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#2439082 - 01/22/18 01:36 PM Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp
davesmopars Offline
master

Registered: 08/01/04
Posts: 2776
Loc: cheshire, ct
Does any body make Big Block mechanical pump that can support 800 hp?
I know Race pumps did but only sell parts for them now.
Thanks for any help

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#2439128 - 01/22/18 03:16 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: davesmopars]
Mopar Guy Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 10/07/06
Posts: 372
Loc: Sweden
This one !?


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#2439246 - 01/22/18 08:00 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: davesmopars]
rt66jim Offline
master

Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 3928
Loc: Joplin, Mo
Call Clay Smith.

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#2439370 - 01/22/18 11:43 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: davesmopars]
hemi-itis Offline
I Live Here

Registered: 12/29/07
Posts: 10326
Loc: Great Neck,LI,new york
Went with the Magna 500.Should just about cover all the cars here


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#2439431 - 01/23/18 05:41 AM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: hemi-itis]
Dragula Offline


Registered: 05/02/04
Posts: 10111
Loc: Taxes R-US, NY
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#2439454 - 01/23/18 08:06 AM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: davesmopars]
sr4440 Offline
mopar

Registered: 02/06/08
Posts: 430
Loc: Central TEXAS!!!!
The math says a 66GPH pump is needed. 800 HP/ 1/2 lb of fuel per hour = 400 lbs of fuel per hour. 400 LBS per hour / 6 lbs per gallon = 66 GPH.
If you ran a 110 pump that would give you a 40% reserve.

http://www.manciniracing.com/homefupu.html


Joe
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#2439517 - 01/23/18 10:30 AM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: davesmopars]
Brewzer67 Offline
member

Registered: 05/12/17
Posts: 26
Loc: WI
I second the Clay Smith recommendation. They make a 6 valve big block pump that should meet your needs.

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#2439523 - 01/23/18 10:48 AM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: sr4440]
carter Offline
member

Registered: 10/25/06
Posts: 27
Loc: sweden
Thats thru in theory, but in reality it need moore. I don't think a 110 GPH fuel pump is big enough.
Fuel pump must struggle against fuel filter(s), regulator, various bends and turns in the fuel system and G-force when you floor it.


Edited by carter (01/23/18 10:56 AM)

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#2439540 - 01/23/18 11:11 AM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: davesmopars]
hemi-itis Offline
I Live Here

Registered: 12/29/07
Posts: 10326
Loc: Great Neck,LI,new york
You can never have a "too big" fuel pump as long as it is regulated.
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#2439567 - 01/23/18 11:59 AM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: carter]
an8sec70cuda Offline
I Live Here

Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 10300
Loc: Marion, South Carolina [><]
Originally Posted By carter
Thats thru in theory, but in reality it need moore. I don't think a 110 GPH fuel pump is big enough.
Fuel pump must struggle against fuel filter(s), regulator, various bends and turns in the fuel system and G-force when you floor it.

iagree Do all the calculations you want, but in the real world, on the car, at the track...that little 110 pump won't keep up.
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'70 hemicuda...8.91 at 150.5 mph street car...Mopar Action feature Dec. '14
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#2439574 - 01/23/18 12:10 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: carter]
fast68plymouth Offline
I Live Here

Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 10640
Loc: So. Burlington, Vt.
Originally Posted By carter
Thats thru in theory, but in reality it need moore. I don't think a 110 GPH fuel pump is big enough.
Fuel pump must struggle against fuel filter(s), regulator, various bends and turns in the fuel system and G-force when you floor it.


And maintain a steady 6psi at the carb through it all.

Most pump ratings are for "free flow"....... 0 psi.
Those numbers are essentially useless.
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#2439584 - 01/23/18 12:37 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: davesmopars]
mprhound Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 05/19/03
Posts: 388
Loc: Texas
Put it in the for sale section.... tsk


Edited by tboomer (01/23/18 12:50 PM)

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#2439635 - 01/23/18 02:37 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: carter]
sr4440 Offline
mopar

Registered: 02/06/08
Posts: 430
Loc: Central TEXAS!!!!
Originally Posted By carter
Thats thru in theory, but in reality it need moore. I don't think a 110 GPH fuel pump is big enough.
Fuel pump must struggle against fuel filter(s), regulator, various bends and turns in the fuel system and G-force when you floor it.


what you have described is supply issues. You (and others) have made assumptions on where the engine is going and it's location relative to the fuel tank. The OP stated none of these.
I have data (meaning I have tested) showing a mechanical fuel pump supporting 837HP with no issues.


Joe


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#2439638 - 01/23/18 02:43 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: davesmopars]
hemicar1971 Offline
master

Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 4470
Loc: Chicago Blackhawks
Ran the 110 Pump back when that was all you could get, for a while and it did drop in different locations on a pass. I also ran a very big line and big filter with no kinks and slow curves in the line up to the regulator that was beside the Carbs. Being a stick car with a violent leave I knew I needed more pump. I would spend the money on it once and buy a better pump. There are a lot of fuel pumps that do a much better job than the 110 Pump and are not that much more money. Usually a pump pushes better than it pulls so location of the type of pump you are using has an effect of performance of the pump.

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#2439661 - 01/23/18 03:26 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: rt66jim]
davesmopars Offline
master

Registered: 08/01/04
Posts: 2776
Loc: cheshire, ct
Originally Posted By rt66jim
Call Clay Smith.


Thanks

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#2439662 - 01/23/18 03:27 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: Brewzer67]
davesmopars Offline
master

Registered: 08/01/04
Posts: 2776
Loc: cheshire, ct
Originally Posted By Brewzer67
I second the Clay Smith recommendation. They make a 6 valve big block pump that should meet your needs.


Thanks, this should work.

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#2439676 - 01/23/18 03:50 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: davesmopars]
bobby66 Offline
master

Registered: 07/11/04
Posts: 2912
Loc: Arlington, Texas
Be ready to do some serious grinding on that Clay Smith pump. Had to grind the block on my 440, ran out of room on the pump.
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#2439684 - 01/23/18 04:09 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: hemicar1971]
sr4440 Offline
mopar

Registered: 02/06/08
Posts: 430
Loc: Central TEXAS!!!!
Originally Posted By hemicar1971
Ran the 110 Pump back when that was all you could get, for a while and it did drop in different locations on a pass. I also ran a very big line and big filter with no kinks and slow curves in the line up to the regulator that was beside the Carbs. Being a stick car with a violent leave I knew I needed more pump. I would spend the money on it once and buy a better pump. There are a lot of fuel pumps that do a much better job than the 110 Pump and are not that much more money. Usually a pump pushes better than it pulls so location of the type of pump you are using has an effect of performance of the pump.

are you talking about a electric pump? Because a mechanical pump develops a significant amount of vacuum on the suction side(10 inches of mercury on a stock pump)unlike a electric pump. I have never tested a HP pump to see how much vacuum it pulls.


To the OP, it's clear that the majority opinion is you need a very large pump. A 140 GPH pump from clay smith that, he claims, supports 1300HP might get you by.
http://www.claysmithcams.com/mopar-b-426-chrysler-hemi/

I give up.

Joe
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#2439689 - 01/23/18 04:17 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: davesmopars]
crabman173 Offline
master

Registered: 01/01/06
Posts: 3635
Loc: Big Lick , North Carolina
Every time I have upgraded pumps the perfectly running drag car picked up and ran even better at the track----
The Edelbrock mechanical is pretty darn good for street cars but even on street rides with great mechanicals when I added an electric as a booster to the mechanical it ran better by far--good thing is you can run on the Mechanical and just flip on the electric when you are ready to stomp on it hard works like a charm and you don't have to hear that damn buzz all the time
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#2439700 - 01/23/18 04:59 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: crabman173]
tvt59 Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 04/11/04
Posts: 259
Loc: Northport, al.
I have used the C&S before works very well Must be regulated though

NEW

TOOL STEEL PREMIUM QUALITY MECHANICAL FUEL PUMPS

HIGH STRENGTH CASTINGS: Exclusive casting design adds material 7 places to eliminate cracking, breakage, waviness, and leakage.
CORROSION RESISTANCE: Castings are bead blasted and alodine treated. Then color coded with baked catalyzed coating.
VALVES: 6 C&S High Flow pumping valves, combined with internal porting are proven to deliver twice the fuel flow.
DIAPHRAGM: All other pumping diaphragms are stamped from flat sheet stock. The convoluted (stepped) replacement doesn’t require stretching, eliminating leaks and elongated bolt holes. Less stress to the diaphragm itself means much longer life.
DRIVE SPRING: Single spring replaced with two stainless alloy springs to lower stress and improve reliability.
INTERNAL PUMP ARM: CNC milled from high strength 0-1 tool steel, then hardened and ground. All other brands use stamped low strength steel with no precision milling or grinding.
PUMP ARM BUSHING: Low strength bushing prone to breaking replaced with a A-2 high strength tool steel precision part.
VERTICAL PUMP SHAFT: Premium A-2 air hardening tool steel, Swiss CNC machined, smooth center less ground shaft. Creates an ideal surface for the new double lipped oil seal.

On the pivot end a hardened and ground pin pivots in a precision pocket. Previously two raw stamped steel edges created pivot point. Rough shaft made oil seal prone to leak. Available for SBC, BBC and Dodge. Recommended use with #4505 Alcohol Mechanical Bypass. 4230S-HD will work very well on gas with pressure sensitive bypass #4501. Some type of bypass regulator is required as unregulated pumps make over 17 PSI which will flood the engine if not controlled.
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#2439725 - 01/23/18 06:02 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: bobby66]
Brewzer67 Offline
member

Registered: 05/12/17
Posts: 26
Loc: WI
Originally Posted By bobby66
Be ready to do some serious grinding on that Clay Smith pump. Had to grind the block on my 440, ran out of room on the pump.

I hit it lucky and didn't have to clearance the block at all but it is a snug fit as it sits. I did have to clearance the pump almost to one of the screws. Last motor was a little over 600hp running with this pump and held a steady 7psi all the way down the track. Hopefully it will keep up with the new motor as well. Time will tell.

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#2439726 - 01/23/18 06:06 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: bobby66]
davesmopars Offline
master

Registered: 08/01/04
Posts: 2776
Loc: cheshire, ct
Originally Posted By bobby66
Be ready to do some serious grinding on that Clay Smith pump. Had to grind the block on my 440, ran out of room on the pump.


What block do you have? I really do not want to grind my block


Edited by davesmopars (01/23/18 06:07 PM)

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#2439728 - 01/23/18 06:09 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: Brewzer67]
davesmopars Offline
master

Registered: 08/01/04
Posts: 2776
Loc: cheshire, ct
Originally Posted By Brewzer67
Originally Posted By bobby66
Be ready to do some serious grinding on that Clay Smith pump. Had to grind the block on my 440, ran out of room on the pump.

I hit it lucky and didn't have to clearance the block at all but it is a snug fit as it sits. I did have to clearance the pump almost to one of the screws. Last motor was a little over 600hp running with this pump and held a steady 7psi all the way down the track. Hopefully it will keep up with the new motor as well. Time will tell.


What block do you have and do you run a return line?

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#2439737 - 01/23/18 06:28 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: davesmopars]
dogdays Offline
I Live Here

Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 15950
There is ONLY SO MUCH atmospheric pressure available to push the fuel into either pump. Same as on the oil pump, (except if you run a vacuum system in your crankcase there is less atmospheric pressure to push oil into the oil pump).

The atmospheric pressure will have an easier time pushing fuel through an 18" hose into an electric pump than it will have pushing the fuel through an 18 foot line up to the mechanical fuel pump. This is a fact of life. After the fuel gets into the pump it doesn't matter what the atmospheric pressure is because now it is the pump pushing the fuel into the carb.

R.

PS: Pumping a huge amount of fuel and using a regulator to return most of it to the tank heats the fuel and hurts performance as the engine runs. That's why it is better to have the system adequately sized, but not excessively huge.

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#2439752 - 01/23/18 07:12 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: sr4440]
Spaceman Spiff Online   penguin-006
master

Registered: 11/28/10
Posts: 2984
Loc: jersey
Originally Posted By sr4440
Originally Posted By hemicar1971
Ran the 110 Pump back when that was all you could get, for a while and it did drop in different locations on a pass. I also ran a very big line and big filter with no kinks and slow curves in the line up to the regulator that was beside the Carbs. Being a stick car with a violent leave I knew I needed more pump. I would spend the money on it once and buy a better pump. There are a lot of fuel pumps that do a much better job than the 110 Pump and are not that much more money. Usually a pump pushes better than it pulls so location of the type of pump you are using has an effect of performance of the pump.

are you talking about a electric pump? Because a mechanical pump develops a significant amount of vacuum on the suction side(10 inches of mercury on a stock pump)unlike a electric pump. I have never tested a HP pump to see how much vacuum it pulls.


To the OP, it's clear that the majority opinion is you need a very large pump. A 140 GPH pump from clay smith that, he claims, supports 1300HP might get you by.
http://www.claysmithcams.com/mopar-b-426-chrysler-hemi/

I give up.

Joe


from their website:
And, according to Dyno figures, it takes approximately 10galllons of gas per 100 HP per hour, the Clay Smith Power Pumper will theoretically handle up to 1300 HP on gas or 1150 on alcohol !

"THEORETICALLY" Just like your signature says, Without Data, you’re just another guy with an opinion.

I'd like to see that data that proves this will support 1300hp.
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#2439835 - 01/23/18 10:13 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: davesmopars]
AndyF Offline
Too Many Posts

Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 23626
Loc: Oregon
NASCAR did it back in the day. My 514 uses 360 lbs of gas an hour to make 900 hp. That is 60 gph.

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#2440048 - 01/24/18 12:10 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: davesmopars]
davesmopars Offline
master

Registered: 08/01/04
Posts: 2776
Loc: cheshire, ct
Thanks everybody
I called clay smith they recommend to run the pump with a regulator , check valve with a return line. I am running a cross ram with 4235 and 4236 carbs any suggestion on how I should set up my fuel system and lines.
Thanks

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#2440068 - 01/24/18 12:40 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: davesmopars]
astjp2 Offline
master

Registered: 01/18/11
Posts: 4124
Loc: Utah and Alaska
Rigid 1/2" stainless feed lines, parker braided Teflon between the pickup and hard line and frame rail to the pump. Tim
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#2440069 - 01/24/18 12:41 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: davesmopars]
Cuda340 Offline


Registered: 12/09/04
Posts: 1940
Loc: Wheatfield, NY
Mine is ran like this.


Attachments
IMG_5979.JPG




Edited by Cuda340 (01/24/18 12:42 PM)

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#2440087 - 01/24/18 01:00 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: davesmopars]
Cab_Burge Offline
I Win

Registered: 08/23/03
Posts: 30185
Loc: Bend,OR USA
1/2 inch pickup in the tank with a 100 micron filter before the pump, 1/2 line to the pump then 3/8 lines from the regulator to the carbs. and probably a 5/16 or 3/8 return line twocents up
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#2440366 - 01/24/18 11:18 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: davesmopars]
Brewzer67 Offline
member

Registered: 05/12/17
Posts: 26
Loc: WI
Originally Posted By davesmopars
Originally Posted By Brewzer67
Originally Posted By bobby66
Be ready to do some serious grinding on that Clay Smith pump. Had to grind the block on my 440, ran out of room on the pump.

I hit it lucky and didn't have to clearance the block at all but it is a snug fit as it sits. I did have to clearance the pump almost to one of the screws. Last motor was a little over 600hp running with this pump and held a steady 7psi all the way down the track. Hopefully it will keep up with the new motor as well. Time will tell.


What block do you have and do you run a return line?
I would have to go down and look but I am pretty sure it is a '72 or '73 440 block.

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#2440420 - 01/25/18 03:12 AM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: davesmopars]
bobby66 Offline
master

Registered: 07/11/04
Posts: 2912
Loc: Arlington, Texas
Originally Posted By davesmopars
Originally Posted By bobby66
Be ready to do some serious grinding on that Clay Smith pump. Had to grind the block on my 440, ran out of room on the pump.


What block do you have? I really do not want to grind my block


A '73 440. I mocked it up on a '78 400 and no grinding was needed on the block.
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#2440625 - 01/25/18 01:53 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: bobby66]
Cab_Burge Offline
I Win

Registered: 08/23/03
Posts: 30185
Loc: Bend,OR USA
Some Mopar RB and B blocks have a half moon shape machined into them by the fuel pump, some don't shruggy
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#2440655 - 01/25/18 02:55 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: Cab_Burge]
davesmopars Offline
master

Registered: 08/01/04
Posts: 2776
Loc: cheshire, ct
Hopefully the pump will fit.
Picture not working, I need to take new one
moparts uses old tech, I have to set my phone on old settings


Attachments
fullsizeoutput_1c6f.jpeg




Edited by davesmopars (01/25/18 02:59 PM)

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#2448498 - 02/08/18 10:53 AM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: davesmopars]
davesmopars Offline
master

Registered: 08/01/04
Posts: 2776
Loc: cheshire, ct
Here is a picture on my block. Hopefully the pump fits.
I have a solid roller cam. Is the stock fuel pump pushrod ok to use?


Attachments
IMG_0763.JPG



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#2448500 - 02/08/18 11:01 AM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: davesmopars]
an8sec70cuda Offline
I Live Here

Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 10300
Loc: Marion, South Carolina [><]
No. You need a bronze tipped pushrod to use on a billet roller cam.
_________________________
CHIP
'70 hemicuda...8.91 at 150.5 mph street car...Mopar Action feature Dec. '14
'69 road runner 446" w/ Indy SRs
'69 road runner 440-6, 4 speed...Dad's ride
'71 Demon 340 resto project
'01 Ram 2500 QCSB 4x4 Cummins...toy hauler
'16 Grand Caravan SXT...baby hauler

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#2448851 - 02/08/18 09:40 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: davesmopars]
davesmopars Offline
master

Registered: 08/01/04
Posts: 2776
Loc: cheshire, ct
Any recommendations on who sells them?


Edited by davesmopars (02/08/18 10:43 PM)

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#2448900 - 02/08/18 10:55 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: davesmopars]
FastmOp Offline
master

Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 5031
Loc: Hot Rod Ridge
Mancini

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#2449102 - 02/09/18 11:29 AM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: Mopar Guy]
BIGSTROKER Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 01/12/06
Posts: 262
Loc: NEW HAMPSHIRE AND MAINE
That one will do it easy
claysmith nfg

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#2449194 - 02/09/18 04:20 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: davesmopars]
davesmopars Offline
master

Registered: 08/01/04
Posts: 2776
Loc: cheshire, ct
Thanks
Now how figure out the plumbing and the return line and make it look good.


Attachments
IMG_6747-2.JPG




Edited by davesmopars (02/09/18 04:22 PM)

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#2449264 - 02/09/18 06:42 PM Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp [Re: davesmopars]
bobby66 Offline
master

Registered: 07/11/04
Posts: 2912
Loc: Arlington, Texas
There are rumors of small-block pumps from CV-Products that work on the big blocks. Haven't tried it myself, yet.
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