
sgcuda Offline
master
sgcuda  Offline
master

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 4,243
Charlotte, North Carolina
Originally Posted By 6PakBee
Originally Posted By sgcuda
If the rod discolored, I would replace it. If it is a cracked cap design, maybe not. Don't know if they can be machined flat and rehoned. As far as durability in your stroker, you get what you pay for.


If you didn't spin the bearings I'd be tempted to reuse them. If you have no discoloration that's good but I'm not sure discoloration would be a problem. I've had many B/RB rods assembled by using a rod furnace to expand the small end of the rod on a pressed pin assembly. As to cracked cap rods, I thought the only way you could rebuild them was to bore them oversize and use the oversize bearings. As to durability in a stroker, I agree with sgcuda. shruggy


I wasn't referring to the small end. If the large end is discolored from heat, I would toss it.

Re: Can H beam rods be rebuilt? [Re: sgcuda] #2538989
08/20/18 01:10 PM
08/20/18 01:10 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,665
North Dakota
6PakBee Offline
I Live Here
6PakBee  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,665
North Dakota
Originally Posted By sgcuda
Originally Posted By 6PakBee
Originally Posted By sgcuda
If the rod discolored, I would replace it. If it is a cracked cap design, maybe not. Don't know if they can be machined flat and rehoned. As far as durability in your stroker, you get what you pay for.


If you didn't spin the bearings I'd be tempted to reuse them. If you have no discoloration that's good but I'm not sure discoloration would be a problem. I've had many B/RB rods assembled by using a rod furnace to expand the small end of the rod on a pressed pin assembly. As to cracked cap rods, I thought the only way you could rebuild them was to bore them oversize and use the oversize bearings. As to durability in a stroker, I agree with sgcuda. shruggy


I wasn't referring to the small end. If the large end is discolored from heat, I would toss it.



I realize that. I was just pointing out that IMHO discoloration is not an automatic reason for rejection.


"We live in a time when intelligent people are being silenced so that stupid people won't be offended".
Re: Can H beam rods be rebuilt? [Re: 6PakBee] #2539010
08/20/18 01:32 PM
08/20/18 01:32 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,707
Moved to N.E. Tennessee
GomangoCuda Offline
master
GomangoCuda  Offline
master

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,707
Moved to N.E. Tennessee
If they got hot enough to change color then the heat treat is altered. If you have the hardness tested the areas that changed color will be different than the rest of the rod.



Last edited by GomangoCuda; 08/20/18 01:33 PM.

In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice, there is.
Re: Can H beam rods be rebuilt? [Re: GomangoCuda] #2539023
08/20/18 01:55 PM
08/20/18 01:55 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,116
PA.
pittsburghracer Offline
"Little"John
pittsburghracer  Offline
"Little"John

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,116
PA.
Is it worth less than 100.00 a piece to chance it.


1970 Duster
Edelbrock headed 408
5.984@112.52
422 Indy headed small block
5.982@112.56 mph
9.42@138.27

Livin and lovin life one day at a time




Re: Can H beam rods be rebuilt? [Re: pittsburghracer] #2539091
08/20/18 03:34 PM
08/20/18 03:34 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,478
So. Burlington, Vt.
F
fast68plymouth Offline
I Live Here
fast68plymouth  Offline
I Live Here
F

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,478
So. Burlington, Vt.
Originally Posted By pittsburghracer
Is it worth less than 100.00 a piece to chance it.


Hard to argue with that for a new high hp build.

If they got hot enough to turn color, it’s likely they’ll need resizing(not free), which makes that under $100/ea money a little more palatable.


68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123
Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
Re: Can H beam rods be rebuilt? [Re: Digger73] #2539093
08/20/18 03:39 PM
08/20/18 03:39 PM
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,205
New York
polyspheric Offline
master
polyspheric  Offline
master

Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,205
New York
A color change probably exceeded the anneal temperature, which means the hardness/ductility is affected.
I'd change them.


Boffin Emeritus
Re: Can H beam rods be rebuilt? [Re: Digger73] #2539123
08/20/18 04:31 PM
08/20/18 04:31 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 304
Portland, Oregon
D
Digger73 Offline OP
enthusiast
Digger73  Offline OP
enthusiast
D

Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 304
Portland, Oregon
What you all have said has confirmed what I was thinking.
My first inclination was to toss them and start over.
The only reason I was even considering a redo of the big end was to preserve the balance job on the rotational assembly. I have other options that I may pursue also. Just trying to gather all the information I can to make the most economical and educated choice. The whole once bitten twice shy thing.
Thanks for all the input.

Digger73 (Mike)


I live with fear everyday but, sometimes she lets me race!
Re: Can H beam rods be rebuilt? [Re: Digger73] #2539139
08/20/18 05:04 PM
08/20/18 05:04 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,665
North Dakota
6PakBee Offline
I Live Here
6PakBee  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,665
North Dakota
I seem to be in the minority but I think an assumption is being made that this particular rod has some type of heat treatment. If you want an accurate answer rather than just opinions, why don't you call the rod manufacturer and see what he says. wave


"We live in a time when intelligent people are being silenced so that stupid people won't be offended".
Re: Can H beam rods be rebuilt? [Re: Digger73] #2539152
08/20/18 05:30 PM
08/20/18 05:30 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 304
Portland, Oregon
D
Digger73 Offline OP
enthusiast
Digger73  Offline OP
enthusiast
D

Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 304
Portland, Oregon
The truth of the matter is that I am sort of embarrassed. Due to the fact that I work for a living and have very little extra disposable money flow, I use 440 Source kits. I know I will get all kinds of back lash but it is what I can afford and it allows me to continue to race. I could call them but I am not too sure the rods are even worth any more effort. I take full responsibility for the failure as I was trying something new and am now paying the price for it. I had the rod and main bearings coated with an anti-friction coating. When I assembled the engine the mains were very good on the clearance but the rods were on the tight side. I wanted to assemble the engine and get it in the car so against my better judgement I didn't replace the rod bearings. So I am to fault...

Digger73 (Mike)


I live with fear everyday but, sometimes she lets me race!
Re: Can H beam rods be rebuilt? [Re: Digger73] #2539186
08/20/18 06:19 PM
08/20/18 06:19 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,116
PA.
pittsburghracer Offline
"Little"John
pittsburghracer  Offline
"Little"John

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,116
PA.
Nothing to be ashamed about when Racing on a budget. Thanks to 440source many years ago when they opened up I was finally able to build my first Stroker engine. That engine went 8.60’s@155mph in my Daytona and that engine rotating assembly is still going strong in a street car today.


1970 Duster
Edelbrock headed 408
5.984@112.52
422 Indy headed small block
5.982@112.56 mph
9.42@138.27

Livin and lovin life one day at a time




Re: Can H beam rods be rebuilt? [Re: pittsburghracer] #2539187
08/20/18 06:23 PM
08/20/18 06:23 PM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,393
Ambridge, Pa.
R
rickraw Offline
top fuel
rickraw  Offline
top fuel
R

Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,393
Ambridge, Pa.
I agree with John, a set of decently priced quality rod is cheaper than a complete engine.

Re: Can H beam rods be rebuilt? [Re: 6PakBee] #2539373
08/21/18 12:54 AM
08/21/18 12:54 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,707
Moved to N.E. Tennessee
GomangoCuda Offline
master
GomangoCuda  Offline
master

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,707
Moved to N.E. Tennessee
Originally Posted By 6PakBee
I seem to be in the minority but I think an assumption is being made that this particular rod has some type of heat treatment


No assumption.
440 source heat treating discription


In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice, there is.
Re: Can H beam rods be rebuilt? [Re: Digger73] #2539628
08/21/18 03:39 PM
08/21/18 03:39 PM
Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 30
CA
W
wyrmrider Offline
member
wyrmrider  Offline
member
W

Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 30
CA
No way did they get close to anneal temp if the bearings did not spin
you not all the post heat temp processes they go through
are they still round
torque the bolts down a couple of times with the same lube- do they change dimensions?
mag is not going to show you anything
if a little out of round- which happens to even non hated rods after a few runs
cut the caps flat and re hone
do not worry about the dimension a the parting line it can be a little wide
who makes - actually makes- these rods
no colour pics?

Re: Can H beam rods be rebuilt? [Re: wyrmrider] #2539796
08/21/18 10:40 PM
08/21/18 10:40 PM
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 13,247
Mt. Vernon, Ohio
dartman366 Offline
I Live Here
dartman366  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 13,247
Mt. Vernon, Ohio
Originally Posted By wyrmrider
No way did they get close to anneal temp if the bearings did not spin
you not all the post heat temp processes they go through
are they still round
torque the bolts down a couple of times with the same lube- do they change dimensions?
mag is not going to show you anything
if a little out of round- which happens to even non hated rods after a few runs
cut the caps flat and re hone
do not worry about the dimension a the parting line it can be a little wide
who makes - actually makes- these rods
no colour pics?
I tend to agree with this to a point but since there is no pic's then this is my opinion,, if there is some minor coloring then they may/probably will be ok to re-use after reconditioning, if they are black then pitch them in the nearest scrap hopper and call the supplier of you choosing.


Light travels faster than the speed of sound,,,this is why some people seem bright untill you hear them speak.
Re: Can H beam rods be rebuilt? [Re: GomangoCuda] #2540008
08/22/18 01:54 PM
08/22/18 01:54 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,665
North Dakota
6PakBee Offline
I Live Here
6PakBee  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,665
North Dakota
Originally Posted By GomangoCuda
Originally Posted By 6PakBee
I seem to be in the minority but I think an assumption is being made that this particular rod has some type of heat treatment


No assumption.
440 source heat treating discription


I stand corrected. Thank you. up


"We live in a time when intelligent people are being silenced so that stupid people won't be offended".
Re: Can H beam rods be rebuilt? [Re: 6PakBee] #2540338
08/23/18 10:35 AM
08/23/18 10:35 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
Master
MR_P_BODY  Offline
Master

Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
Yes they can be .. I just did a set a couple
of weeks ago
wave

Page 1 of 2 1 2






Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.1