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#2511352 - 06/21/18 01:24 PM BB solid roller lifter
Dartski68 Offline
member

Registered: 06/21/18
Posts: 4
Loc: Australia
I have factory lifter bore has anyone used solid roller lifter by crower 66233?
This lifter is available on shelf in Australia so it's my first choice.

I'm also considering comp lifter 96829 or comp amc 861

Solid roller cam duration 263 on intake @ 0.50 with 650 lift, street use with lighter street spring pressure


Edited by Dartski68 (06/21/18 02:12 PM)

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#2511391 - 06/21/18 02:41 PM Re: BB solid roller lifter [Re: Dartski68]
Old School Offline
super stock

Registered: 03/12/09
Posts: 1153
Loc: Virginia Beach, VA
I would not use a needle bearing roller lifter for the street. it would be just a matter of time before it fails and sends tool steel shavings throughout your motor. I only use bushed lifters....
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68 cuda formula S 588" bb 5sp
70 CUDA CONVERT 500" 5SP (SUBLIME)
70 CUDA CONVERT 500" 5SP (PLUMCRAZY):TOO MUCH HORSEPOWER, IS ALMOST ENOUGH!

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#2511487 - 06/21/18 07:09 PM Re: BB solid roller lifter [Re: Old School]
Thumperdart Offline


Registered: 07/12/04
Posts: 18738
Loc: State of confusion
Been running an Isky solid roller on the street for many years and had the rollers rebuilt once at Isky but when I freshon up my motor, bushings are going back in............Good advice....... beer
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#2511583 - 06/21/18 11:16 PM Re: BB solid roller lifter [Re: Dartski68]
Cab_Burge Offline
I Win

Registered: 08/23/03
Posts: 30952
Loc: Bend,OR USA
How man miles, not KM tsk, are you wanting to operate this motor between changing or rebuilding these lifters?
I put around 3000 street miles on a older set of Crower Ultra solid body needle bearing roller lifters with no issues shifting it at or above 7000 RPM at the track, lots of 1/8 and some 1/4 mile passes each year up
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#2511626 - 06/22/18 06:07 AM Re: BB solid roller lifter [Re: Dartski68]
Dartski68 Offline
member

Registered: 06/21/18
Posts: 4
Loc: Australia
500-1000 miles a year. I will hit the track once a year. The crower available is Not the H hippo oiling version so it only receives splash.
I know some guys ran the comp AMC 848 but it's no longer available and the new part is 861

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#2511675 - 06/22/18 09:38 AM Re: BB solid roller lifter [Re: Dartski68]
Stanton Offline
master

Registered: 10/13/05
Posts: 6586
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Quote:
I would not use a needle bearing roller lifter for the street. it would be just a matter of time before it fails and sends tool steel shavings throughout your motor. I only use bushed lifters....


Hmmm ... at the Indy Mopar show I asked the Crane rep about using the bushed versus needle bearing lifters on the street. I always figured it would be a better alternative too. He TOTALLY disagreed saying the bushed lifters would not hold up under low rpm use. Part of the reason being that the bushing is solid bronze, not sintered - which couldn't take the beating of a lifter. Therefore it doesn't retain lube and would just burn up. The needle bearing on the other hand would retain some lube in the space between the rollers.

As to the OP's question, with a stock, unbushed lifter bore you need a lifter that has the roller wheel shrouded, otherwise it will expose the oil galley at high lift. I don't know about the lifters you're looking at but the Crane 66550 lifter meets the criteria.

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#2511682 - 06/22/18 09:44 AM Re: BB solid roller lifter [Re: Stanton]
Old School Offline
super stock

Registered: 03/12/09
Posts: 1153
Loc: Virginia Beach, VA
Originally Posted By Stanton
Quote:
I would not use a needle bearing roller lifter for the street. it would be just a matter of time before it fails and sends tool steel shavings throughout your motor. I only use bushed lifters....


Hmmm ... at the Indy Mopar show I asked the Crane rep about using the bushed versus needle bearing lifters on the street. I always figured it would be a better alternative too. He TOTALLY disagreed saying the bushed lifters would not hold up under low rpm use. Part of the reason being that the bushing is solid bronze, not sintered - which couldn't take the beating of a lifter. Therefore it doesn't retain lube and would just burn up. The needle bearing on the other hand would retain some lube in the space between the rollers.

As to the OP's question, with a stock, unbushed lifter bore you need a lifter that has the roller wheel shrouded, otherwise it will expose the oil galley at high lift. I don't know about the lifters you're looking at but the Crane 66550 lifter meets the criteria.


I use the isky Red Zone EZ Max bushed lifters. They don't use a bronze bushing. I have ruined three of my Street Motors using needle bearing roller lifters. It's never a matter of oiling. The problem is spring pressure. With needle bearings, only two or three of the bearings carry the full load, all the other ones are just along for the ride. It's just a matter of not enough surface area to carry the load......


Edited by Old School (06/22/18 09:46 AM)
_________________________
68 cuda formula S 588" bb 5sp
70 CUDA CONVERT 500" 5SP (SUBLIME)
70 CUDA CONVERT 500" 5SP (PLUMCRAZY):TOO MUCH HORSEPOWER, IS ALMOST ENOUGH!

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#2511683 - 06/22/18 09:47 AM Re: BB solid roller lifter [Re: Dartski68]
fast68plymouth Offline
I Live Here

Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 10897
Loc: So. Burlington, Vt.
It would be interesting to know what the ratio is between needle bearing vs bushing, of the roller lifters that have failed on Drag Week.
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#2511829 - 06/22/18 03:28 PM Re: BB solid roller lifter [Re: Dartski68]
Stanton Offline
master

Registered: 10/13/05
Posts: 6586
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Quote:
EZ Max bushed lifters. They don't use a bronze bushing.


Well do they or don't they ??

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#2511842 - 06/22/18 03:55 PM Re: BB solid roller lifter [Re: Stanton]
Old School Offline
super stock

Registered: 03/12/09
Posts: 1153
Loc: Virginia Beach, VA
Originally Posted By Stanton
[quote]EZ Max bushed lifters. They don't use a bronze bushing.


Well do they or don't they ??
[/quote

They don't call it Bronze. It might have some in it you could call isky to find out......


Attachments
Screenshot_20180622-155212.png




Edited by Old School (06/22/18 03:59 PM)
_________________________
68 cuda formula S 588" bb 5sp
70 CUDA CONVERT 500" 5SP (SUBLIME)
70 CUDA CONVERT 500" 5SP (PLUMCRAZY):TOO MUCH HORSEPOWER, IS ALMOST ENOUGH!

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#2511908 - 06/22/18 07:25 PM Re: BB solid roller lifter [Re: Dartski68]
polyspheric Offline
master

Registered: 10/10/07
Posts: 2672
Loc: New York
Just that tiny error in "applications": here is the corrected list
High spring pressure
High spring pressure
High spring pressure
High spring pressure
High spring pressure
High spring pressure
High spring pressure
High spring pressure
High spring pressure
High spring pressure
High spring pressure
High spring pressure
High spring pressure
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#2511923 - 06/22/18 08:08 PM Re: BB solid roller lifter [Re: Dartski68]
Dartski68 Offline
member

Registered: 06/21/18
Posts: 4
Loc: Australia
Isky needle roller bearing lifter 3672-RH
Has anyone used in stock lifter bore
Im planning to use on a Street solid roller cam with lighter spring pressure

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#2511983 - 06/22/18 09:54 PM Re: BB solid roller lifter [Re: Old School]
PorkyPig Offline
mopar

Registered: 08/31/06
Posts: 575
Loc: home in bed
Originally Posted By Old School

I use the isky Red Zone EZ Max bushed lifters. They don't use a bronze bushing. I have ruined three of my Street Motors using needle bearing roller lifters.

How much spring pressure do you run on the street? How much driving do you do on the street?

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#2512030 - 06/23/18 12:16 AM Re: BB solid roller lifter [Re: Dartski68]
Dave Hall Offline
top fuel

Registered: 01/21/08
Posts: 1923
Loc: Cotati, CA
I have Comp 829's in both of my .660-.690 roller motors. I have an extra set so I send them back to Comp for a check and renew/replace. I have had 1 roller lifter issue in the 16 years I have ran these. Broke the guide bar somehow. shruggy Wiped the cam of course. I needed a bigger one anyway... whistling I swap them out in the race car about 250-300 passes along with the inter. gear. The ones in my Dart were a renew set and have been flawless for about 2 years of beat runs to the store and the occasional car show or something. I would go with the Crowers Dartski68 and not think twice about it.

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#2512046 - 06/23/18 03:19 AM Re: BB solid roller lifter [Re: Dartski68]
Dartski68 Offline
member

Registered: 06/21/18
Posts: 4
Loc: Australia
Thanks for posts
About 500 miles a year on street
Springs 210 seat & 550 open

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#2512096 - 06/23/18 09:28 AM Re: BB solid roller lifter [Re: PorkyPig]
Old School Offline
super stock

Registered: 03/12/09
Posts: 1153
Loc: Virginia Beach, VA
Originally Posted By PorkyPig
Originally Posted By Old School

I use the isky Red Zone EZ Max bushed lifters. They don't use a bronze bushing. I have ruined three of my Street Motors using needle bearing roller lifters.

How much spring pressure do you run on the street? How much driving do you do on the street?


On mine I am about 260 seat 785 open. I drive only a couple thousand miles a year.....
_________________________
68 cuda formula S 588" bb 5sp
70 CUDA CONVERT 500" 5SP (SUBLIME)
70 CUDA CONVERT 500" 5SP (PLUMCRAZY):TOO MUCH HORSEPOWER, IS ALMOST ENOUGH!

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#2512690 - 06/24/18 04:44 PM Re: BB solid roller lifter [Re: Old School]
BradH Offline
I Live Here

Registered: 01/30/03
Posts: 13776
Loc: Valhalla... eventually
Originally Posted By Old School
Originally Posted By PorkyPig
Originally Posted By Old School

I use the isky Red Zone EZ Max bushed lifters. They don't use a bronze bushing. I have ruined three of my Street Motors using needle bearing roller lifters.

How much spring pressure do you run on the street? How much driving do you do on the street?


On mine I am about 260 seat 785 open. I drive only a couple thousand miles a year.....

If you need almost 800#s open pressure, you're probably not running a cam that I would consider for a "street motor". No wonder your lifters didn't hold up.

Yeah, you drive it on the street, but you're not really building it with any realistic expectations of longer-term durability.
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#2512697 - 06/24/18 05:05 PM Re: BB solid roller lifter [Re: BradH]
Old School Offline
super stock

Registered: 03/12/09
Posts: 1153
Loc: Virginia Beach, VA
Originally Posted By BradH
Originally Posted By Old School
Originally Posted By PorkyPig
Originally Posted By Old School

I use the isky Red Zone EZ Max bushed lifters. They don't use a bronze bushing. I have ruined three of my Street Motors using needle bearing roller lifters.

How much spring pressure do you run on the street? How much driving do you do on the street?


On mine I am about 260 seat 785 open. I drive only a couple thousand miles a year.....

If you need almost 800#s open pressure, you're probably not running a cam that I would consider for a "street motor". No wonder your lifters didn't hold up.

Yeah, you drive it on the street, but you're not really building it with any realistic expectations of longer-term durability.


All of that above, is correct.... up
_________________________
68 cuda formula S 588" bb 5sp
70 CUDA CONVERT 500" 5SP (SUBLIME)
70 CUDA CONVERT 500" 5SP (PLUMCRAZY):TOO MUCH HORSEPOWER, IS ALMOST ENOUGH!

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#2512943 - 06/25/18 09:32 AM Re: BB solid roller lifter [Re: Dartski68]
an8sec70cuda Offline
I Live Here

Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 10666
Loc: Marion, South Carolina [><]
I have Isky Red Zone solid roller lifters 3472-RH in my hemi. They have needle bearings and were bought in 2006. They didn't offer the bushed lifters back then or that's what I would have gotten. I've sent them back for a check-up twice since then, once in '08, last time in '12. Didn't need anything so back in they went.
My cam has mild lobes and doesn't need a lot of spring pressure...220# closed, 600# open.
I'll be stepping up to a much stronger spring soon, possibly a new cam, and will be sending these lifters back to Isky for yet another check up. I'll evaluate what is needed then.

My KB block has no pressurized lifter oiling. They just get splash and drainback oil. Like said earlier, oiling is rarely the issue w/ lifter failure...it's spring pressure.
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'70 hemicuda...8.91 at 150.5 mph street car...Mopar Action feature Dec. '14
'69 road runner 446" w/ Indy SRs
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#2512962 - 06/25/18 10:05 AM Re: BB solid roller lifter [Re: Old School]
LAD 524 Offline
mopar

Registered: 09/22/05
Posts: 456
Loc: Oz
[/quote]I use the isky Red Zone EZ Max bushed lifters. They don't use a bronze bushing. I have ruined three of my Street Motors using needle bearing roller lifters. It's never a matter of oiling. The problem is spring pressure. With needle bearings, only two or three of the bearings carry the full load, all the other ones are just along for the ride. It's just a matter of not enough surface area to carry the load...... [/quote]

^ this....the same reason I run the same lifters in my combo. Zero issues so far.

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