Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2
Bang-for-buck street protection - oil pan or accumulator? #2472385
03/26/18 05:20 PM
03/26/18 05:20 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 817
Eugene, Oregon
Secret Chimp Offline OP
super stock
Secret Chimp  Offline OP
super stock

Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 817
Eugene, Oregon
I have been spending a lot of hours replacing the rest of my car's suspension - which has me turning to the stock mid-sump small block oil pan I have on my motor (late 90s 318 in a 67 Coronet)

I'm never going to run this car very hard, maybe an autocross at most - otherwise just some backwoods fun. But I don't want to cause myself problems from cornering or braking starvation if it's a possibility with a stock pan. I can see how the oil can slop forward away from the pickup currently.

However, I also don't want to run a road race pan for the sake of ground clearance - if I were to change the pan, I'd want a trapdoored/baffled stock mid-sump, not an 8 qt with kickouts. However, nobody seems to outright sell these things so I don't know where to start with that option.

This is what makes me curious about an accumulator - just a basic type plumbed in through a sandwich plate.

Does this make sense for my application or do the failure risks involved with running the lines to/from the accumulator not make sense for street use?


1967 Dodge Coronet Deluxe station wagon

1.03" T-bars, QA1 arms/rods, Cordoba/GM Metric/Volare brake & knuckle, XHDs, Hellwig rear sway, 318 Magnum w/ air gap, 727, 3.23s
Re: Bang-for-buck street protection - oil pan or accumulator? [Re: Secret Chimp] #2472388
03/26/18 05:33 PM
03/26/18 05:33 PM
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 701
Northern California
lilcuda Offline
super stock
lilcuda  Offline
super stock

Joined: May 2007
Posts: 701
Northern California
Here's my two cents. I owned the "Red Brick" aka "Tim's Valiant" for a couple of years and only drove it on the street. It has an Accusump as well as a road race pan. One of the advantages of the Accusump is that you can prime the oil system before you crank it. Great for when the car sits for a long time. The oil lines can leak. I had a one medium size leak that I fixed by re-sealing the connection. The Accumsump makes oil changes a bit more of a task, but not too involved. If you really don't want to mess with a road race pan, it is a good alternative. Spend the money for the electric valve. Makes it much easier to deal with.


'67 is an abbreviation of 1967
67' is an abbreviation of 67 feet
They are not interchangeable.
Re: Bang-for-buck street protection - oil pan or accumulator? [Re: Secret Chimp] #2472394
03/26/18 05:47 PM
03/26/18 05:47 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
BigBlockMopar Offline
master
BigBlockMopar  Offline
master

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
I simply welded a baffle inside the pan to somewhat control the oil.

Bang-for-Buck approved?



https://www.bigblockmopar.nl/2016/08/360-engine-update/


Re: Bang-for-buck street protection - oil pan or accumulator? [Re: Secret Chimp] #2472417
03/26/18 06:12 PM
03/26/18 06:12 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 817
Eugene, Oregon
Secret Chimp Offline OP
super stock
Secret Chimp  Offline OP
super stock

Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 817
Eugene, Oregon
I haven't spent the bucks on a MIG yet (I have no idea how to and I'd be teaching myself, so good reason!) but otherwise I would've done that already, indeed. Probably should've noted why I haven't just done that yet..


1967 Dodge Coronet Deluxe station wagon

1.03" T-bars, QA1 arms/rods, Cordoba/GM Metric/Volare brake & knuckle, XHDs, Hellwig rear sway, 318 Magnum w/ air gap, 727, 3.23s
Re: Bang-for-buck street protection - oil pan or accumulator? [Re: Secret Chimp] #2472421
03/26/18 06:23 PM
03/26/18 06:23 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
BigBlockMopar Offline
master
BigBlockMopar  Offline
master

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
But you could always pre-fab the baffle and have it welded in place by someone else.
I started out with a simple piece of sheetmetal and trimmed it to fit.
Folded a lip on sides and in the center for reinforcement and tacked it in place. Did some finish welding afterwards.

Re: Bang-for-buck street protection - oil pan or accumulator? [Re: BigBlockMopar] #2472432
03/26/18 06:40 PM
03/26/18 06:40 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 4,368
Michigan
MarkZ Offline
Worthy
MarkZ  Offline
Worthy

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 4,368
Michigan
Had one of these when I was running a 360. Never had an oil starvation problem with spirited driving. Price has gone up a tad though.

https://kevkoracing.com/collections/mopar/products/part-m302-chrysler-stock-location-pans-1


Last edited by MarkM; 03/26/18 06:40 PM.

1987 Fifth Avenue - 512/518/D60
Re: Bang-for-buck street protection - oil pan or accumulator? [Re: Secret Chimp] #2472578
03/27/18 12:41 AM
03/27/18 12:41 AM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 817
Eugene, Oregon
Secret Chimp Offline OP
super stock
Secret Chimp  Offline OP
super stock

Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 817
Eugene, Oregon
Man, I knew I was forgetting an option when I was circling back to this. That's not a bad price for the features. I should've bought a Kevko pan when I swapped this thing originally. Thanks!


1967 Dodge Coronet Deluxe station wagon

1.03" T-bars, QA1 arms/rods, Cordoba/GM Metric/Volare brake & knuckle, XHDs, Hellwig rear sway, 318 Magnum w/ air gap, 727, 3.23s
Re: Bang-for-buck street protection - oil pan or accumulator? [Re: Secret Chimp] #2473031
03/27/18 11:07 PM
03/27/18 11:07 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
Mr.Yuck Offline
Not enough dumb comments...yet
Mr.Yuck  Offline
Not enough dumb comments...yet

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
I doubt you'll need an accumulator. It will be hard to find a nice road racing pan for a mopar. I'd think a nice 6qt pan with some trap doors would work well enough.


[IMG]http://i66.tinypic.com/pui5j.jpg[/IMG]
Coming soon!!!!
Re: Bang-for-buck street protection - oil pan or accumulator? [Re: MarkZ] #2473034
03/27/18 11:09 PM
03/27/18 11:09 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
Mr.Yuck Offline
Not enough dumb comments...yet
Mr.Yuck  Offline
Not enough dumb comments...yet

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
Originally Posted By MarkM
Had one of these when I was running a 360. Never had an oil starvation problem with spirited driving. Price has gone up a tad though.

https://kevkoracing.com/collections/mopar/products/part-m302-chrysler-stock-location-pans-1



that is a nice pan and a good price. we paid over $350 for our SBC raod racing pan.

Re: Bang-for-buck street protection - oil pan or accumulator? [Re: BigBlockMopar] #2473394
03/28/18 04:58 PM
03/28/18 04:58 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,385
Pikes Peak Country
T
TC@HP2 Offline
master
TC@HP2  Offline
master
T

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,385
Pikes Peak Country
Originally Posted By Mr.Yuck
I doubt you'll need an accumulator. It will be hard to find a nice road racing pan for a mopar. I'd think a nice 6qt pan with some trap doors would work well enough.


The Milodon pans are pretty nice. They are darn near a custom piece with an off the shelf price.

Originally Posted By BigBlockMopar
I simply welded a baffle inside the pan to somewhat control the oil.

Bang-for-Buck approved?



https://www.bigblockmopar.nl/2016/08/360-engine-update/



I've done that on several cars. Even if you don't have a welder, if you trim up a piece of steel sheet fromteh hardware store and have it welded in at the local shop, you are talking about a less than $20 modification to ensure the pick up stays covered.

Re: Bang-for-buck street protection - oil pan or accumulator? [Re: Secret Chimp] #2476737
04/03/18 01:15 PM
04/03/18 01:15 PM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,440
NW Chicago suburban area
Mopar Mitch Offline
pro stock
Mopar Mitch  Offline
pro stock

Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,440
NW Chicago suburban area
Too bad MaMopar didn't produce the factory stock oil pans with simple horizontal baffles similar to as shown. I had that done (by a fellow Mopar experienced road racer/autocrosser who showed me his own) to my own oil pan nearly 40 years ago when I began autocrossing. This was the absolute best engine modification ever done to any of my engines -- allows retained oil pressure under hi-g-force cornering, acceleration and deceleration.

The best reason to use an Accusump would be for pre-oiling after long sitting time periods. I actually have a new 3-qt Accusump and most of the required items to install, just never got around to it. Truly, I've done without it for over 40 years of very serious competition AXg (pylon, HSAX/HPDE, etc).

During my current new engine rebuild (small block), I'm considering installing it this time around. Possibly with a ~25 psi valve to activate it while engine is running IF it would ever run below ~25 psi. All considerations being thought of, as well as location and plumbing. Its still a street-driven car, but used primarily for wknd track events (mostly HPDE/HSAX, maybe returning to pylon autocrossing in the future).

I'd like to see some pictures of cars with an Accusump installed -- location, set-up details, etc. Engine bay location adds weight to the front end (not desirable, but convenient). Interior? Trunk? Remote filter location? Electronic solenoid valve location? Activation light?


Mopar Mitch "Road racers and autocrossers go in deeper and come out harder!"... and rain never stops us from having fun with our cars... in fact, it makes us better drivers! Check out MOPAR ACTION MAGAZINE, August 2006 issue for feature article and specs on my autocross T/A!
Re: Bang-for-buck street protection - oil pan or accumulator? [Re: Mopar Mitch] #2476896
04/03/18 05:39 PM
04/03/18 05:39 PM
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 701
Northern California
lilcuda Offline
super stock
lilcuda  Offline
super stock

Joined: May 2007
Posts: 701
Northern California
Originally Posted By Mopar Mitch
Too bad MaMopar didn't produce the factory stock oil pans with simple horizontal baffles similar to as shown. I had that done (by a fellow Mopar experienced road racer/autocrosser who showed me his own) to my own oil pan nearly 40 years ago when I began autocrossing. This was the absolute best engine modification ever done to any of my engines -- allows retained oil pressure under hi-g-force cornering, acceleration and deceleration.

The best reason to use an Accusump would be for pre-oiling after long sitting time periods. I actually have a new 3-qt Accusump and most of the required items to install, just never got around to it. Truly, I've done without it for over 40 years of very serious competition AXg (pylon, HSAX/HPDE, etc).

During my current new engine rebuild (small block), I'm considering installing it this time around. Possibly with a ~25 psi valve to activate it while engine is running IF it would ever run below ~25 psi. All considerations being thought of, as well as location and plumbing. Its still a street-driven car, but used primarily for wknd track events (mostly HPDE/HSAX, maybe returning to pylon autocrossing in the future).

I'd like to see some pictures of cars with an Accusump installed -- location, set-up details, etc. Engine bay location adds weight to the front end (not desirable, but convenient). Interior? Trunk? Remote filter location? Electronic solenoid valve location? Activation light?


Mitch, here is a picture of the Accusump in "Tim's Valiant". It has the electronic valve. THe lines run along the passenger side sill and up under the dash, through a plate over the hole where the heater fan used to be. The gauge on the Accusump stays close to the same pressure as the gauge on the dash, so no need to have a valve that opens at 25 psi. If the engine oil pressure drops, the Accusump automatically dumps its contents into the engine.

13 (2).jpg

'67 is an abbreviation of 1967
67' is an abbreviation of 67 feet
They are not interchangeable.
Re: Bang-for-buck street protection - oil pan or accumulator? [Re: lilcuda] #2477432
04/04/18 03:52 PM
04/04/18 03:52 PM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,440
NW Chicago suburban area
Mopar Mitch Offline
pro stock
Mopar Mitch  Offline
pro stock

Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,440
NW Chicago suburban area
T/Anks Lilcuda for the pic... IF I had a roll bar setup I'd consider something like that.


Mopar Mitch "Road racers and autocrossers go in deeper and come out harder!"... and rain never stops us from having fun with our cars... in fact, it makes us better drivers! Check out MOPAR ACTION MAGAZINE, August 2006 issue for feature article and specs on my autocross T/A!
Re: Bang-for-buck street protection - oil pan or accumulator? [Re: lilcuda] #2477445
04/04/18 04:33 PM
04/04/18 04:33 PM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,432
NorCal
RylisPro Offline
top fuel
RylisPro  Offline
top fuel

Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,432
NorCal
Isn't that a Moroso Accumulator in the pic? Exactly the same thing as Canton's Accusump but in a silver can instead of blue.
I wouldn't mount an Accumulator/Accusump on a roll bar like that if I had room further back and lower on the floor as it helps with weight distribution and center of gravity. I mounted mine where the rear bench seat used to be. I don't have a good pic of it but you can see it make a cameo in my camera mount video on YouTube. The AN-12 line is plumbed and runs by the passenger seat to the engine bay.



73 `Cuda
Instagram: @rylispro
YouTube: RylisPro
www.rylispro.com
925-214-9192
Re: Bang-for-buck street protection - oil pan or accumulator? [Re: RylisPro] #2477466
04/04/18 05:18 PM
04/04/18 05:18 PM
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 701
Northern California
lilcuda Offline
super stock
lilcuda  Offline
super stock

Joined: May 2007
Posts: 701
Northern California
Originally Posted By RylisPro
Isn't that a Moroso Accumulator in the pic? Exactly the same thing as Canton's Accusump but in a silver can instead of blue.
I wouldn't mount an Accumulator/Accusump on a roll bar like that if I had room further back and lower on the floor as it helps with weight distribution and center of gravity. I mounted mine where the rear bench seat used to be. I don't have a good pic of it but you can see it make a cameo in my camera mount video on YouTube. The AN-12 line is plumbed and runs by the passenger seat to the engine bay.


Yes, I believe it is the Moroso Accumulator. I refer to it as an Accusump incorrectly, like many people refer to all tissues as Kleenex. Not sure why it was mounted that way. I guess so that the gauge was readable by looking over your shoulder. I was never fully comfortable with it in that spot, thinking that a leak could be quite messy and possibly painful if it sprayed around in the passenger compartment, but since I no longer own the car, it's not my problem. :-)


'67 is an abbreviation of 1967
67' is an abbreviation of 67 feet
They are not interchangeable.
Re: Bang-for-buck street protection - oil pan or accumulator? [Re: Secret Chimp] #2477509
04/04/18 07:19 PM
04/04/18 07:19 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,645
Phila. Pa.
Mattax Offline
top fuel
Mattax  Offline
top fuel

Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,645
Phila. Pa.
That's an Accusump. It used to be the difference was that Canton's used a schraeder valve for a preload of airpressure behind the piston. IIRC Moroso's had a hemispherical end and that had to be pointed upward. Canton Accusmps's were raw finish for years.

accusump.jpg
Last edited by Mattax; 04/05/18 01:38 AM. Reason: clarification and spelling
Re: Bang-for-buck street protection - oil pan or accumulator? [Re: Secret Chimp] #2477527
04/04/18 07:44 PM
04/04/18 07:44 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,645
Phila. Pa.
Mattax Offline
top fuel
Mattax  Offline
top fuel

Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,645
Phila. Pa.
As far as the original question goes, a basic sump baffle as bigblockmopar posted will be fine. The problem with these pans is the relatively shallow sumps - and back wall is worse than front due to the clearance needed for the oilpump.
IMO a long baffle about 1/2 way up the sidewall can also help. These baffles won't trap the oil, but will redirect slosh and splash back into the sump.

Also when using a factory small block windage tray open a couple more louvers on it. That's an old tech bulletin tip and I had class racers tell me it makes a difference at high rpm.

The accussump brings its own quirks. I'm actually not using mine right now. Haven't for a while - although its ready if needed, but does not have differential fill vs empty arrangement. IMO that's important. The electric valve's big advantage is the pressure switch prioritizing the oil to go to the engine first. Tim added the pressure switch and that helped address what had been a problem.

Re: Bang-for-buck street protection - oil pan or accumulator? [Re: Secret Chimp] #2477603
04/04/18 10:23 PM
04/04/18 10:23 PM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,695
Bitopia
J
jcc Offline
If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
jcc  Offline
If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
J

Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,695
Bitopia
See pic #57 for my solution, far bottle is fire suppression. I took so much heat a decade ago here when I mentioned this solution, of oil pressure lines inside car, that I never brought it again till posting my build thread a few years back. Sounds like times have changed. up

https://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/ubbt...tml#Post1553823


Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.
Re: Bang-for-buck street protection - oil pan or accumulator? [Re: Mopar Mitch] #2487629
04/25/18 02:24 AM
04/25/18 02:24 AM
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 9
colorado, USA
C
cudaracer42 Offline
member
cudaracer42  Offline
member
C

Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 9
colorado, USA
Mitch, the Cuda has an Accusump mounted between the seats. Not optimal for car balance or for a street driven car but it works well because it is controlled manually. The line out from the engine goes to the filter mounted where the windshield washer bottle for E bodies is located. This makes sure the Accusump bottle gets clean oil. The line out of the filter has a check valve to prevent back flow from the Accusump into the wrong side of the filter. After the check valve is a T. One side of the T goes to the Accusump and the other side of the T goes to the oil in at the block. Email me outside here if you want more info. Jess

Re: Bang-for-buck street protection - oil pan or accumulator? [Re: Mattax] #2487646
04/25/18 03:19 AM
04/25/18 03:19 AM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,432
NorCal
RylisPro Offline
top fuel
RylisPro  Offline
top fuel

Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,432
NorCal
Canton was cool enough to let me be a dealer for them now and as for the electric valve they are promoting their updated Pro Electric Valve kit which has more durable piston design instead of the older rubber diaphragm version which is prone to rupture with high oil pressures

For road racing applications Canton also recommends their 35-40 psi control valve.

Plumbing is easy enough just as Jess described above, just a pain in the ass because of the residual oil contained within the Accusump even though it has been pressurized to dump all the oil back into the oil pan.


73 `Cuda
Instagram: @rylispro
YouTube: RylisPro
www.rylispro.com
925-214-9192
Page 1 of 2 1 2






Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.1