Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: AndyF]
#2482727
04/14/18 08:49 PM
04/14/18 08:49 PM
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Posts: 14,491 So. Burlington, Vt.
fast68plymouth
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In NHRA Stock Eliminator the battery must remain in the stock location....... So, there are plenty of surprisingly quick small tire cars running with the battery up front.
Last edited by fast68plymouth; 04/14/18 08:51 PM.
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: dthemi]
#2482735
04/14/18 09:10 PM
04/14/18 09:10 PM
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AndyF
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I see Lithium in the driver compartment all the time now, but yet to see one under the hood. I haven't seen that. I wouldn't think that NHRA would allow a battery in the driver compartment. Do they put them in a sealed box or under the floor?
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: AndyF]
#2482823
04/15/18 12:20 AM
04/15/18 12:20 AM
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Bad340fish
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I've seen stock eliminator cars with a master disconnect on the rear panel. That seems really nuts to me unless there is something else going on with the wiring that I don't know about. If they are running a hot cable all the way to the back just for a disconnect switch then it seems like it is less safe than not having a disconnect.
With a battery up front and no disconnect switch there isn't a lot of hot cable. For my car I'm going to use a Ford type solenoid so the starter cable is only hot while cranking. So the only hot line when the key is off is the BATT feed to the fuse panel under the dash. There is some Solid State disconnects now that seem pretty neat. You would have the actual disconnect up front with just some small wires running to the switch in the back. Like this one from Motion RaceWorks. https://www.motionraceworks.com/store/p841/BatteryKillSwitchKitI do not know about NHRA legality though since it is not a mechanical disconnect.
68 Barracuda Formula S 340
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: AndyF]
#2482831
04/15/18 12:25 AM
04/15/18 12:25 AM
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,134 OHIO THE HEART OF IT ALL
64hemi330sedan
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I've seen stock eliminator cars with a master disconnect on the rear panel. That seems really nuts to me unless there is something else going on with the wiring that I don't know about. If they are running a hot cable all the way to the back just for a disconnect switch then it seems like it is less safe than not having a disconnect.
With a battery up front and no disconnect switch there isn't a lot of hot cable. For my car I'm going to use a Ford type solenoid so the starter cable is only hot while cranking. So the only hot line when the key is off is the BATT feed to the fuse panel under the dash. i don't have the wiring diagram handy to post. but there is a simple way to use a switch at the rear using ten gauge and smaller wire.. it just controls the relay mounted in the front. it has to be a snow plow constant power style relay.
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: nss guy]
#2482841
04/15/18 12:40 AM
04/15/18 12:40 AM
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Joined: Aug 2003
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Cab_Burge
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Stockers may have a small battery (possible decoy) up front and large capacity or 16volt in trunk to run everything. Been that way for years
Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: AndyF]
#2482853
04/15/18 01:12 AM
04/15/18 01:12 AM
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Al_Alguire
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My battery in the rear is only 11lbs....
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: AndyF]
#2482918
04/15/18 03:56 AM
04/15/18 03:56 AM
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cudaman1969
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I've seen stock eliminator cars with a master disconnect on the rear panel. That seems really nuts to me unless there is something else going on with the wiring that I don't know about. If they are running a hot cable all the way to the back just for a disconnect switch then it seems like it is less safe than not having a disconnect.
With a battery up front and no disconnect switch there isn't a lot of hot cable. For my car I'm going to use a Ford type solenoid so the starter cable is only hot while cranking. So the only hot line when the key is off is the BATT feed to the fuse panel under the dash. On a stocker, a battery has to be in stock location, no disconnect is needed. Add a battery in the trunk, disconnect is manditory. I'll be using the 3 lbs lithium in the front ($375) and if I need weight I'll use steel plate and lead where needed.
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: hudsonhornet7x]
#2482996
04/15/18 12:12 PM
04/15/18 12:12 PM
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cudaman1969
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Could any of these lithium batteries be used for a street/strip car? Lot's of street miles, say 3,000 per year. Good question. A friend owns and runs an RV operation, sells these batteries. He has a ex pro mod Stattis (? spelling) with an 800 cu Chevy engine, he has two batteries (3x5x5), one for starting and one to run the electronics. No problems even with his previous Corvette race car whitch had them also. Just saying with the vibration and extreme conditions the race cars had-have, street driving should be a breeze. Might add, he has a bank of these in his trailer to run lights and AC with solar panels on the roof to recharge. I was amazed how well they worked
Last edited by cudaman1969; 04/15/18 12:16 PM.
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: AndyF]
#2483012
04/15/18 12:29 PM
04/15/18 12:29 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,491 So. Burlington, Vt.
fast68plymouth
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On a stocker, a battery has to be in stock location, no disconnect is needed. Add a battery in the trunk, disconnect is manditory. Exactly.
68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123 Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: AndyF]
#2483039
04/15/18 01:04 PM
04/15/18 01:04 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
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ProSport
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I put mine up front also just for simplicity.
1970 Challenger, all aluminum 528 Hemi, HDK suspension, Tremec 5 speed manual
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: moparx]
#2483055
04/15/18 01:33 PM
04/15/18 01:33 PM
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Joined: Mar 2003
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cdwmotorsports
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On a stocker, a battery has to be in stock location, no disconnect is needed. Add a battery in the trunk, disconnect is manditory.
which begs this question. what about the "factory" location[s] on several newer cars with the battery in the trunk or under the rear seat ? disconnect mandatory even though this is a factory location[s] ? Not that its fast but some of the SRT's are... my wife's 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee has the battery under the front passenger seat
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: AndyF]
#2483099
04/15/18 03:02 PM
04/15/18 03:02 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
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longram60
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I run the Braille battery in my NSS car. The 17# only lasted about two years, so I went with the larger 21# this year.
1979 AMC Spirit, NHRA Q/SA
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: AndyF]
#2483108
04/15/18 03:23 PM
04/15/18 03:23 PM
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slantzilla
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Challengers are in the spare tire well.
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: AndyF]
#2483110
04/15/18 03:26 PM
04/15/18 03:26 PM
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CMcAllister
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Some stocker guys put a master switch up front to shut the front battery off as well. 9.99 or quicker requires a shut off in the back, regardless where the battery is. The switch doesn't have to be back there. The shut off does so everyone knows where to look for it. It can operate the actual switch with a cable. Master switch is a safety device. I wouldn't have a race car without it. Especially with a lithium battery. I want everything off when the car is not being raced.
Not sure why a battery up front is any better than a battery in the rear with appropriate cables running up front to a set of terminals, studs or pass throughs.
If the results don't match the theory, change the theory.
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: moparx]
#2483112
04/15/18 03:37 PM
04/15/18 03:37 PM
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cudaman1969
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On a stocker, a battery has to be in stock location, no disconnect is needed. Add a battery in the trunk, disconnect is manditory.
which begs this question. what about the "factory" location[s] on several newer cars with the battery in the trunk or under the rear seat ? disconnect mandatory even though this is a factory location[s] ? Only if another is added. Why? Can't remember NHRAs rational on this, maybe we can't make as good a battery box as the factory? Shut offs have to be in the back of car so running two cables front to back would be, lets say, weird. Them wanting battery in stock location is to keep the car "stock appearing" only.
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: cudaman1969]
#2483117
04/15/18 03:49 PM
04/15/18 03:49 PM
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Joined: Feb 2006
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1DGEMAN
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Could any of these lithium batteries be used for a street/strip car? Lot's of street miles, say 3,000 per year. Good question. A friend owns and runs an RV operation, sells these batteries. He has a ex pro mod Stattis (? spelling) with an 800 cu Chevy engine, he has two batteries (3x5x5), one for starting and one to run the electronics. No problems even with his previous Corvette race car whitch had them also. Just saying with the vibration and extreme conditions the race cars had-have, street driving should be a breeze. Might add, he has a bank of these in his trailer to run lights and AC with solar panels on the roof to recharge. I was amazed how well they worked What brand of battery?
Real Men shift for themselves
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: AndyF]
#2483125
04/15/18 04:10 PM
04/15/18 04:10 PM
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Bad340fish
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All of the charger,magnum,300,Challenger have the battery in the rear. But it is factory so I am sure no disconnect is needed.
68 Barracuda Formula S 340
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: CMcAllister]
#2483306
04/15/18 09:39 PM
04/15/18 09:39 PM
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Joined: Mar 2003
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Forest
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Some stocker guys put a master switch up front to shut the front battery off as well. 9.99 or quicker requires a shut off in the back, regardless where the battery is. The switch doesn't have to be back there. The shut off does so everyone knows where to look for it. It can operate the actual switch with a cable. Master switch is a safety device. I wouldn't have a race car without it. Especially with a lithium battery. I want everything off when the car is not being raced.
Not sure why a battery up front is any better than a battery in the rear with appropriate cables running up front to a set of terminals, studs or pass throughs. Does the rule book specifically say if they battery is in factory location and the car is faster than 9.99 it requires a disconnect switch? I don't believe it does. I just clarified this with a NHRA div 6 tech guy...quite a few hellcat Challenger/Chargers running 9's now with battery in the trunk in the factory location.
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: AndyF]
#2483309
04/15/18 09:46 PM
04/15/18 09:46 PM
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CMcAllister
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Rule book says "must stop all electrical functions". The only thing I ever have on the battery side of the master is the heavy wire running to the one wire alternator. Everything gets shut off.
If the results don't match the theory, change the theory.
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: AndyF]
#2483348
04/15/18 10:45 PM
04/15/18 10:45 PM
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rowin4
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Andy, go to the Painless Performance Products web site . click on accessories. PN# 50105 high output solenoid shut off. I think that could be wired into your key switch for total shut off.
Last edited by rowin4; 04/15/18 10:57 PM.
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: CMcAllister]
#2483381
04/16/18 12:03 AM
04/16/18 12:03 AM
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AndyF
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Rule book says "must stop all electrical functions". The only thing I ever have on the battery side of the master is the heavy wire running to the one wire alternator. Everything gets shut off. That is true for a carb car. I don't think EFI cars are going to work that way. At least they don't if you follow the Holley instructions.
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: rowin4]
#2483383
04/16/18 12:07 AM
04/16/18 12:07 AM
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AndyF
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Andy, go to the Painless Performance Products web site . click on accessories. PN# 50105 high output solenoid shut off. I think that could be wired into your key switch for total shut off. I don't think I need a cutoff switch since I'm not aiming for 9's and I have the battery under the hood. I'm just going to use the key to shut things off. I'm also going to use a Ford type solenoid so the starter wire is only hot during cranking. I think that is pretty safe setup and should be NHRA legal for 10's.
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: AndyF]
#2483562
04/16/18 01:04 PM
04/16/18 01:04 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
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cudaman1969
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Finding the right solenoid has been a bit of an adventure. I started off with a typical Ford solenoid but then learned that I should use a diode suppressed solenoid to protect the ECU. So I got a diode suppressed one and then I figured out that I needed some way to make the neutral start function work. So now I'm shopping for a third solenoid. Good news is these things are cheap. I give my mistakes away to a buddy who is a Ford guy....... Have you thought about one of those cable shut offs the See Doos use when a person is thrown off? Break away on a trailer comes to mind to also, but maybe not enough amperage. Then there's the fuel pump shut off on vehicles in an accident, this would shut down everything if driver was incapitated, might make a difference till safety personnel could get there. Good to have backup systems.
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: AndyF]
#2484428
04/17/18 11:29 PM
04/17/18 11:29 PM
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64HemiSavoy
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I've seen stock eliminator cars with a master disconnect on the rear panel. That seems really nuts to me unless there is something else going on with the wiring that I don't know about. If they are running a hot cable all the way to the back just for a disconnect switch then it seems like it is less safe than not having a disconnect.
With a battery up front and no disconnect switch there isn't a lot of hot cable. For my car I'm going to use a Ford type solenoid so the starter cable is only hot while cranking. So the only hot line when the key is off is the BATT feed to the fuse panel under the dash. Most Stocker's run the battery in the stock under hood location as well as one in the trunk where the disconnect is required.
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: AndyF]
#2484534
04/18/18 10:52 AM
04/18/18 10:52 AM
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Al_Alguire
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For the most part all dragster have their batteries up front, many in the nose area of the car. They have to have a cutoff at the rear as the rulebook states, they all usually also have one in the cockpit as well. If you have a door car there are a few in cockpit kits for battery shut off like this one from Lokar that use a Morse cable https://www.summitracing.com/parts/lok-1330023
"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."
"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: AndyF]
#2484626
04/18/18 02:32 PM
04/18/18 02:32 PM
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Joined: Dec 2005
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CMcAllister
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I wouldn't have another door car without a cable/lever assembly to be able to turn the master on and off from the drivers seat.
If the results don't match the theory, change the theory.
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: Bad340fish]
#2484651
04/18/18 03:16 PM
04/18/18 03:16 PM
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Joined: Dec 2005
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CMcAllister
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Is that for safety reasons or for when you get strapped in and forget to turn the switch on Both. Plenty of situations where I may need to turn power on or off without struggling out of the car first.
If the results don't match the theory, change the theory.
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Re: Battery under hood for race car
[Re: CMcAllister]
#2484673
04/18/18 03:53 PM
04/18/18 03:53 PM
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justinp61
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Is that for safety reasons or for when you get strapped in and forget to turn the switch on Both. Plenty of situations where I may need to turn power on or off without struggling out of the car first. A buddy of mine always runs a cable to the kill switch too. He says if something goes wrong he'll be the first one there.
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