Re: End of season oil change
[Re: Dr Dave]
#2411846
12/01/17 04:28 PM
12/01/17 04:28 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,638 PA
70Duster
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,638
PA
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Before putting away in the fall, run the vehicle so that the engine oil, transmission fluid and differential oil are up to normal operating temperature (normally 20 minutes at highway speed). Put the car in the garage, pull a battery cable, put the sun visors in the down position (so that mice don't have a platform to stand on while they eat your headliner), make sure manually operated outside vents are closed (to keep mice out), lock the car, close the garage door. Done. Been doing it this way for 30 years with no problems. No fuel additives required, no last minute oil changes, no jack stands to keep the tires off the ground, the list can go on and on..........
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Re: End of season oil change
[Re: Dr Dave]
#2411869
12/01/17 05:43 PM
12/01/17 05:43 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,376
dogdays
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,376
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Here come the big spenders! I can hear their footsteps.
So let's get some questions answered. What is this vehicle? How much is it worth? How is it used for the few hundred miles driven per year? Is it a Diesel? Do you run an air filter?
IF: It's a Hemi Cuda It's a particular collectible The 500 miles per year are spent competing in the Daytona, Indy or Baja 500 The 500 miles are put on 1/8 or 1/4 mile at a time You drive on country roads without an air filter It's a Diesel. THEN: You may want to worry about engine oil
If none of the above statements apply to you, my advice would be to use the oil year after year until you've hit 3,000 miles and then change it, or 5,000 miles for a synthetic. ExxonMobil says Mobil 1 has a shelf life of 5 years. I look at that number as being very conservative.
If you are really curious about the condition of your engine oil on October 1, buy an oil analysis kit and get a sample tested. It used to cost me $18.00. Blackstone Labs will send you a free sample kit and charge you $28.00 for the analysis. What you'll get back is a report that gives the specific of your particular sample, how it fits in the manufacturer's acceptable range, and how much/what kind of particles you have in your oil. You will most likely see that everything about the oil is suitable for continued use. The reports do all the interpreting for you, telling you if the value is good, so-so, or bad. Maybe you remember my '93Suburban story. It was used more than half time as a delivery vehicle, delivering kids to practice. Occasionally we'd take a long trip. I was using conventional oil and forgot to change the oil after 5,000 miles. I changed it at 12,000 miles and sent in a sample. The analysis report showed that the oil still met specifications after 12,000 miles.
It is a FACT that there are over a million particles larger than 4 microns in every liter of new motor oil. So changing the oil doesn't necessarily mean you are reducing the number of particulates. The largest source of particulates in the oil is road dust. There are also wear particles present. There may be particles from a chemical reaction causing their formation. Acids in motor oils are produced by moisture in the oil. Doing lots of low speed driving or stop and go driving increases the chances of moisture to accumulate in the oil. Not driving does less.
For most automobiles, oil is much less important than we'd think, as long as it is present and meets minimum specs. How can I say that? Think about the causes of engine failure. I don't believe lubricating oil is in the top five of the list. Overheating, head gaskets, detonation, are a few of the causes.
Several years ago Quaker State ran a program where if you used only Quaker State oil and possibly filters in your car, they'd warranty the engine against oil related failure for a lot longer than factory. The reason they could dare to do this is because oil related failures in engines are relatively rare. This excludes running out of oil, of course.s
I know oil is like religion to most of us, but we really should start taking the longer view. That money I saved on an unnecessary oil change will buy dinner and a movie for two. Keep the marriage strong, it can cause you to lose your special car much more certainly than an oil related engine failure!
R.
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Re: End of season oil change
[Re: Dr Dave]
#2412696
12/03/17 04:20 PM
12/03/17 04:20 PM
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Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 4,445 Morristown Tn.
71birdJ68
master
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master
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 4,445
Morristown Tn.
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It has a lot to do with what kind of building the car is stored in. If a metal building, then there can be a wide range of temp changes over night and almost everyday. This will cause moisture to form inside the engine, and contaminate the oil, and start corrosion to form. In this case why put new oil in to get contaminated and have to be changed in the spring. But like in my case, my car is in a basement, which the temps hardly vary, and from summer to winter it takes weeks for them to change, so I don't worry about it. I have seen airplane cylinders go bad with corrosion from sitting in a metal hanger, and remember that when you restart up something that has surface rust, then all of the power gets spread through the engine like sand. If you really would like to store it right, they make these heating pads for airplane engines that stick to the oil pan and block, then you can keep the engine at the same warm temp all winter. They also make blowers that blow hot air through hoses that can be directed into the engine bay, and not only the engine, but everything can be kept warm.
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Re: End of season oil change
[Re: 71birdJ68]
#2412727
12/03/17 05:50 PM
12/03/17 05:50 PM
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,574 Lakeland FL
floridian
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,574
Lakeland FL
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It has a lot to do with what kind of building the car is stored in. So true, especially dependent an what part of the country you live in.. In Florida there is no "bedtime" as we here can use our toys all year round.... Personally I believe in the before I put the car to bed theory of getting the contaminated oil out and clean new oil circulated throughout the system.. Anymore, if the oil is clean I just put it to bed as is, even driving it another season with the same oil.. First good warm up and drive will burn out all of the condensation..
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Re: End of season oil change
[Re: second 70]
#2413219
12/04/17 08:05 PM
12/04/17 08:05 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 21,318 Manitoba, Canada
DaytonaTurbo
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 21,318
Manitoba, Canada
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The acid in the oil etching the bearings while in storage theory is why I change my oil before storage now.
Plus it seems like every small engine manual says to do it before storage. I've heard this before a lot too. I don't have any data to back up my claims but I've pulled apart several engines that were sitting for years in old oil and I have never been able to find any sort of wear, damage or corrosion from sitting in used oil. I read a storage post from an oil expert and they suggested to chance oil when putting car in storage and not to start the car at all until removing from storage.They said just starting the car when doing the oil change alone would put acid in the oil and defeat the purpose. So according to your expert, what's the difference between storing an engine with used oil vs an engine with new oil in the pan but used oil still on all the bearing surfaces as it would be after an oil change if you didn't start the engine to cycle it through?
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Re: End of season oil change
[Re: DaytonaTurbo]
#2413350
12/05/17 12:36 AM
12/05/17 12:36 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,788 Hamilton, Ontario Canada
Magnum
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,788
Hamilton, Ontario Canada
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The acid in the oil etching the bearings while in storage theory is why I change my oil before storage now.
Plus it seems like every small engine manual says to do it before storage. I've heard this before a lot too. I don't have any data to back up my claims but I've pulled apart several engines that were sitting for years in old oil and I have never been able to find any sort of wear, damage or corrosion from sitting in used oil. I read a storage post from an oil expert and they suggested to chance oil when putting car in storage and not to start the car at all until removing from storage.They said just starting the car when doing the oil change alone would put acid in the oil and defeat the purpose. So according to your expert, what's the difference between storing an engine with used oil vs an engine with new oil in the pan but used oil still on all the bearing surfaces as it would be after an oil change if you didn't start the engine to cycle it through? For me the stored car should sit with fresh oil vs used but the biggest killer for any engine is dry start ups. Changing the oil then not starting it until 5 months later is definitely not shortening the time for oil pressure to develop. Quick oil pressure right after fire up is the key to long engine life. That is why I prefill my filters and start the engine as soon as the new oil is poured in.
69 Super Bee, 93 Mustang LX, 04 Allure Super
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Re: End of season oil change
[Re: Dave Hall]
#2413478
12/05/17 09:58 AM
12/05/17 09:58 AM
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 3,696 jersey
Spaceman Spiff
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 3,696
jersey
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Yeah that oil pro statement makes ZERO sense. You have to start it to check for leaks or you are not done with your oil change. I think what he means is, do not start the car during storage.
526 cubes of angry wedge, pushbutton shifted, 9 passenger killer!
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Re: End of season oil change
[Re: Dr Dave]
#2413984
12/06/17 12:51 AM
12/06/17 12:51 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,788 Hamilton, Ontario Canada
Magnum
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,788
Hamilton, Ontario Canada
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The acid in the oil may be true in theory but the amount after running it for a few minutes after the oil change would be absolutely minor.
The only part is agree with is NOT starting it up while in storage. Idling will not get the oil hot enough to get rid of the moisture.
As for all the other ways to do the end of season change. I'm sure nobody will have any problems. Nobody is going to ruin their engine by doing some other method, we are just sharing the best way to do it.
69 Super Bee, 93 Mustang LX, 04 Allure Super
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