Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp
#2439082
01/22/18 04:36 PM
01/22/18 04:36 PM
|
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,391 cheshire, ct
davesmopars
OP
master
|
OP
master
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,391
cheshire, ct
|
Does any body make Big Block mechanical pump that can support 800 hp? I know Race pumps did but only sell parts for them now. Thanks for any help
Keeper of the 440 M code Cuda registry mcodecuda@yahoo.com
|
|
|
Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp
[Re: davesmopars]
#2439454
01/23/18 11:06 AM
01/23/18 11:06 AM
|
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 714 Central TEXAS!!!!
sr4440
super stock
|
super stock
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 714
Central TEXAS!!!!
|
The math says a 66GPH pump is needed. 800 HP/ 1/2 lb of fuel per hour = 400 lbs of fuel per hour. 400 LBS per hour / 6 lbs per gallon = 66 GPH. If you ran a 110 pump that would give you a 40% reserve. http://www.manciniracing.com/homefupu.html Joe
Without Data, you’re just another guy with an opinion.
|
|
|
Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp
[Re: sr4440]
#2439523
01/23/18 01:48 PM
01/23/18 01:48 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 89 sweden
carter
member
|
member
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 89
sweden
|
Thats thru in theory, but in reality it need moore. I don't think a 110 GPH fuel pump is big enough. Fuel pump must struggle against fuel filter(s), regulator, various bends and turns in the fuel system and G-force when you floor it.
Last edited by carter; 01/23/18 01:56 PM.
|
|
|
Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp
[Re: carter]
#2439567
01/23/18 02:59 PM
01/23/18 02:59 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,345 Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,345
Marion, South Carolina [><]
|
Thats thru in theory, but in reality it need moore. I don't think a 110 GPH fuel pump is big enough. Fuel pump must struggle against fuel filter(s), regulator, various bends and turns in the fuel system and G-force when you floor it. Do all the calculations you want, but in the real world, on the car, at the track...that little 110 pump won't keep up.
CHIP '70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60 '69 road runner, 440-6, 18 spline 4 speed, Dana 60 '71 Demon, 340, low gear 904, 8.75 '73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75 '90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt '06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
|
|
|
Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp
[Re: carter]
#2439574
01/23/18 03:10 PM
01/23/18 03:10 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,491 So. Burlington, Vt.
fast68plymouth
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,491
So. Burlington, Vt.
|
Thats thru in theory, but in reality it need moore. I don't think a 110 GPH fuel pump is big enough. Fuel pump must struggle against fuel filter(s), regulator, various bends and turns in the fuel system and G-force when you floor it. And maintain a steady 6psi at the carb through it all. Most pump ratings are for "free flow"....... 0 psi. Those numbers are essentially useless.
68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123 Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
|
|
|
Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp
[Re: carter]
#2439635
01/23/18 05:37 PM
01/23/18 05:37 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 714 Central TEXAS!!!!
sr4440
super stock
|
super stock
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 714
Central TEXAS!!!!
|
Thats thru in theory, but in reality it need moore. I don't think a 110 GPH fuel pump is big enough. Fuel pump must struggle against fuel filter(s), regulator, various bends and turns in the fuel system and G-force when you floor it. what you have described is supply issues. You (and others) have made assumptions on where the engine is going and it's location relative to the fuel tank. The OP stated none of these. I have data (meaning I have tested) showing a mechanical fuel pump supporting 837HP with no issues. Joe
Without Data, you’re just another guy with an opinion.
|
|
|
Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp
[Re: Brewzer67]
#2439662
01/23/18 06:27 PM
01/23/18 06:27 PM
|
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,391 cheshire, ct
davesmopars
OP
master
|
OP
master
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,391
cheshire, ct
|
I second the Clay Smith recommendation. They make a 6 valve big block pump that should meet your needs. Thanks, this should work.
Keeper of the 440 M code Cuda registry mcodecuda@yahoo.com
|
|
|
Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp
[Re: hemicar1971]
#2439684
01/23/18 07:09 PM
01/23/18 07:09 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 714 Central TEXAS!!!!
sr4440
super stock
|
super stock
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 714
Central TEXAS!!!!
|
Ran the 110 Pump back when that was all you could get, for a while and it did drop in different locations on a pass. I also ran a very big line and big filter with no kinks and slow curves in the line up to the regulator that was beside the Carbs. Being a stick car with a violent leave I knew I needed more pump. I would spend the money on it once and buy a better pump. There are a lot of fuel pumps that do a much better job than the 110 Pump and are not that much more money. Usually a pump pushes better than it pulls so location of the type of pump you are using has an effect of performance of the pump. are you talking about a electric pump? Because a mechanical pump develops a significant amount of vacuum on the suction side(10 inches of mercury on a stock pump)unlike a electric pump. I have never tested a HP pump to see how much vacuum it pulls. To the OP, it's clear that the majority opinion is you need a very large pump. A 140 GPH pump from clay smith that, he claims, supports 1300HP might get you by. http://www.claysmithcams.com/mopar-b-426-chrysler-hemi/I give up. Joe
Without Data, you’re just another guy with an opinion.
|
|
|
Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp
[Re: davesmopars]
#2439689
01/23/18 07:17 PM
01/23/18 07:17 PM
|
crabman173
Unregistered
|
crabman173
Unregistered
|
Every time I have upgraded pumps the perfectly running drag car picked up and ran even better at the track---- The Edelbrock mechanical is pretty darn good for street cars but even on street rides with great mechanicals when I added an electric as a booster to the mechanical it ran better by far--good thing is you can run on the Mechanical and just flip on the electric when you are ready to stomp on it hard works like a charm and you don't have to hear that damn buzz all the time
|
|
|
Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp
[Re: ]
#2439700
01/23/18 07:59 PM
01/23/18 07:59 PM
|
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 324 Northport, al.
tvt59
enthusiast
|
enthusiast
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 324
Northport, al.
|
I have used the C&S before works very well Must be regulated though
NEW
TOOL STEEL PREMIUM QUALITY MECHANICAL FUEL PUMPS
HIGH STRENGTH CASTINGS: Exclusive casting design adds material 7 places to eliminate cracking, breakage, waviness, and leakage. CORROSION RESISTANCE: Castings are bead blasted and alodine treated. Then color coded with baked catalyzed coating. VALVES: 6 C&S High Flow pumping valves, combined with internal porting are proven to deliver twice the fuel flow. DIAPHRAGM: All other pumping diaphragms are stamped from flat sheet stock. The convoluted (stepped) replacement doesn’t require stretching, eliminating leaks and elongated bolt holes. Less stress to the diaphragm itself means much longer life. DRIVE SPRING: Single spring replaced with two stainless alloy springs to lower stress and improve reliability. INTERNAL PUMP ARM: CNC milled from high strength 0-1 tool steel, then hardened and ground. All other brands use stamped low strength steel with no precision milling or grinding. PUMP ARM BUSHING: Low strength bushing prone to breaking replaced with a A-2 high strength tool steel precision part. VERTICAL PUMP SHAFT: Premium A-2 air hardening tool steel, Swiss CNC machined, smooth center less ground shaft. Creates an ideal surface for the new double lipped oil seal.
On the pivot end a hardened and ground pin pivots in a precision pocket. Previously two raw stamped steel edges created pivot point. Rough shaft made oil seal prone to leak. Available for SBC, BBC and Dodge. Recommended use with #4505 Alcohol Mechanical Bypass. 4230S-HD will work very well on gas with pressure sensitive bypass #4501. Some type of bypass regulator is required as unregulated pumps make over 17 PSI which will flood the engine if not controlled.
Nothing worth anything comes easy. It is always harder to do the right thing.
My Grandfather
|
|
|
Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp
[Re: bobby66]
#2439725
01/23/18 09:02 PM
01/23/18 09:02 PM
|
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 72 WI
Brewzer67
member
|
member
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 72
WI
|
Be ready to do some serious grinding on that Clay Smith pump. Had to grind the block on my 440, ran out of room on the pump. I hit it lucky and didn't have to clearance the block at all but it is a snug fit as it sits. I did have to clearance the pump almost to one of the screws. Last motor was a little over 600hp running with this pump and held a steady 7psi all the way down the track. Hopefully it will keep up with the new motor as well. Time will tell.
|
|
|
Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp
[Re: bobby66]
#2439726
01/23/18 09:06 PM
01/23/18 09:06 PM
|
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,391 cheshire, ct
davesmopars
OP
master
|
OP
master
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,391
cheshire, ct
|
Be ready to do some serious grinding on that Clay Smith pump. Had to grind the block on my 440, ran out of room on the pump. What block do you have? I really do not want to grind my block
Last edited by davesmopars; 01/23/18 09:07 PM.
Keeper of the 440 M code Cuda registry mcodecuda@yahoo.com
|
|
|
Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp
[Re: Brewzer67]
#2439728
01/23/18 09:09 PM
01/23/18 09:09 PM
|
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,391 cheshire, ct
davesmopars
OP
master
|
OP
master
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,391
cheshire, ct
|
Be ready to do some serious grinding on that Clay Smith pump. Had to grind the block on my 440, ran out of room on the pump. I hit it lucky and didn't have to clearance the block at all but it is a snug fit as it sits. I did have to clearance the pump almost to one of the screws. Last motor was a little over 600hp running with this pump and held a steady 7psi all the way down the track. Hopefully it will keep up with the new motor as well. Time will tell. What block do you have and do you run a return line?
Keeper of the 440 M code Cuda registry mcodecuda@yahoo.com
|
|
|
Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp
[Re: sr4440]
#2439752
01/23/18 10:12 PM
01/23/18 10:12 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 3,696 jersey
Spaceman Spiff
master
|
master
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 3,696
jersey
|
Ran the 110 Pump back when that was all you could get, for a while and it did drop in different locations on a pass. I also ran a very big line and big filter with no kinks and slow curves in the line up to the regulator that was beside the Carbs. Being a stick car with a violent leave I knew I needed more pump. I would spend the money on it once and buy a better pump. There are a lot of fuel pumps that do a much better job than the 110 Pump and are not that much more money. Usually a pump pushes better than it pulls so location of the type of pump you are using has an effect of performance of the pump. are you talking about a electric pump? Because a mechanical pump develops a significant amount of vacuum on the suction side(10 inches of mercury on a stock pump)unlike a electric pump. I have never tested a HP pump to see how much vacuum it pulls. To the OP, it's clear that the majority opinion is you need a very large pump. A 140 GPH pump from clay smith that, he claims, supports 1300HP might get you by. http://www.claysmithcams.com/mopar-b-426-chrysler-hemi/I give up. Joe from their website: And, according to Dyno figures, it takes approximately 10galllons of gas per 100 HP per hour, the Clay Smith Power Pumper will theoretically handle up to 1300 HP on gas or 1150 on alcohol ! "THEORETICALLY" Just like your signature says, Without Data, you’re just another guy with an opinion. I'd like to see that data that proves this will support 1300hp.
526 cubes of angry wedge, pushbutton shifted, 9 passenger killer!
|
|
|
Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp
[Re: davesmopars]
#2440048
01/24/18 03:10 PM
01/24/18 03:10 PM
|
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,391 cheshire, ct
davesmopars
OP
master
|
OP
master
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,391
cheshire, ct
|
Thanks everybody I called clay smith they recommend to run the pump with a regulator , check valve with a return line. I am running a cross ram with 4235 and 4236 carbs any suggestion on how I should set up my fuel system and lines. Thanks
Keeper of the 440 M code Cuda registry mcodecuda@yahoo.com
|
|
|
Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp
[Re: davesmopars]
#2440068
01/24/18 03:40 PM
01/24/18 03:40 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 4,785 Utah and Alaska
astjp2
master
|
master
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 4,785
Utah and Alaska
|
Rigid 1/2" stainless feed lines, parker braided Teflon between the pickup and hard line and frame rail to the pump. Tim
1941 Taylorcraft 1968 Charger 1994 Wrangler 1998 Wrangler 2008 Kia Rio 2017 Jetta
I didn't do 4 years and 9 months of Graduate School to be called Mister!
|
|
|
Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp
[Re: davesmopars]
#2440366
01/25/18 02:18 AM
01/25/18 02:18 AM
|
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 72 WI
Brewzer67
member
|
member
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 72
WI
|
Be ready to do some serious grinding on that Clay Smith pump. Had to grind the block on my 440, ran out of room on the pump. I hit it lucky and didn't have to clearance the block at all but it is a snug fit as it sits. I did have to clearance the pump almost to one of the screws. Last motor was a little over 600hp running with this pump and held a steady 7psi all the way down the track. Hopefully it will keep up with the new motor as well. Time will tell. What block do you have and do you run a return line? I would have to go down and look but I am pretty sure it is a '72 or '73 440 block.
|
|
|
Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp
[Re: davesmopars]
#2440420
01/25/18 06:12 AM
01/25/18 06:12 AM
|
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 3,802 Arlington, Texas
bobby66
master
|
master
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 3,802
Arlington, Texas
|
Be ready to do some serious grinding on that Clay Smith pump. Had to grind the block on my 440, ran out of room on the pump. What block do you have? I really do not want to grind my block A '73 440. I mocked it up on a '78 400 and no grinding was needed on the block.
|
|
|
Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp
[Re: Cab_Burge]
#2440655
01/25/18 05:55 PM
01/25/18 05:55 PM
|
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,391 cheshire, ct
davesmopars
OP
master
|
OP
master
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,391
cheshire, ct
|
Hopefully the pump will fit. Picture not working, I need to take new one moparts uses old tech, I have to set my phone on old settings
Last edited by davesmopars; 01/25/18 05:59 PM.
Keeper of the 440 M code Cuda registry mcodecuda@yahoo.com
|
|
|
Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp
[Re: davesmopars]
#2448498
02/08/18 01:53 PM
02/08/18 01:53 PM
|
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,391 cheshire, ct
davesmopars
OP
master
|
OP
master
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,391
cheshire, ct
|
Here is a picture on my block. Hopefully the pump fits. I have a solid roller cam. Is the stock fuel pump pushrod ok to use?
Keeper of the 440 M code Cuda registry mcodecuda@yahoo.com
|
|
|
Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp
[Re: davesmopars]
#2448500
02/08/18 02:01 PM
02/08/18 02:01 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,345 Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,345
Marion, South Carolina [><]
|
No. You need a bronze tipped pushrod to use on a billet roller cam.
CHIP '70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60 '69 road runner, 440-6, 18 spline 4 speed, Dana 60 '71 Demon, 340, low gear 904, 8.75 '73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75 '90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt '06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
|
|
|
Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp
[Re: davesmopars]
#2448851
02/09/18 12:40 AM
02/09/18 12:40 AM
|
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,391 cheshire, ct
davesmopars
OP
master
|
OP
master
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,391
cheshire, ct
|
Any recommendations on who sells them?
Last edited by davesmopars; 02/09/18 01:43 AM.
Keeper of the 440 M code Cuda registry mcodecuda@yahoo.com
|
|
|
Re: Big Block mechanical pump for 800 Hp
[Re: davesmopars]
#2449194
02/09/18 07:20 PM
02/09/18 07:20 PM
|
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,391 cheshire, ct
davesmopars
OP
master
|
OP
master
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,391
cheshire, ct
|
Thanks Now how figure out the plumbing and the return line and make it look good.
Last edited by davesmopars; 02/09/18 07:22 PM.
Keeper of the 440 M code Cuda registry mcodecuda@yahoo.com
|
|
|
|
|