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#2443761 - 01/30/18 08:50 PM New Rotisserie and Plymouth frame cut for Dakota sub-frame.
Old Ray Offline
member

Registered: 09/20/16
Posts: 129
Loc: British Columbia, Canada
[Sub-titled "rolled my body and got naked" (the frame).]

1956 Canadian Dodge (Plodge) two door wagon. I love my new Rotisserie, I could not continue building without it.
Turns out the sweet spot (were the Dakota and Plymouth) frames are the same width, is 18 " back from the centre line of the front wheels. (I hope!) The frame is cut 4 " long for overlap.




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#2444253 - 01/31/18 06:39 PM Re: New Rotisserie and Plymouth frame cut for Dakota sub-frame. [Re: Old Ray]
65rbdodge Offline


Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 3893
Loc: n.e. pa.
Nice!!

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#2444282 - 01/31/18 07:20 PM Re: New Rotisserie and Plymouth frame cut for Dakota sub-frame. [Re: Old Ray]
Iowan Offline
super stock

Registered: 05/23/15
Posts: 908
Loc: Lost in Time
What's going to power this beast?
_________________________
Have a great day
Iowan

"obsolete is neat, the older I get the better I was"


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#2444348 - 01/31/18 08:32 PM Re: New Rotisserie and Plymouth frame cut for Dakota sub-frame. [Re: Old Ray]
Old Ray Offline
member

Registered: 09/20/16
Posts: 129
Loc: British Columbia, Canada
Hi, thanks for the replies. I was starting to think that I was married again, ......no one would talk to me.

Power is a 1992 318 5.2 fuel injected magnum. This will be my first FI project, so it will be an interesting adventure! shocked

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#2444543 - 02/01/18 09:11 AM Re: New Rotisserie and Plymouth frame cut for Dakota sub-frame. [Re: Old Ray]
moparx Offline
Dreaming of implants

Registered: 09/03/03
Posts: 8976
Loc: north of coder
the underside of your wagon is really solid. looks like a great start ! my first and only FI conversion was with my best bud's 55 chevy. we used an LTI and a conversion harness from those guys in arkansas, plus a shop manual for a cadillac [the same engine was used in it] the local chevy dealership tossed my way. that took many consultation phone calls, plus lots of reading up on my part to get a grasp on how the "foreign" brand does things. i learned stuff i didn't want to know ! but in the end, it was a sweet running ride. keep us up to date on your progress, please. up
beer

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#2444610 - 02/01/18 10:45 AM Re: New Rotisserie and Plymouth frame cut for Dakota sub-frame. [Re: Old Ray]
Old Ray Offline
member

Registered: 09/20/16
Posts: 129
Loc: British Columbia, Canada
Thanks moparx.

The underside picture is misleading, it was taken after the repair. it was bad.



My plan (?) on the FI is I have taken all the electronics off the Donner vehicle and left most of them still connected to the engine, it's not going to be a pretty sight under the hood, and mount them in the Plodge. I am hoping to trick the computer into thinking its still in a Dakota. confused

I will keep you posted as I go along, working on the frame now, contrary to popular belief (mostly mine) the Dakota rear axle (two wheel drive) will work width-wise, with ford deep offset wheels.

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#2444746 - 02/01/18 02:22 PM Re: New Rotisserie and Plymouth frame cut for Dakota sub-frame. [Re: Old Ray]
poorboy Offline
master

Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 6317
Loc: Freeport IL USA
My 1st EFI swap was the 90 Dakota stuff in my 48 Plymouth coupe. That has worked out pretty well. I used everything from the Dakota. A 92 is a bit more complex then the 90 was, the 92 is OBD2 while the 90 was OBD1. I believe as long as you are using the Dakota stuff it will still work out well, its when you start swapping other stuff in that causes the problems.


My current build is 39 Dodge truck sheet metal on a Dakota Chassis. I'm using a 91 Dakota donor, which is also OBD2. One of my issues is the donor was a V6 5 speed, and the drive train is a 5.9 auto from a 97 truck, so the V6 stick computer won't work. The 97 uses a digital speedometer and came with a Hot Wire harness. The 91 Dakota dash doesn't have a digital speedometer, and the remaining instrument cluster is incompatible with the 97 requirements. The Hot Wire harness is a stand alone unit unit requiring only a few wire connections to the truck harness. I really didn't want to use the Dakota dash anyway....

On top of that, I can't use the Dakota heater system (its too wide and doesn't conform to the firewall), and the steering column is too long and without a tilt I need for my 39 truck cab, so I'm using a different steering column and the wiring doesn't match up. It doesn't help that I don't have a wiring diagram for a 91 Dakota, there has been too many wiring changes from the 87 Dakota FSM I have. I thought I could clean up the under dash wiring harness, but there is this under dash control module causing a problem or 2. If I wasn't cheap (and broke) I'd just buy a $250 wiring kit and be done with the whole mess. I'm having fun now!

It is unfortunate that winter has come and the truck is sitting outside, too far away to be pushed in or out of the garage, and too far away to reach with my electric or air, and I'm a wimp, so its cold out there. Come on spring!

Keep moving forward, its nice to see guys making progress. Gene

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#2444775 - 02/01/18 03:28 PM Re: New Rotisserie and Plymouth frame cut for Dakota sub-frame. [Re: Old Ray]
Supercuda Offline
I Live Here

Registered: 09/04/07
Posts: 13455
Loc: up yours
OBDII didn't become mandatory till 1996 and a couple of manufacturers put it in in 95.

No one had it in production in 92.

I think you are confusing throttle body fuel injection (LA motor) and port fuel injection (magnum engine).
_________________________
They say there are no such thing as a stupid question.
They say there is always the exception that proves the rule.
Don't be the exception.

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#2444844 - 02/01/18 05:33 PM Re: New Rotisserie and Plymouth frame cut for Dakota sub-frame. [Re: poorboy]
Old Ray Offline
member

Registered: 09/20/16
Posts: 129
Loc: British Columbia, Canada
Originally Posted By poorboy
It doesn't help that I don't have a wiring diagram for a 91 Dakota,


The mixing and matching is the kind of trouble I am trying to avoid.

Gene, I think I have a 92 shop manual, I could scan the pertinent wiring diagram page if it would help?

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#2444963 - 02/01/18 09:26 PM Re: New Rotisserie and Plymouth frame cut for Dakota sub-frame. [Re: Old Ray]
bboogieart Offline
master

Registered: 01/12/08
Posts: 3551
Loc: Lost and Spaced
Nice looking toy. up

I give you fellas lots of credit.

I go the other way and run from the modern electronics.
I have a few 60's, & early 70's cars, trucks, & drive trains.
I'm still learnin' how that stuff goes together & werks.
_________________________
I have mechanical Aptitude.
I can screw up anything.

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#2444998 - 02/01/18 10:26 PM Re: New Rotisserie and Plymouth frame cut for Dakota sub-frame. [Re: Old Ray]
poorboy Offline
master

Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 6317
Loc: Freeport IL USA
Originally Posted By Old Ray
Originally Posted By poorboy
It doesn't help that I don't have a wiring diagram for a 91 Dakota,


The mixing and matching is the kind of trouble I am trying to avoid.

Gene, I think I have a 92 shop manual, I could scan the pertinent wiring diagram page if it would help?


Old Ray, at this point if I can get a pin out for the rear body harness plug at the firewall for the 92 Dakota, that would help. The 87 didn't have a connector there, and that would save me from undoing all the wiring to the rear of the truck.

I've pretty much decided I needed to start at the fuse box and wire everything from there. I have most of the circuits laid out, its just a matter of getting everything in the right place and splice a bunch of wires. Gene

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#2445002 - 02/01/18 10:31 PM Re: New Rotisserie and Plymouth frame cut for Dakota sub-frame. [Re: Supercuda]
poorboy Offline
master

Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 6317
Loc: Freeport IL USA
Originally Posted By Θάνατος
OBDII didn't become mandatory till 1996 and a couple of manufacturers put it in in 95.

No one had it in production in 92.

I think you are confusing throttle body fuel injection (LA motor) and port fuel injection (magnum engine).


Your probably right, but the 92 harness is different from the 90 harness, and both were 3.9 throttle body motors. The 92 also has an underhood fuse box that the 90 does not have. My 93 port injected 3.9 has a different computer then the 90 or the 92, which both appear to be the same. Gene

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#2445012 - 02/01/18 10:44 PM Re: New Rotisserie and Plymouth frame cut for Dakota sub-frame. [Re: bboogieart]
poorboy Offline
master

Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 6317
Loc: Freeport IL USA
Originally Posted By bboogieart
Nice looking toy. up

I give you fellas lots of credit.

I go the other way and run from the modern electronics.
I have a few 60's, & early 70's cars, trucks, & drive trains.
I'm still learnin' how that stuff goes together & werks.


My last hot rod truck was carbed, and it didn't like any brand of carbs. I think I rebuilt or replaced a carb every year. After 12 years of fighting with carbs, I was ready for something that worked. The efi in my 48 Plymouth coupe works well.

I would have went with fuel injection way back in the mid 80s if there had been an affordable way to put a system on a Mopar. It still irritates me that there isn't a kit for Mopars to convert over for less then a grand, but you can convert over a GM for less the $500 with all new stuff. Gene

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#2445028 - 02/01/18 11:33 PM Re: New Rotisserie and Plymouth frame cut for Dakota sub-frame. [Re: poorboy]
Old Ray Offline
member

Registered: 09/20/16
Posts: 129
Loc: British Columbia, Canada
Gene, looks like the 1992 has a 50 pin rectangle bulkhead, I have scanned it , easier I think to email it to you as an attachment. If so email address please, thanks.

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#2445270 - 02/02/18 02:22 PM Re: New Rotisserie and Plymouth frame cut for Dakota sub-frame. [Re: Old Ray]
poorboy Offline
master

Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 6317
Loc: Freeport IL USA
Old Ray, The tail harness I have is separate from the 50 pin bulkhead connector. This one is a blue connector with 17 pins (I'm attaching a picture of it, you might have to click on the attachment thing to see it.), It came through the lower firewall near the steering column with its own plug.

If I use the email system through Moparts, it uses Outlook Express, so I will include my email address here. It should show up as a link you can click on and send directly to me.

poorboysweldingshop@yahoo.com


Attachments
017.JPG



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#2445757 - 02/03/18 03:21 PM Re: New Rotisserie and Plymouth frame cut for Dakota sub-frame. [Re: poorboy]
Old Ray Offline
member

Registered: 09/20/16
Posts: 129
Loc: British Columbia, Canada
Originally Posted By poorboy
so I will include my email address here.


....email sent.

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#2446639 - 02/04/18 10:51 PM Re: New Rotisserie and Plymouth frame cut for Dakota sub-frame. [Re: Old Ray]
poorboy Offline
master

Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 6317
Loc: Freeport IL USA
Thank You, that helps a bunch!

Sorry I hijacked your thread. Gene

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#2448481 - 02/08/18 10:34 AM Re: New Rotisserie and Plymouth frame cut for Dakota sub-frame. [Re: Old Ray]
67R/T4speeder Offline
pro stock

Registered: 02/03/07
Posts: 1511
Loc: Pismo Beach,California
Nice work Old Ray, keep the updates coming.

I go get some more popcorn ready.
_________________________
Andy








www.troxellsgarage.com

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#2448712 - 02/08/18 06:17 PM Re: New Rotisserie and Plymouth frame cut for Dakota sub-frame. [Re: 67R/T4speeder]
Old Ray Offline
member

Registered: 09/20/16
Posts: 129
Loc: British Columbia, Canada
SO! Not sure if i should ask this or not (under the heading of don't ask a question you don’t want to hear the answer to!) I am putting the running gear and front subframe from a ‘92 Dakota (with change to 5 stud wheels) in my ‘56 plymouth 2 door wagon. The “experts” said the Dakota diff is to wide but by using deep offset ford wheels (centering hub cut out 1 mm) it fits fine. Turns out the Dakota leaf rear springs are EXACTLY the same length as the Plymouth but the Dak springs have more arc, so to get as slammed (low) as I would like the rear of the springs are to high. So I could do many other things that involve money, ...or flip the rear spring mounting bracket over (they will still fit inside the body) and use the Dak springs bolted rather then welded, (just in case). Will it work?


,

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#2448899 - 02/08/18 10:54 PM Re: New Rotisserie and Plymouth frame cut for Dakota sub-frame. [Re: Old Ray]
poorboy Offline
master

Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 6317
Loc: Freeport IL USA
Yes, as long as the flip doesn't interfere with the car body, since the shackles and brackets are above the frame. Flipping the rear shackles will change the pinion angle some, as well, which may or may not be a problem. You can flip the front brackets as well, if it would help.

I bought a set of 2" lowering blocks with the U-bolts & nuts, and free shipping included for something like $30 off ebay a few months ago. I looked but, no longer have the link. I did a google search, a generic ebay listing showed up, and I scrawled down the list until I found what I was looking for, make sure there isn't one with a better price a little farther down the list. Gene


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