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What went wrong? #2469889
03/21/18 07:09 PM
03/21/18 07:09 PM
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Howell, Mi
Shatar4 Offline OP
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I had built a 505 stroker. here is the list of parts:
440 bored .30
505 stroker kit from Ohio Crankshaft
84cc Edelbrock heads with stock rocker arms
Edelbrock Torker 2 intake
Holley 850 carb
HYDRAULIC − Serious street and bracket
race cam.
10:1 compression, lower gears,
headers and 3500+ stall.
Hyd. Hyd. 3000 to 6500 21-229-428
Single-Bolt
XE295HL 295 307 251 257.564.564 110°
Dougs 3" headers

Took it to the dyno and it only put out 231 hp and 286 torque.
I lost probably about half the horse power somewhere.

Last edited by Shatar4; 03/21/18 07:27 PM.
Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2469910
03/21/18 07:28 PM
03/21/18 07:28 PM
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Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
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Did you degree the cam
wave

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2469913
03/21/18 07:29 PM
03/21/18 07:29 PM
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Sonora CA
Mopar_Rich Offline
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Are those rear wheel HP and TQ numbers?

Last edited by Mopar_Rich; 03/21/18 07:30 PM.
Re: What went wrong? [Re: MR_P_BODY] #2469930
03/21/18 07:51 PM
03/21/18 07:51 PM
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Howell, Mi
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Yes

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2469931
03/21/18 07:52 PM
03/21/18 07:52 PM
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merpar Offline
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Stock rocker arms? Is that meaning stamped steel? If so get rid of them and get some adjustable's. That's a pretty decent hyd cam should make over 600 hp easily. Degree the cam? Break in the cam with proper lube?

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Mopar_Rich] #2469932
03/21/18 07:52 PM
03/21/18 07:52 PM
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Howell, Mi
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Originally Posted By Mopar_Rich
Are those rear wheel HP and TQ numbers?

Rear wheel

Re: What went wrong? [Re: merpar] #2469952
03/21/18 08:07 PM
03/21/18 08:07 PM
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Howell, Mi
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Originally Posted By merpar
Stock rocker arms? Is that meaning stamped steel? If so get rid of them and get some adjustable's. That's a pretty decent hyd cam should make over 600 hp easily. Degree the cam? Break in the cam with proper lube?

Yes,stamped steel rockers.
Broke the motor in with Joe Gibbs oil.
We did degree the cam.
Hot rod magizine built a 573 hp and used stamped steel rockers so I doubt that would make me lose that much hp and tq.

http://www.hotrod.com/how-to/engine/1412-how-you-can-build-a-stout-537hp-street-440/

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2469955
03/21/18 08:10 PM
03/21/18 08:10 PM
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Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
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What did you degree the cam into
wave

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2469958
03/21/18 08:13 PM
03/21/18 08:13 PM
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I don't see any problems with that parts list so I'm guessing the tune is way off. Do the standard checks and see what you find.

Spark plug wires connected? Plug wires in the correct order? Compression check? Look at plugs, look at ports, etc. Vacuum leaks? Air Fuel ratio? Ignition timing? etc.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2469965
03/21/18 08:23 PM
03/21/18 08:23 PM
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Bend,OR USA
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That sounds like half throttle or less results work
Did you verify that you have the carb opened all the way with you in the car with the gas pedal on the floor? If not try that up twocents
Let us know what you find to fix this luck thumbs


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2469970
03/21/18 08:25 PM
03/21/18 08:25 PM
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Cochise Co, Az, From Detroit
moetown Offline
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Does the car run and drive like a 230hp engine or what it should be over 500hp ?. With numbers that low, but the car runs strong, I might have to question the dyno itself.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: AndyF] #2469971
03/21/18 08:26 PM
03/21/18 08:26 PM
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pittsburghracer Offline
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I hate the intake for that combo, I hate the convertor choice for that combo, did you check for total timing in the 32-36 range for a start. Did you check for proper preload on those non adjustable rockers.


1970 Duster
Edelbrock headed 408
5.984@112.52
422 Indy headed small block
5.982@112.56 mph
9.42@138.27

Livin and lovin life one day at a time




Re: What went wrong? [Re: AndyF] #2469974
03/21/18 08:29 PM
03/21/18 08:29 PM
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Howell, Mi
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Originally Posted By AndyF
I don't see any problems with that parts list so I'm guessing the tune is way off. Do the standard checks and see what you find.

Spark plug wires connected? Plug wires in the correct order? Compression check? Look at plugs, look at ports, etc. Vacuum leaks? Air Fuel ratio? Ignition timing? etc.

They did change the plugs and upped the jets to 88 and 90. They reset the timing to 34 degrees. I have the dyno sheet at home and I’ll post it when I get there. It’s a very well Mopar place in Michigan that ran it on the Dyno and he can’t figure it out. Very disappointing

Re: What went wrong? [Re: moetown] #2469977
03/21/18 08:34 PM
03/21/18 08:34 PM
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Howell, Mi
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I had it dyno’d at Jake’s. He’s a Mopar guy so I don’t think it’s the dyno

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2469978
03/21/18 08:34 PM
03/21/18 08:34 PM
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Porter67 Offline
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Wondering what you used for push rods and lifter preload?


Do ya got a vid of this dyno session or of the car running, id think it probably dont sound well when running either.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Porter67] #2469984
03/21/18 08:46 PM
03/21/18 08:46 PM
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Howell, Mi
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Originally Posted By EV2Bird
Wondering what you used for push rods and lifter preload?


Do ya got a vid of this dyno session or of the car running, id think it probably dont sound well when running either.

I do have a video but have no idea how to post it here

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2469987
03/21/18 08:59 PM
03/21/18 08:59 PM
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Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
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Originally Posted By Shatar4
I had it dyno’d at Jake’s. He’s a Mopar guy so I don’t think it’s the dyno


I had my car checked at Jakes also... did you
ask him what might be your issue(if he throught
there was)
wave

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2469992
03/21/18 09:05 PM
03/21/18 09:05 PM
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CMcAllister Offline
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Something going on besides the jetting or the timing being off a few numbers. Compression test, leak it, get the timing cover off and check the cam timing. Cut the oil filter apart and check it. Exhaust blocked. Transmission OK. Has to run and sound bad when it's being driven.


If the results don't match the theory, change the theory.
Re: What went wrong? [Re: MR_P_BODY] #2470005
03/21/18 09:29 PM
03/21/18 09:29 PM
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Howell, Mi
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Originally Posted By MR_P_BODY
Originally Posted By Shatar4
I had it dyno’d at Jake’s. He’s a Mopar guy so I don’t think it’s the dyno


I had my car checked at Jakes also... did you
ask him what might be your issue(if he throught
there was)
wave

I did and he had no idea. He was going to ask his buddy at Modern to see if he had anything and get back with me.
I believe I'm going to pull the motor and dissect it and maybe something will show up.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: CMcAllister] #2470006
03/21/18 09:31 PM
03/21/18 09:31 PM
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Howell, Mi
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Originally Posted By CMcAllister
Something going on besides the jetting or the timing being off a few numbers. Compression test, leak it, get the timing cover off and check the cam timing. Cut the oil filter apart and check it. Exhaust blocked. Transmission OK. Has to run and sound bad when it's being driven.


Did all that. Did the compession check and leak down and everything looked great. Trans is good. I just dont know. I sank and boat load of money in this thing and my Ford Focus has more power!

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2470010
03/21/18 09:41 PM
03/21/18 09:41 PM
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Howell, Mi
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Originally Posted By Shatar4
Originally Posted By EV2Bird
Wondering what you used for push rods and lifter preload?


Do ya got a vid of this dyno session or of the car running, id think it probably dont sound well when running either.

I do have a video but have no idea how to post it here

https://youtu.be/0TVC1dn6SwI

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2470014
03/21/18 09:47 PM
03/21/18 09:47 PM
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Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
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I really think your cam timing is retarted..
check the crank zero mark first.. I wouldnt
pull the engine yet.. pull the timing cover
and check the cam timing again
wave

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2470015
03/21/18 09:47 PM
03/21/18 09:47 PM
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Very nice car!!!!!!!!!!


1970 Duster
Edelbrock headed 408
5.984@112.52
422 Indy headed small block
5.982@112.56 mph
9.42@138.27

Livin and lovin life one day at a time




Re: What went wrong? [Re: MR_P_BODY] #2470019
03/21/18 09:50 PM
03/21/18 09:50 PM
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Howell, Mi
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Originally Posted By MR_P_BODY
I really think your cam timing is retarted..
check the crank zero mark first.. I wouldnt
pull the engine yet.. pull the timing cover
and check the cam timing again
wave

Would that make me lose half the hp? I was thinking cam lobe's or something. To lose that much hp, it has to be affecting all the cylinders.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: pittsburghracer] #2470020
03/21/18 09:50 PM
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Howell, Mi
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Originally Posted By pittsburghracer
Very nice car!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2470025
03/21/18 09:53 PM
03/21/18 09:53 PM
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Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
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Originally Posted By Shatar4
Originally Posted By MR_P_BODY
I really think your cam timing is retarted..
check the crank zero mark first.. I wouldnt
pull the engine yet.. pull the timing cover
and check the cam timing again
wave

Would that make me lose half the hp? I was thinking cam lobe's or something. To lose that much hp, it has to be affecting all the cylinders.


A retarted cam will act just like that.. I check
the cam 3-4 times when I put them in and it'll
be slow reving
wave

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2470027
03/21/18 09:55 PM
03/21/18 09:55 PM
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baldwinsville new york
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a493demon Offline
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Are you sure it's getting full throttle ?

Re: What went wrong? [Re: a493demon] #2470030
03/21/18 09:58 PM
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Howell, Mi
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Yes. It gets to around 4600 rpm and drops like a rock

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2470033
03/21/18 10:01 PM
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If you missed it, what are you using for pushrods?

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2470034
03/21/18 10:02 PM
03/21/18 10:02 PM
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plycuda Offline
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check to see if your balancer timing mark is right.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: MR_P_BODY] #2470038
03/21/18 10:04 PM
03/21/18 10:04 PM
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Mt. Vernon, Ohio
dartman366 Offline
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Originally Posted By MR_P_BODY
Originally Posted By Shatar4
Originally Posted By MR_P_BODY
I really think your cam timing is retarted..
check the crank zero mark first.. I wouldnt
pull the engine yet.. pull the timing cover
and check the cam timing again
wave

Would that make me lose half the hp? I was thinking cam lobe's or something. To lose that much hp, it has to be affecting all the cylinders.


A retarted cam will act just like that.. I check
the cam 3-4 times when I put them in and it'll
be slow reving
wave
i have to agree with Mike, sounds like its laboring untill it get's up so then it liven's up after that.


Light travels faster than the speed of sound,,,this is why some people seem bright untill you hear them speak.
Re: What went wrong? [Re: Porter67] #2470041
03/21/18 10:10 PM
03/21/18 10:10 PM
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Howell, Mi
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Had them made. 3/8 chromemoly

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2470053
03/21/18 10:22 PM
03/21/18 10:22 PM
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Howell, Mi
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Here are the dyno sheets. First one is before they changed the jets. Second is what the car sits now.

35B111A6-5F8E-49B4-AD84-D0F3D254978D.jpeg49A0C234-5B82-497C-9630-7C1589ECAB74.jpeg
Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2470064
03/21/18 10:38 PM
03/21/18 10:38 PM
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Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
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Could you hear the engine surging
wave

Last edited by MR_P_BODY; 03/21/18 10:39 PM.
Re: What went wrong? [Re: MR_P_BODY] #2470075
03/21/18 10:44 PM
03/21/18 10:44 PM
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Howell, Mi
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Originally Posted By MR_P_BODY
Could you hear the engine surging
wave

No. The only way they knew the jets were off is by the laptop.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2470078
03/21/18 10:46 PM
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There is a lot of ups and downs in the pulls
wave

Re: What went wrong? [Re: MR_P_BODY] #2470080
03/21/18 10:50 PM
03/21/18 10:50 PM
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Howell, Mi
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Originally Posted By MR_P_BODY
There is a lot of ups and downs in the pulls
wave

There was then he changed the primary jets and it cleaned it up.
The last sheet is after the jet change. Was at Jakes for 5 hrs trying to figure this out.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2470093
03/21/18 11:10 PM
03/21/18 11:10 PM
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If it won't pull past 4000 rpm then I'd suspect that it is a valve train issue. Lifters are probably collapsing. Put a solid flat tappet cam in it and it will probably pull hard to 6500 rpm and give you 500+ hp.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2470138
03/22/18 12:23 AM
03/22/18 12:23 AM
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Cotati, CA
Dave Hall Offline
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FWIW, the graph looks like the car has a throttle stop on it! I agree with Andy and others that the valves aren't opening or at the wrong time. If you're going to go solid lifter, make it a solid roller.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2470256
03/22/18 10:16 AM
03/22/18 10:16 AM
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Marion, South Carolina [><]
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Nothing wrong w/ the parts list IMO. Definitely something stupid holding it back. The lifters could be an issue, but there's no reason a hydraulic shouldn't pull to 6k+ rpm. Might need different lifters if those are bleeding down. A solid roller would be my choice too, but the hydraulic you have should work.

Check things like where the cam is in at, verify the TDC mark on the balancer is where it should be, verify you don't have lobes going flat, etc.

FWIW...my old stock stroke 440, 10:1, basically stock 906 heads w/ the 509/292 purpleshaft (w/ stock stamped rockers and stock pushrods) made 340 hp on the chassis dyno and ran 11.80s at 112 mph at 3700 lbs.


CHIP
'70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60
'69 road runner, 440-6, 18 spline 4 speed, Dana 60
'71 Demon, 340, low gear 904, 8.75
'73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75
'90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt
'06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2470275
03/22/18 11:00 AM
03/22/18 11:00 AM
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lewtot184 Offline
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loose torque converters (especially with hi-torque engines) and chassis dynos aren't always a good mix. stock rockers can give too much preload on the tappets and I don't think those edelbrock springs are up to snuff for that cam. you probably have a coupe of, if not more, issues to look at.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: an8sec70cuda] #2470276
03/22/18 11:01 AM
03/22/18 11:01 AM
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NE
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Are you using the valve springs that came with the heads? I had a problems and after trying so many things I pulled off all the valve spring and had them checked. I had at least 4 that were really weak. You might want to check valve springs and if weak go with a better set recommended for the cam you are running.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: moparpoolman] #2470297
03/22/18 11:53 AM
03/22/18 11:53 AM
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Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
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It can very well be the springs.. when I dynoed
my engine it had about 6 weak springs.. I changed
them and got my power and rpms back... and I checked
a few before I put the engine together.. but the ones
I checked were OK
wave

Re: What went wrong? [Re: lewtot184] #2470327
03/22/18 12:40 PM
03/22/18 12:40 PM
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Washington
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madscientist Offline
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Originally Posted By lewtot184
loose torque converters (especially with hi-torque engines) and chassis dynos aren't always a good mix. stock rockers can give too much preload on the tappets and I don't think those edelbrock springs are up to snuff for that cam. you probably have a coupe of, if not more, issues to look at.



His converter isn't too loose. If anything it's too tight.

I just watched a video of monza from street outlaws with his car on a wheel dyno. You can hear it go up on the converter.

High torque and chassis dynos are done all the time. It's not the dynos fault.


Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
Re: What went wrong? [Re: madscientist] #2470404
03/22/18 02:46 PM
03/22/18 02:46 PM
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I am putting one of those kit together right now. They used a 1.865 ch piston, and a 6.700 rod. I had to take .040 off the block to get to 0 deck. If you are .040 in the hole and have 80+ cc heads your compression could be way off. What was the parts used in your kit? What was your assembled c.h.? Example 10 cc for the deck vol. 8 cc for the pockets 10 cc for the gasket and 84cc for the heads =112cc at tdc. 1035cc swept vol.
1147/112 = 10.24cr. ok still seems down on power. What is the intake close at .050. Could way down on dynamic compression.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2470416
03/22/18 03:00 PM
03/22/18 03:00 PM
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Sweden
Mopar Guy Offline
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Are you shore that you have the cam were it is surpose to be.... it must be of ! A classic mistake is to degree it on the ext lobe ! Just my 2 cent if the cam is made corekt and i hope you sort it out.

Last edited by Mopar Guy; 03/22/18 03:04 PM.
Re: What went wrong? [Re: Mopar Guy] #2470438
03/22/18 03:40 PM
03/22/18 03:40 PM
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sasquatch Offline
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That graph/chart shows what valve float looks like on the dyno. IF you are using the Edelbrock springs they are NOT suited to that camshaft. The Comp XE grinds are really aggressive and need a pretty serious spring. I know, I know that they are supposed to be good for 600 lift. Horse puckey. I have a 5 gallon bucket full of them that we only use on really mild stuff (like 480 and under lift). That cam is 564 lift. I would use a Comp 925 with the right retainers and locks. Not a huge fan of the super big hyd cams either for this and other reasons. I would also advise against a cam like this as a single bolt cam either. Comp will grind the same (or any) single bolt cam as a 3 bolt (you just have to order it like that). Hey the Hemi and factory six pack motors are three bolts for a reason. Now please send all the "i have ran single bolts and edelbrock springs for years" posts to someone else. Also of note is what part number lifter are you using? 822-16 or 867-16? It matters. Also stock rockers on this cam profile will most likely lead to pushrods being pushed through the sockets in the rockers in the not so distant future. Pull the valve covers and have a looky loo. Pop one or two springs off and look at the bottom of the retainers and the locks. Are they shiny? Are the locks already showing wear? The eddies do not use a great lock. Upgrade to some 10 degree stuff if you change the springs.
Todd

Last edited by sasquatch; 03/22/18 03:44 PM.
Re: What went wrong? [Re: sasquatch] #2470439
03/22/18 03:43 PM
03/22/18 03:43 PM
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Either valve springs or a fuel delivery issue.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: sasquatch] #2470562
03/22/18 06:49 PM
03/22/18 06:49 PM
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Howell, Mi
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Originally Posted By sasquatch
That graph/chart shows what valve float looks like on the dyno. IF you are using the Edelbrock springs they are NOT suited to that camshaft. The Comp XE grinds are really aggressive and need a pretty serious spring. I know, I know that they are supposed to be good for 600 lift. Horse puckey. I have a 5 gallon bucket full of them that we only use on really mild stuff (like 480 and under lift). That cam is 564 lift. I would use a Comp 925 with the right retainers and locks. Not a huge fan of the super big hyd cams either for this and other reasons. I would also advise against a cam like this as a single bolt cam either. Comp will grind the same (or any) single bolt cam as a 3 bolt (you just have to order it like that). Hey the Hemi and factory six pack motors are three bolts for a reason. Now please send all the "i have ran single bolts and edelbrock springs for years" posts to someone else. Also of note is what part number lifter are you using? 822-16 or 867-16? It matters. Also stock rockers on this cam profile will most likely lead to pushrods being pushed through the sockets in the rockers in the not so distant future. Pull the valve covers and have a looky loo. Pop one or two springs off and look at the bottom of the retainers and the locks. Are they shiny? Are the locks already showing wear? The eddies do not use a great lock. Upgrade to some 10 degree stuff if you change the springs.
Todd


I had pulled the motor today just to dissect to find the problem. I’m going to send the heads out to have the springs and valves checked. While it’s out I believe I’m going to change the cam to a solid. Any recommendations on a cam? It’s just disheartening to have high expectations from this motor and my wife’s car has more power than mine.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2470581
03/22/18 07:20 PM
03/22/18 07:20 PM
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You don't need a very big cam for what you are trying to accomplish. The old Mopar .528 solid will work fine or use something similar from your favorite cam vendor. Comp has a 294S or a XS282S. I'm sure Hughes has some cams that will work just fine. If you want to go custom then call Porter Racing Heads and have Dwayne spec you a cam, lifters and valve spring combo.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2470644
03/22/18 08:22 PM
03/22/18 08:22 PM
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Oakland, MI
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Honestly there is nothing the matter with the cam you have... if anything it probably needs more valve spring, but it will make power just fine.

Double check everything, including the rocker to spring clearance, and rocker pattern.

On the dyno you looked at o2, so fuel starvation is out because it would show up going lean. You double checked the timing (although the balancer could be way off), so sort of ruled that out. It could have weak springs on it, but even if they are weak, I would have expected it to run clean a lot higher RPM then it did (but you'll double check that now).

Honestly though... That being said, if the motor sounded like it ran good (no ticking or anything crazy), I wouldn't be surprised if the coil was junk (new or not).

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2470673
03/22/18 09:07 PM
03/22/18 09:07 PM
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Originally Posted By Shatar4
I had pulled the motor today just to dissect to find the problem. I’m going to send the heads out to have the springs and valves checked. While it’s out I believe I’m going to change the cam to a solid. Any recommendations on a cam? It’s just disheartening to have high expectations from this motor and my wife’s car has more power than mine.

Are you going to do all the checking you can on this motor now?
If so please recheck the cam timing to make sure EXACTLY where the intake lobe center is twocents
I've used the same Comp Cams grind in more than one pump gas street motor, stock stroke and 4.25 stroke motors, all of them did good on the engine dyno and in the car up
I do use adjustable rocker arms also on any of my halfway serious motor, especially on hydraulic lifter motors to get the lifter preload correct scope work
I set the heads up with between 140 to 165 Lbs. on the seats and from 325 to 360 Lbs. open pressures up
I use to know John Deanna(SP?), Hot Rod, Car Craft, Motor trend writer and publisher a long time ago, and buy parts from him. I have seen many articles written buy other writers at Pertersen Publishing in those magazines that where dead wrong on a lot of the details and parts use on cars they did articles on some of my friends race cars whiney Same thing on technical build articles that some of shops fed them bad info to test how smart the writers where haha work shruggy
My message is do NOT believe every thing you see in print or pictures tsk
Please let us know what you find on this problem, YOU can find it up

Last edited by Cab_Burge; 03/22/18 09:08 PM.

Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: What went wrong? [Re: Cab_Burge] #2470770
03/23/18 12:38 AM
03/23/18 12:38 AM
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you never answered if you were using the springs that came with the heads?
Sounds like you're doing way to much when you could of taken off all the valve springs and had them checked while the engine was together and still in the car. Sounds too late though but if you haven't taken the engine apart yet, that's what I would do.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: moparpoolman] #2470816
03/23/18 03:18 AM
03/23/18 03:18 AM
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Howell, Mi
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Originally Posted By moparpoolman
you never answered if you were using the springs that came with the heads?
Sounds like you're doing way to much when you could of taken off all the valve springs and had them checked while the engine was together and still in the car. Sounds too late though but if you haven't taken the engine apart yet, that's what I would do.

Yes, I did not change the springs. From box to motor. I took it out because I want to check everything and it’s a lot easier when it’s out. Besides I can put it on an engine dyno and check it when it’s all together.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2470852
03/23/18 09:52 AM
03/23/18 09:52 AM
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Everyone is giving great recommendations here. That being said let me give my take on this. None of the parts are realy wrong but maybe just not right for combo. Maybe some not my choice but should have still made way more power than it did. when the veh was brought in it was brought in mostly because he was having a spark knock issue so the first things checked was plugs and timing. found there was the wrong plugs in it. It had short reach j style plug when it needs long reach n style so plugs where changed timing was locked out at 34. Doing low speed runs found the carb was very lean so a jet change was made. Full pulls where found to be lean but not in the danger zone. Still my thoughts thou where the tuning was not going to make up for that much lose in power. Tried to add some jet and it went crazy and didnt like that at all. My thoughts are I would have done adjustable rockers and different springs. I have never had much faith in those springs that come with those heads. Also it seam like lifter preload may have been to tight without knowing what the adjustment really was when assembled with the none adjustable rockers. Also if cam was not degreed in just the power band would just been off not that much of a loss unless it was way off,but he said it was dot to dot. watching the graff the converter was going to about 3700 rpm so that wasn't way out. now that the motor is out I would get the heads set up get the rockers. Not a big fan on spending the money on new cam that cam is fine. On another note car was done very nice and the customer and his son and friend that where there where great to talk to

Last edited by JAKE68; 03/23/18 10:02 AM.

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Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2470877
03/23/18 11:11 AM
03/23/18 11:11 AM
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Was the exhaust open or closed? Did you check for excess back pressure? I had a muffler come apart once and partially blocked the exhaust. that car couldn't get out of it's own way.


Joe


Without Data, you’re just another guy with an opinion.
Re: What went wrong? [Re: B1MAXX] #2470968
03/23/18 02:46 PM
03/23/18 02:46 PM
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Apollo, PA.
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Originally Posted By B1MAXX
I am putting one of those kit together right now. They used a 1.865 ch piston, and a 6.700 rod. I had to take .040 off the block to get to 0 deck. If you are .040 in the hole and have 80+ cc heads your compression could be way off. What was the parts used in your kit? What was your assembled c.h.? Example 10 cc for the deck vol. 8 cc for the pockets 10 cc for the gasket and 84cc for the heads =112cc at tdc. 1035cc swept vol.
1147/112 = 10.24cr. ok still seems down on power. What is the intake close at .050. Could way down on dynamic compression.


Using advertised cam timing event your dynamic c.r. could be as low as 6.4 to 1 with excess lifter preload on a hydraulic would make it worse. mabe start with reducing preload to almost 0.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: B1MAXX] #2471074
03/23/18 07:23 PM
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sasquatch Offline
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Ok
Red flag to check.
You cannot degree a cam by going dot to dot on the timing chain. It could be anywhere. You need a degree wheel and find true TDC. Just going off what I read here.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: sasquatch] #2471084
03/23/18 07:42 PM
03/23/18 07:42 PM
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Originally Posted By sasquatch
Ok
Red flag to check.
You cannot degree a cam by going dot to dot on the timing chain. It could be anywhere. You need a degree wheel and find true TDC. Just going off what I read here.




Bingo


1970 Duster
Edelbrock headed 408
5.984@112.52
422 Indy headed small block
5.982@112.56 mph
9.42@138.27

Livin and lovin life one day at a time




Re: What went wrong? [Re: sasquatch] #2471128
03/23/18 09:33 PM
03/23/18 09:33 PM
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Carson City, Nevada
Biginchmopar Offline
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Originally Posted By sasquatch
Ok
Red flag to check.
You cannot degree a cam by going dot to dot on the timing chain. It could be anywhere. You need a degree wheel and find true TDC. Just going off what I read here.


iagree

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2471147
03/23/18 10:14 PM
03/23/18 10:14 PM
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McGregor,Iowa 52157
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Stamped rockers w/no adjustment might have too much preload and may keep the valves from sealing when you get into the rpm

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Biginchmopar] #2471155
03/23/18 10:49 PM
03/23/18 10:49 PM
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Howell, Mi
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Originally Posted By Biginchmopar
Originally Posted By sasquatch
Ok
Red flag to check.
You cannot degree a cam by going dot to dot on the timing chain. It could be anywhere. You need a degree wheel and find true TDC. Just going off what I read here.


iagree

That’s why I pulled the motor so I can check everything.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2471223
03/24/18 03:12 AM
03/24/18 03:12 AM
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Carson City, Nevada
Biginchmopar Offline
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Originally Posted By Shatar4
Originally Posted By Biginchmopar
Originally Posted By sasquatch
Ok
Red flag to check.
You cannot degree a cam by going dot to dot on the timing chain. It could be anywhere. You need a degree wheel and find true TDC. Just going off what I read here.


iagree

That’s why I pulled the motor so I can check everything.

up

Re: What went wrong? [Re: pittsburghracer] #2471231
03/24/18 04:43 AM
03/24/18 04:43 AM
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Mt.Gilead, Ohio
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Originally Posted By pittsburghracer
Very nice car!!!!!!!!!!

iagree You have an awesome Challenger. I hope you can get it figured out.


1969 Dart GTS 340
1969 Super Bee X9 N-96
1969 Coronet R/T X9 N-96
2015 Dodge Dart GT
2019 Ram 2500 Big Horn.
Looking for the original block for my Bee. The last 4 are 7449
Re: What went wrong? [Re: OhioMopar] #2471233
03/24/18 05:28 AM
03/24/18 05:28 AM
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Howell, Mi
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Originally Posted By OhioMopar
Originally Posted By pittsburghracer
Very nice car!!!!!!!!!!

iagree You have an awesome Challenger. I hope you can get it figured out.

Thank you

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2471414
03/24/18 05:22 PM
03/24/18 05:22 PM
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There is something crazy wrong here! It seems everyone has given some good insights. It could be a combination of probs, but I am going with the cam timing is off or the lifters are being crushed by too much preload {just a simple shimming of the rocker shafts would fix this}

Re: What went wrong? [Re: tjmarcus1] #2471432
03/24/18 06:17 PM
03/24/18 06:17 PM
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Land 'O Lakes
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Originally Posted By tjmarcus1
There is something crazy wrong here! It seems everyone has given some good insights. It could be a combination of probs, but I am going with the cam timing is off or the lifters are being crushed by too much preload {just a simple shimming of the rocker shafts would fix this}



iagree with this statement, double check cam with degree wheel....also nice Challenger BTW...hope you can straighten this out, good luck!


Plymouth Makes It!
Re: What went wrong? [Re: RoadRunnerLuva] #2482982
04/15/18 11:47 AM
04/15/18 11:47 AM
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NE
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any update on your findings?

Re: What went wrong? [Re: moparpoolman] #2548300
09/10/18 11:22 AM
09/10/18 11:22 AM
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Howell, Mi
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Well after i took the motor back out and gave it to the engine builder, he found that he acidently put the timing off by one tooth. I took the heads off and the valves were kissing the pistons leaving a half moon mark on them. Set the heads off to be checked and replaced the lifters with roller rockers. I put the motor back in and its like night and day. Huge difference! Now i just have to get it back on the dyno to see the differemce. Anyone know of one that is around the Detriot area? Called Jakes this morning and they were 3-4 weeks out.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2548314
09/10/18 11:49 AM
09/10/18 11:49 AM
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Everyone may be on to something with the cam timing.We had an engine that came in that had the cam lined dot to dot and wouldn't run.Came to find the dot to dot was the wrong refrence one dot was at the came gear and the other was at the crank keyway slot when it should have been at the crank gear tooth.The dot crank keyway was the designation for the retard tooth setting.Rest the crank gear tooth slot dot to the cam gear dot and it ran fine.There were 3 setting at the crank gear a retangle for retard a triangle for advance and a dot for straight up.The installer mistook the retangle for dot.Never use the mark at the keyway as a setting for the cam use it to position the related mark at the tooth area.This is worth investigating.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: B G Racing] #2548333
09/10/18 12:25 PM
09/10/18 12:25 PM
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Chilliwack B.C. Canada
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It sounds like he tried to go dot to dot the first time, missed that and cost you some bent valves. Then he really put in the effort and got it dot to dot on the second go?
Please. before bolting the heads on find out what the measured centerline is. Your guy probably can't do it. Find someone who can. Oops too late, well I guess it's running anyway.

Last edited by RUNCHARGER; 09/10/18 12:26 PM.

Sheldon
Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2548354
09/10/18 01:14 PM
09/10/18 01:14 PM
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JAKE68 Offline
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Originally Posted By Shatar4
Well after i took the motor back out and gave it to the engine builder, he found that he acidently put the timing off by one tooth. I took the heads off and the valves were kissing the pistons leaving a half moon mark on them. Set the heads off to be checked and replaced the lifters with roller rockers. I put the motor back in and its like night and day. Huge difference! Now i just have to get it back on the dyno to see the differemce. Anyone know of one that is around the Detriot area? Called Jakes this morning and they were 3-4 weeks out.



Give me a call and I will see what I can do to get you in earlier Jake


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Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2548357
09/10/18 01:18 PM
09/10/18 01:18 PM
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MI, usa
dvw Online content
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Why didn't the motor "assembler" degree the cam?
Doug

Re: What went wrong? [Re: dvw] #2548361
09/10/18 01:23 PM
09/10/18 01:23 PM
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pittsburghracer Offline
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Some of these "so called" engine builders scare the CRAP out of me.


1970 Duster
Edelbrock headed 408
5.984@112.52
422 Indy headed small block
5.982@112.56 mph
9.42@138.27

Livin and lovin life one day at a time




Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2548368
09/10/18 01:35 PM
09/10/18 01:35 PM
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A few lessons learned. whistlingThere are parts guys that do more than just sell parts whistling
Cams MUST be degreed with a wheel and dial indicator.

Even good engine builders can make a mistake,they ARE human.I hope he stepped up and took car of the expense you had to endure!

Cams and springs really need to be "matched" and checked for accuracy!
The right combo of cam & spring can make a huge difference up


HEMI-ITIS has no cure.
My condition is fully BLOWN!!
Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2548378
09/10/18 01:52 PM
09/10/18 01:52 PM
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New York
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What's the A:F just after the torque drop-off?


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Re: What went wrong? [Re: pittsburghracer] #2548382
09/10/18 02:02 PM
09/10/18 02:02 PM
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Bend,OR USA
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Originally Posted By pittsburghracer
Some of these "so called" engine builders scare the CRAP out of me.
iagree Me too shruggy
The first solid roller cam I bought and installed in a customers 1958 392 (300 motor originally with dual AFB quads and adjustable rocker arms boogie) stock hemi boat motor in a 18 ft. flat bottom Stevens V drive. It had a solid lifter cam in it before and would rev a little over 6000 RPM in gear on the water according to the customer, not so with the new Sig Erson solid roller race boat camshaft whiney
It wouldn't rev past 3000 RPM with that new cam install straight up dot to dot in the water in gear shock runaway
It revved like crazy in the boat out of the water confused
I had my wife take that cam back to Sig Erson three times to have them check it, they swore up and down it was okay runaway I had to wait 5 weeks for them to grind that cam as it was not a standard shelf cam they stock at their factory back then in 1971 work
They where not real helpful on solving the problem as long as I dealt with Sig Erson younger brother Babe Erson down
I had that motor in and out of the boat fives times and apart before finding out that the cam had been ground 10 degrees retarded runaway puke
I learned that from one of their older techs on the next to the last call to them when he taught me how to degree the cam on the lobe centers, it was a real eye opener up shruggy
They swore it wasn't their special ground expensive brand new cam shaft, it had to be the timing set or the crankshaft key way being ground in the wrong location and so on and on.
They ended up giving me a set of offset cam and crankshaft keyways to get it installed where the lobe centers should have been instead of replacing it with another new one ground properly whiney down
It was off on the cam card on the lobes a little bit, 2 to 5 degrees at .020 checking it on both intake and exhaust lobes so that should have been a good indicator it was ground wrong from day one to me realcrazy
That was my first experience with a solid roller cam and my last time I bought any Sig Erson products down
I have learned since then most problems with engines or with other things, end up helping me become better up

Last edited by Cab_Burge; 09/10/18 02:05 PM.

Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2548450
09/10/18 04:44 PM
09/10/18 04:44 PM
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 874
Missouri
J
jwb123 Offline
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Missouri
I agree with what several said, its a cam timing issue. I would do a cranking compression test and then a running compression test. You should have 160 to 180 lbs of compression at least, and then the running compression test should go to 80% of the cranking when you blip the throttle. If those numbers are low your cam is off. A quick way to tell is rotate the engine to the overlap at TDC, look at the valves one is opening and one is closing, if both vales are the same height your cam is in heads up, if intake is down its advanced, if exhaust is down its retarded. One bad things about a chassis dyno is lack of instrumentation, an engine dyno with exhaust temp sensors, fuel flow, pressure, etc. would really help diagnose the issue. Their is nothing really wrong with your parts, its something with how they were assembled.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2548495
09/10/18 06:50 PM
09/10/18 06:50 PM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,853
Pattison Texas
CSK Offline
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CSK  Offline
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Pattison Texas
Originally Posted By Shatar4
Well after i took the motor back out and gave it to the engine builder, he found that he acidently put the timing off by one tooth. I took the heads off and the valves were kissing the pistons leaving a half moon mark on them. Set the heads off to be checked and replaced the lifters with roller rockers. I put the motor back in and its like night and day. Huge difference! Now i just have to get it back on the dyno to see the differemce. Anyone know of one that is around the Detriot area? Called Jakes this morning and they were 3-4 weeks out.




He found the problem !!!!! ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ smile


1968 Charger COLD A/C Hilborn EFI
512ci 9.7 compression, Stealth heads, 4.10 gear A518 ODtrans 4100lb,10.93 full street car trim
2020 T/A 392 Stock 11.79 @ 114.5

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2548503
09/10/18 07:03 PM
09/10/18 07:03 PM
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,581
N/E, Michigan
RATTRAP Offline
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RATTRAP  Offline
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Posts: 1,581
N/E, Michigan
Originally Posted By Shatar4
Anyone know of one that is around the Detriot area? Called Jakes this morning and they were 3-4 weeks out.




You an try Full Throttle racing In Fraser,MI they have a chassis dyno.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2548511
09/10/18 07:24 PM
09/10/18 07:24 PM
Joined: Dec 2013
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Wichita
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GY3 Offline
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GY3  Offline
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Wichita
Jeez, what a stupid mistake!

I've seen combos that don't run like they should and people always blame the cam. I always ask if they degreed it and 9 times out of 10 they say, "I made sure and lined up the dots!". blush


'63 Dodge 330
11.19 @ 121 mph
Pump gas, n/a, through the mufflers on street tires with 3.54's. 3,600 lbs.
10.01 @ 133mph with a 250 shot of nitrous an a splash of race gas. 1.36 60 ft. 3,700 lbs.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: GY3] #2548515
09/10/18 08:03 PM
09/10/18 08:03 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,158
PA.
pittsburghracer Offline
"Little"John
pittsburghracer  Offline
"Little"John

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,158
PA.
For you guys that struggle with degreeing in cams buy yourself this tool. It sure make the job a lot easier.



https://www.summitracing.com/oh/parts/cca-4926


1970 Duster
Edelbrock headed 408
5.984@112.52
422 Indy headed small block
5.982@112.56 mph
9.42@138.27

Livin and lovin life one day at a time




Re: What went wrong? [Re: RATTRAP] #2548518
09/10/18 08:35 PM
09/10/18 08:35 PM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 1,038
Howell, Mi
Shatar4 Offline OP
super stock
Shatar4  Offline OP
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Posts: 1,038
Howell, Mi
Originally Posted By RATTRAP
Originally Posted By Shatar4
Anyone know of one that is around the Detriot area? Called Jakes this morning and they were 3-4 weeks out.




You an try Full Throttle racing In Fraser,MI they have a chassis dyno.


Got it covered! Jake was awesome and fit me in sooner! 👍

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2548524
09/10/18 08:56 PM
09/10/18 08:56 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
Master
MR_P_BODY  Offline
Master

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Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
Glad you got it squared away.. very nice ride
wave

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2548572
09/10/18 11:19 PM
09/10/18 11:19 PM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,495
Shelby mi.
J
JAKE68 Offline
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JAKE68  Offline
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Shelby mi.
I got him coming in Thursday.


JAKES AUTOMOTIVE
Re: What went wrong? [Re: JAKE68] #2548603
09/11/18 12:27 AM
09/11/18 12:27 AM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,123
Bend,OR USA
C
Cab_Burge Offline
I Win
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I Win
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,123
Bend,OR USA
Make sure you LET him ring its tale whistling wrench hammer


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2549718
09/13/18 06:49 PM
09/13/18 06:49 PM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 1,038
Howell, Mi
Shatar4 Offline OP
super stock
Shatar4  Offline OP
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Howell, Mi
Just got home from the dyno at Jakes. First I have to say Gary at Jakes is awesome fortaking care of me. So now the numbers. For a Stroker motor that has only parts from out of the box I think it’s pretty good adding in the power train lose.
414 hp and 429 torque.

7A180E15-ADD1-481F-8C94-78666A29E432.jpeg
Last edited by Shatar4; 09/13/18 07:28 PM.
Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2549754
09/13/18 09:05 PM
09/13/18 09:05 PM

S
Superfreak
Unregistered
Superfreak
Unregistered
S



So about 484hp

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2549798
09/13/18 11:43 PM
09/13/18 11:43 PM
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 598
NC, USA
D
davenc Offline
mopar
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D

Joined: May 2005
Posts: 598
NC, USA
Looks like there is more power to be had with further carb tuning. Did you get a chance to do any tuning when you had the car on the rollers?

Re: What went wrong? [Re: davenc] #2549809
09/13/18 11:58 PM
09/13/18 11:58 PM
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 566
Texas
R
RustyM Offline
mopar
RustyM  Offline
mopar
R

Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 566
Texas
Agree with Dave.
Was that with an air cleaner on it?

I cannot remember if this is a carb or efi?
Wondering if valve train is getting unstable at 5k and above as well.
Certainly seems really lean to me.


Last edited by RustyM; 09/14/18 12:01 AM.
Re: What went wrong? [Re: pittsburghracer] #2549853
09/14/18 04:25 AM
09/14/18 04:25 AM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
451Mopar Offline
master
451Mopar  Offline
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Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
Originally Posted By pittsburghracer
For you guys that struggle with degreeing in cams buy yourself this tool. It sure make the job a lot easier.

https://www.summitracing.com/oh/parts/cca-4926


That tool is nice for checking cam centerline. I have seen it mis-used trying to set/measure opening and closing events or duration. The results will be slightly off because the follower diameter of the tool is smaller (0.841" is what mine measured) than a real MOPAR lifter (0.904".)
I don't know the radius used for the rounded follower used for roller cams? If I want to measure duration or opening and closing events, I use the actual lifter the engine will be using as the roller cam lifters may have different diameter rollers.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2549917
09/14/18 11:53 AM
09/14/18 11:53 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,492
So. Burlington, Vt.
F
fast68plymouth Offline
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fast68plymouth  Offline
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Posts: 14,492
So. Burlington, Vt.
Originally Posted By Shatar4
Well after i took the motor back out and gave it to the engine builder, he found that he acidently put the timing off by one tooth. I took the heads off and the valves were kissing the pistons leaving a half moon mark on them.


So, two things that I would consider pretty much “mandatory” for a build like this obviously didn’t get done.
Cam didn’t get degreed, and valve to piston clearance not verified.

I dynoed a very mild 505 last fall that was similar, but milder.
Stage 1 rpm heads, .483 lift hyd cam, original Torker, 850vs carb, 1-7/8” headers.

I told him it would make about 600ft/lbs and 500hp.
It made 628tq/515hp.

With an RPM intake and the OP’s cam I would have been looking for another 40-50hp.

Back in about 1990, on a 500hp 440 I tested an original Torker against a Torker II.
The Torker II had noticeably better top end power than the original Torker, which resulted in a peak gain of about 15hp, but at the top of the run it was more like a 30hp difference.
The original Torker had better bottom end and made about 15ft/lbs more peak tq.


68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123
Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
Re: What went wrong? [Re: RustyM] #2550046
09/14/18 06:01 PM
09/14/18 06:01 PM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 1,038
Howell, Mi
Shatar4 Offline OP
super stock
Shatar4  Offline OP
super stock

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Posts: 1,038
Howell, Mi
Originally Posted By RustyM
Agree with Dave.
Was that with an air cleaner on it?

I cannot remember if this is a carb or efi?
Wondering if valve train is getting unstable at 5k and above as well.
Certainly seems really lean to me.


The air cleaner was not on it. It is a 850 carb.

Re: What went wrong? [Re: fast68plymouth] #2550049
09/14/18 06:08 PM
09/14/18 06:08 PM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 1,038
Howell, Mi
Shatar4 Offline OP
super stock
Shatar4  Offline OP
super stock

Joined: May 2004
Posts: 1,038
Howell, Mi
Originally Posted By fast68plymouth
Originally Posted By Shatar4
Well after i took the motor back out and gave it to the engine builder, he found that he acidently put the timing off by one tooth. I took the heads off and the valves were kissing the pistons leaving a half moon mark on them.


So, two things that I would consider pretty much “mandatory” for a build like this obviously didn’t get done.
Cam didn’t get degreed, and valve to piston clearance not verified.

I dynoed a very mild 505 last fall that was similar, but milder.
Stage 1 rpm heads, .483 lift hyd cam, original Torker, 850vs carb, 1-7/8” headers.

I told him it would make about 600ft/lbs and 500hp.
It made 628tq/515hp.

With an RPM intake and the OP’s cam I would have been looking for another 40-50hp.

Back in about 1990, on a 500hp 440 I tested an original Torker against a Torker II.
The Torker II had noticeably better top end power than the original Torker, which resulted in a peak gain of about 15hp, but at the top of the run it was more like a 30hp difference.
The original Torker had better bottom end and made about 15ft/lbs more peak tq.

So do you think if I change the intake to a Edelbrock RPM I would gain some?

Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2550057
09/14/18 06:35 PM
09/14/18 06:35 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,492
So. Burlington, Vt.
F
fast68plymouth Offline
I Live Here
fast68plymouth  Offline
I Live Here
F

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,492
So. Burlington, Vt.
“Some”?
Sure...... but mostly in the lower part of the curve is what I’d expect.

Peak hp would likely be within 10.

Way more work involved, but I’d expect better results out of some head porting instead.


68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123
Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
Re: What went wrong? [Re: Shatar4] #2550142
09/14/18 11:34 PM
09/14/18 11:34 PM
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 598
NC, USA
D
davenc Offline
mopar
davenc  Offline
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 598
NC, USA
Originally Posted By Shatar4

So do you think if I change the intake to a Edelbrock RPM I would gain some?


If the dyno operator has confidence in the AFR values posted in that dyno chart, you should be able to pick up some decent power jetting up on the carb. It looks pretty lean on those runs.

The timing might also be more optimized once the AFR was richer.

Last edited by davenc; 09/14/18 11:34 PM.
Re: What went wrong? [Re: davenc] #2550529
09/16/18 03:40 AM
09/16/18 03:40 AM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 1,038
Howell, Mi
Shatar4 Offline OP
super stock
Shatar4  Offline OP
super stock

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Posts: 1,038
Howell, Mi
Originally Posted By davenc
Originally Posted By Shatar4

So do you think if I change the intake to a Edelbrock RPM I would gain some?


If the dyno operator has confidence in the AFR values posted in that dyno chart, you should be able to pick up some decent power jetting up on the carb. It looks pretty lean on those runs.

The timing might also be more optimized once the AFR was richer.

The jets at 80 primary 88 secondary.

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